Dominion . . ?

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posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
30,830
10,123
113
#1
does the church have a duty/mandate to impose a veneer of outward righteousness on an unregenerate, unbelieving world through legislated ethical behaviour?

is it the appointed task of Christendom to take hold of governmental & legislative power and in so doing force the lost to act like they're not wicked?

would appreciate examples / justification from scripture and discussion of the theological underpinnings of your views; thanks!
 

tourist

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2014
34,271
11,943
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66
Tennessee
#2
A prime example of Christendom taking hold of government was the Inquisition. I am of the opinion that you cannot legislate morality and, God forbid, the US government ever tries to do such a thing. It would surely be a moral disaster.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
14,299
6,663
113
#3
does the church have a duty/mandate to impose a veneer of outward righteousness on an unregenerate, unbelieving world through legislated ethical behaviour?
Dominion Theology is unbiblical. In any event, since the evildoers are now in total control, it has become irrelevant.
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
17,501
9,586
113
#4
Dominion Theology is unbiblical. In any event, since the evildoers are now in total control, it has become irrelevant.
If the evildoers are in total control now, when weren't they?
 

SoulWeaver

Senior Member
Oct 25, 2014
4,891
2,528
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#5
If the evildoers are in total control now, when weren't they?
“The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers.”

― Socrates


"I see no hope for the future of our people if they are dependent on frivolous youth of today, for certainly all youth are reckless beyond words... When I was young, we were taught to be discreet and respectful of elders, but the present youth are exceedingly wise [disrespectful] and impatient of restraint".

Hesiod, 8th century BC



"The world is passing through troublous times. The young people of today think of nothing but themselves. They have no reverence for parents or old age. They are impatient of all restraint. They talk as if they knew everything, and what passes for wisdom with us is foolishness with them. As for the girls, they are forward, immodest and unladylike in speech, behavior and dress."

(From a sermon preached by Peter the Hermit in A.D. 1274)
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
17,501
9,586
113
#6
does the church have a duty/mandate to impose a veneer of outward righteousness on an unregenerate, unbelieving world through legislated ethical behaviour?

is it the appointed task of Christendom to take hold of governmental & legislative power and in so doing force the lost to act like they're not wicked?

would appreciate examples / justification from scripture and discussion of the theological underpinnings of your views; thanks!
I could respond with a treatise, but instead I'll choose just one concept:

Isaiah 58:6 “Is not this the kind of fasting I have chosen: to loose the chains of injustice and untie the cords of the yoke, to set the oppressed free and break every yoke?"

I don't think that "Christian takeover of government" is in view here, but rather, effort to bring about righteous laws that make it possible to live in peace, relatively free from oppression. That doesn't force sinners to act like saints, but it does make (some kinds of ) sinful behaviour less attractive because the consequences are unpleasant to the sinner.
 

SoulWeaver

Senior Member
Oct 25, 2014
4,891
2,528
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#7
I don't know what is this theology, but these Scriptures come to mind related to the opening post...

Revelation 22:11 He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still.
Romans 7:5 For when we were in the flesh, the motions of sins, which were by the law, did work in our members to bring forth fruit unto death.
 
S

Scribe

Guest
#9
I believe every Christian should be dedicated to world evangelism and let the dead bury the dead. You Preaching the Gospel and the Word of God will influence more people in your lifetime than voting for a law in congress.
 

p_rehbein

Senior Member
Sep 4, 2013
27,407
4,675
113
#10
does the church have a duty/mandate to impose a veneer of outward righteousness on an unregenerate, unbelieving world through legislated ethical behaviour?

is it the appointed task of Christendom to take hold of governmental & legislative power and in so doing force the lost to act like they're not wicked?

would appreciate examples / justification from scripture and discussion of the theological underpinnings of your views; thanks!
Seems to me the Church only has ONE DUTY. To do the Will of God here on earth. We have been purposed by God, and equipped by the Holy Spirit with the ability(ies) necessary to fulfill the purpose God has purposed us for. This is the duty of the Church.

People worried about their Nation only need to turn to Scripture to see what they should do to make their Nation whole..............

2 Chronicles, Chapter 7:

14) If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.
 

calibob

Sinner saved by grace
May 29, 2018
8,268
5,463
113
Anaheim, Cali.
#11
does the church have a duty/mandate to impose a veneer of outward righteousness on an unregenerate, unbelieving world through legislated ethical behaviour?

is it the appointed task of Christendom to take hold of governmental & legislative power and in so doing force the lost to act like they're not wicked?

would appreciate examples / justification from scripture and discussion of the theological underpinnings of your views; thanks!
NO! Be in the world not of the world... Avoid appearances of evil... and John 16:11 ...and in regard to judgment, because the prince of this world has been condemned. and from @Magenta


It's not our job to change the world. The world is doomed already. It is our job to carry the message. Not the whole damned world! Only Jesus saves, not us!
 

calibob

Sinner saved by grace
May 29, 2018
8,268
5,463
113
Anaheim, Cali.
#14
you could go all the way back to Nimrod, to be honest - and God bade Noah build an ark, not a city or a nation.
Very true. I laughed because I think a lot of Nimrods now-a-daze don't know who the real Nimrod was or what he did.

