Hebrews Study
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P
Hi oldhermit.
I'm still in the process of catching up, but I just read posts #148 and #168 in which you covered the second chapter of Hebrews, but you seem to have skipped commenting on Hebrews chapter 2 verse 5. Is there a reason for this or was this just an oversight? Here's the verse:
Hebrews chapter 2 verse 5
For unto the angels hath he not put in subjection the world to come, whereof we speak.
I've got to get some sleep, so I'll do my best to finish catching up tomorrow.
Good night.
I'm still in the process of catching up, but I just read posts #148 and #168 in which you covered the second chapter of Hebrews, but you seem to have skipped commenting on Hebrews chapter 2 verse 5. Is there a reason for this or was this just an oversight? Here's the verse:
Hebrews chapter 2 verse 5
For unto the angels hath he not put in subjection the world to come, whereof we speak.
I've got to get some sleep, so I'll do my best to finish catching up tomorrow.
Good night.
i do a little leaning toward this as well, because the "Bible" these readers used would have been the Septuagint.
not to be contrary...and perhaps it doesn't matter all that much? just saying.
not to be contrary...and perhaps it doesn't matter all that much? just saying.
P
psychomom said:
i do a little leaning toward this as well, because the "Bible" these readers used would have been the Septuagint.
not to be contrary...and perhaps it doesn't matter all that much? just saying.
not to be contrary...and perhaps it doesn't matter all that much? just saying.
Hebrews chapter 10 verse 5
Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me:
This is a direct citation from Psalm 40 verse 6 and here is how it reads in the Masoretic Text which underlies the King James Bible and many other English translations:
Psalm 40 verse 6
Sacrifice and offering thou didst not desire; mine ears hast thou opened: burnt offering and sin offering hast thou not required.
There is quite a bit of difference between but a body hast thou prepared for me and mine ears hast thou opened and the author's intended point simply wouldn't come across if the Septuagint rendering wasn't used. I've read the Bible numerous times, but I've never read the Septuagint translation. I'm seriously wondering if I should.
Of course, the possibility that the Hebrews writer was quoting from Deuteronomy chapter 32 verse 43 only exists if the author was using the Septuagint as well. In other words, that reading simply isn't found in the Masoretic Text either.
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Regarding this confirmation issue, I'm seriously wondering if it simply doesn't boil down to this:
Mark chapter 16 verse 20
And they went forth, and preached everywhere, the Lord working with them, and confirming the word with signs following. Amen.
The same Greek word, bebaioō, is used for confirming in Mark chapter 16 verse 20 and for confirmed in Hebrews chapter 2 verse 3
Hebrews chapter 2 verses 3 and 4
How shall we escape, if we neglect so great salvation; which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord, and was confirmed unto us by them that heard him;
God also bearing them witness, both with signs and wonders, and with divers miracles, and gifts of the Holy Ghost, according to his own will?
and both passages seem to simply be saying the following:
Jesus initially preached the New Covenant and then the twelve apostles (Matthias would have replaced Judas by this time) confirmed the same unto us as Jesus Himself confirmed their preaching with signs following...or am I missing something? If what I'm suggesting is true, then I fail to see how such would exclude Paul or any other apostle such as Barnabas or James from possibly being the authors of this epistle. In other words, Jesus still would have been the original preacher of the New Covenant, the 12 apostles would have still confirmed the same as Jesus confirmed their preaching with signs following and another apostle still could have written this epistle without any contradiction whatsoever.
I have a direct question for you, oldhermit, and I ask it respectfully and not the least bit in any sort of accusatory manner:
You've stated that you believe that Apollos is a likely candidate for the authorship of this epistle, but doesn't the Bible give us reason to believe that Apollos was an apostle himself?
For example, we read:
I Corinthians chapter 1 verses 10 thru 12
Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment.
For it hath been declared unto me of you, my brethren, by them which are of the house of Chloe, that there are contentions among you.
Now this I say, that every one of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ.
For starters, Paul seems to put Apollos on the same level as himself and Peter (Cephas) here and both Paul and Peter were apostles. Paul continued:
I Corinthians chapter 3 verses 1 thru 10
And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ.
I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able.
For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?
For while one saith, I am of Paul; and another, I am of Apollos; are ye not carnal?
Who then is Paul, and who is Apollos, but ministers by whom ye believed, even as the Lord gave to every man?
I have planted, Apollos watered; but God gave the increase.
So then neither is he that planteth any thing, neither he that watereth; but God that giveth the increase.
Now he that planteth and he that watereth are one: and every man shall receive his own reward according to his own labour.
For we are labourers together with God: ye are God's husbandry, ye are God's building.
According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon.
