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It is very frustrating when you take the time to post your opening remarks (the OP) and certain people don't even read it through and THEN and only then reply. Too often only a the first few sentences are read and BANGGGG
Excellent post worth repeating. I also believe that because of our human frailties there is a blindness when it comes to "by grace through faith" So afraid we humans are., not only that we would be taken advantage of but that God could be taken advantage of. By grace through faith must be taken not only for salvation but for the life of the saved. To live any other way frustrates the grace of God in our lives.
Amen. We are called to grow up now and come to maturity. With maturity comes responsibility. We have been given this gift in earthen vessels. We still have the old vessel but we have a new man inside that must be trained to now take over where the old used to be. The old man walked according to the world and what he could see with his eyes. The new man has a whole ton of things the old man never had because we are called to walk by faith and not by sight. Heb.11:1 We have the Holy Spirit now instead of the law. He (HolySpirit) now shows us who we are and how we are to behave as new creations living according to and by faith.
But instead., there are many Christians who keep going back to the old school master (the law) and asking him for direction and comfort and guidance. Totally ignoring the lovely Holy Spirit that is in them.
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It is Christ within.. that is given strength.. under Grace and free in liberty through Faith in Christ to Love GOD and each other even my enemies.. that is the power and Grace of GOD.. Christ’s Perfect sacrifice sanctifying us.. physically I can not Keep the Sabbath.. Spiritually I can.. it is a hard saying.. but it is because I believe.. that iam Keeping the Sabbath.. Now may all come to understand that Truth.. for I’m the least deserving.. but GOD increases through our Belief in His Son..
Just a wonderful thought here., we have the Holy Spirit living in us waiting to lead us and direct us into ALL TRUTH. Transformation takes time unfortunately in these "earth suits" Takes time to learn how to walk according to faith and not by our eye sight or our emotional sight or our reasoning sight from our old manner of living.
The memory of our old man is still there but the old man is gone. The memory of how we used to see life is what we built our lives with. We don't know any other way ourselves. Giving ourselves over to the Holy Spirit to train and lead us is a major DETOUR to the natural senses.
I've considered ... is it any wonder so many of us believers have not yet done very much on the percentage scale of things for Jesus? We may have learned to depend on the Holy Spirit to work in us 10% or 30% but have no idea what it would be like to give over 89% to 99% to 100%
I'm excited to think that today is another chance to let go of more of my own ideas and take on His ways. Jesus said in John 14:12
[SUP]12 [/SUP]Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto the Father.
We would do the works He did and even more as we allowed the Holy Spirit to work in us. Paul learned how to do this as well as the other apostles. John really got a handle on the love of Christ in his life. We have the Holy Spirit and also the Bible. Those guys didn't have what we have and look how much they did in and through the Holy Spirit.
I really believe we are the ones who put limits on God's power in our lives by our own insistence to see with our poor eyesight. Not many miracles are done in the day to day lives of good moral Christians who depend on the law and the power of human ability and fine tuned human skills.
The memory of our old man is still there but the old man is gone. The memory of how we used to see life is what we built our lives with. We don't know any other way ourselves. Giving ourselves over to the Holy Spirit to train and lead us is a major DETOUR to the natural senses.
I've considered ... is it any wonder so many of us believers have not yet done very much on the percentage scale of things for Jesus? We may have learned to depend on the Holy Spirit to work in us 10% or 30% but have no idea what it would be like to give over 89% to 99% to 100%
I'm excited to think that today is another chance to let go of more of my own ideas and take on His ways. Jesus said in John 14:12
[SUP]12 [/SUP]Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto the Father.
We would do the works He did and even more as we allowed the Holy Spirit to work in us. Paul learned how to do this as well as the other apostles. John really got a handle on the love of Christ in his life. We have the Holy Spirit and also the Bible. Those guys didn't have what we have and look how much they did in and through the Holy Spirit.
I really believe we are the ones who put limits on God's power in our lives by our own insistence to see with our poor eyesight. Not many miracles are done in the day to day lives of good moral Christians who depend on the law and the power of human ability and fine tuned human skills.
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E
I wonder sometimes, No one expects a baby to obey his parents every time, Even as young children, A trust of a parent still is ongoing, and the child will still be disobedient,
So why do people expect baby or you’d adolescent christians to be any different? There is a reason God used those terms in sacripture. Do we just ignore them?
That is what is so amazing about the Christian life. We find out that what we once thought to be the truth and would have even died for it., is totally not the way. And that the Holy Spirit is waiting and has been waiting and ready to show us the way of life.
Following the old shriveled up school master holding the whip is not the way. That schoolmaster is not for us anymore. But when we seek to raise him up again and follow him., we frustrate the grace of God and we grieve the Holy Spirit. I think He is grieved because of all the things He is waiting to do in and through us and here we are not believing Jesus reallllly meant what He said.
