Palm Sunday vs Common Sense

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Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
1,102
188
63
Oregon
#1
.
Zech 9:9 . . Rejoice greatly, O daughter of Zion! Shout in triumph, O
daughter of Jerusalem! Behold, your king is coming to you; He is just and
endowed with salvation, humble, and mounted on a donkey, even on a colt,
the foal of a donkey.

That prediction shows up in Matt 21:1-11 and John 12:12-16.

Palm Sunday is one of my very favorite Bible events because its date
was predicted many years prior in the ninth chapter of Daniel; and so precise
is the prediction that anybody with the mathematical wherewithal in that day
could've figure it out.

However, we really need to question the event. Did Daniel's and Zechariah's
predictions come true in real life or is it all just story-book fiction? Can it be
proven beyond even a shadow of sensible doubt that Matt 21:1-11 and John
12:12-16 are historically true, factual, and reliable?
_
 

Adelia

Junior Member
Apr 18, 2018
51
54
18
#3
It was prophesied in Zechariah 9 and fulfilled in Matthew 21 as the witnesses recorded. Matthew 21:
11 And the multitude said, This is Jesus the prophet of Nazareth of Galilee.
 

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
1,102
188
63
Oregon
#4
.
It's amazing the number of things Christians are required to believe without
the slightest empirical evidence to substantiate them.

For example; soon after Jesus' grand entry into the city, Matt 21:12-13 says
he went on a rampage clearing the Temple of commercial activity. Did that
really happen? Well; I believe it did, but in reality; there's no way to verify
it.

Before departing the Temple, Matt 21:13 says that blind and lame people
came to him for healing. Did that really happen? Well; I believe it's true, but
in reality that part of the story has never been verified either.
_
 

tourist

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2014
29,081
7,490
113
64
Florida
#5
.
It's amazing the number of things Christians are required to believe without
the slightest empirical evidence to substantiate them.


For example; soon after Jesus' grand entry into the city, Matt 21:12-13 says
he went on a rampage clearing the Temple of commercial activity. Did that
really happen? Well; I believe it did, but in reality; there's no way to verify
it.


Before departing the Temple, Matt 21:13 says that blind and lame people
came to him for healing. Did that really happen? Well; I believe it's true, but
in reality that part of the story has never been verified either.
_
It is called faith, and that requires a belief in the evidence unseen.
 

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
1,102
188
63
Oregon
#6
.
Every so often I get asked how I know that my beliefs are true. My answer
is: I don't know if they're true. Then of course they follow up with: Then why
do you believe your beliefs are true when you have no way of knowing
they're true?

Most of the people who ask me those kinds of questions are genuine; they're
not trying to trip me up and make a fool out of me. They really are curious
about it. So I tell them that though I don't know if my beliefs are true, my
instincts tell me they are; in other words: I cannot shake the conviction that
they're true.

"I have never seen what to me seemed an atom of truth that there is a
future life, and yet, I am strongly inclined to expect one." (Mark Twain)

Twain logically concluded that there is no afterlife, but his instincts did not
agree with his thinking; and I dare not criticize him for that because even
my own religion requires that I believe in my heart rather then only in my
head.

"For with the heart one believes, and is declared innocent" (Rom 10:10

Why does any believer believe what they believe? Buddhist, Muslim, Hindu,
Bahá'í, Hare Krishna, Jehovah's Witness, Mormon, Catholic, Baptist,
Judaism, Voodoo, Wiccan, Jain, Druze, Native American, etc, etc, etc. The
answer? Because it grips their heart-- the core of their being --which is very
different than persuading someone with logic and reasoning.

People brought into a religion by logic and reasoning can just as easily be
taken away by logic and reasoning. But someone whose heart is gripped by
a religion, is not so easily removed.

So, when people believe that Jesus Christ's crucified dead body was restored
to life in spite of all the world's reason and logic to the contrary; they can
take comfort in knowing that their belief is not supposed to be logical.

"Unto the Greeks, foolishness." (1Cor 1:23)
_
 

MattforJesus

Senior Member
Apr 15, 2017
2,104
336
83
#7
But if we say did it really happen, and the word of God comes from God, then how do we know that Jesus is really the Savior of the world, and how do we know God really exists, if we question if events really happened.

Isa 41:21 Produce your cause, saith the LORD; bring forth your strong reasons, saith the King of Jacob.
Isa 41:22 Let them bring them forth, and shew us what shall happen: let them shew the former things, what they be, that we may consider them, and know the latter end of them; or declare us things for to come.
Isa 41:23 Shew the things that are to come hereafter, that we may know that ye are gods: yea, do good, or do evil, that we may be dismayed, and behold it together.
Isa 41:24 Behold, ye are of nothing, and your work of nought: an abomination is he that chooseth you.
Isa 41:25 I have raised up one from the north, and he shall come: from the rising of the sun shall he call upon my name: and he shall come upon princes as upon morter, and as the potter treadeth clay.
Isa 41:26 Who hath declared from the beginning, that we may know? and beforetime, that we may say, He is righteous? yea, there is none that sheweth, yea, there is none that declareth, yea, there is none that heareth your words.
Isa 41:27 The first shall say to Zion, Behold, behold them: and I will give to Jerusalem one that bringeth good tidings.
Isa 41:28 For I beheld, and there was no man; even among them, and there was no counsellor, that, when I asked of them, could answer a word.
Isa 41:29 Behold, they are all vanity; their works are nothing: their molten images are wind and confusion.

God told us all things that would happen beforehand so we would know He is God, and He said no other religion, or person would be able to do that.

Look at the religions, and who has told us all things that shall happen today, and it is the Bible, for the nations come together and rebel against God, so their religions sure do not tell them anything.

The next kingdom to come is the ten horn kingdom, the world split in to ten sections with a leader in each section.

Is that what the wall is about on the Mexico, American border, so they can dissolve the border between them as the answer so America, Canada, and Mexico, can be super nation number 1.

Or will they have a wall, and stop allowing Mexico to use America as a release valve, so they can come to America for a better life, and will not start one big revolution in Mexico, for they should not be that poor, but it appears as if corruption is causing it to be crippled, and by the wall cause Mexico to revolt like a big dog, and overthrow the corruption and establish a better system, and more cooperative with America.

Which is why America is in Arab nations to get them to cooperate, for their governments will be the most stubborn to come together with the other governments when they say Peace and safety.
 

JaumeJ

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2011
16,150
3,081
113
#8
It was prophesied in Zechariah 9 and fulfilled in Matthew 21 as the witnesses recorded. Matthew 21:
11 And the multitude said, This is Jesus the prophet of Nazareth of Galilee.
Nazar or Naazarite was Our Lord. From Hebrew a nazar would be a branch, ergo Jesus, the Branch to fulfill all righteousnous, and the Word is Righteousness,a emn.
 

Budman

Senior Member
Mar 9, 2014
3,989
1,819
113
#9
It's amazing the number of things Christians are required to believe without
the slightest empirical evidence to substantiate them.
What exactly do you believe?

Could you elaborate?
 

oyster67

Senior Member
May 24, 2014
1,789
1,377
113
#10
.
Zech 9:9 . . Rejoice greatly, O daughter of Zion! Shout in triumph, O
daughter of Jerusalem! Behold, your king is coming to you; He is just and
endowed with salvation, humble, and mounted on a donkey, even on a colt,
the foal of a donkey...
...However, we really need to question the event. Did Daniel's and Zechariah's
predictions come true in real life or is it all just story-book fiction? Can it be
proven beyond even a shadow of sensible doubt that Matt 21:1-11 and John
12:12-16 are historically true, factual, and reliable?
_
I'm starting to actually like you now. You are like a giant living and dynamic billboard for us to post upon. You make error look so foolish and stupid that everyone will soon be seeking eternal spiritual truths (which, by definition, your 'empirical evidence' has little to no bearing on). People don't just look for food for their mouths, but also look for food for the soul. You're blasphemous lies from hell shall never prevail against us.
 

Godsgirl83

Well-known member
Apr 1, 2019
2,615
2,073
113
#11
.
Every so often I get asked how I know that my beliefs are true. My answer
is: I don't know if they're true. Then of course they follow up with: Then why
do you believe your beliefs are true when you have no way of knowing
they're true?


Most of the people who ask me those kinds of questions are genuine; they're
not trying to trip me up and make a fool out of me. They really are curious
about it. So I tell them that though I don't know if my beliefs are true, my
instincts tell me they are; in other words: I cannot shake the conviction that
they're true.


