Do you believe you can get to know God better by learning in general?

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B

BeyondET

Guest
#21
Some thing which many Christians still have to learn is that everything is not EXPLICITLY stated in Scripture. God has many truths which are implicit, since He expects us to labor in the Word and doctrine, not simply look for "easy pickins".

So yes the Bible does not state explicitly that the world is only 6,000 years old (or approximately so). However, the Holy Spirit has carefully recorded for us many genealogies and also given us "dates" as to when the patriarchs were born, when they died, and how long they lived on earth. In addition to that we have various secular chronologies.

However, Martin Anstey created a chronology which is (a) strictly based on the Masoretic Hebrew Text of the Old Testament and the Authorized Version of the Bible (KJV), (b) corrected the chronology of Ptolemy (on which almost all chronologers have relied but is in error by over 80 years) and (c) used the creation of Adam as the first Year of Man (Anno Hominis or AH).

You will find his research in The Chronology of the Old Testament and it is worth reading if you want to know the truth. So based on the Year of Man, the earth is indeed approximately 6,000 years old, and archeology and radiometric data also confirm this to a large degree.

Naturally, the Bible is in conflict with Evolutionism with its millions and billions of years for species to evolve. But evolution is not genuine science, and many respected scientists (Christian and non-Christian) have rejected the theory of evolution (which is essentially absurd). Genuine science will never be in conflict with Scripture, since the same God who created the universe also created the natural laws through which science has been established.
Well that is a little mixing of evolution and science theory, science alone supports billion year old universe without any monkey to man theories, but maybe the dust on a shoreline of deep sea corals, lol
 
May 13, 2017
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#22
Well that is a little mixing of evolution and science theory, science alone supports billion year old universe without any monkey to man theories, but maybe the dust on a shoreline of deep sea corals, lol
Looking at geneology you can see that man has been for about six thousand years but I have to agree, the bible does not say the age of the Earth. And the civilizations before Adam are not counted either.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
5,800
553
113
#23
Looking at geneology you can see that man has been for about six thousand years but I have to agree, the bible does not say the age of the Earth. And the civilizations before Adam are not counted either.
How could there be "civilizations before Adam" since Adam was created on the 6th day of creation, and the Ten Commandments confirm that all of the universe was created in those six days (Excodus 20:8-11)?

Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.

Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:


But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:


For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.
 
P

Persuaded

Guest
#24
We learn of God by the study of His Word.
Now we must know how to read and comprehend, and understood every word.
We must understand who is speaking, who they are speaking to, what they are spraking about, why they are speaking, and the time frame, (past, present, future).
There is much more to it than just reading words.
One must know HOW to study.
 
B

BeyondET

Guest
#25
Looking at geneology you can see that man has been for about six thousand years but I have to agree, the bible does not say the age of the Earth. And the civilizations before Adam are not counted either.
I agree, the Adam n eve story, can be of the first souled humans IMO.
 
B

BeyondET

Guest
#26
How could there be "civilizations before Adam" since Adam was created on the 6th day of creation, and the Ten Commandments confirm that all of the universe was created in those six days (Excodus 20:8-11)?

Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.

Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:


But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:


For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.
That depends on how one looks at those verses, then there was morning and evening, a dawn and a dusk, continueous ambient light.

A simplied account that can be as well of complexity for future gens, Sort of like teaching pre schoolers how to place the square peg in the right place.
 
May 13, 2017
2,359
27
0
#27
How could there be "civilizations before Adam" since Adam was created on the 6th day of creation, and the Ten Commandments confirm that all of the universe was created in those six days (Excodus 20:8-11)?

Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.

Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:


But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:


For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.
LOL Well Keep in mind that I did not say human civilizations.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
5,800
553
113
#28
A simplified account that can be as well of complexity for future gens, Sort of like teaching pre schoolers how to place the square peg in the right place.
I believe the Lord placed that confirmation of the six day creation account within the Ten Commandments because He anticipated that men would question it, or read into it more than was revealed. The Holy Spirit deliberately placed that statement about EVENING AND MORNING to define each day in the Creation account.

Since the Hebrew day begins and ends at sundown (assumed to be 6:00 p.m.) all conservative Bible scholars and students accept this as a definition of a literal 24-hour day. And since the Ten Commandments were to read by ordinary people and scholars, "for is six days" ties in with "six days shalt thou labour". There can be absolutely no misunderstanding here, so trying to make those creation days anything other than regular 24 hour days indicates a desire to subvert Bible truth.
 
