Did Jesus ever tell us that we no longer need to keep the law of Moses?

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Dan_473

Senior Member
Mar 11, 2014
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Well I guess there are 4 Gospels for that reason and like all viewpoints they vary slightly like any witness accounts. But they mostly agree I think. Why is Christianity not all of one viewpoint?


World Christianity consists of 6 major ecclesiastico-cultural blocs, divided into 300 major ecclesiastical traditions, composed of over 33,000 distinct denominations in 238 countries.


There cannot be 33,000 different representations of Jesus. No one should doubt the Apostles but Bibles can differ in their interpretation and many people don't actually read the Bible but listen to the Preachers without reading it at all.


Most Churches in the UK quote Paul more than Jesus although I am not sure why this is.

But disputes over whether some of Mark is dubious or whether Jesus preached to Noah's people or not are just mistranslation errors which do not help. That is why I stick to the KJV because it's written in the simplest language. I do not know all the answers but I know that people's beliefs on this forum differ greatly. How can that be?


Just read the “speaking in tongues” posts on earlier today. All the posts quote the same Scripture but they read them differently or “interpret” them differently.


I do not think that Jesus and His apostles are saying different things it is just "interpreted" to be that way by some. Jesus made clear all his words and if some say they contradict others statements (or appear to do so to them) then Jesus is the first to believe is what I meant. I was especially talking about what Jesus said about the Law which was some on here say is done away with.
Yes, there are four Gospels. All of them were written down on paper by human hands, none of them were written down by Jesus himself.

Of course we can say that God made sure that each writer remembered correctly, and got exactly the right words down on paper. But then, why not also believe that God inspired the apostles to write down exactly the right words in their letters?

If you trust the KJV, I think this verse deals directly with gentiles and the law.

Acts 21: 24. Them take, and purify thyself with them, and be at charges with them, that they may shave their heads: and all may know that those things, whereof they were informed concerning thee, are nothing; but that thou thyself also walkest orderly, and
keepest the law.
25. As touching the Gentiles which believe, we have written and
concluded that they observe no such thing,
save only that they keep themselves from things offered to idols, and from blood, and from strangled, and from fornication.

No such thing as what? I think the antecedent is the thing immediately previous, "keeping the law".
 

Heyjude

Active member
Sep 7, 2019
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Hi Heyjude, nice to meet you!

I've heard of this idea that maybe there is a conflict between what Jesus said when he walked here on Earth and what the apostles later wrote in their Epistles.

One thing a person may wish to consider is who is likely to have a better understanding of what Jesus meant? Those who grew up in the same culture and spoke the same native language? Or those of us today, 2000 years later?

I think another interesting question is, who wrote the book of Matthew? If it was an apostle who wrote down the words of Jesus in that book, then what happens if an apostle can't be trusted?
Sorry Dan so rude of me.... I forgot to say Nice to meet you as well!
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
31,565
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The ceremonial law related specifically to Israel’s worship (see Lev 1:2-3, for example). Its primary purpose was to point forward to Jesus Christ; these laws, therefore, were no longer necessary after Jesus’ death and resurrection.
so you're one of those people saying the law was done away with, too?

while you smile and pretend you're not deleting jots and tittles?
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
31,565
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so you're one of those people saying the law was done away with, too?

while you smile and pretend you're not deleting jots and tittles?
you have plenty of other hypocritical company in this thread.
welcome.


beware of flattery.
 

Heyjude

Active member
Sep 7, 2019
277
121
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Did you read the reply? The ceremonial laws were done away with but not the moral law. Not one jot or tittle unless you think Heaven and Earth have passed away? When did that happen?
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
31,565
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Did you read the reply? The ceremonial laws were done away with but not the moral law. Not one jot or tittle unless you think Heaven and Earth have passed away? When did that happen?
you said: "The ceremonial laws were done away"

what % of the jots and tittles of the law do you figure that is? i admit '2/3' is just an estimate.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
31,565
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hey @Heyjude, no one in the Bible ever talked about the Law as though there's 3 parts and you can delete 1 or 2 of them.
no one, ever.

God speaks of the whole law as one law.
Moses speaks of the whole law as one law.
Jesus speaks of the whole law as one law.
Paul speaks of the whole law as one law.
the council in Jerusalem speaks of the whole law as one law.
James speaks of the whole law as one law.

you speak of the law as parts you can selectively ignore.
that's not scriptural. not even in the least. it is however, very common these days.

you said you trust Jesus before anyone else. well, He said '
not one jot' -- so maybe you ought to do some thinking about that.


righteousness does not change. the believer is not under law, but grace: not because even a single dot of the law is removed, but because the believer has died with Christ, and is hidden in Christ, and the law, which is the power of sin, has no jurisdiction whatsoever over the dead.

you'll have plenty of people giving you thumbs up in this thread, and telling you how nice you are and how much they like what you say, tho, if you want to continue in hypocrisy. there are number of people regularly posting who claim to be under the law, and claim to be keeping it, all the while ignoring 2/3 of it ((let's just stick with the 2/3 number until we can get a more accurate estimate)). they love to have more converts.

i hope you enjoy your time with us either way :)
 

Yahshua

Senior Member
Sep 22, 2013
2,387
553
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hey @Heyjude, no one in the Bible ever talked about the Law as though there's 3 parts and you can delete 1 or 2 of them.
no one, ever.