Again, Paul seems to be placing Apollos on the same level as himself in that both he and Apollos were ministers by whom the Corinthians believed and in that he referred to himself and Apollos as being one. Granted, Paul did seem to have some sort of preeminence at Corinth in that he planted whereas Apollos watered that which had been planted and in that Paul laid the foundation and others, presumably including Apollos, built thereupon, but Apollos' influence at Corinth simply cannot be denied. Here's where it gets even more interesting:
I Corinthians chapter 3 verse 21 thru I Corinthians chapter 4 verse 9
Therefore let no man glory in men. For all things are yours;
Whether Paul, or Apollos, or Cephas, or the world, or life, or death, or things present, or things to come; all are yours;
And ye are Christ's; and Christ is God's.
Let a man so account of us, as of the ministers of Christ, and stewards of the mysteries of God.
Moreover it is required in stewards, that a man be found faithful.
But with me it is a very small thing that I should be judged of you, or of man's judgment: yea, I judge not mine own self.
For I know nothing by myself; yet am I not hereby justified: but he that judgeth me is the Lord.
Therefore judge nothing before the time, until the Lord come, who both will bring to light the hidden things of darkness, and will make manifest the counsels of the hearts: and then shall every man have praise of God.
And these things, brethren, I have in a figure transferred to myself and to Apollos for your sakes; that ye might learn in us not to think of men above that which is written, that no one of you be puffed up for one against another.
For who maketh thee to differ from another? and what hast thou that thou didst not receive? now if thou didst receive it, why dost thou glory, as if thou hadst not received it?
Now ye are full, now ye are rich, ye have reigned as kings without us: and I would to God ye did reign, that we also might reign with you.
For I think that God hath set forth us the apostles last, as it were appointed to death: for we are made a spectacle unto the world, and to angels, and to men.
Paul was instructing the Corinthians in relation to how they ought to account of us and, contextually, the us was Paul, Apollos and Peter (Cephas). Paul then continued on to refer to us the apostles. Did Paul therefore count Apollos as being an apostle? It seems so to me. If so, then if we're going to remove Paul from the running in relation to the authorship of the epistle to the Hebrews ought we not also remove Apollos from the running based upon the same criteria?
Personally, I still believe that Paul authored the epistle to the Hebrews, but, again, it doesn't really matter in that it was ultimately inspired by the Holy Spirit regardless of which earthy vessel was used to actually apply the ink to the parchment.
Mark chapter 16 verse 20
And they went forth, and preached everywhere, the Lord working with them, and confirming the word with signs following. Amen.
The same Greek word, bebaioō, is used for confirming in Mark chapter 16 verse 20 and for confirmed in Hebrews chapter 2 verse 3
Hebrews chapter 2 verses 3 and 4
How shall we escape, if we neglect so great salvation; which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord, and was confirmed unto us by them that heard him;
God also bearing them witness, both with signs and wonders, and with divers miracles, and gifts of the Holy Ghost, according to his own will?
and both passages seem to simply be saying the following:
Jesus initially preached the New Covenant and then the twelve apostles (Matthias would have replaced Judas by this time) confirmed the same unto us as Jesus Himself confirmed their preaching with signs following...or am I missing something? If what I'm suggesting is true, then I fail to see how such would exclude Paul or any other apostle such as Barnabas or James from possibly being the authors of this epistle. In other words, Jesus still would have been the original preacher of the New Covenant, the 12 apostles would have still confirmed the same as Jesus confirmed their preaching with signs following and another apostle still could have written this epistle without any contradiction whatsoever.
I have a direct question for you, oldhermit, and I ask it respectfully and not the least bit in any sort of accusatory manner:
You've stated that you believe that Apollos is a likely candidate for the authorship of this epistle, but doesn't the Bible give us reason to believe that Apollos was an apostle himself?
For example, we read:
I Corinthians chapter 1 verses 10 thru 12
Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment.
For it hath been declared unto me of you, my brethren, by them which are of the house of Chloe, that there are contentions among you.
Now this I say, that every one of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ.
For starters, Paul seems to put Apollos on the same level as himself and Peter (Cephas) here and both Paul and Peter were apostles. Paul continued:
I Corinthians chapter 3 verses 1 thru 10
And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ.
I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able.
For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?
For while one saith, I am of Paul; and another, I am of Apollos; are ye not carnal?
Who then is Paul, and who is Apollos, but ministers by whom ye believed, even as the Lord gave to every man?
I have planted, Apollos watered; but God gave the increase.
So then neither is he that planteth any thing, neither he that watereth; but God that giveth the increase.
Now he that planteth and he that watereth are one: and every man shall receive his own reward according to his own labour.
For we are labourers together with God: ye are God's husbandry, ye are God's building.
According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon.