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Angela53510

Senior Member
Jan 24, 2011
9,946
772
113
#29
Because I am a teacher, and I would be a professional student, I have always had a love of learning. In teacher training, we learned to inspire "life long learners!" That is my goal. To be learning and growing my whole life!

So, I do love learning new things, especially about God's earth! I am an avid gardener, and I inherited a lot of new and unusual flowers when we moved to a warmer climate. I am just now learning their names, and the variety in creation is astounding.

In fact, when I was a new Christian in university, I was specializing in Biogeography, which is the interaction of plants and animals. The professor had done a lot of exploring in both the savannahs and rain forests in South American.

He talked about "relic" areas, which were rain forests with literally millions of unnamed and unknown plant and animal species. And sadly, industry is slashing and burning a lot of those areas. I talked a lot with my professor about this, who was a Christian. He theorized that this was left over from before the flood, and represented the incredible diversity and creative power of Jesus in creation. And how sad it is to see the world devolving, and deforestation destroying this diversity. Because these areas are so small, it would be wonderful, to see them preserved, but that has not happened!

Anyway, in a secular university, I met a Christian professor, and was able to learn about a living testimony to God's creation. I doubt I would have learned about that just sitting at home reading my Bible! Including the locations of these relic areas. As to why they were preserved? Well, perhaps that area was uplifted and was covered by only a small amount of water, and thus the flora and fauna preserved? Of course, that is mere speculation! But, a witness to the fact that the earth is not evolving and getting more diverse, but the exact fact that the earth is losing speciation, losing diversity. And that the earth was created perfectly with full complement of "kinds" and that evolution is just a bad theory which doesn't fit the facts. (Sorry long earthers, that is how I see it)

I will love to study and learn new things as long as I live. Right now, I am learning German, to complement my Greek, and reviewing Hebrew. But, I am also learning more about gardening, a passion. And I am a musician, and I learn new music daily. Another life long passion! God's gift to humanity, music, and the more I play and learn, the better I can glorify God when I play in church.

So, does that mean I only study science, or art or music? No! Studying the Bible is always my top priority. At the end of a day, no matter how much I have accomplished, or what new exciting things I have learned, if I have not read my Bible, and prayed and sought God, then my day is just ashes.

So, I believe thinking Christians need to study, and to be involved in commerce, science, the arts and politics. Or sports or trades and journalism and a thousand other areas of study! And to do that, requires studying non-biblical material. But, to truly be an effective Christian in whatever God calls us to do, we need to remain totally grounded in the Word, reading the Bible through, in context, and also studying the deeper things of the Word.
 

oldethennew

Senior Member
Feb 28, 2016
7,619
428
83
#30
like you Angela,

we've both spent a lift-time studying and learning, especially after our 'conversion' -
at this point in our lives, we respect others opinions and take all things to heart,
their life's experiences, etc., whether scholars or whom ever our Father puts
in our every day paths as we live day-by-day...you know, the 'common-folk',
like we really all are in His eyes...
but of course we only rely on The Holy Spirit's Truths to teach us what we
really need to learn in order to grow in the gift of Grace and knowledge
from our Heavenly Father, without question and to share His Word
and gifts with those whom He leads us to...
 
Y

Yahweh_is_gracious

Guest
#31
I've wanted to reply, but since this is the BDF, I feel as though I must choose my words very, very carefully.

The more I studied the topics I was required to in school and the more I studied the topics that interested me, the more I discovered that could not be adequately answered by modern theories.

I feel I should limit my answer to the above sentence. Seeing as this is the BDF, and everyone here is so ultra-intelligent, there should be no issue with people correctly discerning the meaning of my statement without the slightest bit of confusion or taking my words out of context. Yeah, that's it.
 

preacher4truth

Senior Member
Dec 28, 2016
6,004
259
83
#32
What I mean by that is when you study mathematics, languages, biology, physics, chemistry, history, geography and other fields of knowledge? I believe we can, by following this logic: the more we know about God's creation, the more we know about the Creator. There are hidden mysteries and knowledge to be obtained in almost every field of knowledge I believe.

For example before studying natural sciences I wouldn't be able to ascertain God created everything in 6 literal days and the earth is only about 6000 years old, but after doing research on it I found out about all the evidence proving the bible is true, before that I would take those statements on faith.

