Not By Works

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,371
113
Sure I do. It's just that YOU don't understand them.

Could you explain to the crowd here the difference between
OSAS and
Eternal Security
??
There is no difference but in terminology.....same coin......same thing.......except one is used by the workers for and salvation losers to devalue the truth

And of course I expect some flippant answer on your part and to fully reject the truth.....................
 

GodsGrace101

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2018
2,225
517
113
AND her daughters LIKE I have said.........did you miss the post about my Grandfather that was a die hard AOG believer and member....

He went to his death from cancer whipping around, screaming that he was catching fire and begging for help and to be saved...

He peddled a works based and kept salvation....

My other grandpa was a die hard drunk, he loved his Olympia BEER.....he also died of cancer with a smile and as peaceful as one can be...he trusted JESUS by faith the last week of his life and was not immersed and or did ONE good work in the name of JESUS

I will stick with JESUS and FAITH and HOPE....he will see me through to the end......you can have a ball with your works based I keep myself saved belief...
What a horrible post and thing to say.
So those who want to please God will be thrashing about on their beds...

and those who do NOTHING for God will die a peaceful death.

Isaiah 5:20-23
20Woe to those who call evil good, and good evil;
Who substitute darkness for light and light for darkness;

Who substitute bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter!

21Woe to those who are wise in their own eyes
And clever in their own sight!

22Woe to those who are heroes in drinking wine
And valiant men in mixing strong drink,


23Who justify the wicked for a bribe,
And take away the rights of the ones who are in the right!




1 Corinthians 15:1-2
1Now I make known to you, brethren, the gospel which I preached to you, which also you received, in which also you stand,
2by which also you are saved, if you hold fast the word which I preached to you, unless you believed in vain.


So easy to understand, it needs no comment...
 

GodsGrace101

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2018
2,225
517
113
There is no difference but in terminology.....same coin......same thing.......except one is used by the workers for and salvation losers to devalue the truth

And of course I expect some flippant answer on your part and to fully reject the truth.....................
You don't know.
And yet you want to teach.

OSAS
Eternal Security
Perseverance of the Saints

DIFFERENT!
Learn it.
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,371
113
What a horrible post and thing to say.
So those who want to please God will be thrashing about on their beds...

and those who do NOTHING for God will die a peaceful death.

Isaiah 5:20-23
20Woe to those who call evil good, and good evil;
Who substitute darkness for light and light for darkness;
Who substitute bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter!


21Woe to those who are wise in their own eyes
And clever in their own sight!


22Woe to those who are heroes in drinking wine
And valiant men in mixing strong drink,


23Who justify the wicked for a bribe,
And take away the rights of the ones who are in the right!




1 Corinthians 15:1-2
1Now I make known to you, brethren, the gospel which I preached to you, which also you received, in which also you stand,
2by which also you are saved, if you hold fast the word which I preached to you, unless you believed in vain.



So easy to understand, it needs no comment...
Not what I said and the truth is the truth.........that is exactly how they died...........
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,371
113
You don't know.
And yet you want to teach.

OSAS
Eternal Security
Perseverance of the Saints <----THIS ONE WAS ADDED BY FRAN AFTER THE FACT TO MAKE MY RESPONSE LOOK WRONG

DIFFERENT!
Learn it.
Sure Fran.....only in your mind and now you added one....more deception fro the Queen of Deception.......here I fixed it
 

gb9

Senior Member
Jan 18, 2011
9,201
4,935
113
If you think that is the intent of the tree symbol, you are badly mistaken. Plus there are many crops that don't take years to yield
yes, crops, you are right.

but we are talking about fruit. ( or we were till you moved the target again).

i'll say it again- grapes were a staple in Israel. grapes grow on vines that have to run, bloom, then the clusters of grapes began to grow.

that is a process. the vine is alive WHILE the fruit is in the PROCESS of growing.

if you want to try an adult word, it's called sanctification.
 

Hevosmies

Well-known member
Sep 8, 2018
3,612
2,628
113
Romans 7:15-20 and no problem on the questions.....
God bless you

This makes sense.

Maybe @UnderGrace was right and i just heard a bad sermon!

Thanks guys


Rom 7:15 For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.
Rom 7:16 If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good.
Rom 7:17 Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
Rom 7:18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.
Rom 7:19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.
Rom 7:20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
Rom 7:21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
Rom 7:22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
Rom 7:23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
Rom 7:24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
Rom 7:25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

SOUNDS ABOUT RIGHT. Can i get an amen? Lets keep on fighting the good fight!
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,371
113
God bless you

This makes sense.

Maybe @UnderGrace was right and i just heard a bad sermon!

Thanks guys


Rom 7:15 For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.
Rom 7:16 If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good.
Rom 7:17 Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
Rom 7:18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.
Rom 7:19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.
Rom 7:20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
Rom 7:21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
Rom 7:22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
Rom 7:23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
Rom 7:24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
Rom 7:25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

SOUNDS ABOUT RIGHT. Can i get an amen? Lets keep on fighting the good fight!
The fact that you have a struggle is a good sign bro.....and AMEN
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,371
113
yes, crops, you are right.

but we are talking about fruit. ( or we were till you moved the target again).

i'll say it again- grapes were a staple in Israel. grapes grow on vines that have to run, bloom, then the clusters of grapes began to grow.

that is a process. the vine is alive WHILE the fruit is in the PROCESS of growing.

if you want to try an adult word, it's called sanctification.
HAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHHAH love it....man the truth is so simple hey
 
Dec 27, 2018
4,170
875
113
HAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHHAH love it....man the truth is so simple hey
Was the fruit in Matthew 13 crops or trees? Hahahahahahahaha, Dc

Sanctification is both instantaneous and progressive. In the real adult world, it begins instantly and then grows progressively.

