Jesus didn’t die for us to be miserable

[7seasrekeyed]

To take up our cross simply means to receive all the benefits I have provide for you.

said Swaggart

probably most of us do not live the double life he did so we just don't get the revelation he did

I think we should stick with what Paul said regarding sin and remember that the Bible, not Swaggart, says Jesus despised the shame

starting to remind me of hucksters selling pieces of the 'original' cross along the routes the Crusades took

would have needed a Sequoia to furnish the 'cross'

 

[plainguy]

starting to remind me of hucksters selling pieces of the 'original' cross along the routes the Crusades took

God doesn't frown on us being successful . I recently installed a bathtub Madonna in my front yard that cries real tears. Lots of people paying me a dollar each to see it. Set up my BBQ as well. I'm selling Apostle burgers, Judas chilli dogs and the Mary Magdelene Veggie special ... that comes with a pop.

 

[Magenta]

Yes, I sometimes wonder what some of "the Holy Ones" believed 26 years ago.

Hmmm, makes me wonder, where was I 26 years ago??? *Gets out calculator* Ah! I was 36 then. I vaguely remember being in a relationship with a man who beat me up on a fairly (unfairly?) regular basis. Things have changed a LOT in the intervening years. I wasn't even a believer back then. But I do recall reading a book about the miracles in Medjugorje at that time, that I found strangely compelling and inspirational Medjugorje is a town in Bosnia and Herzegovina that has been an unofficial place of Catholic pilgrimage since Mary (the mother of Jesus) allegedly appeared on Apparition Hill in 1981. Yep, that is the year I was 36 years old, 26 years ago

 

[preacher4truth]

I have been blessed by preaching some from the OT these last few months. I went through the first three chapters of Hosea and then I preached a little from Deuteronomy. The thing that God showed me is that those who don't know their history, are doomed to repeat it. Ppl who scoffed God's ppl and rushed to the defense of heretics are just as rampant today...maybe even worse...as they were in biblical times. Ppl are dooming themselves because they fail to see what those scoffers did in the bible are the exact same thing(s) they're doing now.

Yep. Sound doctrine is mocked, exegesis is mocked, the Gospel is belittled, those who are godly are despised.

The emergent church mentality is rampant, and scoffers like Willie and those of his ilk love to make it sound like no one has any real biblical truth, that everything is up for grabs and that any theological stance is foolish.

It makes sense for them to embrace that mindset given the many errors and false doctrines they allow (Vineyard movement, Bill Johnson, WoF, Osteen &c). Try talking to them about any type of sound doctrine, Bible, theology, the attributes and nature of God and they drown in confusion, then ridicule at the same time.

 

[Willie-T]

Yep. Sound doctrine is mocked, exegesis is mocked, the Gospel is belittled, those who are godly are despised.

The emergent church mentality is rampant, and scoffers like Willie and those of his ilk love to make it sound like no one has any real biblical truth, that everything is up for grabs and that any theological stance is foolish.

It makes sense for them to embrace that mindset given the many errors and false doctrines they allow (Vineyard movement, Bill Johnson, WoF, Osteen &c). Try talking to them about any type of sound doctrine, Bible, theology, the attributes and nature of God and they drown in confusion, then ridicule at the same time.

Not knowing part of your anatomy from a hole in the ground, you try to resort to identifying The Vineyard Movement with other things you attack simply because I like that church?

Well, you have proven your mouth is fat, how about you see if your fingers are also husky enough to pull up the Vineyard SOF, and show us what they follow that is false doctrine.

 

[Magenta]

Hmmm, makes me wonder, where was I 26 years ago??? *Gets out calculator* Ah! I was 36 then. I vaguely remember being in a relationship with a man who beat me up on a fairly (unfairly?) regular basis. Things have changed a LOT in the intervening years. I wasn't even a believer back then. But I do recall reading a book about the miracles in Medjugorje at that time, that I found strangely compelling and inspirational Medjugorje is a town in Bosnia and Herzegovina that has been an unofficial place of Catholic pilgrimage since Mary (the mother of Jesus) allegedly appeared on Apparition Hill in 1981. Yep, that is the year I was 36 years old, 26 years ago

My math skills are next to non existent In '81 I was 26
I was 36 when I read about it tho 26 years ago. Too many sixes!

