Did Jesus ever tell us that we no longer need to keep the law of Moses?

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Grandpa

Senior Member
Jun 24, 2011
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There is only one Lawgiver and Judge, the one who is able to save and destroy. But you—who are you to judge your neighbor? James 4:12

Therefore judge nothing before the appointed time; wait till the Lord comes. He will bring to light what is hidden in darkness and will expose the motives of men’s hearts. At that time each will receive his praise from God. 1 Corinthians 4:5

For when there is a change of the priesthood, there must also be a change of the law. Hebrews 7:12

In my simple mind, I believe that being lawless means disobedience of the law and/or having no law or the rejection of the law.

Carry each other’s burdens, and in this way you will fulfill the law of Christ. If anyone thinks he is something when he is nothing, he deceives himself. Each one should test his own actions. Then he can take pride in himself, without comparing himself to somebody else, for each one should carry his own load. Galatians 6:2-5

Love One Another
This is the message you heard from the beginning: We should love one another. And this is his command: to believe in the name of his Son, Jesus Christ, and to love one another as he commanded us. Those who obey his commands live in him, and he in them. And this is how we know that he lives in us: We know it by the Spirit he gave us. 1 John 3:11,23-24

Love is the fulfilment of the law. (Romans 13:8-14)

Confess Jesus Christ as your Lord and Walk in Love.

God's love endures forever.
Its hard to show people who work at the law scripture that shows their extreme error. Because I don't believe they have the capacity to understand it. Otherwise, why is there 290 pages of this?

Romans 8:2-3
2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:


Do you understand what this is saying????

Its saying that the law is NOT the way to become "lawless". The law is weak through the flesh.

Only through the Spirit of Life in Christ Jesus do we become "Law-keepers".

If people were really so concerned with keeping the law they should know how its done. But they don't. All they know is their carnal work at a carnal law.
 

Grandpa

Senior Member
Jun 24, 2011
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It is so amazing, our Heavenly Father, and God is, that even in the Bible's explanations in "simple" terms, so that flesh man might understand, doesn't really give "due diligence" as to His Power and Authority.

One has to "come to grips" with the fact that our Heavenly Father, as well as Messiah, does have enemies! So, it's not so much of a "pre-ordaining" of knowing the "end from the beginning." As it is, a "fore-knowing" of what the enemies of God will do, when peoples love for Him, waxes cold!
You mean they will stop abiding in Christ, turn away from Him and turn to their own work at the 10 commandments instead?

And then call that "Christianity"...
 

NayborBear

Banned Serpent Seed Heresy
This part is wrong. Moses was already coming down with commandments written on stone when he found the people making an idol.

So the transgression HAD ALREADY TAKEN PLACE that caused the law to be added.

What was that transgression? Rejecting Gods Grace and Provision.

The Hebrews wanted to go back to Egypt. They murmured and complained about what God was Providing and doing for them.

God was going to strike them all dead and start over with a different people but Moses was able to stand in the gap for them.


SO the Law that was added because of transgression was the 10 commandments. Those who reject Grace still are sentenced to this same sentence. They get the 10 commandments. AND THEY DO IT IN THEIR OWN UNDERSTANDING. Nobody has to tell them. They automatically do it.

Accepts the Grace that God Gives;
Romans 9:30 What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, which followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith.

Rejects the Grace that God Gives;
Romans 9:31-32
31 But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness.
32 Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone;

What is the cause of legalists going back to or staying in the understanding of working at the 10 commandments?

Rejecting Gods Grace.

2 Corinthians 3:14-15
14 But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ.
15 But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart.


This is the CAUSE of taking the law and splitting it into parts and saying some of it has been abolished but some of it still applies.

Because the understanding of Coming to Christ and receiving Rest hasn't been received. And because of this the vail remains untaken away.
1 Peter 2
24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

Resting IN Christ, as you can see Peter saying here, does NOT cause one to be "refined." Healed? Yes! Refined? No!
Going unto the Father as one is confessed BY Christ, is where the "refining" takes place. Then? It's a "continuous" "Back and forth", from the Father to Jesus "to be healed", to the Father, "to be refined."


It's when one doesn't go "unto" the Father when confessed to Him, is when "things" start going "sideways."
 
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It is so amazing, our Heavenly Father, and God is, that even in the Bible's explanations in "simple" terms, so that flesh man might understand, doesn't really give "due diligence" as to His Power and Authority.