Again, Paul seems to be placing Apollos on the same level as himself in that both he and Apollos were ministers by whom the Corinthians believed and in that he referred to himself and Apollos as being one. Granted, Paul did seem to have some sort of preeminence at Corinth in that he planted whereas Apollos watered that which had been planted and in that Paul laid the foundation and others, presumably including Apollos, built thereupon, but Apollos' influence at Corinth simply cannot be denied. Here's where it gets even more interesting:
I Corinthians chapter 3 verse 21 thru I Corinthians chapter 4 verse 9
Therefore let no man glory in men. For all things are yours;
Whether Paul, or Apollos, or Cephas, or the world, or life, or death, or things present, or things to come; all are yours;
And ye are Christ's; and Christ is God's.
Let a man so account of us, as of the ministers of Christ, and stewards of the mysteries of God.
Moreover it is required in stewards, that a man be found faithful.
But with me it is a very small thing that I should be judged of you, or of man's judgment: yea, I judge not mine own self.
For I know nothing by myself; yet am I not hereby justified: but he that judgeth me is the Lord.
Therefore judge nothing before the time, until the Lord come, who both will bring to light the hidden things of darkness, and will make manifest the counsels of the hearts: and then shall every man have praise of God.
And these things, brethren, I have in a figure transferred to myself and to Apollos for your sakes; that ye might learn in us not to think of men above that which is written, that no one of you be puffed up for one against another.
For who maketh thee to differ from another? and what hast thou that thou didst not receive? now if thou didst receive it, why dost thou glory, as if thou hadst not received it?
Now ye are full, now ye are rich, ye have reigned as kings without us: and I would to God ye did reign, that we also might reign with you.
For I think that God hath set forth us the apostles last, as it were appointed to death: for we are made a spectacle unto the world, and to angels, and to men.
Paul was instructing the Corinthians in relation to how they ought to account of us and, contextually, the us was Paul, Apollos and Peter (Cephas). Paul then continued on to refer to us the apostles. Did Paul therefore count Apollos as being an apostle? It seems so to me. If so, then if we're going to remove Paul from the running in relation to the authorship of the epistle to the Hebrews ought we not also remove Apollos from the running based upon the same criteria?
Personally, I still believe that Paul authored the epistle to the Hebrews, but, again, it doesn't really matter in that it was ultimately inspired by the Holy Spirit regardless of which earthy vessel was used to actually apply the ink to the parchment.
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Since Hebrews chapter 2 verse 5 wasn't addressed in the outline (I'm assuming that it was an oversight), I'll address it myself now:
Hebrews chapter 2 verse 5
For unto the angels hath he not put in subjection the world to come, whereof we speak.
Both the immediate context of what the author was describing and more of the overall context of what the author would later discuss was the world to come and the world to come is just that:
The world to come.
Before addressing the passages which immediately follow this contextual timeframe, I'll quickly remind everybody here of another portion of scripture which has already been mentioned here during this study:
Ephesians chapter 1 verses 15 thru 23
Wherefore I also, after I heard of your faith in the Lord Jesus, and love unto all the saints,
Cease not to give thanks for you, making mention of you in my prayers;
That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him:
The eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of his inheritance in the saints,
And what is the exceeding greatness of his power to usward who believe, according to the working of his mighty power,
Which he wrought in Christ, when he raised him from the dead, and set him at his own right hand in the heavenly places,
Far above all principality, and power, and might, and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this world, but also in that which is to come:
And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church,
Which is his body, the fulness of him that filleth all in all.
When the man Christ Jesus was raised from the dead and seated at the right hand of the Father in heaven and when He by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than the angels, He obtained a name that is far above not only every name that is named in this world, but also a name that is far above every name that is named in the world which is to come. Again, there most definitely is yet a world to come. If not, then what are the new heavens, new earth and new Jerusalem all about? The author of the epistle to the Hebrews will further address the world to come in chapter 4 when he contrasts the rest of entering into the promised land with the rest which yet awaits Christians and also in chapter 11 when he speaks of the heavenly city or of the new Jerusalem which Abraham and the other Old Testament saints looked forward to. The author makes other references to the world to come throughout this epistle as well, so let's just settle it in our hearts that there is actually a world to come. Now to the immediate context of what follows our opening text:
Hebrews chapter 2 verses 5 thru 9
For unto the angels hath he not put in subjection the world to come, whereof we speak.
But one in a certain place testified, saying, What is man, that thou art mindful of him? or the son of man, that thou visitest him?
Thou madest him a little lower than the angels; thou crownedst him with glory and honour, and didst set him over the works of thy hands:
Thou hast put all things in subjection under his feet. For in that he put all in subjection under him, he left nothing that is not put under him. But now we see not yet all things put under him.
