I am curious
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again
scripture directly against what you accuse him of
Romans 9
9 I say the truth in Christ, I lie not, my conscience also bearing me witness in the Holy Ghost,
2 That I have great heaviness and continual sorrow in my heart.
3 For I could wish that myself were accursed from Christ for my brethren, my kinsmen according to the flesh:
4 Who are Israelites; to whom pertaineth the adoption, and the glory, and the covenants, and the giving of the law, and the service of God, and the promises;
5 Whose are the fathers, and of whom as concerning the flesh Christ came, who is over all, God blessed for ever. Amen.
6 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:
7 Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.
8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.
9 For this is the word of promise, At this time will I come, and Sarah shall have a son.
10 And not only this; but when Rebecca also had conceived by one, even by our father Isaac;
11 (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth; )
scripture directly against what you accuse him of
Romans 9
9 I say the truth in Christ, I lie not, my conscience also bearing me witness in the Holy Ghost,
2 That I have great heaviness and continual sorrow in my heart.
3 For I could wish that myself were accursed from Christ for my brethren, my kinsmen according to the flesh:
4 Who are Israelites; to whom pertaineth the adoption, and the glory, and the covenants, and the giving of the law, and the service of God, and the promises;
5 Whose are the fathers, and of whom as concerning the flesh Christ came, who is over all, God blessed for ever. Amen.
6 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:
7 Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.
8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.
9 For this is the word of promise, At this time will I come, and Sarah shall have a son.
10 And not only this; but when Rebecca also had conceived by one, even by our father Isaac;
11 (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth; )
http://www.essene.org/Yahowshua_or_Paul.htm
while i do not agree with everything in this text about things like meat eating vs veganism etc...I think this article does provide some good insight into why I have issues with Paul's many tenets in his writings and compares them to Jesus writings....
also Paul said it is okay to eat things offered to idols....this is not godly.....nor approved by Yahweh (Father God) as he repeatedly said in the OT never to touch or eat the unclean thing or that offered to idols...Israelites were killed off for eating from the golden calf and baal worship (eating sacrifices of the dead/burned up human remains).....how can Paul suddenly rewrite this?.....it doesn't add up.;...the excuse of grace under Jesus is not a solid argument to go willingly and eat food that has been infused with satanic rites/rituals....
while i do not agree with everything in this text about things like meat eating vs veganism etc...I think this article does provide some good insight into why I have issues with Paul's many tenets in his writings and compares them to Jesus writings....
also Paul said it is okay to eat things offered to idols....this is not godly.....nor approved by Yahweh (Father God) as he repeatedly said in the OT never to touch or eat the unclean thing or that offered to idols...Israelites were killed off for eating from the golden calf and baal worship (eating sacrifices of the dead/burned up human remains).....how can Paul suddenly rewrite this?.....it doesn't add up.;...the excuse of grace under Jesus is not a solid argument to go willingly and eat food that has been infused with satanic rites/rituals....
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acts 10
7 And when the angel which spake unto Cornelius was departed, he called two of his household servants, and a devout soldier of them that waited on him continually;
8 And when he had declared all these things unto them, he sent them to Joppa.
9 On the morrow, as they went on their journey, and drew nigh unto the city, Peter went up upon the housetop to pray about the sixth hour:
10 And he became very hungry, and would have eaten: but while they made ready, he fell into a trance,
11 And saw heaven opened, and a certain vessel descending unto him, as it had been a great sheet knit at the four corners, and let down to the earth:
12 Wherein were all manner of fourfooted beasts of the earth, and wild beasts, and creeping things, and fowls of the air.
13 And there came a voice to him, Rise, Peter; kill, and eat.
14 But Peter said, Not so, Lord; for I have never eaten any thing that is common or unclean.
15 And the voice spake unto him again the second time, What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common
1 Corinthians 8:4
“As concerning therefore the eating of those things that are offered in sacrifice unto idols, we know that an idol is nothing in the world, and that there is none other God but one.”
right now
your words cling to hebrew roots and not scripture...
but you accused paul of this
7 And when the angel which spake unto Cornelius was departed, he called two of his household servants, and a devout soldier of them that waited on him continually;
8 And when he had declared all these things unto them, he sent them to Joppa.
9 On the morrow, as they went on their journey, and drew nigh unto the city, Peter went up upon the housetop to pray about the sixth hour:
10 And he became very hungry, and would have eaten: but while they made ready, he fell into a trance,
11 And saw heaven opened, and a certain vessel descending unto him, as it had been a great sheet knit at the four corners, and let down to the earth:
12 Wherein were all manner of fourfooted beasts of the earth, and wild beasts, and creeping things, and fowls of the air.