One has to "come to grips" with the fact that our Heavenly Father, as well as Messiah, does have enemies! So, it's not so much of a "pre-ordaining" of knowing the "end from the beginning." As it is, a "fore-knowing" of what the enemies of God will do, when peoples love for Him, waxes cold!

Hey NayborBear,

It is very obvious that the one thing that "obedience", "repentance", "works", etc have in common is what a mans heart, when yielded to the Holy Spirit, does, and that is go into action! These are the exact words that many scoff at though.

Why do you think they scoff so much at our personal desire and enthusiasm to do these things out of Love for our Creator?

SG
 

NayborBear

Banned Serpent Seed Heresy
You mean they will stop abiding in Christ, turn away from Him and turn to their own work at the 10 commandments instead?

And then call that "Christianity"...
No? It's something that "Christianity" doesn't even realize they aren't doing!

Nor, has "Christianity" any idea of, nor can give an interpretation to!

1) The "fullness of the gentiles!"
2) How to "provoke" Israel to jealousy!

CRICKETS!

Ya see? "Christianity" cannot keep going forward being "wise in their own conceits", with the "mind set": "We're going to KEEP on doing it THIS way!" "Not CARING if Israel gets jealous or not!"
As you can see! This "boasting against the branches" gets as DANGEROUS for "Christianity" as it did FOR Israel!
Romans 11

21 For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.
22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou ALSO shalt be cut off.

But, "Christianity" CAN'T "see" that, can it? :cry:
 
Mar 14, 2011
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Philipians 4:13 I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me.

Romans 9:31 But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness.
Romans 9:32 Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone;
Romans 9:33 As it is written, Behold I lay in Sion a stumblingstone and rock of offence and whosoever believeth on Him shall not be ashamed.

I have been given the faith needed to follow the law of righteousness. I do NOT FOLLOW TO ATTAIN WHAT HAS ALREADY BEEN GIVEN, WHAT I ALREADY POSSESS.

CAN YOU NOT SEE HOW "BACKWARDS" THAT TYPE OF THINKING IS?

IT IS ABOUT OSAS, A doctrine of man. Which requires the Word of God "to be changed" to accommodate it.

Once again, you call me unsaved, because I believe in His Law, written within, my heart and mind. I am not ashamed.
1. I never called you unsaved

So once again you are a liar

Don’t come in here telling people they need to obey gods commands,then break them with many of your posts.. you should be ashamed.

And its not about OSAS, Its about the promise of God. CAN GOD DO WHAT HE PROMISED OR NOT? (You need to get off this war you think you are fighting and start to look at the word..

You seem to think Not..

Yet claim you have faith in him

That is circular reasoning is it not?

If God said HE WILL COMPLETE what HE STARTED. Do you not think he will?? YOu seem to think you can overpower him and prevent him from keeping his promise
 
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I just call what I see

If You are offended about what I believe thats sad..

But to say it is calling you names.. While you do this almost every post.. once again just shows your true nature..
 
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My Reply ( see my signature ) where it says Galatians 3:13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law......
Yes he has

So why do you want to go back and follow a law WHICH ONLY HAS THE POWER TO CURSE YOU??

Thats like me being saved from falling through thin ice. Then going back on the thin ice again, and thinking I will nto fall through this time.. Thats called being a fool is it not? (Even I would think I was foolish!)
 

NayborBear

Banned Serpent Seed Heresy
Hey NayborBear,

It is very obvious that the one thing that "obedience", "repentance", "works", etc have in common is what a mans heart, when yielded to the Holy Spirit, does, and that is go into action! These are the exact words that many scoff at though.

Why do you think they scoff so much at our personal desire and enthusiasm to do these things out of Love for our Creator?

SG
Comes from a "high-mindedness" a majority of gentiles have in thinking they are "something special."
Because of this? They "boast against the branches!"
And, pay no heed to the "warning" Paul gave in Romans 11!
 
Mar 14, 2011
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I think it is how you choose to read my words.
Is this your problem with the way you respond to me? The way you read my words?

You seem to have this complex that if someone disagrees with you, They have the problem, it is not your own.

That a sad root from which to try to converse with other people..

As far as the the Pharisees, they were hypocrites who hated Gods Laws and instead justified violations of them by instead adhering to what previous Pharisees and teachers (traditions of the fathers) prescribed. They literally reversed, REVERSED, every one of the ten commandments through their traditions and created systems of burden and harassment of the people through their written traditions. No one could bear up under them, and even since the time of Yahshua' first advent, they have enhanced them even more and they grow more and more anti-Christ year after year. This is who the Pharisees were/are, not how you framed it; "The pharisees loved Gods law" I do not know how you arrived at that about the Pharisees, but I think I corrected that before. Even Paul admitted to being zealous to the traditions of the fathers;

Gal 1:14 KJV And profited in the Jews' religion above many my equals in mine own nation, being more exceedingly zealous of the traditions of my fathers.