 

[Locutus]

I see three sixes in there.

 

[preacher4truth]

Not knowing part of your anatomy from a hole in the ground, you try to resort to identifying The Vineyard Movement with other things you attack simply because I like that church?

Well, you have proven your mouth is fat, how about you see if your fingers are also husky enough to pull up the Vineyard SOF, and show us what they follow that is false doctrine.

And there, my point is proven once again, thanks Willie.

You've been shown the false teachings often enough, yet all you offer in return is ridicule of the messenger, a smart aleck retort and more importantly ridicule of any form of sound biblical doctrine. You belittle the person and propagate the false teachers you admire.

Your doctrine is there are no doctrines. Unfortunately you aren't biblically sound unless scoffing is to be counted.

You already know this, you're well acquainted with yourself, and so am I.

When is the last time you cracked open a Bible, and thought solemnly about John 17:17 for yourself?

Oh, and by the way, any "church" can have a SOF. It's when they actually start teaching that they prove their SOF has been abandoned and it is a facade. Denial of this fact follows suit. You should already know this, and surely you do.

 

[Willie-T]

And there, my point is proven once again, thanks Willie.

You've been shown the false teachings often enough, yet all you offer in return is ridicule of the messenger, a smart aleck retort and more importantly ridicule of any form of sound biblical doctrine. You belittle the person and propagate the false teachers you admire.

Your doctrine is there are no doctrines. Unfortunately you aren't biblically sound unless scoffing is to be counted.

You already know this, you're well acquainted with yourself, and so am I.

When is the last time you cracked open a Bible, and thought solemnly about John 17:17 for yourself?

Oh, and by the way, any "church" can have a SOF. It's when they actually start teaching that they prove their SOF has been abandoned and it is a facade. Denial of this fact follows suit. You should already know this, and surely you do.

You make a lot of dumb comments, but that has to top them all. If you can't find anything wrong with the Vineyard's teaching, just admit it. Don't try to weakly claim they don't teach what they put online for the whole world to see.

 

[7seasrekeyed]

God doesn't frown on us being successful . I recently installed a bathtub Madonna in my front yard that cries real tears. Lots of people paying me a dollar each to see it. Set up my BBQ as well. I'm selling Apostle burgers, Judas chilli dogs and the Mary Magdelene Veggie special ... that comes with a pop.

well be careful of the Apostle burgers...I heard they occasionally burst into flames

 

[Magenta]

I see three sixes in there.

I did, too

 

[jsr1221]

Her words sound good to covetous ears "Jesus doesn't want you to be miserable." Thats why people flock to her because their ears are itching to hear how they can get more stuff, and how to justify getting more stuff and they get their ears scratched. This is what they think it means to "be right with God."

Scripture calls them covetous, and that this is also idolatry.

Oh no, they'll never believe that! Exactly. They're being deceived so of course not.

In this world we will have tribulation. Weep with those who weep. We through much tribulation enter the kingdom of God. We are granted belief and suffering. In all these things and even in lacking the true believer has joy.

No person in the NT church expected a trouble free walk and whatever material thing they desired. The heresy that teaches the opposite comes from rich self important psychologists posing as Gospel ministers. They usually write books about how much you can get from God because you deserve it.

Being miserable in life is different than going through tribulations. Trials in life tests our trust in the Lord. Being miserable about everything goes to show how we aren't appreciated of the blessings God gave us. How majority of folks are missimg that distinction is beyond me. Then again, because it comes from a controversial figure, people are ready to spear their way through in the battlefield.

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

Being miserable in life is different than going through tribulations. Trials in life tests our trust in the Lord. Being miserable about everything goes to show how we aren't appreciated of the blessings God gave us. How majority of folks are missimg that distinction is beyond me. Then again, because it comes from a controversial figure, people are ready to spear their way through in the battlefield.