God speaks of the whole law as one law.
Moses speaks of the whole law as one law.
Jesus speaks of the whole law as one law.
Paul speaks of the whole law as one law.
the council in Jerusalem speaks of the whole law as one law.
James speaks of the whole law as one law.


you speak of the law as parts you can selectively ignore.
that's not scriptural. not even in the least. it is however, very common these days.


you said you trust Jesus before anyone else. well, He said 'not one jot' -- so maybe you ought to do some thinking about that.

righteousness does not change. the believer is not under law, but grace: not because even a single dot of the law is removed, but because the believer has died with Christ, and is hidden in Christ, and the law, which is the power of sin, has no jurisdiction whatsoever over the dead.

you'll have plenty of people giving you thumbs up in this thread, and telling you how nice you are and how much they like what you say, tho, if you want to continue in hypocrisy. there are number of people regularly posting who claim to be under the law, and claim to be keeping it, all the while ignoring 2/3 of it ((let's just stick with the 2/3 number until we can get a more accurate estimate)). they love to have more converts.

i hope you enjoy your time with us either way :)
What about the phrase "laws, statutes, judgments" or "laws, statutes and ordinances" often repeated in scripture by the Almighty, by Moses...?
 
May 1, 2019
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hey @Heyjude, no one in the Bible ever talked about the Law as though there's 3 parts and you can delete 1 or 2 of them.
no one, ever.


God speaks of the whole law as one law.
Moses speaks of the whole law as one law.
Jesus speaks of the whole law as one law.
Paul speaks of the whole law as one law.
the council in Jerusalem speaks of the whole law as one law.
James speaks of the whole law as one law.


you speak of the law as parts you can selectively ignore.
that's not scriptural. not even in the least. it is however, very common these days.


you said you trust Jesus before anyone else. well, He said 'not one jot' -- so maybe you ought to do some thinking about that.

righteousness does not change. the believer is not under law, but grace: not because even a single dot of the law is removed, but because the believer has died with Christ, and is hidden in Christ, and the law, which is the power of sin, has no jurisdiction whatsoever over the dead.

you'll have plenty of people giving you thumbs up in this thread, and telling you how nice you are and how much they like what you say, tho, if you want to continue in hypocrisy. there are number of people regularly posting who claim to be under the law, and claim to be keeping it, all the while ignoring 2/3 of it ((let's just stick with the 2/3 number until we can get a more accurate estimate)). they love to have more converts.

i hope you enjoy your time with us either way :)
Too mechanical PH,

The Holy Spirit leads men into all truth. You ask, how do you have the audacity of choosing how to interpret the Scriptures!?

The Holy Spirit writes upon a mans heart. Did you give the Holy Spirit the list to write from? Or did God? If a man who is anointed with the Holy Spirit follows what is put upon his heart and it does not jive with your list is it then wrong?

Rom 14:2-10 NIV One man's faith allows him to eat everything, but another man, whose faith is weak, eats only vegetables. (3) The man who eats everything must not look down on him who does not, and the man who does not eat everything must not condemn the man who does, for God has accepted him. (4) Who are you to judge someone else's servant? To his own master he stands or falls. And he will stand, for the Lord is able to make him stand. (5) One man considers one day more sacred than another; another man considers every day alike. Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind. (6) He who regards one day as special, does so to the Lord. He who eats meat, eats to the Lord, for he gives thanks to God; and he who abstains, does so to the Lord and gives thanks to God. (7) For none of us lives to himself alone and none of us dies to himself alone. (8) If we live, we live to the Lord; and if we die, we die to the Lord. So, whether we live or die, we belong to the Lord. (9) For this very reason, Christ died and returned to life so that he might be the Lord of both the dead and the living. (10) You, then, why do you judge your brother? Or why do you look down on your brother? For we will all stand before God's judgment seat.


