Not By Works

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
31,548
10,534
113
We MUST obey, then if we do or not is a totally different question.
nah Fran.

if we MUST do some thing then there is no path in which we may not.
if we do or do not is exactly the question, and the problem is what you said next:


We won't be perfect till we die.
an hard constraint which isn't met is 100% 'no solution' outcome. it's simple linear optimization. math doesn't lie.

here's the solution:

For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.
(Colossians 3:3)

:D

it's a narrow way, lady
 

GodsGrace101

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2018
2,225
517
113
earlier you said "His directions and commandments" with the implication of all of them.
why are you changing your argument?
Do you not know that two types of commandments have been abolished?
Leaving only the moral commandments...
 

GodsGrace101

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2018
2,225
517
113
nah Fran.

if we MUST do some thing then there is no path in which we may not.
if we do or do not is exactly the question, and the problem is what you said next:




an hard constraint which isn't met is 100% 'no solution' outcome. it's simple linear optimization. math doesn't lie.

here's the solution:

For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.
(Colossians 3:3)

:D

it's a narrow way, lady
I like responding to comments that make sense.
Some comments make little or no sense and it's difficult to respond.
Maybe if you could rephrase?
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,369
113
i read through all 244 uses of this word in the NT and i only saw about 8 or 9 where i could legitimately replace the word 'believe' with 'obey' and the scripture still make any sense. but within the greater contexts those wouldn't make sense either. mostly they were phrases like ".. to you who have believed" where it was plausible that someone might describe the same people as "you who have obeyed"
-- not that it read to me as though that would be a legitimate or accurate translation anywhere, just that that would be a plausible thing to be written instead of what's actually written.
Both of them are wrong.....but you know what....they will NEVER accept that truth....even when facing the Lord in their LAST DAY........
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,369
113
Always your own words, your own doctrines. Same ole Decon.

"I'm already immortal gosh darn it, and I don't care what Paul, Jesus or God Almighty says".
You know....your statement above is ignorant and has no bearing whatsoever at ALL on the current convo.....nor value I might add.....
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,369
113
Which of the 10 commandments has changed from Exodus through to the present?
We don't know FRAN?....other than the fact that it is whittled down to 2 and the 1 in the NEW Covenant....but hey....let's conflate everything into some working for, not saved yet, I have to help JESUS because he is too weak to keep his promises and or word dogma.........
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,369
113
nah Fran.

if we MUST do some thing then there is no path in which we may not.
if we do or do not is exactly the question, and the problem is what you said next:




an hard constraint which isn't met is 100% 'no solution' outcome. it's simple linear optimization. math doesn't lie.

here's the solution:

For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.
(Colossians 3:3)

:D

it's a narrow way, lady
WINNER WINNER CHICKEN DINNER........the IRREVOCABLE GIFT of ETERNAL LIFE by GRACE through FAITH.................<---BIBLICAL SALVATION
 

maxwel

Senior Member
Apr 18, 2013
8,654
1,887
113
It does not get any plainer..........Our righteous works have ZERO to do with Salvation!
The was the original Opening Post, back on page #1.

Now we've had 3700 pages of argumentation.

3700 pages of disagreement!!

3700 pages of argumentation can ONLY MEAN one thing, that dcontroversal is WRONG!

Unless...

mmm....

unless....

just maybe...

lots of Christians living in a fallen postmodern world have really terrible doctrine because most of the modern churches they attend have strayed so far from the Bible that they spout utterly non-biblical doctrine coming from utterly terrible teachers who will say almost anything just to fill up the coffers and make a quick buck... and... people are generally too lazy or ambivalent about spiritual things to do any serious study on their own which might just possibly contradict their own pastor who has really really really great hair.


Got me.

It could really go either way.



...
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
11,236
4,183
113
Which of the 10 commandments has changed from Exodus through to the present?

You are insisting on you are to KEEP you False Gospel, are you NOT?

The Ten Commandments were HIGHER than a MAN can KEEP them PERFECTLY. There purpose was to PROVE TO SINFUL MAN that he could not KEEP THEM, therefore man needed a MESSIAH to keep them FOR THE SINNER.

James 2:10 (CSBBible)
10 For whoever keeps the entire law, and yet stumbles at one point, is guilty of breaking it all.


YOU HAVE TO KEEP IT PERFECTLY OR YOU ARE GUILTY OF THE WHOLE LAW.

ONLY JESUS KEPT IT PERFECTLY, and then we can inherit HIS RIGHTEOUSNESS.

But INSTEAD you are Trying to KEEP the LAW PERFECTLY, just like a Modern Day Pharisee, you lowered GOD's STANDARD, to a level you THINK you can KEEP. Do you even say to yourself, "Look how Holy I am." Do not hurt your arm, trying to pat yourself on the back. You are a SINNER by GOD's STANDARD.


Romans 4:13 (GWT)
13 So it was not by obeying Moses' Teachings that Abraham or his descendants received the promise that he would inherit the world. Rather, it was through God's approval of his faith.

Galatians 2:16 (ASV)
16 yet knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law but through faith in Jesus Christ, even we believed on Christ Jesus, that we might be justified by faith in Christ, and not by the works of the law: because by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

Galatians 3:24-26 (ESV)
24 So then, the law was our guardian until Christ came, in order that we might be justified by faith.
25 But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian,
26 for in Christ Jesus you are all sons of God, through faith.

Galatians 3:10-11 (ESV)
10 For all who rely on works of the law are under a curse; for it is written, “Cursed be everyone who does not abide by all things written in the Book of the Law, and do them.”
11 Now it is evident that no one is justified before God by the law, for “The righteous shall live by faith.”
 

maxwel

Senior Member
Apr 18, 2013
8,654
1,887
113
solve these simultaneous equations:

x > 0
x ≤ 0


I'm not much of a mathematician, however...
being completely ignorant has never stopped me from weighing in before.

BTW, the answer to the equations is... cow.

...
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,369
113
i'm not that old. barely into my 40's. but as the years have gone by, i find myself more and more often asking 'why isn't everyone a mathematician?'
I love math.....done grade 12 algebra at age 7.....used it a lot in Machine shop figuring bolt hole patterns and where to move on my x and y axis.......but since I have retired and use a calculator I have gotten lazy with my math and funny thing....use it or lose it rings true for any number of things
 

maxwel

Senior Member
Apr 18, 2013
8,654
1,887
113
i'm not that old. barely into my 40's. but as the years have gone by, i find myself more and more often asking 'why isn't everyone a mathematician?'

I can give you an answer...

but I can't give you an answer that's mathematical.


...