But Jesus reeeeeeallly meant what He said. Those who trust Him wholly., find Him wholly true.
The church has been given such abilities in the life of the Spirit as it says in Romans 8:2 [SUP]2 [/SUP]For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus made me free from the law of sin and of death.
There is so much to that verse. We are now supposed to be living by the law of the Spirit of life IN Christ Jesus. Many of us have only just grazed the very edges of what that means.
Following the old shriveled up school master holding the whip is not the way. That schoolmaster is not for us anymore. But when we seek to raise him up again and follow him., we frustrate the grace of God and we grieve the Holy Spirit. I think He is grieved because of all the things He is waiting to do in and through us and here we are not believing Jesus reallllly meant what He said.
But Jesus reeeeeeallly meant what He said. Those who trust Him wholly., find Him wholly true.
The church has been given such abilities in the life of the Spirit as it says in Romans 8:2 [SUP]2 [/SUP]For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus made me free from the law of sin and of death.
There is so much to that verse. We are now supposed to be living by the law of the Spirit of life IN Christ Jesus. Many of us have only just grazed the very edges of what that means.
Don’t be confused or concerned my dear.. just as you will find the I’m in your post is a way of sharing my Beliefs.. the iam appears.. let me help you:
Romans 8
9But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his. 10And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. 11But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
12Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh. 13For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live. 14For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God. 15For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father. 16The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: 17And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.
verse 16.... The Spirit itself bears witness with our spirit...
Romans 8
9But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his. 10And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. 11But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
12Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh. 13For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live. 14For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God. 15For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father. 16The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: 17And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.
verse 16.... The Spirit itself bears witness with our spirit...
Paul speaks of a law that was "ADDED" till the seed should come. This "Added" law was the Levitical Priesthood which was created temporarily for the administration of the Laws of God and the cleansing of transgression of the Laws of God. This law consisted of sacrificial, ceremonial "Works of the Law" for remission of sins and the appointment of a specific bloodline to administer these "Works of the Law" as Paul calls them.
Heb. 7:11 If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (for under it the people received the law,) what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron?
This "ADDED" law was a shadow of the works Christ would perform to cleanse our transgressions of God's eternal law that Abraham was blessed for obeying. (Gen. 26:5) Abraham sinned of course as have we all, but his sin was justified by (Faith) Christ's Blood just like yours and mine. He was justified "Apart from the Law" of justification. Abraham didn't have the Levitical Priesthood, he believed in the cleansing blood of Christ before there was a Levi, or the Priesthood.
This truth is not taught in Mainstream Christianity and therefore Paul is misunderstood and his words are twisted, as prophesied, to support a lot of differing doctrines and religions.
The 10 Commandments are not part of this temporary law (Gal. 3:19), but "Many" who come in Christ's name, preach it is just the same. (Also prophesied, Matt. 24)
Any belief built on the foundation of this untruth is corrupted. This is why you don't understand the significance of God's Instruction including His Sabbaths. But to accept this truth would mean to also accept that Mainstream Christianity is preaching falsehoods, and all that preach their doctrines are false preachers. The Pharisees, the Mainstream God of Abraham preachers of Christ's time, couldn't do that. They refused to humble themselves to this truth and Jesus rejected them as He did the prophets who taught lies before them.
I notice you go outside the Bible for much of your understanding. Since Jesus warned about the "MANY" who come in His name to deceive, do you think it wise to pick and choose what "preacher" you honor? I mean you don't believe Ellen White, but you do believe anyone on "non-SDA.org".
What is the SDA guilty of that the Baptists are not guilty of, or AOG, or Catholics, or any religious franchise on the planet. They all transgress the commandments of God by their own doctrines and traditions. This can't be denied. Is it wise to pick one religious franchise that creates their own gospel over another religious franchise who creates their own gospel?
There is a reason why the understanding of Zacharias, Jesus, Peter and Paul was different than the understanding of the Pharisees and the Jews even though they all read from the same Law and Prophets.
You said:
Paul answered your question before you asked it.
Rom. 1:21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
The understanding of God's Word is spiritual. God give this understanding to those who obey Him. (Acts 5:32)
Like Eve, you have been convinced not to obey Him. God's Word is true, man is the liar. If you had "FAITH" in God you would trust His instruction as did Abel and Noah and Abraham, and every other righteous example of "FAITH" in the Bible.
Or you can reject God's instruction as did Cain and the Children of Israel, and the Pharisees and all the other "Children of disobedience" our written examples show us. We choose!!!!
Heb. 7:11 If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (for under it the people received the law,) what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron?
This "ADDED" law was a shadow of the works Christ would perform to cleanse our transgressions of God's eternal law that Abraham was blessed for obeying. (Gen. 26:5) Abraham sinned of course as have we all, but his sin was justified by (Faith) Christ's Blood just like yours and mine. He was justified "Apart from the Law" of justification. Abraham didn't have the Levitical Priesthood, he believed in the cleansing blood of Christ before there was a Levi, or the Priesthood.