Are you like the Pharisee?;

Luk 18:9-14 NIV To some who were confident of their own righteousness and looked down on everybody else, Jesus told this parable: (10) "Two men went up to the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. (11) The Pharisee stood up and prayed about himself: 'God, I thank you that I am not like other men—robbers, evildoers, adulterers—or even like this tax collector. (12) I fast twice a week and give a tenth of all I get.' (13) "But the tax collector stood at a distance. He would not even look up to heaven, but beat his breast and said, 'God, have mercy on me, a sinner.' (14) "I tell you that this man, rather than the other, went home justified before God. For everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, and he who humbles himself will be exalted."
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
31,565
10,549
113
What about the phrase "laws, statutes, judgments" or "laws, statutes and ordinances" often repeated in scripture by the Almighty, by Moses...?
whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it.
(James 2:10)
 
May 1, 2019
1,336
744
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What about the phrase "laws, statutes, judgments" or "laws, statutes and ordinances" often repeated in scripture by the Almighty, by Moses...?

1Ki 2:3 KJV And keep the charge of the LORD thy God, to walk in his ways, to keep his statutes, and his commandments, and his judgments, and his testimonies, as it is written in the law of Moses, that thou mayest prosper in all that thou doest, and whithersoever thou turnest thyself:
 

Heyjude

Active member
Sep 7, 2019
277
121
43
you have plenty of other hypocritical company in this thread.
welcome.


beware of flattery.
Oh I dont fall for flattery
hey @Heyjude, no one in the Bible ever talked about the Law as though there's 3 parts and you can delete 1 or 2 of them.
no one, ever.


God speaks of the whole law as one law.
Moses speaks of the whole law as one law.
Jesus speaks of the whole law as one law.
Paul speaks of the whole law as one law.
the council in Jerusalem speaks of the whole law as one law.
James speaks of the whole law as one law.


you speak of the law as parts you can selectively ignore.
that's not scriptural. not even in the least. it is however, very common these days.


you said you trust Jesus before anyone else. well, He said 'not one jot' -- so maybe you ought to do some thinking about that.

righteousness does not change. the believer is not under law, but grace: not because even a single dot of the law is removed, but because the believer has died with Christ, and is hidden in Christ, and the law, which is the power of sin, has no jurisdiction whatsoever over the dead.

you'll have plenty of people giving you thumbs up in this thread, and telling you how nice you are and how much they like what you say, tho, if you want to continue in hypocrisy. there are number of people regularly posting who claim to be under the law, and claim to be keeping it, all the while ignoring 2/3 of it ((let's just stick with the 2/3 number until we can get a more accurate estimate)). they love to have more converts.

i hope you enjoy your time with us either way :)
You talk of jurisdiction. Like you are saying "this does not apply to me". That's not the Point. Some people think the Law is a good idea. Don't you get it? And obviously there are different laws, which is why some were in stone (moral law) and some were put in the side of the arc (ceremonial law) and they only applied to the Israelites at that time. Some people are do-ers of the moral law you know. Why do you ignore scripture? You don't seem to answer the questions I ask back but say rude and insulting things.

No need to be unkind is there? And just because people are welcoming on here doesn't mean you have to be mean about it.

  1. For it is not the hearers of the law who are righteous before God, but the doers of the law who will be justified.

Romans 2:13
 

Yahshua

Senior Member
Sep 22, 2013
2,387
553
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no one in the Bible ever talked about the Law as though there's 3 parts...no one ever.
Does the phrase "laws, statutes, judgments" or "laws, statutes and ordinances" count? However it's rendered in translations, it's usually rendered as different elements.
 

Yahshua

Senior Member
Sep 22, 2013
2,387
553
113
1Ki 2:3 KJV And keep the charge of the LORD thy God, to walk in his ways, to keep his statutes, and his commandments, and his judgments, and his testimonies, as it is written in the law of Moses, that thou mayest prosper in all that thou doest, and whithersoever thou turnest thyself:
Genesis 26:5
Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
31,565
10,549
113
obviously there are different laws, which is why some were in stone (moral law) and some were put in the side of the arc (ceremonial law) and they only applied to the Israelites at that time.

you are making excuses to delete 2/3 of the law.

to tell you the truth is not to insult you or to be rude; flattery is.

have a nice time. your new friends are currently arriving to help slander me.
 
May 1, 2019
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Genesis 26:5
Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.
Luk 1:6 KJV And they were both righteous before God, walking in all the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blameless.
 

Heyjude

Active member
Sep 7, 2019
277
121
43
you are making excuses to delete 2/3 of the law.

to tell you the truth is not to insult you or to be rude; flattery is.

have a nice time. your new friends are currently arriving to help slander me.
 

Yahshua

Senior Member
Sep 22, 2013
2,387
553
113
Luk 1:6 KJV And they were both righteous before God, walking in all the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blameless.
Deuteronomy 6:1
Now these are the commandments, the statutes, and the judgments, which the LORD your God commanded to teach you, that ye might do them in the land whither ye go to possess it: