Holiness

[chubbena]

Are you looking for a practical definition like, what does it look like in a persons life? Or dictionary definition?

I'm looking for a new definition in NT if there is one.
My other question is, does the "old" definition still apply? Why and why not?

 

[jogoldie]

Acts 24:16....
Romans 6:22
Romans 12:1,2. Sorry got carried away.......
1Corinthians 6:19,20
Ephesians 1:4. Also 4:23,24
Colossians 1:22
Hebrews 12:10. And 14
1Peter 1:14,15

.

 

[JesusLives]

That begs the same question why Peter said what he said in my OP.
On the other hand, no Christian would say he does not have the Holy Spirit. It's His promise for all the followers after all. However, He also warned directly and through His disciples that there will be false prophets, false teachers and false spirit.
That begs another question: Every spirit that acknowledges that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God in 1 John 4:2 - what is this verse about? No Christian that I know of (I admit I don't know too many) does not acknowledge that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh and yet to be realistic we can have very different understandings in the Word of God. Why?
The way I understand 1 John 4:2 is, Every spirit that acknowledges that the Word, who has spoken since the beginning of the world, has come in the flesh is from God - given John also wrote the 4th gospel which begins with in the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. In other words, this Word who came in the flesh spoke the same Word who has spoken since the beginning of the world. The Bereans probably knew that and thus examine the scripture to see if what Paul said was true.

This is really the sanctification process and we won't have arrived to total perfection until Jesus comes and we put on immortality - it is a process becoming more and more like Jesus as the Holy Spirit works in us to will and to do God's pleasure. But right now this very minute when God looks at us He sees Jesus perfection/holiness and this is justification. We are covered by Jesus blood/grace.

 

[chubbena]

Not being a Bible scholar, I'm going to go out on a limb, here, and possibly show my ignorance, but...

Holy means to be set aside, separate from the world. When God brought Israel out of Egypt, He provided instructions on how they were to be Holy. This, of course, led to the Law, which through Israel, God demonstrated that it is impossible for man and woman to live absolutely pure, holy lives. As Paul wrote, "For all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God." Romans 3:23

We are saved through grace, by the blood of our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ. We are instructed to live "holy," which leads me to believe that we are not to live as the world does. I don't think that means to follow the Law, either, though. Paul wrote of the folly of trying to live by the law.

So, we are to live separate lives from the world, not following its whims and predilections. I think that means to let His love surround us and be in us, to act on love.

Can we be holy? Not in the sense that God is holy. But we can be holy in the sense that we don't follow the ways of the world.

What can claim to be a scholar when it comes to understanding Him?
Yet God demonstrated that it is possible for man to live absolutely pure, holy lives - hey remember our Saviour who came in the flesh just like you and me?
You are right we are not to live as the world does but today the line has become blurry. Much leaven has entered the lump wouldn't you agree? So how can we tell if one lives as the world or not?
Don't we all agree the bible is the infallible word of God? Didn't Paul say all scripture is God breathed and is useful for teaching for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness? So it depends on how one's definition is to live by the law isn't it - whether one thinks he can be justified or sees he's not worthy?

Can we be holy, as He is holy? Can we be perfect, for He is perfect?
I'm going to go out on a limb to ask this question - if He came in a weak flesh like you and me and through obedience lived a sinless life, why can't we? I don't have the answer.

 

[posthuman]

everything we do will be tried by fire, like gold & silver purified in a furnace,
and all the impurities burned away, until what remains is pure.

a metalsmith starts with a great hunk of ore and when he is done only the little bits of precious metal is left.

i believe when all that must be done is finally done, all that remains of me and you in Him will be what is holy. want to amount to much? be holy. more was given to the servant that multiplied his master's talents!