But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.
As oldhermit already noted, the author was here citing from Psalm 8. I don't necessarily have a problem with believing that the man spoken of here was Adam in that he was definitely originally given dominion over this earth, so I'm going to focus primarily upon the son of man part or literally from the original Hebrew text of Psalm 8 the ben 'adam part or the son of Adam Who is Jesus Christ part. Again, as oldhermit rightly noted, Jesus, in His incarnation, was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death and although all things have been put in subjection unto Him, as the author noted, we see not yet all things put under Him. Well, what does this mean? Part of what it means was described for us by Paul elsewhere:
I Corinthians chapter 15 verses 22 thru 28
For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.
For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith, all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him.
And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.
The Apostle Paul, writing after Christ's exaltation to the right hand of the Father in heaven, said and when all things shall be subdued unto Him with the Him being Jesus. Again, all things are not yet subject unto Christ and Paul clearly stated what the last enemy to be destroyed is and that enemy is death. Death is still around us, is it not? Unfortunately, it is. When then does the Bible tell us that death will be destroyed? Let's look at that now:
Revelation chapter 20 verses 1 thru 15
And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.
And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.
And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.
Scripture tells us that the last enemy of death will be destroyed when it is cast into the lake of fire at the end of Christ's Millennial or 1,000 year reign upon the earth which is ushered in immediately after His second coming. We've previously examined how the saints who are joint-heirs with Christ will assist Him in ruling the nations with a rod of iron at His return and this perfectly coincides with the thrones that we've just read about here. This also perfectly coincides with the cities that the saints are given authority over in Jesus' parable from Luke chapter 19 that we also examined and such authority is given when Jesus returns having received the kingdom. This also perfectly coincides with Paul's own eschatological beliefs in that Christ is the firstfruits of them that slept or the firstborn from the dead unto eternal life and afterward the saints will partake in the same at His second coming. Christ then reigns until He has put down all rule and authority or until both He and His saints rule the nations with a rod of iron and then the last enemy of death which is to be destroyed is finally destroyed after one final rebellion against Christ and His saints which is initiated when Satan is momentarily loosed from his prison and fire comes down from God out of heaven and consumes all of the rebels. Then comes the second death where death is cast into the lake of fire and such is followed by the new heavens, the new earth and the heavenly Jerusalem which descends from heaven upon this earth. This, in my estimation, is the world to come and this, in my estimation, is why the author of this epistle to the Hebrews said but now we see not yet all things put under Him. Again, the last enemy to be destroyed or the last enemy to be put under Christ is death and such is not destroyed until the end of Christ's coming Millennial Reign and then the world to come or the new heavens, new earth and new Jerusalem are ushered in.
Thanks for reading and for considering these things before the Lord in your own times of prayer and study.
Hebrews chapter 2 verse 5
For unto the angels hath he not put in subjection the world to come, whereof we speak.
Both the immediate context of what the author was describing and more of the overall context of what the author would later discuss was the world to come and the world to come is just that:
The world to come.
Before addressing the passages which immediately follow this contextual timeframe, I'll quickly remind everybody here of another portion of scripture which has already been mentioned here during this study:
Ephesians chapter 1 verses 15 thru 23
Wherefore I also, after I heard of your faith in the Lord Jesus, and love unto all the saints,
Cease not to give thanks for you, making mention of you in my prayers;
That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him:
The eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of his inheritance in the saints,
And what is the exceeding greatness of his power to usward who believe, according to the working of his mighty power,
Which he wrought in Christ, when he raised him from the dead, and set him at his own right hand in the heavenly places,
Far above all principality, and power, and might, and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this world, but also in that which is to come:
And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church,
Which is his body, the fulness of him that filleth all in all.
When the man Christ Jesus was raised from the dead and seated at the right hand of the Father in heaven and when He by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than the angels, He obtained a name that is far above not only every name that is named in this world, but also a name that is far above every name that is named in the world which is to come. Again, there most definitely is yet a world to come. If not, then what are the new heavens, new earth and new Jerusalem all about? The author of the epistle to the Hebrews will further address the world to come in chapter 4 when he contrasts the rest of entering into the promised land with the rest which yet awaits Christians and also in chapter 11 when he speaks of the heavenly city or of the new Jerusalem which Abraham and the other Old Testament saints looked forward to. The author makes other references to the world to come throughout this epistle as well, so let's just settle it in our hearts that there is actually a world to come. Now to the immediate context of what follows our opening text:
Hebrews chapter 2 verses 5 thru 9
For unto the angels hath he not put in subjection the world to come, whereof we speak.
But one in a certain place testified, saying, What is man, that thou art mindful of him? or the son of man, that thou visitest him?
