Job and its relevance to our struggles

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DivineDove

Junior Member
May 24, 2018
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#1
Hello everyone! I was recently reading about Job and found this story terrifying. Does God still wager with the devil in the way he did with Job? I kind of resonate with Job and his trials and losses. I'm curious what your opinions on this complex story are...

I'm not really sure if God answers why we must suffer exactly and I don't believe the answer is always to make someone a stronger believer.
 
Dec 9, 2017
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#2
God declared Job a righteous man as He does all who receive grace through faith in Him but notice it is a righteousness imputed from God, a gift, not a righteousness of works, so no one may boast. Jobs problem was he counted his righteousness as being his own, see chapter 32. The moral of the story is to trust in God, not yourself, no matter what happens. He is working things out. If you finish the story you will notice that is what Job did.
 

Joidevivre

Senior Member
Jul 15, 2014
3,838
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#3
I'm not really sure if God answers why we must suffer exactly and I don't believe the answer is always to make someone a stronger believer.[/QUOTE]

If you have ever really suffered in a physical way as Job did, you learn that you really have no control over your own life. You learn that there is no person who will understand the "why?". You are forced to turn to God for answers.

And then God will only turn your attention to Himself. He will not answer one "why?" question because the answer is not what you need. He wants to reveal more of Himself and take your eyes off of yourself.
 

Laish

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2016
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#4
Hello DevineDove

My take on Job is that God didn’t wager with the devil. Look at the what is written in Job .



Job 6:1 Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan also came among them.7 The Lord said to Satan, “From where do you come?” Then Satan answered the Lord and said, “From roaming about on the earth and walking around on it.”8 The Lord said to Satan, “Have you considered My servant Job? For there is no one like him on the earth, a blameless and upright man, fearing God and turning away from evil.”9 Then Satan answered the Lord, “Does Job fear God for nothing?10 Have You not made a hedge about him and his house and all that he has, on every side



First thing Satan is more like a title. Satan means the accuser. He , Satan is there to accuse God . Also God dose not point out Job to Satan. Satan already knew Job . Satan said that God had built a hedge around Job . How did Satan know ? Unless Satan already tested it . Think about it . Satan the devil is a evil spirit he is always on the move . Not ever resting.



1Peter 5:8 Be of sober spirit, be on the alert. Your adversary, the devil, prowls around like a roaring lion, seeking someone to devour.



Like Satan said moving up and down the earth .



Mathew 12:43 Now when the unclean spirit goes out of a man, it passes through waterless places seeking rest, and does not find it.



Satan or the devil is always on the prowl. Seeking someone to devour. Given that God had said There was none like Job . Job would have been on Satan’s mind.

As for what is the answer to why the suffering. I believe that’s not the point of the Book of Job. Job in the end only repents in ashes. Knowing that all God dose is Just ,good ,and beyond his comprehension.



Job 42:1Then Job answered the LORD and said,

2“I know that You can do all things,

And that no purpose of Yours can be thwarted.

3‘Who is this that hides counsel without knowledge?’

“Therefore I have declared that which I did not understand,

Things too wonderful for me, which I did not know.”

4‘Hear, now, and I will speak;

I will ask You, and You instruct me.’

5“I have heard of You by the hearing of the ear;

But now my eye sees You;

6Therefore I retract,

And I repent in dust and ashes.”
Blessings
Bill
 

mcubed

Senior Member
Dec 20, 2013
1,449
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#5
Hello everyone! I was recently reading about Job and found this story terrifying. Does God still wager with the devil in the way he did with Job? I kind of resonate with Job and his trials and losses. I'm curious what your opinions on this complex story are...

I'm not really sure if God answers why we must suffer exactly and I don't believe the answer is always to make someone a stronger believer.

Job's relevance... Does your life evr suck? If you don't think think it it is to make you more of a believer in Him maybe you are a righteous Man and G-d said have you ever considered my servant.....

Think about it, especially those that think they can lose their Salvation.... Do you want to be as righteous as Job? If you do.... Can you prove G-d calls you a Job to get you to heaven.... Then what about the rest of us....?

Yes, I do believe He does but I do not think I am righteous enough for a wager, but because I am Saved I am righteous in Him and will make it heaven!!!! Whatever happens in the meantime I am the apple of His eye... I love Him and He LOVES ME... AND ALL IS WELL WITH MY SOUL!!!! Job gives me a pick into the Character of my G-d... which is Love, Forgiveness, Hope, and Life in Him....
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
16,145
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#6
Hello everyone! I was recently reading about Job and found this story terrifying.
Looks like all the previous posts have been wiped out. Anyway there is nothing terrifying about the book of Job.