 

[JesusLives]

What can claim to be a scholar when it comes to understanding Him?
Yet God demonstrated that it is possible for man to live absolutely pure, holy lives - hey remember our Saviour who came in the flesh just like you and me?
You are right we are not to live as the world does but today the line has become blurry. Much leaven has entered the lump wouldn't you agree? So how can we tell if one lives as the world or not?
Don't we all agree the bible is the infallible word of God? Didn't Paul say all scripture is God breathed and is useful for teaching for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness? So it depends on how one's definition is to live by the law isn't it - whether one thinks he can be justified or sees he's not worthy?

Can we be holy, as He is holy? Can we be perfect, for He is perfect?
I'm going to go out on a limb to ask this question - if He came in a weak flesh like you and me and through obedience lived a sinless life, why can't we? I don't have the answer.

[h=3]Romans 5:17[/h]New Living Translation (NLT)

[SUP]17 [/SUP]For the sin of this one man, Adam, caused death to rule over many. But even greater is God’s wonderful grace and his gift of righteousness, for all who receive it will live in triumph over sin and death through this one man, Jesus Christ.

Jesus does it for us - all of our good deeds are as filthy rags - Jesus covers us - God sees Him and not us.

 

[78jon]

The majority of people will never sin. Half the population get spouses, have children, etc.. That's my own figure, it may be more. For instance, a "wrath" sin is someone who gets so mad at someone they kill them. It takes pretty severe circumstances for a sin to happen. Holy means "all knowing" if I'm correct. The word came about I'm almost sure from the first ever encounter between a Holy Spirit and humans. I'm sure the word wasn't in the human dialect until then. For instance, the Holy Spirit knows everyone's social security number down to how many fish are in all of the waters on earth.

 

[chubbena]

Acts 24:16....

And he said this a couple of verses earlier: "However, I admit that I worship the God of our fathers as a follower of the Way, which they call a sect. I believe everything that agrees with the Law and that is written in the Prophets."

Romans 6:22

Just as the Israelites were set free from slavery in Egypt so yes, we shouldn't even consider going back - just as Romans 6:21 said.

Romans 12:1,2. Sorry got carried away.......

That I don't agree. You didn't get carried away. You are right on.

1Corinthians 6:19,20

Good one. We can't use this same vessel for shameful things.

Ephesians 1:4. Also 4:23,24

Hey you missed 4:22.

Colossians 1:22

And 1:23 and thus Peter's teaching 1 Pet 1:13-19 and in fact the whole book - and I knew you would quote that.

Hebrews 12:10. And 14

How could you not quote the whole chapter?

1Peter 1:14,15

Oh yes.
Thanks for the online bible study and fellowship.

.[/QUOTE]

 

[chubbena]

This is really the sanctification process and we won't have arrived to total perfection until Jesus comes and we put on immortality - it is a process becoming more and more like Jesus as the Holy Spirit works in us to will and to do God's pleasure. But right now this very minute when God looks at us He sees Jesus perfection/holiness and this is justification. We are covered by Jesus blood/grace.

His child, despite his inadequacy, is still His child, that I know.

 

[chubbena]

Romans 5:17

New Living Translation (NLT)

[SUP]17 [/SUP]For the sin of this one man, Adam, caused death to rule over many. But even greater is God’s wonderful grace and his gift of righteousness, for all who receive it will live in triumph over sin and death through this one man, Jesus Christ.

Jesus does it for us - all of our good deeds are as filthy rags - Jesus covers us - God sees Him and not us.

All of our good deeds WERE as filthy rags. We ARE (should be) His good works now. He accepts us because of Him.

 

[posthuman]

The majority of people will never sin.

no, everyone sins.

If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
If we say we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.
(1 John 1:8-10)

 

[RedTent]

Not being a Bible scholar, I'm going to go out on a limb, here, and possibly show my ignorance, but...

Holy means to be set aside, separate from the world. When God brought Israel out of Egypt, He provided instructions on how they were to be Holy. This, of course, led to the Law, which through Israel, God demonstrated that it is impossible for man and woman to live absolutely pure, holy lives. As Paul wrote, "For all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God." Romans 3:23

We are saved through grace, by the blood of our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ. We are instructed to live "holy," which leads me to believe that we are not to live as the world does. I don't think that means to follow the Law, either, though. Paul wrote of the folly of trying to live by the law.

