Concerning the gift of tongues
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I do not attempt to "refute" Romans 11:29.
I refute your understanding of the verse to be a blanket all-encompassing edict.
I will now ask the question again, the same question that you and others who bring this verse up ignore,
Does this verse imply that God has never and will never revoke a gift or blessing bestowed upon someone?
I refute your understanding of the verse to be a blanket all-encompassing edict.
I will now ask the question again, the same question that you and others who bring this verse up ignore,
Does this verse imply that God has never and will never revoke a gift or blessing bestowed upon someone?
O know you won't refute it because you cannot but I will answer your question if you answer mine common courtesy and such. No it does not because he has taken gifts from people who didn't deserve it but this verse and the gift you are thinking of are not the same you want to say that since he has taken gifts from people that he can take the spiritual gifts but while there is records of him doing this with normal gifts in scripture there is not a single record of him doing so with the spiritual gifts
that is because the spiritual gifts are not like any other gift he has given and never once has he taken any in scripture and if it isn't recorded in scripture then we have no basis to stand on for it to be the case now my question to you is what is your understanding of this verse since you don't like my understanding of it
that is because the spiritual gifts are not like any other gift he has given and never once has he taken any in scripture and if it isn't recorded in scripture then we have no basis to stand on for it to be the case now my question to you is what is your understanding of this verse since you don't like my understanding of it
Conjecture???
The whole Pentecostal movement is based on conjecture.
They surmise that since some Christians in the 1st Century were speaking in tongues then their modern day babble must be the same thing. This is conjecture.
Show me your biblical verses that backup your claims that modern day tongues are akin to those mentioned in the Bible. Chapter and verse.
Remember no surmising, just scripture.
The whole Pentecostal movement is based on conjecture.
They surmise that since some Christians in the 1st Century were speaking in tongues then their modern day babble must be the same thing. This is conjecture.
Show me your biblical verses that backup your claims that modern day tongues are akin to those mentioned in the Bible. Chapter and verse.
Remember no surmising, just scripture.
What do you think it looks like when the gifts of the Holy Spirit are operating in a believer that…
patiently suffers long and is kind; does not envy; does not parade itself, is not puffed up; does not behave rudely, does not seek its own, is not provoked, thinks no evil; bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things. does not rejoice in iniquity, but rejoices in the truth?
How would this type of a believer manifest the Holy Spirit’s gifts of the word of wisdom, the word of knowledge, faith, gifts of healings, working of miracles, prophecy, discerning of spirits, different kinds of tongues, and interpretation of tongues all by the Holy Spirit?
What would it look like?
Who would love it and receive spiritual edification and life from it?
Who would hate it and speak evil of it?
patiently suffers long and is kind; does not envy; does not parade itself, is not puffed up; does not behave rudely, does not seek its own, is not provoked, thinks no evil; bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things. does not rejoice in iniquity, but rejoices in the truth?
How would this type of a believer manifest the Holy Spirit’s gifts of the word of wisdom, the word of knowledge, faith, gifts of healings, working of miracles, prophecy, discerning of spirits, different kinds of tongues, and interpretation of tongues all by the Holy Spirit?
What would it look like?
Who would love it and receive spiritual edification and life from it?
Who would hate it and speak evil of it?
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So Romans 11:29 only applies to "spiritual gifts"? What in the verbiage of the verse compels you to think this.
On your question, what is my understanding of the verse?
I believe that the verse is a true but general statement that applies to individuals who have been blessed by God. God is a giving god who desires the best for His followers. But this verse does not prove a person has whatever gift they claim to have.
This is another true but general statement:
Numbers 23:19 New International Version
God is not human, that he should lie, not a human being, that he should change his mind. Does he speak and then not act? Does he promise and not fulfill?
Can we take this verse and claim that God never changes His mind.
Of course He has, just ask Abraham and Moses.
On your question, what is my understanding of the verse?
I believe that the verse is a true but general statement that applies to individuals who have been blessed by God. God is a giving god who desires the best for His followers. But this verse does not prove a person has whatever gift they claim to have.
This is another true but general statement:
Numbers 23:19 New International Version
God is not human, that he should lie, not a human being, that he should change his mind. Does he speak and then not act? Does he promise and not fulfill?
Can we take this verse and claim that God never changes His mind.
Of course He has, just ask Abraham and Moses.
The reason I understand it to mean spiritual gifts is because that is what was being spoken about in the chapter this verse comes from it is quite simple take the entire chapter into account with the verse in question
But no you cannot take that verse and think that God never changes his mind because that is not what is being spoken about in the chapter it comes from in fact it has nothing to do with his mind changing again read the chapter then consider the verse in question it explains itself
But no you cannot take that verse and think that God never changes his mind because that is not what is being spoken about in the chapter it comes from in fact it has nothing to do with his mind changing again read the chapter then consider the verse in question it explains itself
A believer in Jesus Christ that…
patiently suffers long and is kind; does not envy; does not parade itself, is not puffed up; does not behave rudely, does not seek its own, is not provoked, thinks no evil; bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things. does not rejoice in iniquity, but rejoices in the truth while manifesting the Holy Spirit’s gifts of the word of wisdom, the word of knowledge, faith, gifts of healings, working of miracles, prophecy, discerning of spirits, different kinds of tongues, and interpretation of tongues all by the Holy Spirit.
patiently suffers long and is kind; does not envy; does not parade itself, is not puffed up; does not behave rudely, does not seek its own, is not provoked, thinks no evil; bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things. does not rejoice in iniquity, but rejoices in the truth while manifesting the Holy Spirit’s gifts of the word of wisdom, the word of knowledge, faith, gifts of healings, working of miracles, prophecy, discerning of spirits, different kinds of tongues, and interpretation of tongues all by the Holy Spirit.
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