Every Christian's faith will be tested, and some will be tested very severely. Expect to have your faith tested, and then learn how Job remained righteous through everything.

Those who preach and teach that the Christian's life on earth will be a walk in the park with health, wealth, and happiness galore, are simply lying through their teeth.
 

FlSnookman7

Senior Member
Jun 27, 2015
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#7
Welcome to CC!

Just a couple thoughts. Being a Christian is no promise of an easy life here. Being a Christian is often very trying indeed. At the same time I have found being a Christian is always amazing, can always be joyful and can also be peaceful. I also think it is important to remember that Job did not have the indwelling of the Holy Spirit that we have as Christians today.

God loves you and there is no reason to be afraid. Shalom.
 

Zmouth

Senior Member
Nov 21, 2012
3,391
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#8
Those who preach and teach that the Christian's life on earth will be a walk in the park with health, wealth, and happiness galore, are simply lying through their teeth.
Do you mean like those who wish above all things that you mayest prosper and be in health, or have a more abundant life?
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
16,145
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#9
Do you mean like those who wish above all things that you mayest prosper and be in health, or have a more abundant life?
This is undoubtedly in Scripture, but we need to look at the broad picture.

Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword? As it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; we are accounted as sheep for the slaughter. Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us.
(Rom 8:35-27).

So "all these things" are promised to Christians, while they are encouraged that they will be "more than conquerors".
 
A

AuntieAnt

Guest
#10
If you have ever really suffered in a physical way as Job did, you learn that you really have no control over your own life. You learn that there is no person who will understand the "why?". You are forced to turn to God for answers.

And then God will only turn your attention to Himself. He will not answer one "why?" question because the answer is not what you need. He wants to reveal more of Himself and take your eyes off of yourself.
I agree wholeheartedly with you, Joi that when we suffer we come to realize that God is in control, not us.
And hallelujah for that! \:)/

Although He has often answered my questions why, it's never in the way I expect. He always narrows my questions down to some deeper question in my heart. And it's always doubt based. And as you said, His Presence is always the answer, in various aspects, too.
Our Amazing God. \:love:/

Btw, I hope DivineDove isn't that psychic readings advisor who's all over Google, YouTube, Twitter & FB. :oops: If not, I apologize for assuming wrong. :censored:
 
Jan 6, 2018
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#11
Hello everyone! I was recently reading about Job and found this story terrifying. Does God still wager with the devil in the way he did with Job? I kind of resonate with Job and his trials and losses. I'm curious what your opinions on this complex story are...

I'm not really sure if God answers why we must suffer exactly and I don't believe the answer is always to make someone a stronger believer.
The application of Job for today is stay faithful to God even if it seems He has forsaken you.
 

Angela53510

Senior Member
Jan 24, 2011
11,458
2,639
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#12
Job has been my best friend, on many occasions. I believe God allowed him to go through trials, both for a witness to Satan, and also to show us that we do suffer in this world.

When I had my foot reconstructed in 2009, God told me to read Job. Each day, the words comforted and encouraged me. Certainly what I suffered was not any worse than Job. And like Job, I did recover - although I did not receive any riches, I was more or less restored. More, because after 5 months, the bunion finally fused, and I did not lose my foot. Less, because the foot causes me more pain than when it was terribly deformed.

Only today I was reminded of that, when the foot would not stop spasming. But, someone gave me a clue a few years back to apply magnesium gel, and within minutes, the pain and cramping was gone. Amazing how God has provided all we need to move through life, no matter what ails us!

God has taught me so much through suffering. I pity anyone, who only clings to God when good things happen. Adversity does teach us that God is in control, and yes, he is a good God, who loves us, and knows the best way to transform us into the image of Christ. And sometimes, that is in spite of ourselves.
 

maxwel

Senior Member
Apr 18, 2013
8,654
1,887
113
#13
Hello everyone! I was recently reading about Job and found this story terrifying. Does God still wager with the devil in the way he did with Job? I kind of resonate with Job and his trials and losses. I'm curious what your opinions on this complex story are...

I'm not really sure if God answers why we must suffer exactly and I don't believe the answer is always to make someone a stronger believer.
Wager

It actually wasn't a wager.
And although we might hear the term "wager with the devil" in pop culture, that isn't really what happened in job.
It's probably better theology for us to avoid that expression... it makes it sound like God is out of control, and he's just up there shooting dice.