Yep, Paul was showing his previous zeal for Talmusdism when he was a Pharisee. Yahshua delivered him from it. This is what Yahshua condemned;

Mar 7:7-9 KJV Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men. (8) For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do. (9) And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.

For once I wish you would read these words and remember them so as to NOT ever try to foist the lie that the Pharisees were anything but a bunch of hypocrites and a few other things.
Paul said he LOVED GODS LAW. He even considered going and killing the followers of Jesus was Gods will,, And remember, according to the LAW He said HE WAS BLAMELESS.

You love to selectively read scripture.. Thats another problem.

The pharisee is not different than religious people today. THEY THINK they love God, when in reality, they spit on his grave..
 
Mar 14, 2011
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Your identification is getting a little fuzzy here EG. So you are criticizing people here who love God and His Laws
Oh? Do I criticize myself? Do I critisize others who love Gods laws and make it a focus of their christian life to see what must be done to get to the point they automatically act like jesus, and by nature OBEY those laws?

Of course not

for something the Jews do and some other "Self Professing Judiazers" is that right? You haven't talked specifics here, which is what I want otherwise take your criticisms to those people.
Well lets see

They take the law, and tar it to peaces. They say this part of the law is no longer valid, but this part, we must follow and obey.

Then instead of lookin got what EMPOWERS them to live righteous lives, They go back to that same law that CONDEMNS, and say we must follow it. If we do not WE HATE GODS LAW

Sound familiar?
 
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My Reply
Ecclesiastes 12:13 Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter Fear God, and keep his commandments for this is the whole duty of man.


Ecclesiastes 12:14 For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil.
You still are begining in the spirit, (grace) but perfecting in the flesh. (Works)
Read gal 3. Paul calls you a name (I will let Paul do it, since You claim I keep calling you names)
 
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Are you saying that the only things that can be lost are things that must be earned ?
i am saying God gave you something so special. And so precious, And he PROMISED that you would never lose it. In fact, he called it eternal life. And now calls you a son (adoption)

If you can ever lose that? It is of works, it is NOT OF GRACE.

You want to earn salvation, feel free..

But good luck, I pray you see the futility of your adventure and how it will fail.
 
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Wise point SW. I think many question not if our Heavenly Father would revoke it, but if a man "abides not" in the vine and hence bears no fruit, perhaps it is a sign that that man has rejected the vine, the gift. Jesus states that The Father Himself will cut off that branch and it will be burned in the fire. Not a pleasant thought. But the fruitless branch rejected, I think we can say that God did not revoke. :)

Abide. :)
This would be EARNING your salvation.

It would mean God revolks his gift

I think the user you responded to answered this question, The gifts and calling of God are IRREVOKABLE
 
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My Reply

Maybe you will answer this for me,

I have this passage that is written to GODS ELECT " but as touching the election, they are beloved for the father's sakes for the gifts and calling of God are without repentance" Clearly for Gods elect and no one else here,

Romans 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob
Romans 11:27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.
Romans 11:28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the father's sakes.
Romans 11:29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.
Romans 11:30 For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief:
Romans 11:31 Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy.

Where is it written that " the gifts and callings of God are IRREVOCABLE" for everyone else?
Everyone else did not get the gift.

So there is nothing to revoke..
 
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Nobody said that. What people are arguing is this idea which some believers have, that if you're given the gift of salvation that you can lose it. I believe Jesus is well capable of finishing what He started. As you have just posted.
Amen, The bible says he WILL complete it. It does not say he might. Or he will only complete it if we help him (how foolish are we if we think we can help God in the first place)
 
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Ok. You trust in your work.

I'll trust in the Lord.

I'm certain that He will complete what He has started and He will Do what He has Promised.
Its amazing that naylor bear dislikes a post where you call out the promise of God..
 

gb9

Senior Member
Jan 18, 2011
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Thanks, You just showed you have no comprehension of the gift that God is offering nor do you understand th law.
it really is sad, they contradict themselves all over the place, play hopscotch all over Scripture, ignore word definitions, and context, yet tell us we " don't get it".


modern day Pharisees , searching the Scriptures , thinking they will find eternal life. the Scripture points to Jesus, but they won't come to Him.....