So, we are to live separate lives from the world, not following its whims and predilections. I think that means to let His love surround us and be in us, to act on love.

Can we be holy? Not in the sense that God is holy. But we can be holy in the sense that we don't follow the ways of the world.

If you start with the OT and follow through with how it is explained through Christ, this post seems to cover it.

In the OT, something loses its holiness when something unclean touches it. The OT often uses physical things to represent spiritual ones, like death, dirt on hands, unclean blood, etc. That scripture gives ways to cleanse from the unholy so it is holy again.

The NT takes these physical things and shows us the spiritual. Scripture talks about sanctification, of separating things out to the use of God. Lives are to be separated from the world, people who live immoral lives are to be separated from the church, we are to be separated from sin through Christ.

Christ even said we were to be able to separate ourselves from our family for His sake: Luke 14:26 "If anyone comes to Me, and does not hate his own father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters, yes, and even his own life, he cannot be My disciple.”

 

[jogoldie]

I had fun finding it....thanks for the challenge......thank you for finishing it off......team work...

 

[chubbena]

The majority of people will never sin. Half the population get spouses, have children, etc.. That's my own figure, it may be more. For instance, a "wrath" sin is someone who gets so mad at someone they kill them. It takes pretty severe circumstances for a sin to happen. Holy means "all knowing" if I'm correct. The word came about I'm almost sure from the first ever encounter between a Holy Spirit and humans. I'm sure the word wasn't in the human dialect until then. For instance, the Holy Spirit knows everyone's social security number down to how many fish are in all of the waters on earth.

Not so when Jesus clarified some of the standards He set in the past in Matthew 5:21-28 eh?
I'm not sure about the "all knowing" meaning. Where do you get this from?
In Canada the equivalent of social security number is social insurance number a.k.a. SIN so you are right, the Holy Spirit knows everyone's SIN here

 

[ji]

I would think that holiness is the Holy Spirit living in us and working through us to will and to do God's pleasure. We are saved by Grace it is a gift of God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So when we come to Him Jesus robe of righteousness covers us and God sees Jesus perfection covering us. Jesus makes us Holy before God. Because we love God we trust and obey Him and have faith that He who began a good work will keep on to completion.

As humans we will never be holy but with Holy Spirit dwelling in us Jesus makes us holy.

yes,the standard we keep is not how God keeps the standard..
God's ways are Higher than ours..our lack of faith is hindrance for God to work in us..
i realized it taking years,and i used to compare me with other people who had denominational spirit..how wrong i was and God proved it all wrong...His standards are not limited like human thinking..
Yes,God covers us with His holiness when we go close to Him and continue to Live in Him.
That's True..
God Bless

 

[ji]

I agree we live in the dispensation of grace but weren't all dispensations in the past were of grace also? The psalmist praised and understood much more grace of God than many of us in the NT didn't he?
Weren't the Israelites to obey God spiritually? To obey is better than animal sacrifices? Circumcise the heart rather than the foreskin?
Yes godly standard is to follow and is actually higher than previously written in OT don't you agree and is actually easier because He's done it don't you think?
You quoted Hebrews 12:14 and you quoted it well - to live in peace with all men and to be holy. However, to live in peace does not equal to be holy. To live in peace with all men is ideal but there is time for war also. I
You are right in quoting Romans 12:18. If not for one war we probably wouldn't have the luxury to read the bible.
The question remains. T
here are, some would say were, clear definitions for holiness in OT. Is there clear definitions for holiness in NT?
Some would say, with the guidance of the Holy Spirit one should know what holiness is without having to refer to the letter. Now would the Holy Spirit contradict with the Word of God in the past?