I believe it's the same thing with other fields of knowledge when we learn it can be a way to glorify our God, by getting to know the creation better, and glorifying the Creator.
Yes, I believe a converted person can learn more about God in this way.
 

mcubed

Senior Member
Dec 20, 2013
1,419
162
63
#33
Oh absolutely! When I was in University my anatomy professor said that because all living things are made with 5% (some element… I forget 20 years later I think it was carbon… even sea creatures have it, and that was his point ) he said it was evidence of evolution. I asked my anatomy him asked him if it could not also be true that there is a common thread because if a Creators signature. Our English professor would know our papers even without our name because of our writing styles. Famous painters are known by their brush strokes. A creator has a signature. Is it not possible this could be the signature of a creator? He said it could, but it’s not. The “cool” thing was I had like 20 other students respond, yeah? after my question. I did not make my professor change his mind but those students thought about it. Today, I live in a city where there is heavy snow. I HATE SNOW!!!! I tell my employees, at work, I prayed to get to work. I tell G-d He made the snow and ice for some stupid reason but since you made it and you know I have to get to work You are responsible for me to get there safely. They look at me like I’m crazy… but it is true… and He does. Once in a meeting some higher up was asking me about myself…. She asked me what I like to read, I told her I read a lot of Answers in Genesis. They are Creationist. She asked me do you believe people lived here on Earth with dinosaurs. I swallowed and boldly said yes. I believe the Genesis account of creation…. We spoke again latter. I had an answer for every question of my faith. The point is… people are hungry in all walks of life, it hit the nail on the head. If we cannot testify G-d’s Word is the infallible, inerrant Word of G-d who will? Men are saved by the word of our testimony!!!!!
 

Marano

Senior Member
Dec 7, 2011
385
25
28
23
#34
Some thing which many Christians still have to learn is that everything is not EXPLICITLY stated in Scripture. God has many truths which are implicit, since He expects us to labor in the Word and doctrine, not simply look for "easy pickins".

So yes the Bible does not state explicitly that the world is only 6,000 years old (or approximately so). However, the Holy Spirit has carefully recorded for us many genealogies and also given us "dates" as to when the patriarchs were born, when they died, and how long they lived on earth. In addition to that we have various secular chronologies.

However, Martin Anstey created a chronology which is (a) strictly based on the Masoretic Hebrew Text of the Old Testament and the Authorized Version of the Bible (KJV), (b) corrected the chronology of Ptolemy (on which almost all chronologers have relied but is in error by over 80 years) and (c) used the creation of Adam as the first Year of Man (Anno Hominis or AH).

You will find his research in The Chronology of the Old Testament and it is worth reading if you want to know the truth. So based on the Year of Man, the earth is indeed approximately 6,000 years old, and archeology and radiometric data also confirm this to a large degree.

Naturally, the Bible is in conflict with Evolutionism with its millions and billions of years for species to evolve. But evolution is not genuine science, and many respected scientists (Christian and non-Christian) have rejected the theory of evolution (which is essentially absurd). Genuine science will never be in conflict with Scripture, since the same God who created the universe also created the natural laws through which science has been established.
I cannot agree with you more, evolution is not real science, real science corroborates the bible, and real science really supports the earth is around 6000 years old and I'm surprised many christians still deny this and side with an evolution/old earth view of creation.
 
B

BeyondET

Guest
#35
I believe the Lord placed that confirmation of the six day creation account within the Ten Commandments because He anticipated that men would question it, or read into it more than was revealed. The Holy Spirit deliberately placed that statement about EVENING AND MORNING to define each day in the Creation account.

Since the Hebrew day begins and ends at sundown (assumed to be 6:00 p.m.) all conservative Bible scholars and students accept this as a definition of a literal 24-hour day. And since the Ten Commandments were to read by ordinary people and scholars, "for is six days" ties in with "six days shalt thou labour". There can be absolutely no misunderstanding here, so trying to make those creation days anything other than regular 24 hour days indicates a desire to subvert Bible truth.
I here ya, good reason why I'm done speak on things, I'm heading back to live among the people, at least they are open to reasoning,
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
5,800
553
113
#36
Well that is a little mixing of evolution and science theory, science alone supports billion year old universe without any monkey to man theories, but maybe the dust on a shoreline of deep sea corals, lol
Here is a source which shows us why the billions of years may not be true.
Age of the earth - creation.com

Can science prove the age of the earth?
No scientific method can prove the age of the earth and the universe, and that includes the ones we have listed here. Although age indicators are called ‘clocks’ they aren’t, because all ages result from calculations that necessarily involve making assumptions about the past. Always the starting time of the ‘clock’ has to be assumed as well as the way in which the speed of the clock has varied over time. Further, it has to be assumed that the clock was never disturbed.
There is no independent natural clock against which those assumptions can be tested.
 