Thou madest him a little lower than the angels; thou crownedst him with glory and honour, and didst set him over the works of thy hands:
Thou hast put all things in subjection under his feet. For in that he put all in subjection under him, he left nothing that is not put under him. But now we see not yet all things put under him.
But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.
As oldhermit already noted, the author was here citing from Psalm 8. I don't necessarily have a problem with believing that the man spoken of here was Adam in that he was definitely originally given dominion over this earth, so I'm going to focus primarily upon the son of man part or literally from the original Hebrew text of Psalm 8 the ben 'adam part or the son of Adam Who is Jesus Christ part. Again, as oldhermit rightly noted, Jesus, in His incarnation, was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death and although all things have been put in subjection unto Him, as the author noted, we see not yet all things put under Him. Well, what does this mean? Part of what it means was described for us by Paul elsewhere:
I Corinthians chapter 15 verses 22 thru 28
For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.
For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith, all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him.
And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.
The Apostle Paul, writing after Christ's exaltation to the right hand of the Father in heaven, said and when all things shall be subdued unto Him with the Him being Jesus. Again, all things are not yet subject unto Christ and Paul clearly stated what the last enemy to be destroyed is and that enemy is death. Death is still around us, is it not? Unfortunately, it is. When then does the Bible tell us that death will be destroyed? Let's look at that now:
Revelation chapter 20 verses 1 thru 15
And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.
And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.
And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.
Scripture tells us that the last enemy of death will be destroyed when it is cast into the lake of fire at the end of Christ's Millennial or 1,000 year reign upon the earth which is ushered in immediately after His second coming. We've previously examined how the saints who are joint-heirs with Christ will assist Him in ruling the nations with a rod of iron at His return and this perfectly coincides with the thrones that we've just read about here. This also perfectly coincides with the cities that the saints are given authority over in Jesus' parable from Luke chapter 19 that we also examined and such authority is given when Jesus returns having received the kingdom. This also perfectly coincides with Paul's own eschatological beliefs in that Christ is the firstfruits of them that slept or the firstborn from the dead unto eternal life and afterward the saints will partake in the same at His second coming. Christ then reigns until He has put down all rule and authority or until both He and His saints rule the nations with a rod of iron and then the last enemy of death which is to be destroyed is finally destroyed after one final rebellion against Christ and His saints which is initiated when Satan is momentarily loosed from his prison and fire comes down from God out of heaven and consumes all of the rebels. Then comes the second death where death is cast into the lake of fire and such is followed by the new heavens, the new earth and the heavenly Jerusalem which descends from heaven upon this earth. This, in my estimation, is the world to come and this, in my estimation, is why the author of this epistle to the Hebrews said but now we see not yet all things put under Him. Again, the last enemy to be destroyed or the last enemy to be put under Christ is death and such is not destroyed until the end of Christ's coming Millennial Reign and then the world to come or the new heavens, new earth and new Jerusalem are ushered in.
Thanks for reading and for considering these things before the Lord in your own times of prayer and study.
P
I'll just add a bit to what oldhermit has already said and finish catching up to the end of chapter 2:
Hebrews chapter 2 verses 10 thru 12
For it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons unto glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings.
For both he that sanctifieth and they who are sanctified are all of one: for which cause he is not ashamed to call them brethren,
Saying, I will declare thy name unto my brethren, in the midst of the church will I sing praise unto thee.
Keeping with his protocol of establishing his doctrine to his Hebrew readers from the Old Testament scriptures, the author here cites from the 22nd Psalm to make his intended point:
Psalm 22 verse 22
I will declare thy name unto my brethren: in the midst of the congregation will I praise thee.
Thank God that Christ is bringing many sons (and daughters) unto glory and that He is not ashamed to call the same His brethren (or sisters).
Hebrews chapter 2 verse 13
And again, I will put my trust in him. And again, Behold I and the children which God hath given me.
The author again cites two more proof texts from the Old Testament. Seeing how there are many possible candidates for the I will put my trust in Him citation, I will not even venture a guess on that one. The next proof text comes directly from the writings of the prophet Isaiah:
Isaiah chapter 8 verse 18
Behold, I and the children whom the LORD hath given me are for signs and for wonders in Israel from the LORD of hosts, which dwelleth in mount Zion.
We need to pay very close attention to these proof texts and go back and examine them in their original settings if we haven't done so already. In other words, seeing how, for example, the author has here attributed both the words of Psalm 22 verse 22 and Isaiah chapter 8 verse 18 directly to Jesus, when we read those portions of scripture we need to recognize that it is actually Christ speaking to us directly in the Old Testament. Yes, the words of Christ aren't limited to the red letters of our New Testaments as He is heard speaking all throughout the Old Testament as well if we're paying attention.