I read somewhere long ago, that he and his mother were the models for Baal and Asherah worship since before the Egyptians or Canaanites' .

That was truly a very long time ago. :geek: (So what if I'm a nerd?) (Just food for thought)
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
30,830
10,123
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#15
Very true. I laughed because I think a lot of Nimrods now-a-daze don't know who the real Nimrod was or what he did.

I read somewhere long ago, that he and his mother were the models for Baal and Asherah worship since before the Egyptians or Canaanites' .

That was truly a very long time ago. :geek: (So what if I'm a nerd?) (Just food for thought)
that's interesting! never heard it before.

i have heard that he came into possession of one of the two garments God made for Adam & Eve, the one having been passed to Cain -- and that Esau killed him, taking the garment; that it was immediately afterward, fleeing from Nimrod's men, when he met Jacob & sold his birthright for 'soup on the run'
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
30,830
10,123
113
#16
Just before the MASSIVE AND CRIMINAL ELECTION FRAUD.
is there a theological underpinning for this belief?

i mean if you were apostolic/dominion-theologist, then to my understanding, it would be clear the only way you can fathom '
the chosen one' losing an election is that Satan had deceptively *stolen* it from 'prophecy voters' -- and you'd believe it your mandate from God to overturn the results at any cost.


but you agree dominion theology is anti-Biblical, so i'm curious whether there are Biblical reasons for you to believe the 'massive fraud' story, or if it's purely political on your part.

thanks :)
 

calibob

Sinner saved by grace
May 29, 2018
8,268
5,463
113
Anaheim, Cali.
#17
that's interesting! never heard it before.

i have heard that he came into possession of one of the two garments God made for Adam & Eve, the one having been passed to Cain -- and that Esau killed him, taking the garment; that it was immediately afterward, fleeing from Nimrod's men, when he met Jacob & sold his birthright for 'soup on the run'
Allegedly his mothers name was Semiramis. I just pulled this up before turning in tonight: (CO follow in truth)

Most people will be aware of the claims made regarding Nimrod, Semiramis and Tammuz. These 3 characters being the start of pagan sun god worship throughout the world. There are actually a few different stories about the “pagan trinity” as they are sometimes called. The most popular version is that Nimrod and Semiramis were king and queen of Babylon. They ruled the people and turned them against God. However Nimrod eventually died. Semiramis in a desperate attempt to hold onto her thrown derived a plan that would ultimately lead to not only retaining the throne but would elevate her to that of goddess.
 

Adstar

Senior Member
Jul 24, 2016
6,498
2,963
113
#18
does the church have a duty/mandate to impose a veneer of outward righteousness on an unregenerate, unbelieving world through legislated ethical behaviour?

is it the appointed task of Christendom to take hold of governmental & legislative power and in so doing force the lost to act like they're not wicked?

would appreciate examples / justification from scripture and discussion of the theological underpinnings of your views; thanks!
No... Dominionism is wrong.. Let the kings of this world run their kigdoms as they wish.. The LORD will judge them.. We are here to simply spread the Word of God so that all those individuels who love the truth can hear it and come to salvation..

(John 18:35-36) "Pilate answered, Am I a Jew? Thine own nation and the chief priests have delivered thee unto me: what hast thou done? {36} Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence."
 

Roughsoul1991

Senior Member
Sep 17, 2016
6,291
3,034
113
#19
does the church have a duty/mandate to impose a veneer of outward righteousness on an unregenerate, unbelieving world through legislated ethical behaviour?

is it the appointed task of Christendom to take hold of governmental & legislative power and in so doing force the lost to act like they're not wicked?

would appreciate examples / justification from scripture and discussion of the theological underpinnings of your views; thanks!
is it the appointed task of Christendom to take hold of governmental & legislative power and in so doing force the lost to act like they're not wicked?
If you mean by theocracy then no. If you mean by influence then yes.


Matthew 5:13-16
13 “You are the salt of the earth. But if the salt loses its saltiness, how can it be made salty again? It is no longer good for anything, except to be thrown out and trampled underfoot.
14 “You are the light of the world. A town built on a hill cannot be hidden. 15 Neither do people light a lamp and put it under a bowl. Instead they put it on its stand, and it gives light to everyone in the house. 16 In the same way, let your light shine before others, that they may see your good deeds and glorify your Father in heaven.

"Of all the dispositions and habits which lead to political prosperity, religion and morality are indispensable supports. In vain would that man claim the tribute of patriotism who should labor to subvert these great pillars of human happiness-these firmest props of the duties of men and citizens. The mere politician, equally with the pious man, ought to respect and to cherish them."
George Washington
 

Roughsoul1991

Senior Member
Sep 17, 2016
6,291
3,034
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#20
We must also realize the making of laws takes the legislation of morality. So a very important question any country must answer is who's morality?