May 13, 2017
2,359
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#37
Here is a source which shows us why the billions of years may not be true.
Age of the earth - creation.com

I believe that there is no way for us to come to a hard and fast time frame of Earths age. We know however that the civilizations before Adam lasted up to two million years. and the occupants of the planet were here almost from the creation of the planet. I am guessing that the Earth is no more than three million years old.
 

Marano

Senior Member
Dec 7, 2011
385
25
28
23
#38
Because I am a teacher, and I would be a professional student, I have always had a love of learning. In teacher training, we learned to inspire "life long learners!" That is my goal. To be learning and growing my whole life!

So, I do love learning new things, especially about God's earth! I am an avid gardener, and I inherited a lot of new and unusual flowers when we moved to a warmer climate. I am just now learning their names, and the variety in creation is astounding.

In fact, when I was a new Christian in university, I was specializing in Biogeography, which is the interaction of plants and animals. The professor had done a lot of exploring in both the savannahs and rain forests in South American.

He talked about "relic" areas, which were rain forests with literally millions of unnamed and unknown plant and animal species. And sadly, industry is slashing and burning a lot of those areas. I talked a lot with my professor about this, who was a Christian. He theorized that this was left over from before the flood, and represented the incredible diversity and creative power of Jesus in creation. And how sad it is to see the world devolving, and deforestation destroying this diversity. Because these areas are so small, it would be wonderful, to see them preserved, but that has not happened!

Anyway, in a secular university, I met a Christian professor, and was able to learn about a living testimony to God's creation. I doubt I would have learned about that just sitting at home reading my Bible! Including the locations of these relic areas. As to why they were preserved? Well, perhaps that area was uplifted and was covered by only a small amount of water, and thus the flora and fauna preserved? Of course, that is mere speculation! But, a witness to the fact that the earth is not evolving and getting more diverse, but the exact fact that the earth is losing speciation, losing diversity. And that the earth was created perfectly with full complement of "kinds" and that evolution is just a bad theory which doesn't fit the facts. (Sorry long earthers, that is how I see it)

I will love to study and learn new things as long as I live. Right now, I am learning German, to complement my Greek, and reviewing Hebrew. But, I am also learning more about gardening, a passion. And I am a musician, and I learn new music daily. Another life long passion! God's gift to humanity, music, and the more I play and learn, the better I can glorify God when I play in church.

So, does that mean I only study science, or art or music? No! Studying the Bible is always my top priority. At the end of a day, no matter how much I have accomplished, or what new exciting things I have learned, if I have not read my Bible, and prayed and sought God, then my day is just ashes.

So, I believe thinking Christians need to study, and to be involved in commerce, science, the arts and politics. Or sports or trades and journalism and a thousand other areas of study! And to do that, requires studying non-biblical material. But, to truly be an effective Christian in whatever God calls us to do, we need to remain totally grounded in the Word, reading the Bible through, in context, and also studying the deeper things of the Word.
Yeah, I believe there are a multitude of ways we can learn more about the Lord, this is a great post.
 

Dai3234

Senior Member
Sep 6, 2016
524
3
0
#39
I don't think we learn anything much. I think from what I've experienced in my own personal experience so far, is that God will send messages in some way, but they end up saying ignore everything except Bible.

Seriously. Like today I've seen YouTube videos on various bible things. Then suddenly, again, a random video shows up showing a connection to aiding and abetting of pastor's (kissing Pope etc).
Kind of puts me off YouTube. Now I've got nearly nothing but a church that barely functions as a church.

You don't learn much about God away from scripture, unless God lets you as a blessing in some way. Or it's a way of pointing out (for me so far) im not listening and reading as im asked to, in Bible.
 

mcubed

Senior Member
Dec 20, 2013
1,419
162
63
#40
My heart gets so sad and confused by the Christians that can even believe in evolution or billions of years…. If G-d’s Word is a lie about 6 days creation how is it even possible to believe some man, was perfect, (we will leave out G-d Himself for the ones that do not believe Y-shua is G-d) died on a cross, rose from the dead three days later, a now if you accept Him as Lord and Savior you will not go to hell. Then is hell even a literal place…. How make believe does this needing a Savior called Y-shua sound anyway. The only reason we need a Savior is because we must answer to a Creator. I mean if there is a lie in the Bible is there not others? How do you choose what is truth or just a story? If Creation is a lie or not literal then the whole thing about needing a Savior and Messiah could be too!!!

We know that anything other than Y-shua and Him Crucified as our Lord and Savior is nonscience and so is anything but the creation story as literal just like Messiah!!!!
 
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