Hebrews chapter 2 verses 14 thru 16
Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;
And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.
For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham.
The following question arises at times and perhaps you've heard someone ask it yourself or perhaps you've even asked it yourself:
Can Satan or fallen angels be saved? or Why can't Satan and fallen angels be saved?
Well, Christ, in His incarnation, didn't take upon Himself the nature of angels, so there is no atoning sacrifice for them at all. Instead, He took upon Himself the seed of Abraham and I could probably write a book on this particular point. I'll try to keep my comments concise, but I am open to further discussion on this point with anybody who might be interested in the same. Again, let's turn to the writings of Paul for some clarification:
Galatians chapter 3 verses 16 thru 19
Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.
And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.
For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.
Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.
There are several important things to note here in relation to Jesus taking upon Himself the seed of Abraham. Here are some of them:
1. God made promises to Abraham's seed.
2. God said not seeds, as of many, but as of one, And to thy seed which is Christ. In other words, the promises which were made to Abraham's seed were actually made to Christ.
3. Before the law was given 430 years later, God had already confirmed His covenant in Christ. Again, the promises and the covenant actually pertain to Christ Himself.
4. Jesus is the seed to Whom the promise was made.
My brothers and my sisters, all sorts of heresies abound within professing Christendom because of a failure to recognize these things. When you read the promises back in the early chapters of Genesis, it is imperative that you recognize that the promises made to Abraham's seed were in fact made to Jesus Christ Who is the seed of Abraham. I'm not going to go into all of the implications of the same at this point in time because, like I said, I could literally write a book on this topic, but please grasp the fact that Abraham's singular seed is Jesus Christ. Thankfully, Paul went on to say:
Galatians chapter 3 verse 29
And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.
It is because of our association with Christ that we too are accounted as being Abraham's seed and heirs according to the promise or joint-heirs with Christ. Natural descendancy or natural lineage has absolutely nothing to do with this. I'll just leave it at that for now.
Hebrews chapter 2 verses 17 and 18
Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.
For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.
Again, our High Priest or the only mediator between God and man is THE MAN Christ Jesus:
I Timothy chapter 2 verses 5 and 6
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.
Yes, having been made like unto His brethren or having partaken of flesh and blood Himself, Jesus Christ is able to succour or able to help them who are tempted in that He Himself has suffered the same temptations, yet without sin, which we all face ourselves. Thank God that our High Priest understands us in that He became as one of us.
WHAT A WONDERFUL SAVIOUR!
Amen?
Hebrews chapter 2 verses 10 thru 12
For it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons unto glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings.
For both he that sanctifieth and they who are sanctified are all of one: for which cause he is not ashamed to call them brethren,
Saying, I will declare thy name unto my brethren, in the midst of the church will I sing praise unto thee.
Keeping with his protocol of establishing his doctrine to his Hebrew readers from the Old Testament scriptures, the author here cites from the 22nd Psalm to make his intended point:
Psalm 22 verse 22
I will declare thy name unto my brethren: in the midst of the congregation will I praise thee.
Thank God that Christ is bringing many sons (and daughters) unto glory and that He is not ashamed to call the same His brethren (or sisters).
Hebrews chapter 2 verse 13
And again, I will put my trust in him. And again, Behold I and the children which God hath given me.
The author again cites two more proof texts from the Old Testament. Seeing how there are many possible candidates for the I will put my trust in Him citation, I will not even venture a guess on that one. The next proof text comes directly from the writings of the prophet Isaiah:
Isaiah chapter 8 verse 18
Behold, I and the children whom the LORD hath given me are for signs and for wonders in Israel from the LORD of hosts, which dwelleth in mount Zion.
We need to pay very close attention to these proof texts and go back and examine them in their original settings if we haven't done so already. In other words, seeing how, for example, the author has here attributed both the words of Psalm 22 verse 22 and Isaiah chapter 8 verse 18 directly to Jesus, when we read those portions of scripture we need to recognize that it is actually Christ speaking to us directly in the Old Testament. Yes, the words of Christ aren't limited to the red letters of our New Testaments as He is heard speaking all throughout the Old Testament as well if we're paying attention.
Hebrews chapter 2 verses 14 thru 16
Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;
And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.
For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham.
The following question arises at times and perhaps you've heard someone ask it yourself or perhaps you've even asked it yourself:
Can Satan or fallen angels be saved? or Why can't Satan and fallen angels be saved?
Well, Christ, in His incarnation, didn't take upon Himself the nature of angels, so there is no atoning sacrifice for them at all. Instead, He took upon Himself the seed of Abraham and I could probably write a book on this particular point. I'll try to keep my comments concise, but I am open to further discussion on this point with anybody who might be interested in the same. Again, let's turn to the writings of Paul for some clarification:
Galatians chapter 3 verses 16 thru 19
Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.