Gm again, mister! Being miserable DOES in a roundabout way show we are not appreciative but...it takes some time to trust Him unreservedly. I had to to go through some things and some miseries and get to the other side of them to see that His sole intent had been to have me trust Him more. I had to actually SEE some good, some growth, to be able to have that moment where I understood that I really COULD trust Him even in miseries.

There's a dividing line of sorts, and on the other side of it is where we can say, oh my gosh, He WAS guiding it all and it WAS all to bless me in the end.

Its on the other side of that dividing line that we begin to have a calmness, trust and peace even when IN misery that is such a relief to us that we are more glad to suffer miseries as really from His hand and complain to Him much less in the discomfort.

Its so odd a feeling to be in a situation where everyone around us is freaking out over our situation but we ourselves are not. You feel like the looks they give you are as if you are some odd sort of bug they are looking at! They will tell you that you can't just sit and wait for God to help you but that you have to DO something! (That whole God helps those who help themselves nonsense.)

What you are really doing is walking by trust instead of sight. You are walking in the darkness of trust. Trusting without seeing.walking calmly along in the dark. But others will think you are just being lazy! They will even convince you of it sometimes until you catch yourself and say: no! I am going to keep trusting and waiting to see what He means by this and what He is doing for me!

 

[SovereignGrace]

You make a lot of dumb comments, but that has to top them all. If you can't find anything wrong with the Vineyard's teaching, just admit it. Don't try to weakly claim they don't teach what they put online for the whole world to see.

No, he was spot on. My home church adheres to the Philadelphia Confession of Faith, but they are way closer to free will than they are Calvinist. The church is a little 100 years old, so I'd guess the first members agreed with the PCoF.

But if we went through in on Wednesday nights, I'd bet dollars to donuts many would reject most of it.

So, CoF's are not always representative of what that church adheres to.

 

[preacher4truth]

You make a lot of dumb comments, but that has to top them all. If you can't find anything wrong with the Vineyard's teaching, just admit it. Don't try to weakly claim they don't teach what they put online for the whole world to see.

More ad hominem, but fully expected from you.

It's funny, really, that you want to go by a piece of paper stating alleged beliefs, but not by the actual practice and history which goes against sound doctrine.

There's a reason for that.

And, there's a huge elephant in the room.

 

[preacher4truth]

No, he was spot on. My home church adheres to the Philadelphia Confession of Faith, but they are way closer to free will than they are Calvinist. The church is a little 100 years old, so I'd guess the first members agreed with the PCoF.

But if we went through in on Wednesday nights, I'd bet dollars to donuts many would reject most of it.

So, CoF's are not always representative of what that church adheres to.

Yep. We talked about how many claim to be Sola Scriptura, then when they start teaching it denies their claim. A person, church can say anything they want concerning beliefs, but the proof is seen in what they are actually living and teaching.

 

[7seasrekeyed]

Being miserable in life is different than going through tribulations. Trials in life tests our trust in the Lord. Being miserable about everything goes to show how we aren't appreciated of the blessings God gave us. How majority of folks are missimg that distinction is beyond me. Then again, because it comes from a controversial figure, people are ready to spear their way through in the battlefield.

that pretty much defines it IMO

 

[Willie-T]

No, he was spot on. My home church adheres to the Philadelphia Confession of Faith, but they are way closer to free will than they are Calvinist. The church is a little 100 years old, so I'd guess the first members agreed with the PCoF.

But if we went through in on Wednesday nights, I'd bet dollars to donuts many would reject most of it.

So, CoF's are not always representative of what that church adheres to.

So, you must, then, believe that most Catholic Churches are fine in their teaching? I mean, since your church has wandered from their CoF, all churches must obviously do that?

 

[Willie-T]

Yep. We talked about how many claim to be Sola Scriptura, then when they start teaching it denies their claim. A person, church can say anything they want concerning beliefs, but the proof is seen in what they are actually living and teaching.

Have you ever set foot in a Vineyard Church? I don't think I ever saw you in the one I attended. Yet, you somehow seem to know what they teach.