Hahahahahahaha, DC

How long were the apostles saved before they began bearing fruit? Years?

Someone knows very little about church history.

Receive the word, teach others, who in turn teach others. No time to waste...
 

FollowHisSteps

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2019
3,674
1,201
113
I think they come at this with the need to believe no one can lose their salvation, so it doesn't matter what scripture plainly states, it must be ignored, or somehow set aside. You cannot get any mature debate when that is the case, sadly
The danger is simply by repeating an idea, it becomes that idea is the only way to express the concept.
According to John, if we truly understand Jesus we will not sin.

That is quite a claim. Obviously no one could have experienced this, as these people know the whole of
human existance and can rightly judge everyone.

Now the idea that people are changed by God into people of the Kingdom is not a difficult step, considering
Jesus rose from the dead and will raise us from the dead. But defeated folk, lower their gaze to the ways of
the world and their slavery to sinful behaviour.
 

unclesilas

Active member
Feb 6, 2019
483
170
43
Those on the rocky ground are the ones who receive the word with joy when they hear it, but they have no root. They believe for a while, but in the time of testing they fall away.
It gets crazy when people go to such extraordinary lengths to explain away what a verse plainly states and means
 

FollowHisSteps

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2019
3,674
1,201
113
Wrong again....you do not believe in eternal security....you believe in a self maintained salvation that is dependent upon what YOU do and not what Christ does.......and that is the difference between you and I.....

I boast in JESUS

You boast in yourself and what YOU DO to maintain it....<----that is NOT the faith and hope the bible lays bare.....

And who cares about all of the Baskin Robbins 57 flavors of Christianity.......woven throughout that whole mess is a linage of truthful churches and believers........

And as far as the (sad statement) WHY would I agree with someone that ignores context, Greek verb tense, hundreds of scriptures and the simple truth that the irrevocable gift of faith is what saves a man eternally...the same FAITH JESUS begins, finishes and COMPLETES

You do understand the words FINISHES and COMPLETES right
Wrong again....you do not believe in eternal security....you believe in a self maintained salvation

This is called projection. What is its value?
It is rude, judgemental, condemnatory, derogatory.

If you know Jesus in your heart you know eternal security.
Paul describes the presence of the Holy Spirit as Gods approval on our lives.
 
Dec 27, 2018
4,170
875
113
Above I meant to say how long were the apostles converts saved before bearing fruit? Years before they could do it?That would have drastically slowed down the growth of the church which filled the known world even in Paul's day.

I guess you think the original believers did all that work by themselves for how ever many years it takes for a tree to grow

Not much knowledge of church history do you have
 

Hevosmies

Well-known member
Sep 8, 2018
3,612
2,628
113
Sanctification is both instantaneous and progressive. In the real adult world, it begins instantly and then grows progressively.

Hahahahahahaha, DC

How long were the apostles saved before they began bearing fruit? Years?

Someone knows very little about church history.

Receive the word, teach others, who in turn teach others. No time to waste...
You got to realize that not everyone is an apostle.

Nobody said it ALWAYS takes a long time. To some people it IS instant. To some it takes time. IT VARIES
 

gb9

Senior Member
Jan 18, 2011
9,201
4,935
113
Was the fruit in Matthew 13 crops or trees? Hahahahahahahaha, Dc

Sanctification is both instantaneous and progressive. In the real adult world, it begins instantly and then grows progressively.

Hahahahahahaha, DC

How long were the apostles saved before they began bearing fruit? Years?

Someone knows very little about church history.

Receive the word, teach others, who in turn teach others. No time to waste...
ah, so now I see what is behind your lack of being able to accept how fruit grows and matures.

you think sanctification is instantaneous .

you could not be more wrong.

moving on. nothing to see here. just another person so steeped in religious mindset, they can't see the forest for the tress.
 

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
Nov 24, 2013
10,647
1,811
113
I study words. It's the way I roll, and actually received 2 prophecies about this very thing. So who should I obey? You or Jesus?
Did you ask me a question? If so I didn't see it.
I haven't said anything about this here except for one person. I have limited time. My daughter was in a bad accident; hit by a police car that was full speed going to a call. Car totaled and her neck so badly injured that she has a plate now holding three vertebras. Then developed complications. I am caring for her.
Sorry to hear about you daughter stones, I will put you both on my prayer list. [/QUOTE]

Thank you. She is starting to do small things for herself now. The complication that rose was her ability to swallow. Now she is eating small bites of soft food. I am thankful for all prayers that arose all around the world. Took some time but she's healing.
 
Dec 27, 2018
4,170
875
113
ah, so now I see what is behind your lack of being able to accept how fruit grows and matures.

you think sanctification is instantaneous .

you could not be more wrong.

moving on. nothing to see here. just another person so steeped in religious mindset, they can't see the forest for the tress.
No I said BOTH instantaneous and progressive.

I guess you don't ever read the posts.

How long did the original disciples bear all the fruit in the early church? In the amount of time it takes a tree to grow?

When Paul planted a church, did it take years for the children to bear fruit? How then did that church grow?