And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.
For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.
Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.
There are several important things to note here in relation to Jesus taking upon Himself the seed of Abraham. Here are some of them:
1. God made promises to Abraham's seed.
2. God said not seeds, as of many, but as of one, And to thy seed which is Christ. In other words, the promises which were made to Abraham's seed were actually made to Christ.
3. Before the law was given 430 years later, God had already confirmed His covenant in Christ. Again, the promises and the covenant actually pertain to Christ Himself.
4. Jesus is the seed to Whom the promise was made.
My brothers and my sisters, all sorts of heresies abound within professing Christendom because of a failure to recognize these things. When you read the promises back in the early chapters of Genesis, it is imperative that you recognize that the promises made to Abraham's seed were in fact made to Jesus Christ Who is the seed of Abraham. I'm not going to go into all of the implications of the same at this point in time because, like I said, I could literally write a book on this topic, but please grasp the fact that Abraham's singular seed is Jesus Christ. Thankfully, Paul went on to say:
Galatians chapter 3 verse 29
And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.
It is because of our association with Christ that we too are accounted as being Abraham's seed and heirs according to the promise or joint-heirs with Christ. Natural descendancy or natural lineage has absolutely nothing to do with this. I'll just leave it at that for now.
Hebrews chapter 2 verses 17 and 18
Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.
For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.
Again, our High Priest or the only mediator between God and man is THE MAN Christ Jesus:
I Timothy chapter 2 verses 5 and 6
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.
Yes, having been made like unto His brethren or having partaken of flesh and blood Himself, Jesus Christ is able to succour or able to help them who are tempted in that He Himself has suffered the same temptations, yet without sin, which we all face ourselves. Thank God that our High Priest understands us in that He became as one of us.
WHAT A WONDERFUL SAVIOUR!
Amen?
P
Hmmm?
I've never heard that distinction before, so I'll have to look into it. Thanks for suggesting it. Two questions do immediately come to mind, though:
1. Does the Bible state somewhere that James was chosen as an apostle by the Lord?
Perhaps it does, but I'm not recollecting it at the moment.
2. How does the following pertain to Barnabas' apostleship if at all?
Acts chapter 13 verses 1 thru 4
Now there were in the church that was at Antioch certain prophets and teachers; as Barnabas, and Simeon that was called Niger, and Lucius of Cyrene, and Manaen, which had been brought up with Herod the tetrarch, and Saul.
As they ministered to the Lord, and fasted, the Holy Ghost said, Separate me Barnabas and Saul for the work whereunto I have called them.
And when they had fasted and prayed, and laid their hands on them, they sent them away.
So they, being sent forth by the Holy Ghost, departed unto Seleucia; and from thence they sailed to Cyprus.
I've never heard that distinction before, so I'll have to look into it. Thanks for suggesting it. Two questions do immediately come to mind, though:
1. Does the Bible state somewhere that James was chosen as an apostle by the Lord?
Perhaps it does, but I'm not recollecting it at the moment.
2. How does the following pertain to Barnabas' apostleship if at all?
Acts chapter 13 verses 1 thru 4
Now there were in the church that was at Antioch certain prophets and teachers; as Barnabas, and Simeon that was called Niger, and Lucius of Cyrene, and Manaen, which had been brought up with Herod the tetrarch, and Saul.
As they ministered to the Lord, and fasted, the Holy Ghost said, Separate me Barnabas and Saul for the work whereunto I have called them.
And when they had fasted and prayed, and laid their hands on them, they sent them away.
So they, being sent forth by the Holy Ghost, departed unto Seleucia; and from thence they sailed to Cyprus.
We have to consider also that there were specified qualifications concerning one's appointment to apostleship. These were set forth by Peter is Acts 1:21-22. “Therefore it is necessary that of the men who have accompanied us all the time that the Lord Jesus went in and out among us—beginning with the baptism of John until the day that He was taken up from us—one of these must become a witness with us of His resurrection.” James the Lord's brother would have met these qualifications. It is not likely that Barnabas would have and is it certain that Apollos would not have.
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A
Okay, at this point I'm cheating. I have read more, but I'm still stuck on my last question, and now I'm looking to see if that question got answered, but (obviously) I am getting caught up in what's going on in between while looking for it.
Just want to ask something since eschatology seems to be an easily pushed personal button (on me too, just so you don't think I'm pointing fingers) that has launched a few wars on this site since I've been here. Is it possible to have a private group on the subject? It would have to be strict on the rules, with the possibility of kicking people out of the group if they don't obey the rules. But the rules would be to discuss, not argue. Trying to understand it, instead of trying to prove-a-point.
