Oh goody another OSAS thread!

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Lewiz

Senior Member
Mar 11, 2018
346
22
18
#21
No, not at all.

It is my (probably fruitless) hope that this will not become yet another in a sea of osas debates.

Instead, I'd like to know why this subject is sooo important that people feel the need to debate it until they puke?
Let me take a stab at it.

It's important to the Antichrist.

Most of us agree that just before/during the Tribulation Satan is trying to bring all religions together under one roof.

IMO, in order to do that, religions are going to have to slowly evolve/morph into something the Antichrist desires.

If we look hard enough, we can see false doctrines slowly evolving into something new.

I distinctly remember years ago (60's-70's) that OSAS was predominately inside the Southern Baptist denomination. now other denominations believe it as well.

Before long, the only differences between denominations will be the govt structure & the name over the door.

HG/freegrace & OSAS so closely resemble each other we no longer know which members are which.

A few more tweaks to each, and you could have universal salvation all under one roof.

I don't pretend to know if other religions are changing the way these are, but it seems they would have to, because the world stage is being set before our eyes.

Jesus is coming!!! Aaand I for one am glad!!!
 

PennEd

Senior Member
Apr 22, 2013
10,508
6,843
113
#22
Non- osas don't believe they are born again children of God, and therefore must work their way to heaven.

See. 2 can play that game! Difference is, my post is a little more accurate than the previous poster.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#23
To save souls from hell, if possible. OSAS believe they can sin all they want and still go to heaven, but you must obey God in order to go to heaven. I will never give up trying to save them with truth- just like Noah tried right up until they entered the ark.
Strawman.

osas believes we can never be good enough, not that we can sin all we want. How can a child if God think they can sin all they want.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#24
Let me take a stab at it.

It's important to the Antichrist.

Most of us agree that just before/during the Tribulation Satan is trying to bring all religions together under one roof.

IMO, in order to do that, religions are going to have to slowly evolve/morph into something the Antichrist desires.

If we look hard enough, we can see false doctrines slowly evolving into something new.

I distinctly remember years ago (60's-70's) that OSAS was predominately inside the Southern Baptist denomination. now other denominations believe it as well.

Before long, the only differences between denominations will be the govt structure & the name over the door.

HG/freegrace & OSAS so closely resemble each other we no longer know which members are which.

A few more tweaks to each, and you could have universal salvation all under one roof.

I don't pretend to know if other religions are changing the way these are, but it seems they would have to, because the world stage is being set before our eyes.

Jesus is coming!!! Aaand I for one am glad!!!

So lets instead all think we can earn our salvation, and deny te promises of christ?

I actually hate the term osas, i like the words security, rest, eternal life, seal of the spirit, never hunger or thist, never die, will be risen on the last day, to be absent is to be present, perfected forever,

 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#25
Non- osas don't believe they are born again children of God, and therefore must work their way to heaven.

See. 2 can play that game! Difference is, my post is a little more accurate than the previous poster.
i think hey may believe they are born again, they just do not trust god can do what he promised by sanctifyi g those who he has already perfected.

Ie, they begin in the spirit, ut must perfect it in the flesh
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
16,903
8,440
113
#26
OSAS believe they can sin all they want and still go to heaven, but you must obey God in order to go to heaven.
This is self contradictory. But OSAS believers do not believe you can sin all you want.
 
R

Ralph-

Guest
#27
Why live in fear of losing your salvation...
Why do you think that to believe you can stop believing (and so forfeit that which believing secures) automatically and without exception means you're living in fear? Unless you mean the healthy kind of fear of being removed from the vine which Paul talks about in Romans 11.


"...you stand by your faith. Do not be conceited, but fear; for if God did not spare the natural branches, He will not spare you, either."-Romans 11:20-21.


Don't you have the fear Paul is talking about? Not the fear that you will stop believing, but the fear of what will happen if you do.
 

OneFaith

Senior Member
Sep 5, 2016
2,270
367
83
#28
Strawman.

osas believes we can never be good enough, not that we can sin all we want. How can a child if God think they can sin all they want.
[/QUOte)

I've heard them say it doesn't matter whether they sin or not. Another said they can live in the sin of drunkenness on a regular basis, with no goal to stop, and still be saved. But the bible says do not be fooled, such will not enter heaven.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
16,903
8,440
113
#29
Strawman.

osas believes we can never be good enough, not that we can sin all we want. How can a child if God think they can sin all they want.
[/QUOte)

I've heard them say it doesn't matter whether they sin or not. Another said they can live in the sin of drunkenness on a regular basis, with no goal to stop, and still be saved. But the bible says do not be fooled, such will not enter heaven.
You've been talking to the unregenerate who are also self-deceived. I hope you told them to repent ad be converted.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#30
Strawman.

osas believes we can never be good enough, not that we can sin all we want. How can a child if God think they can sin all they want.