13 And there came a voice to him, Rise, Peter; kill, and eat.
14 But Peter said, Not so, Lord; for I have never eaten any thing that is common or unclean.
15 And the voice spake unto him again the second time, What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common
1 Corinthians 8:4
“As concerning therefore the eating of those things that are offered in sacrifice unto idols, we know that an idol is nothing in the world, and that there is none other God but one.”
right now
your words cling to hebrew roots and not scripture...
but you accused paul of this
...now let the wolves come and try to rip me lol....i got thick skin 
As to your allegations about Paul, they will not stand up to a close examination. How could the Pharisees be enemies of Paul if he was promoting their beliefs and practices?
how about this scripture....
Acts 15:29
That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well.
I already said im not a jewish roots person...but clearly Paul is contradicting the OT and even the author of Acts.....
indeed Paul was as legitimate an apostle as any other. peter recognizes Him as a wise brother speaking wisdom from God, there is no reason for anyone to doubt or question peters Judgement and understanding of paul. Peter also confirms that paul was wrotong to the same church He was, which also shows peters approval of Him. commending them to recall pauls point regarding the patience of God that is available to us.
Pauls miracles also bear witness of the Holy ghost in Him.
Pauls miracles also bear witness of the Holy ghost in Him.
Any non-mainstream beliefs are consistently badgered here by people who cannot reasonably debate without name-calling or thinking outside of the box....that is why I referenced the wolves lol..
The pharisees did not like Paul because he became a Christian ....yet he diverted much from the Christian faith by mixing in a lot of old testament rules and tethering them to christianity...in effect he took Christianity and sort of schismed it a part for himself.....
His constant bragging about himself is also a red flag about how righteous he is....no servant of God would boast about himself....yes people will quote hebrews and other scriptures about Paul being of the tribe of benjamin a pharisee yadda yadda....but the guy like to talk down to others as if he was some super spiritual guy....I think the other apostles were right in getting away from him at Jerusalem because they probably knew he was a bit nuts....
The pharisees did not like Paul because he became a Christian ....yet he diverted much from the Christian faith by mixing in a lot of old testament rules and tethering them to christianity...in effect he took Christianity and sort of schismed it a part for himself.....
His constant bragging about himself is also a red flag about how righteous he is....no servant of God would boast about himself....yes people will quote hebrews and other scriptures about Paul being of the tribe of benjamin a pharisee yadda yadda....but the guy like to talk down to others as if he was some super spiritual guy....I think the other apostles were right in getting away from him at Jerusalem because they probably knew he was a bit nuts....
Pauls life was spent pursuing Jesus, and striving to be like Jesus. He is a very good person to set as an example, because His example is Jesus. pauls doctrine is absolutely sound, its only that people have the terrible misconception of His letters just as peter warned the church to beware of. make sure you are not seing the paul that other people are explaining what He said, and that you are actually seeing what He said in light of Jesus words. because you understand which one to follow, paul then will give you depth of understanding. pauls writings are easily distortable when a person ommits the gospel, because there is no foundation for what paul is saying and it lacks discernment. when a person understands Jesus is the One to follow, paul has immense value. He actually doesnt teach most of what modern christians claim His doctrine is. buit extends the Gospels clarity without changing anything
E
what scripture did Jesus pen? Using this line of reasoning, You follow no part of scripture. Because every part of scripture is written by sinners./
it sounds to me that as long as scripture agrees with you, it is ok. If not. Then it is not inspired. That makes scripture unreliable at the least. If I can nto trust one part. How can I trust any of it?
it sounds to me that as long as scripture agrees with you, it is ok. If not. Then it is not inspired. That makes scripture unreliable at the least. If I can nto trust one part. How can I trust any of it?
N
1 Timothy 1:1
“Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the commandment of God our Saviour, and Lord Jesus Christ, which is our hope;”
2 Timothy 3:16-17
16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
17 That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.
_____________
for context
1 Corinthians Chapter 8
►
1 Now as touching things offered unto idols, we know that we all have knowledge. Knowledge puffeth up, but charity edifieth.
2 And if any man think that he knoweth any thing, he knoweth nothing yet as he ought to know.
3 But if any man love God, the same is known of him.
4 As concerning therefore the eating of those things that are offered in sacrifice unto idols, we know that an idol is nothing in the world, and that there is none other God but one.