Everyone is so jumpy on it, I think it would be a good thing for an open discussion in a group, rather than the constant ramblings on this forum. I'd like to be in on it, but I'd like to be more of something with a beginning, middle, and end, rather than a plop-my-view-whenever-I-want or a plop-my-thoughts-whenever-I-want kind of thing.
(Is anyone else catching the humor that I'm doing just what I said I wouldn't want in that discussion? lol) But is there anyway of organizing such discussions on this site, or is that just like dreaming the winning lottery ticket blows into my hand for dreaming too big?
I really do not get where some folks get their views, but when I say that, they tend to just copy-paste the same verses as if that suddenly would make me understand how they got there. If that worked, I would have understood it the first time they copy-pasted. I may be completely wrong in what I believe, but I can point specifically to the books that taught it to me, and they weren't even books about eschatology. I'd love others to do the same so I can see where they get their beliefs, but it doesn't seem like that's how they get their beliefs.
So, I am willing to learn how others think what they think, but when it gets to talking about what we think, most folks seem bound and determined to assume we all think the same, so I'm an evil aberration.
Just want to ask something since eschatology seems to be an easily pushed personal button (on me too, just so you don't think I'm pointing fingers) that has launched a few wars on this site since I've been here. Is it possible to have a private group on the subject? It would have to be strict on the rules, with the possibility of kicking people out of the group if they don't obey the rules. But the rules would be to discuss, not argue. Trying to understand it, instead of trying to prove-a-point.
Everyone is so jumpy on it, I think it would be a good thing for an open discussion in a group, rather than the constant ramblings on this forum. I'd like to be in on it, but I'd like to be more of something with a beginning, middle, and end, rather than a plop-my-view-whenever-I-want or a plop-my-thoughts-whenever-I-want kind of thing.
(Is anyone else catching the humor that I'm doing just what I said I wouldn't want in that discussion? lol) But is there anyway of organizing such discussions on this site, or is that just like dreaming the winning lottery ticket blows into my hand for dreaming too big?
I really do not get where some folks get their views, but when I say that, they tend to just copy-paste the same verses as if that suddenly would make me understand how they got there. If that worked, I would have understood it the first time they copy-pasted. I may be completely wrong in what I believe, but I can point specifically to the books that taught it to me, and they weren't even books about eschatology. I'd love others to do the same so I can see where they get their beliefs, but it doesn't seem like that's how they get their beliefs.
So, I am willing to learn how others think what they think, but when it gets to talking about what we think, most folks seem bound and determined to assume we all think the same, so I'm an evil aberration.
P
We're getting off topic here, but I don't know if James truly would have met these qualifications. After all, we have accounts like these to consider:
Matthew chapter 12 verses 46 thru 50
While he yet talked to the people, behold, his mother and his brethren stood without, desiring to speak with him.
Then one said unto him, Behold, thy mother and thy brethren stand without, desiring to speak with thee.
But he answered and said unto him that told him, Who is my mother? and who are my brethren?
And he stretched forth his hand toward his disciples, and said, Behold my mother and my brethren!
For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.
John chapter 7 verses 1 thru 5
After these things Jesus walked in Galilee: for he would not walk in Jewry, because the Jews sought to kill him.
Now the Jews' feast of tabernacles was at hand.
His brethren therefore said unto him, Depart hence, and go into Judaea, that thy disciples also may see the works that thou doest.
For there is no man that doeth any thing in secret, and he himself seeketh to be known openly. If thou do these things, shew thyself to the world.
For neither did his brethren believe in him.
We see James standing without and not believing in Christ. Things like that. Granted, he was in the upper room in Acts chapter 1, so who knows?
Sorry for the momentary derail.
Matthew chapter 12 verses 46 thru 50
While he yet talked to the people, behold, his mother and his brethren stood without, desiring to speak with him.
Then one said unto him, Behold, thy mother and thy brethren stand without, desiring to speak with thee.
But he answered and said unto him that told him, Who is my mother? and who are my brethren?
And he stretched forth his hand toward his disciples, and said, Behold my mother and my brethren!
For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.
John chapter 7 verses 1 thru 5
After these things Jesus walked in Galilee: for he would not walk in Jewry, because the Jews sought to kill him.
Now the Jews' feast of tabernacles was at hand.
His brethren therefore said unto him, Depart hence, and go into Judaea, that thy disciples also may see the works that thou doest.
For there is no man that doeth any thing in secret, and he himself seeketh to be known openly. If thou do these things, shew thyself to the world.
For neither did his brethren believe in him.
We see James standing without and not believing in Christ. Things like that. Granted, he was in the upper room in Acts chapter 1, so who knows?
Sorry for the momentary derail.