: )

-----
 

Angela53510

Senior Member
Jan 24, 2011
11,458
2,639
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#14
Wager

It actually wasn't a wager.
And although we might hear the term "wager with the devil" in pop culture, that isn't really what happened in job.
It's probably better theology for us to avoid that expression... it makes it sound like God is out of control, and he's just up there shooting dice.

: )

-----
I think Maxwel is right! Certainly, a sovereign God is not making a wager with Satan. Instead, he was showing Satan how wrong he is. And in the process, that God is always in control.

God had a number of distinct purposes in having Satan go after Job. One had to be to show that Job was faithful, in spite of calamity. Another was a witness to the friends. And of course, God knew the book would be a part of our Bible, and it would encourage those who are suffering.

But, more important than those things, are the closing chapters of the book. God describes in great detail, how he is sovereign, and to Job, of all people. Job who did trust God, even though he was hurting. God showed Job, that he is in control, and the most interesting point, is that when Job wants to know why he had to suffer, God never directly answers his question. In the end, Job repents, and yes, God restores him.

I would ask the OP if they have ever read the whole book of Job through? I read it once a year, and every time I get more out of it. The best thing to do is to read the whole Bible, and certainly, Job, once a year. Then, these things will make a lot more sense, than just reading a chapter or a few verses.
 
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7seasrekeyed

Guest
#15
Welcome to CC!

Just a couple thoughts. Being a Christian is no promise of an easy life here. Being a Christian is often very trying indeed. At the same time I have found being a Christian is always amazing, can always be joyful and can also be peaceful. I also think it is important to remember that Job did not have the indwelling of the Holy Spirit that we have as Christians today.

God loves you and there is no reason to be afraid. Shalom.
ummm...not trying to be contradictory here, but while Job did not have the indwelling Holy Spirit as believers do today, he did have an audience with God speaking to him that we are not privy to (even though some will go out on the limb and say they do which I personally do not believe with possibly some very very rare exceptions)

we are led by the Holy Spirit in various ways, but hearing what appears to be the audible voice of God in conversation with Job is what we do not have.
 
Feb 28, 2016
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#16
well,
the scriptures plainly say that 'the Spirit of Christ' was 'in all of the prophets'...
there is only One Spirit of the Holy Nature - we DO BELIEVE that Job was among
the prophets and did receive The Holy Spirit, otherwise, he could not inherit
The Kingdom of God...
 
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7seasrekeyed

Guest
#17
well,
the scriptures plainly say that 'the Spirit of Christ' was 'in all of the prophets'...
there is only One Spirit of the Holy Nature - we DO BELIEVE that Job was among
the prophets and did receive The Holy Spirit, otherwise, he could not inherit
The Kingdom of God...
do you also not believe in the Trinity? cause that is what I am talking about

do you also adhere to what this poster is saying?
 
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7seasrekeyed

Guest
#18
Jesus said that he would send the Holy Spirit in John 15:26, "When the Helper comes, whom I will send to you from the Father, that is the Spirit of truth who proceeds from the Father, He will testify about Me."

So if the Holy Spirit and Jesus were the same, it would not be possible for Jesus to say he would be sending the Holy Spirit.

that's my point.
 
Feb 28, 2016
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#19
EPH. 4:4.
There is one body, and One Spirit, even as you are called in one hope of your calling;

1PETER 1:11. (speaking of the prophets) -
Searching what, or what manner of time The Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify,
when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.

ISA. 63:11.
Then He remembered the days of old, Moses, and His people, saying, Where is He that brought them up
out of the sea with the shepherd of His flock? where is He that put His Holy Spirit within him?

(one scripture NEVER negates another, else it would be total confusion)...
 
7

7seasrekeyed

Guest
#20
EPH. 4:4.
There is one body, and One Spirit, even as you are called in one hope of your calling;

1PETER 1:11. (speaking of the prophets) -
Searching what, or what manner of time The Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify,
when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.

ISA. 63:11.
Then He remembered the days of old, Moses, and His people, saying, Where is He that brought them upout of the sea with the shepherd of His flock? where is He that put His Holy Spirit within him?

(one scripture NEVER negates another, else it would be total confusion)...

well actually people negate scripture to prove their own interpretation

all the time

I am not the expert in criptology that you seem to be