I've heard them say it doesn't matter whether they sin or not. Another said they can live in the sin of drunkenness on a regular basis, with no goal to stop, and still be saved. But the bible says do not be fooled, such will not enter heaven.
Who said those people were saved?

You should stop trying to put everyone in a group. Anyone who excuses their sin does not know god, and there are just as many people who believe salvation can be lost who do enough excusing of ther own sin,
 
R

Ralph-

Guest
#31
But OSAS believers do not believe you can sin all you want.
Some do. You need to open your eyes and see how the teaching that grace is a license to sin lie has crept unawares into the church.

Many, many people are rejecting traditional once saved always belief that says the true believer will not continue in his old life and are believing that the true believer can live in his old life and even fall back into unbelief in a denial of Christ, and they will still be saved (centuries of traditional belief has been that this person was never saved to begin with). It's called 'Hypergrace', or 'Freegrace' doctrine. Read this:


The Free Grace doctrine views the person's character and life after receiving the gift of salvation as independent from the gift itself, which is the main point of differentiation from the traditional Calvinist view, or, in other words, it asserts that justification (that is, being declared righteous before God on account of Christ) does not necessarily result in sanctification (that is, a progressively more righteous life). Charles Stanley, pastor of Atlanta's megachurch First Baptist and a television evangelist, has written that the doctrine of eternal security of the believer persuaded him years ago to leave his familial Pentecostalism and become a Southern Baptist. He sums up his deep conviction that salvation is by faith alone in Christ alone when he claims, "Even if a believer for all practical purposes becomes an unbeliever, his salvation is not in jeopardy… believers who lose or abandon their faith will retain their salvation."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perseverance_of_the_saints#Free_Grace_doctrine



This horrible doctrine has crept in unawares into the church, just as the Bible says it did before:


"...I felt the necessity to write to you appealing that you contend earnestly for the faith which was once for all handed down to the saints. 4For certain persons have crept in unnoticed, those who were long beforehand marked out for this condemnation, ungodly persons who turn the grace of our God into licentiousness and deny our only Master and Lord, Jesus Christ."-Jude 1:3-4


Even hard core Calvinists have not noticed this 'new' once saved always saved doctrine emerging in the church. It seems to slip the notice of them simply because of it's 'once saved always saved' label. The thinking seems to be 'if it believes in once saved always saved then it's good', not realizing it completely and utterly contradicts their traditional Calvinist doctrine.
 

OneFaith

Senior Member
Sep 5, 2016
2,270
367
83
#32
Who said those people were saved?

You should stop trying to put everyone in a group. Anyone who excuses their sin does not know god, and there are just as many people who believe salvation can be lost who do enough excusing of ther own sin,

Well I asssumed all OSAS thought like this cause it matches the ridiculousness of thinking that your behavior can not stop you from going to heaven. In this verse I'm about to give they were saved but are saved no longer because of their behavior and attitude... "But if you sin wilfully there no longer remains a sacrifice for your sins." "No longer" means there once genuinely did.
 
R

Ralph-

Guest
#33
I've heard them say it doesn't matter whether they sin or not. Another said they can live in the sin of drunkenness on a regular basis, with no goal to stop, and still be saved. But the bible says do not be fooled, such will not enter heaven.
Yes, the warning "Do not be deceived" has slipped right past the majority of people in the church.

Freegrace doctrine is sweeping unabated and virtually unchallenged through the church. I'm of the opinion that this is the last great falling away prophesied before Jesus' return. Many are being swept up in it. Many.

At this time, though, I'm seeing a jumbled up mix between the old and the new once saved always doctrines........in on-line forums it depends on which thread the person is participating in at the time as to which they will defend.
 
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R

Ralph-

Guest
#34

Well I asssumed all OSAS thought like this cause it matches the ridiculousness of thinking that your behavior can not stop you from going to heaven. In this verse I'm about to give they were saved but are saved no longer because of their behavior and attitude... "But if you sin wilfully there no longer remains a sacrifice for your sins." "No longer" means there once genuinely did.
From the 35,000 ft. view, traditional once saved always saved was the necessary precursor for the enemy to eventually get the church to swallow the lie that they can go back to unbelief and a denial of Christ and still be saved. It's been a progression of increasing corruption in doctrine in the church, which helps explain how this latest assault of 'grace is a license to sin' doctrine has 'crept in unawares' into the church.
 