"I have never seen what to me seemed an atom of truth that there is a
future life, and yet, I am strongly inclined to expect one." (Mark Twain)


Twain logically concluded that there is no afterlife, but his instincts did not
agree with his thinking; and I dare not criticize him for that because even
my own religion requires that I believe in my heart rather then only in my
head.


"For with the heart one believes, and is declared innocent" (Rom 10:10

Why does any believer believe what they believe? Buddhist, Muslim, Hindu,
Bahá'í, Hare Krishna, Jehovah's Witness, Mormon, Catholic, Baptist,
Judaism, Voodoo, Wiccan, Jain, Druze, Native American, etc, etc, etc. The
answer? Because it grips their heart-- the core of their being --which is very
different than persuading someone with logic and reasoning.


People brought into a religion by logic and reasoning can just as easily be
taken away by logic and reasoning. But someone whose heart is gripped by
a religion, is not so easily removed.


So, when people believe that Jesus Christ's crucified dead body was restored
to life in spite of all the world's reason and logic to the contrary; they can
take comfort in knowing that their belief is not supposed to be logical.


"Unto the Greeks, foolishness." (1Cor 1:23)
_

Seeing is not always believing. We can not see the wind. Only the effects of it. We can not see God... YET But we can see the effect He has in the lives of those who trust, serve and follow Him. religion and God are NOT synonymous God made man, man made religion.

"I've never seen the wind, I've seen the effects of the wind, but I've never seen the wind. There's a mystery to it"- Billy Graham


"Believe" lyrics:
As I lay me down Where do I begin So simply complicated The voice within I hear it singing so clear Invisible like the sound of the wind We all know You are there I just believe I just believe it And sometimes I dunno why I gotta go with my gut again on this one Not just a feeling It's the reason We know a line is crooked `cause we know what's straight That little voice inside As I lay me down I confess I'm a fool for you No more, no less And in this world turning gray Strikes a chord when I say There is black There is white There is wrong And there is right There is no alibi If it's not the truth it's.....?? Falling for the truth again Not by the wisdom of a man, or a machine This is not preference or a taste that disagrees The evidence of things unseen The more you look The more you'll see If there's ever been a time it's now I hear that still small voice inside
 

oyster67

Senior Member
May 24, 2014
1,789
1,377
113
#12
It's amazing the number of things Christians are required to believe without
the slightest empirical evidence to substantiate them.
No, actually it is wonderful and beautiful how our Lord has made things simple enough for a humble child to understand. Only the pompous ones who are wise in their own eyes and legends in their own minds stumble at these things of our wise and gracious Lord, who we adore and you openly blaspheme.
 

oyster67

Senior Member
May 24, 2014
1,789
1,377
113
#13
soon after Jesus' grand entry into the city, Matt 21:12-13 says he went on a rampage
Matthew 21
21:12 And Jesus went into the temple of God, and cast out all them that sold and bought in the temple, and overthrew the tables of the moneychangers, and the seats of them that sold doves,
21:13 And said unto them, It is written, My house shall be called the house of prayer; but ye have made it a den of thieves.
21:14 And the blind and the lame came to him in the temple; and he healed them.
21:15 And when the chief priests and scribes saw the wonderful things that he did, and the children crying in the temple, and saying, Hosanna to the Son of David; they were sore displeased,
21:16 And said unto him, Hearest thou what these say? And Jesus saith unto them, Yea; have ye never read, Out of the mouth of babes and sucklings thou hast perfected praise?
 

kaylagrl

Senior Member
Oct 18, 2014
14,093
2,026
113
#14
.
Zech 9:9 . . Rejoice greatly, O daughter of Zion! Shout in triumph, O
daughter of Jerusalem! Behold, your king is coming to you; He is just and
endowed with salvation, humble, and mounted on a donkey, even on a colt,
the foal of a donkey.


That prediction shows up in Matt 21:1-11 and John 12:12-16.

Palm Sunday is one of my very favorite Bible events because its date
was predicted many years prior in the ninth chapter of Daniel; and so precise
is the prediction that anybody with the mathematical wherewithal in that day
could've figure it out.