5 For though there be that are called gods, whether in heaven or in earth, (as there be gods many, and lords many,)
6 But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.
7 Howbeit there is not in every man that knowledge: for some with conscience of the idol unto this hour eat it as a thing offered unto an idol; and their conscience being weak is defiled.
8 But meat commendeth us not to God: for neither, if we eat, are we the better; neither, if we eat not, are we the worse.
9 But take heed lest by any means this liberty of yours become a stumblingblock to them that are weak.
10 For if any man see thee which hast knowledge sit at meat in the idol's temple, shall not the conscience of him which is weak be emboldened to eat those things which are offered to idols;
11 And through thy knowledge shall the weak brother perish, for whom Christ died?
12 But when ye sin so against the brethren, and wound their weak conscience, ye sin against Christ.
13 Wherefore, if meat make my brother to offend, I will eat no flesh while the world standeth, lest I make my brother to offend.
________
Acts 15
15 And certain men which came down from Judaea taught the brethren, and said, Except ye be circumcised after the manner of Moses, ye cannot be saved.
2 When therefore Paul and Barnabas had no small dissension and disputation with them, they determined that Paul and Barnabas, and certain other of them, should go up to Jerusalem unto the apostles and elders about this question.
3 And being brought on their way by the church, they passed through Phenice and Samaria, declaring the conversion of the Gentiles: and they caused great joy unto all the brethren.
4 And when they were come to Jerusalem, they were received of the church, and of the apostles and elders, and they declared all things that God had done with them.
5 But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses.
6 And the apostles and elders came together for to consider of this matter.
7 And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.
8 And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us;
9 And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.
10 Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?
11 But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.
12 Then all the multitude kept silence, and gave audience to Barnabas and Paul, declaring what miracles and wonders God had wrought among the Gentiles by them.
13 And after they had held their peace, James answered, saying, Men and brethren, hearken unto me:
14 Simeon hath declared how God at the first did visit the Gentiles, to take out of them a people for his name.
15 And to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written,
16 After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up:
17 That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things.
18 Known unto God are all his works from the beginning of the world.
19 Wherefore my sentence is, that we trouble not them, which from among the Gentiles are turned to God:
20 But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.
21 For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.
22 Then pleased it the apostles and elders with the whole church, to send chosen men of their own company to Antioch with Paul and Barnabas; namely, Judas surnamed Barsabas and Silas, chief men among the brethren:
23 And they wrote letters by them after this manner; The apostles and elders and brethren send greeting unto the brethren which are of the Gentiles in Antioch and Syria and Cilicia.
24 Forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment:
25 It seemed good unto us, being assembled with one accord, to send chosen men unto you with our beloved Barnabas and Paul,
26 Men that have hazarded their lives for the name of our Lord Jesus Christ.
27 We have sent therefore Judas and Silas, who shall also tell you the same things by mouth.
28 For it seemed good to the Holy Ghost, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things;
29 That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well
do you not understand hes speaking of the freedom of Christ
and eating these meats does not pertain to salvation
but to not do it in front of one who regards it as sin?
because we ought to use scripture and build eachother up to ALL good works?
even with our freedom in Christ
zero "contradicting"
“Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the commandment of God our Saviour, and Lord Jesus Christ, which is our hope;”
2 Timothy 3:16-17
16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
17 That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.
_____________
for context
1 Corinthians Chapter 8
►
1 Now as touching things offered unto idols, we know that we all have knowledge. Knowledge puffeth up, but charity edifieth.
2 And if any man think that he knoweth any thing, he knoweth nothing yet as he ought to know.
3 But if any man love God, the same is known of him.
4 As concerning therefore the eating of those things that are offered in sacrifice unto idols, we know that an idol is nothing in the world, and that there is none other God but one.
5 For though there be that are called gods, whether in heaven or in earth, (as there be gods many, and lords many,)
6 But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.
7 Howbeit there is not in every man that knowledge: for some with conscience of the idol unto this hour eat it as a thing offered unto an idol; and their conscience being weak is defiled.
8 But meat commendeth us not to God: for neither, if we eat, are we the better; neither, if we eat not, are we the worse.
