Not By Works

[KnowMe]

Mr. M.....I think you are bringing together two separate ideas that are in fact separate

The old man and sin nature are not one and the same

When we are born again we put off the old man, the old man is our former position in the first Adam.

Everything we were in Adam #1 is gone. So yes we become a new creation in Christ, located there positionally and judicially.

When you understand this you will understand why the doctrine of "perserverance" of the saints is not true OSAS but the carnal (as in the flesh) approach to OSAS.

The new man still resides in the body where the sin is ever present, there will always be a propensity for sin in our lives that is just a fact.

I have to disagree about in the body where the sin is ever present, I believe it’s temptations that cause people to sin, those come from outside sources, rather it’s in thoughts/sights/actions of worldly things.

 

[dcontroversal]

Well I’ve decided to chime in on the topic, it appears though if works are not done the reward/repay/give won’t be very much. that may or may not have anything to do with salvation but clearly works is not something people shouldn’t do but do.

Rev 2:23
And I will kill her children with death, and all the churches will know that I am the One searching affections and hearts; and I will give to each of you according to your works.

We have all said the works are for reward <---the word is MISTHOS = pay or wages for service rendered.......however.....the works do not gain, keep, top off, finish or complete salvation.........

And for sure we can see every type of work both good and bad in believers throughout the bible..............

 

[UnderGrace]

Sorry, I thought I exited the other thread "Faith/works". I apologize for the mistake.

We admonished and exhorted to bring our practical state in harmony with our new position in Christ....however, we can and do grieve the Holy Spirit some more than others.

This again is why your statement about "we can sin as much as we want" is nonsensical

Our good deeds did not achieve salvation therefore our sins cannot undo salvation.

 

[UnderGrace]

I have to disagree about in the body where the sin is ever present, I believe it’s temptations that cause people to sin, those come from outside sources, rather it’s in thoughts/sights/actions of worldly things.

Sin is ever present in our body

 

[KnowMe]

We have all said the works are for reward <---the word is MISTHOS = pay or wages for service rendered.......however.....the works do not gain, keep, top off, finish or complete salvation.........

And for sure we can see every type of work both good and bad in believers throughout the bible..............

Well like I said in another post, the works/deeds are pretty basic yet hard to do.

Gala 5
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness, self-control; against such things there is no law.

 

[KnowMe]

Sin is ever present in our body

You can rid satan from your body if you feel that he lives within you.

 

[UnderGrace]

You can rid satan from your body if you feel that he lives within you.

Sin is not satan within us

 

[Hevosmies358]

Canelo beat Jacobs via UD.

28 still in his prime, dont think Canelo can be beat at 160 lbs. My prediction: He will unify the division by 2020. Who can stop the redhead? Billy Joe Saunders?

Did anyone watch the fight?

 

[KnowMe]

Sin is not satan within us

I personally don’t believe we are born natural born killers, when you sin in life for the very first time thus you become a Adam 1. new born babies that die when hours or days of being born I don’t believe are judged according to what Adam did.

 

[dcontroversal]

If we found our ultimate desire (Jesus), why does our flesh look to something else (coveting)?

JESUS had a moment.....If it be possible let this cup pass.....

The SPIRIT is indeed willing, but the FLESH IS WEAK <---this is why

 

[dcontroversal]

Those who do not know Jesus, literally, think their walk is adding to Jesus's work rather than
the fulfilment of it.

This is so fundamental to repentance, purity, holiness, those who preach the opposite have never
entered in, and are trying to close the door for those who might believe and enter.

Their faith is the faith that all are saved no matter what, so why preach so aggressively, unless in
truth they represent opposition to the very gospel itself, and wish to persuade as many as will listen
to abandon the path of salvation and faith, and stay like the world lost in sin.

In their theology I am as saved as anyone, and can never lose it, so why get angry, why accuse of
blasphemy which does not matter, because put simply they are no friend of Jesus or His love.
They claim not to be condemning, judgemental or divisive, except this is what they preach all the
time, and desire to discourage anyone who takes holiness and purity seriously as God intended.

Such opposition to the path of God has only one source.

7 For God did not call us to be impure, but to live a holy life.
1 Thess 4

I was reading your posts yesterday from your past two accounts that you were banned under....same drivel......

 

[UnderGrace]

I personally don’t believe we are born natural born killers, when you sin in life for the very first time thus you become a Adam 1. new born babies that die when hours or days of being born I don’t believe are judged according to what Adam did.