However, we really need to question the event. Did Daniel's and Zechariah's
predictions come true in real life or is it all just story-book fiction? Can it be
proven beyond even a shadow of sensible doubt that Matt 21:1-11 and John
12:12-16 are historically true, factual, and reliable?
_


Oh goody, another one! :rolleyes:
 

kaylagrl

Senior Member
Oct 18, 2014
14,093
2,026
113
#15
.
Every so often I get asked how I know that my beliefs are true. My answer
is: I don't know if they're true. Then of course they follow up with: Then why
do you believe your beliefs are true when you have no way of knowing
they're true?


Most of the people who ask me those kinds of questions are genuine; they're
not trying to trip me up and make a fool out of me. They really are curious
about it. So I tell them that though I don't know if my beliefs are true, my
instincts tell me they are; in other words: I cannot shake the conviction that
they're true.


"I have never seen what to me seemed an atom of truth that there is a
future life, and yet, I am strongly inclined to expect one." (Mark Twain)


Twain logically concluded that there is no afterlife, but his instincts did not
agree with his thinking; and I dare not criticize him for that because even
my own religion requires that I believe in my heart rather then only in my
head.


"For with the heart one believes, and is declared innocent" (Rom 10:10

Why does any believer believe what they believe? Buddhist, Muslim, Hindu,
Bahá'í, Hare Krishna, Jehovah's Witness, Mormon, Catholic, Baptist,
Judaism, Voodoo, Wiccan, Jain, Druze, Native American, etc, etc, etc. The
answer? Because it grips their heart-- the core of their being --which is very
different than persuading someone with logic and reasoning.


People brought into a religion by logic and reasoning can just as easily be
taken away by logic and reasoning. But someone whose heart is gripped by
a religion, is not so easily removed.


So, when people believe that Jesus Christ's crucified dead body was restored
to life in spite of all the world's reason and logic to the contrary; they can
take comfort in knowing that their belief is not supposed to be logical.


"Unto the Greeks, foolishness." (1Cor 1:23)
_


True enough, not everything in the Bible can be explained. Certain things must be
believed in faith. But we have evidence too of things that we know did happen in
the Bible. We have historical evidence, we have archeological evidence and there's nothing
wrong with logical thinking. Christianity isn't just like every other religion. No other religion
has an empty tomb. We can use both logic and faith and there's not a thing wrong with that.
 

oyster67

Senior Member
May 24, 2014
1,789
1,377
113
#16
True enough, not everything in the Bible can be explained. Certain things must be
believed in faith. But we have evidence too of things that we know did happen in
the Bible. We have historical evidence, we have archeological evidence and there's nothing
wrong with logical thinking. Christianity isn't just like every other religion. No other religion
has an empty tomb. We can use both logic and faith and there's not a thing wrong with that.
Amen! God gave us things like The Bible, logic, science, and all sorts of evidences as wonderful gifts. The best by far is The Bible. These gifts are complimentary one to another and synchronize beautifully. How terrible it would be if any man, for any reason, would use one of these gifts to question the validity of another. I don't know how any man who does such a thing could find peace on this earth or hope on judgement day.
 

kaylagrl

Senior Member
Oct 18, 2014
14,093
2,026
113
#17
Amen! God gave us things like The Bible, logic, science, and all sorts of evidences as wonderful gifts. The best by far is The Bible. These gifts are complimentary one to another and synchronize beautifully. How terrible it would be if any man, for any reason, would use one of these gifts to question the validity of another. I don't know how any man who does such a thing could find peace on this earth or hope on judgement day.
People like CS Lewis have been an example of how useful apologetics can be. I find it fascinating and have read books and watched videos of many of these people. I've used their books in useful discussions with people who are not believers. People like Lee Strobel with his books and the book Evidence that Demands a Verdict. A lot of information that is very helpful when sharing the Bible with someone who dismisses it as just a fairytale. Strobel himself came to faith trying to disprove the Bible and found he couldn't.
 

tourist

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2014
29,081
7,490
113
64
Florida
#18
I'm starting to actually like you now. You are like a giant living and dynamic billboard for us to post upon. You make error look so foolish and stupid that everyone will soon be seeking eternal spiritual truths (which, by definition, your 'empirical evidence' has little to no bearing on). People don't just look for food for their mouths, but also look for food for the soul. You're blasphemous lies from hell shall never prevail against us.
Yeah, he's not a bad peep. Just like mailmandan says in his signature at the bottom of his posts, he's not a bad man, just misunderstood.