Romans 8:31-39 KJV holds the answer for your doubts there..
Only a Godly person can resist such situations of trouble and pain.Its not our view of holiness and in OT Jesus was not revealed.
Jesus is revealed to us and we are a Special group-the Sons and Heirs of the Throne sharing inheritance of Jesus
so much that
"God having provided some better thing for us, that they(OT Saints) without us should not be made perfect."
-Hebrews 11:40 KJV

God Bless,for God given Holiness there is a reward because we tried to attain it..that is Hebrews 11:40 KJV

 

[crossnote]

The majority of people will never sin. Half the population get spouses, have children, etc.. That's my own figure, it may be more. For instance, a "wrath" sin is someone who gets so mad at someone they kill them. It takes pretty severe circumstances for a sin to happen. Holy means "all knowing" if I'm correct. The word came about I'm almost sure from the first ever encounter between a Holy Spirit and humans. I'm sure the word wasn't in the human dialect until then. For instance, the Holy Spirit knows everyone's social security number down to how many fish are in all of the waters on earth.

Sin starts in the heart/mind and comes out in our desires/thoughts. Jesus said if we get angry at our brother without a cause shall be in danger of judgment.

But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.
(Mat 5:22)

 

[Cobus]

You are made holy through the blood of Jesus, now renew your mind (Thoughts feelings and will) through the Spirit...in other words line your soul up to the truth of the Spirit.

WRONG!!!! You are made clean by the blood. You are made HOLY by the resurrection of Christ in you. How does God make a person HOLY? By IMPLANTING the Holy Spirit in you. It is a NEW heart not a modified heart. God does not take a stony heart and change it bit by bit to flesh. God REMOVES the stony heart. meaning we DIE off the old man. Lay doen the parts that makes us dirty by the power of HIS BLOOD AND CROSS.... God says purifieth (CLEANSING) ... look and we have to PURIFY OURSELVES.... Not God cleaning us WE CLEAN us..... 1 John 3:3 And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure.

Any person that HOPES to be like Jesus when He somes, will PURIFY HIMSLEF.... How clean? As HE IS CLEAN... spotless!
And they do it by STOP getting dirty AS HE LEADS while we FOLLOW. And if we FOLLOW ALLTHE way till there is no more DIRT (sin) then we are as pure as he is but NOT YET HOLY!!!!! Read acts 8 where Philip got to Samria. And he CLEANED up all dirt but the Holy Spirit did not FALL ON NONE of them YET... they were SPOTLESS clean, but not HOLY not ONE of them.

Then the Apostles prayed and laid hands on them and they REVEIVED JESUS INTO THEIR FLESH.. .and htey were made HOLY AND PERFECT! .....WOW!!!! I hope to be like Him when He comes and I know He will make me LIKE HIM right here on earth as He did with Philip and with Samaria, save maybe Simon the OLD FALSE PROPHET of that city.... Simon the sourcerer.

 

[Cobus]

Ezekiel 36:26 and 27... A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
Eze 36:27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

New Heart and a NEW SPIRIT... Wonder if the body is also renewed? Or will God put this NEW WINE in an old SHACK? I doubt it, I believe the Spirit RENEWS all becasue God says this..... Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.

And God says this.... And no man putteth new wine into old bottles; else the new wine will burst the bottles, and be spilled, and the bottles shall perish. (Bottles is wine sacks in the old times)

I trust my Lord to do this with me as well.... Praise the Lord Jesus, that He still make new wine today....Amen!

 

[78jon]

Lol, funny. The SIN. I'm not sure where I got it from. A Holy Spirit will identify Herself as a Holy Spirit. The Spirit has always been there long before the creation of mankind, and has always been a Holy Spirit. Mankind didn't make up that title. The only way the word could have gotten into human dialect was someone who encountered a Holy Spirit, of course the Spirit will identify Herself as a Holy Spirit. So the word "Holy" sort of got stretched a little bit. Of course She is an "all knowing" Spirit. To be honest, nothing else should be called Holy. That Spirit is Holy, and trust me there is absolutely nothing else that can even come CLOSE to that Spirit. So the word Holy should only come before Spirit, that's my opinion if you can grasp what I'm trying to say. I'm not sure where I got "all knowing" from. An all knowing Spirit called Holy Spirit, sort of self defines Holy a little bit.