Yes the concept of 'sin nature" started with Augustine....not sure if it is explicitly taught in scripture

 

[dcontroversal]

You obviously do not know what the doctrine of perserverance teaches. The doctrine of perserverance and the doctrine of eternal security are ONE AND THE SAME.

per·se·ver·ance
/ˌpərsəˈvirəns/
noun

1. persistence in doing something despite difficulty or delay in achieving success.
   "his perseverance with the technique illustrates his single-mindedness"
   synonymsersistence, tenacity, determination, resolve, resolution, resoluteness, staying power, purposefulness, firmness of purpose; More

YEP...self effort = Glory on man instead of JESUS.................and you have already stated by implication that one can lose it........

a. If in sin
b. if one quits believing

 

[dcontroversal]

You obviously do not know what the doctrine of perserverance teaches. The doctrine of perserverance and the doctrine of eternal security are ONE AND THE SAME.



Why are you treating the Name Above All Names with IRREVERANCE? . But anyways, I don't know who Jeezus is, but my GREAT GOD AND SAVIOUR JESUS finishes and completes my faith. Which is exactly why those who are saved believe and will believe until the end. Even though a Christian may have a temporary lapse, and the Good shepherd may have to go and retrieve them.



That we might be partakers of His Holiness and To produce righteousness in us. (Hebrews 12:10-11) Why do you believe He chastens them.



Where does it say in the Bible that God yanks inheritance from us?



Because some of our works will be burned up.



I'll let Paul answer that one.

1 Corinthians 5:5- To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of theLord Jesus.



Wrong again, as evidenced by my answers above



never said a believer does not sin. Do you want a hat for your strawman or a match to burn it with?

You mean your diversions.....you got that right.....!!

And I see you left off part of my quote......good luck!

 

[KnowMe]

Yes the concept of 'sin nature" started with Augustine....not sure if it is explicitly taught in scripture

I just did a quick search of verses that directly say sin nature and so far it doesn’t seem to be in any verses, so the sin nature is probably a concept.

 

[dcontroversal]

The once saved always saved is very risky business, that is pretty saying there are automatic wheats who don’t get judge at judgement day, the wheat and tares have not been divided yet, everyone will be judged according to deeds and those are not of OT deeds, and no one knows want the judge will do.

Matt 7
21Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22Many will say to Me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?’

23Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you workers of lawlessness!’

22 and 23 is quite profound in that even though they did miracles, good deeds etc. in Jesus name, even folks who believe and do mighty things. plainly are not known.

It is not profound at all....they were never saved.....and why?

Faith plus works for was their dogma <--Galatians states clearly this has NO POWER to save!!!

 

[dcontroversal]

Of these things self control is probably the hardest to do, no doubt I’m guilty of this, but I’m not the only I see far to many who like me have no self control, at times I’m not patience kind good gentle. if I lack these I’m not very worthy. I can’t keep saying o well it’s a new day that doesn’t cut it, I have to ingrain these and they need to be part of who I am.

Like Jesus said......The Spirit is indeed willing, but the FLESH is WEAK

 

[KnowMe]

Like Adam wasn’t born with a sin nature but he acquired it.

Like Jesus said......The Spirit is indeed willing, but the FLESH is WEAK

Yes the mind is weak, and we all need to work on it being stronger by using self control.

 

[Macabeus]

per·se·ver·ance
/ˌpərsəˈvirəns/
noun

1. persistence in doing something despite difficulty or delay in achieving success.
   "his perseverance with the technique illustrates his single-mindedness"
   synonymsersistence, tenacity, determination, resolve, resolution, resoluteness, staying power, purposefulness, firmness of purpose; More

YEP...self effort = Glory on man instead of JESUS.................and you have already stated by implication that one can lose it........

a. If in sin
b. if one quits believing

Where did I say anything about losing salvation?

Again, YOU don't know the difference between DESCRIPTIVE statements and PRESCRIPTIVE statements.

Go learn the difference, and then MAYBE you will be able to comprehend what I am saying.

 

[dcontroversal]

Mr. M.....I think you are bringing together two separate ideas that are in fact separate

The old man and sin nature are not one and the same

When we are born again we put off the old man, the old man is our former position in the first Adam.

Everything we were in Adam #1 is gone. So yes we become a new creation in Christ, located there positionally and judicially.

When you understand this you will understand why the doctrine of "perserverance" of the saints is not true OSAS but the carnal (as in the flesh) approach to OSAS.

The new man still resides in the body where the sin is ever present, there will always be a propensity for sin in our lives that is just a fact.

AMEN........perseverance = self effort..........

per·se·ver·ance
/ˌpərsəˈvirəns/
noun
persistence in doing something despite difficulty or delay in achieving success.
"his perseverance with the technique illustrates his single-mindedness"
synonymsersistence, tenacity, determination, resolve, resolution, resoluteness, staying power, purposefulness, firmness of purpose; More