9 But take heed lest by any means this liberty of yours become a stumblingblock to them that are weak.
10 For if any man see thee which hast knowledge sit at meat in the idol's temple, shall not the conscience of him which is weak be emboldened to eat those things which are offered to idols;
11 And through thy knowledge shall the weak brother perish, for whom Christ died?
12 But when ye sin so against the brethren, and wound their weak conscience, ye sin against Christ.
13 Wherefore, if meat make my brother to offend, I will eat no flesh while the world standeth, lest I make my brother to offend.
________
Acts 15
15 And certain men which came down from Judaea taught the brethren, and said, Except ye be circumcised after the manner of Moses, ye cannot be saved.
2 When therefore Paul and Barnabas had no small dissension and disputation with them, they determined that Paul and Barnabas, and certain other of them, should go up to Jerusalem unto the apostles and elders about this question.
3 And being brought on their way by the church, they passed through Phenice and Samaria, declaring the conversion of the Gentiles: and they caused great joy unto all the brethren.
4 And when they were come to Jerusalem, they were received of the church, and of the apostles and elders, and they declared all things that God had done with them.
5 But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses.
6 And the apostles and elders came together for to consider of this matter.
7 And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.
8 And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us;
9 And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.
10 Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?
11 But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.
12 Then all the multitude kept silence, and gave audience to Barnabas and Paul, declaring what miracles and wonders God had wrought among the Gentiles by them.
13 And after they had held their peace, James answered, saying, Men and brethren, hearken unto me:
14 Simeon hath declared how God at the first did visit the Gentiles, to take out of them a people for his name.
15 And to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written,
16 After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up:
17 That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things.
18 Known unto God are all his works from the beginning of the world.
19 Wherefore my sentence is, that we trouble not them, which from among the Gentiles are turned to God:
20 But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.
21 For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.
22 Then pleased it the apostles and elders with the whole church, to send chosen men of their own company to Antioch with Paul and Barnabas; namely, Judas surnamed Barsabas and Silas, chief men among the brethren:
23 And they wrote letters by them after this manner; The apostles and elders and brethren send greeting unto the brethren which are of the Gentiles in Antioch and Syria and Cilicia.
24 Forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment:
25 It seemed good unto us, being assembled with one accord, to send chosen men unto you with our beloved Barnabas and Paul,
26 Men that have hazarded their lives for the name of our Lord Jesus Christ.
27 We have sent therefore Judas and Silas, who shall also tell you the same things by mouth.
28 For it seemed good to the Holy Ghost, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things;
29 That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well
do you not understand hes speaking of the freedom of Christ
and eating these meats does not pertain to salvation
but to not do it in front of one who regards it as sin?
because we ought to use scripture and build eachother up to ALL good works?
even with our freedom in Christ
zero "contradicting"
So, anything you do not understand is automatically a contradiction.
James suggests behavioral restrictions that were to be common among both Jew and Gentile regarding the practices of idolatry. They were to abstain from:
[SUB][/SUB]1.Fornication
2.The eating of things strangled
3.The eating of blood
Are the eating of things strangled and the eating of blood general in nature or is consumption of these things strictly related to the worship of idols? The consumption of blood had been a restriction of both previous covenants. Now, it would seem that it is restricted for this covenant as well but all of the sepractices are linked to the worship of idols.
In 1 Cor, and in Rom., Paul is discussing the freedom Christians have in the eating of meats. A Christian is free to eat meat that is sacrificed to an idol since he understands that an idol is nothing. There is no idolatry connected with this eating of the meat. The danger for the new Gentiles converts in Acts 15 was the fact they are from a background that is rooted in idolatry. For them, the eating of meats sacrificed to idols would have presented a significant problem. The instruction in Acts 15 was for them to abstain from idolatry.
James suggests behavioral restrictions that were to be common among both Jew and Gentile regarding the practices of idolatry. They were to abstain from:
[SUB][/SUB]1.Fornication
2.The eating of things strangled
3.The eating of blood
Are the eating of things strangled and the eating of blood general in nature or is consumption of these things strictly related to the worship of idols? The consumption of blood had been a restriction of both previous covenants. Now, it would seem that it is restricted for this covenant as well but all of the sepractices are linked to the worship of idols.
In 1 Cor, and in Rom., Paul is discussing the freedom Christians have in the eating of meats. A Christian is free to eat meat that is sacrificed to an idol since he understands that an idol is nothing. There is no idolatry connected with this eating of the meat. The danger for the new Gentiles converts in Acts 15 was the fact they are from a background that is rooted in idolatry. For them, the eating of meats sacrificed to idols would have presented a significant problem. The instruction in Acts 15 was for them to abstain from idolatry.