R

Ralph-

Guest
#35
Let me take a stab at it.

It's important to the Antichrist.

Most of us agree that just before/during the Tribulation Satan is trying to bring all religions together under one roof.

IMO, in order to do that, religions are going to have to slowly evolve/morph into something the Antichrist desires.

If we look hard enough, we can see false doctrines slowly evolving into something new.

I distinctly remember years ago (60's-70's) that OSAS was predominately inside the Southern Baptist denomination. now other denominations believe it as well.

Before long, the only differences between denominations will be the govt structure & the name over the door.

HG/freegrace & OSAS so closely resemble each other we no longer know which members are which.

A few more tweaks to each, and you could have universal salvation all under one roof.

I don't pretend to know if other religions are changing the way these are, but it seems they would have to, because the world stage is being set before our eyes.

Jesus is coming!!! Aaand I for one am glad!!!
You see it too.
 
R

Ralph-

Guest
#36
To save souls from hell, if possible. OSAS believe they can sin all they want and still go to heaven, but you must obey God in order to go to heaven. I will never give up trying to save them with truth- just like Noah tried right up until they entered the ark.
That's right, but we get called all kinds of names for trying.

Only a few will hear and respond. I do it for the few that Jesus said will find the narrow road that leads to life--the life based on "faith expressing itself through love", the faith that justifies. My reward is just that, the salvation of the few. And I'm good with that.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#37

Well I asssumed all OSAS thought like this cause it matches the ridiculousness of thinking that your behavior can not stop you from going to heaven.


maybe this should show you you need to listen and stop thinking you know. Thats one f the major issues with people, they assume 5ings not true, on. Both sides.

In this verse I'm about to give they were saved but are saved no longer because of their behavior and attitude... "But if you sin wilfully there no longer remains a sacrifice for your sins." "No longer" means there once genuinely did.
keep thinking that, your putting people under law and rejecting grace, if on could sin themselves out if salvation, then grace is null and void

the same author said hat by one sacrifice christ perfected forever those who are being sanctified, can the author contradict himself? Does forever no mean forever?
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#38
Yes, the warning "Do not be deceived" has slipped right past the majority of people in the church.

Freegrace doctrine is sweeping unabated and virtually unchallenged through the church. I'm of the opinion that this is the last great falling away prophesied before Jesus' return. Many are being swept up in it. Many.

At this time, though, I'm seeing a jumbled up mix between the old and the new once saved always doctrines........in on-line forums it depends on which thread the person is participating in at the time as to which they will defend.

Grace was not free, it cost alot, the life and humiliation and death Of christ.

I wish you would stop mocking that grace by claiming it must be earned,
 

BenFTW

Senior Member
Oct 7, 2012
4,834
975
113
31
#39
To save souls from hell, if possible. OSAS believe they can sin all they want and still go to heaven, but you must obey God in order to go to heaven. I will never give up trying to save them with truth- just like Noah tried right up until they entered the ark.
You're sinning all you want and you're still going to make it to Heaven. I say that respectfully because you know you're not perfect in thought and deed and the Lord is sanctifying you, yet you also know that sin is a choice. Your belief that OSAS believers think they can sin all they want is them expressing the logical conclusion of saved by grace through faith. Yet also, is such a question addressed in scripture. How are we who are dead to sin, live therein? Likewise the OSAS proponents do not encourage, endorse, suggest, or affirm a hedonist lifestyle or a pursuit of a sinful life (licentiousness).

You're making a false correlation. Once saved always saved doctrine doesn't translate to a sinful life, because it is God's grace that breaks sin's dominion in our lives.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
38,827
15,562
113
#40
You're sinning all you want and you're still going to make it to Heaven. I say that respectfully because you know you're not perfect in thought and deed and the Lord is sanctifying you, yet you also know that sin is a choice. Your belief that OSAS believers think they can sin all they want is them expressing the logical conclusion of saved by grace through faith. Yet also, is such a question addressed in scripture. How are we who are dead to sin, live therein? Likewise the OSAS proponents do not encourage, endorse, suggest, or affirm a hedonist lifestyle or a pursuit of a sinful life (licentiousness).

You're making a false correlation. Once saved always saved doctrine doesn't translate to a sinful life, because it is God's grace that breaks sin's dominion in our lives.
Thank you, Ben, you explained that very well :) That false correlation has been pointed out too many times to count, so it would seem they refuse correction, and prefer their lie instead, and yet probably believe they are going to heaven, too, despite their repeated sin. Funny how that works, huh?