This truth is not taught in Mainstream Christianity and therefore Paul is misunderstood and his words are twisted, as prophesied, to support a lot of differing doctrines and religions.
The 10 Commandments are not part of this temporary law (Gal. 3:19), but "Many" who come in Christ's name, preach it is just the same. (Also prophesied, Matt. 24)
Any belief built on the foundation of this untruth is corrupted. This is why you don't understand the significance of God's Instruction including His Sabbaths. But to accept this truth would mean to also accept that Mainstream Christianity is preaching falsehoods, and all that preach their doctrines are false preachers. The Pharisees, the Mainstream God of Abraham preachers of Christ's time, couldn't do that. They refused to humble themselves to this truth and Jesus rejected them as He did the prophets who taught lies before them.
I notice you go outside the Bible for much of your understanding. Since Jesus warned about the "MANY" who come in His name to deceive, do you think it wise to pick and choose what "preacher" you honor? I mean you don't believe Ellen White, but you do believe anyone on "non-SDA.org".
What is the SDA guilty of that the Baptists are not guilty of, or AOG, or Catholics, or any religious franchise on the planet. They all transgress the commandments of God by their own doctrines and traditions. This can't be denied. Is it wise to pick one religious franchise that creates their own gospel over another religious franchise who creates their own gospel?
There is a reason why the understanding of Zacharias, Jesus, Peter and Paul was different than the understanding of the Pharisees and the Jews even though they all read from the same Law and Prophets.
You said:
Paul answered your question before you asked it.
Rom. 1:21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
The understanding of God's Word is spiritual. God give this understanding to those who obey Him. (Acts 5:32)
Like Eve, you have been convinced not to obey Him. God's Word is true, man is the liar. If you had "FAITH" in God you would trust His instruction as did Abel and Noah and Abraham, and every other righteous example of "FAITH" in the Bible.
Or you can reject God's instruction as did Cain and the Children of Israel, and the Pharisees and all the other "Children of disobedience" our written examples show us. We choose!!!!
I'm so glad He used those terms and doesn't condemn us for being "dusty babies" He knows our frame. But I also think its such a shame for us Christians to NEVER GROW UP!!! It has to grieve the Holy Spirit how much we are crying for His leading in our lives and yet we don't believe Him instead of us.
I was in my 50s before ever considering our denomination could possibly be wrong in our interpretation of Scripture! I could not dare to fathom that my way was totally wrong and THAT is why IT WASN'T WORKING. It was not because Jesus didn't want His fullness for me as well. It was my refusal to dare to believe the Word of God in all it's truth.
I thought God's word and the power of Jesus and His resurrection was only for certain amazing Christians in the olden days. But it is for each believer today who dares to believe what Jesus said BY GRACE THROUGH FAITH. The love of God in Christ is ours if we are born again. Daring to believe that is a major step. We have the Holy Spirit and have been given all things pertaining to life and godliness. It's in there inside us in seed form. Yet we don't believe it so it never grows and comes out of us.
The verse that is so mis used in Phil.2:12 gives a window into what this transformation is about. Yet so many miss it and ignore the truth of it and instead use the verses to promote fear of God AND of working for salvation with great fear and trembling that God may not approve.
Many Christians believe this means to "fear God" and to tremble in His presence. That showing fear and mistrust is something to attain as if that is something God wants. When that is not what the verse means at all. He wants us to trust in Christ's sufficiency to give us our place and thereby giving us PEACE WITH GOD. That is what pleases God., when we have faith IN the Son and not faith in our measly works of righteousness.
I believe we are called to study and mine out the truth as "fine gold" because when we finally get into it., we find the amazing gold veins of answers we were hoping for and even better than we hoped! [SUP]12 [/SUP]So then, my beloved, even as ye have always obeyed, not [SUP][a][/SUP]as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling; [SUP]13 [/SUP]for it is God who worketh in you both to will and to work, for his good pleasure.
[SUP]12 [/SUP]Therefore, my dear ones, as you have always obeyed [my suggestions], so now, not only [with the enthusiasm you would show] in my presence but much more because I am absent, work out (cultivate, carry out to the goal, and fully complete) your own salvation with reverence and awe and trembling (self-distrust, [SUP][a][/SUP]with serious caution, tenderness of conscience, watchfulness against temptation, timidly shrinking from whatever might offend God and discredit the name of Christ).
[SUP]
13 [/SUP][Not in your own strength] for it is God Who is all the while [SUP][b][/SUP]effectually at work in you [energizing and creating in you the power and desire], both to will and to work for His good pleasure and satisfaction and [SUP][c][/SUP]delight.
The amplified Bible gives a better description of this verse. But even more., the HolySpirit gives the right interpretation of this verse. We don't work FOR our salvation., we work OUT the salvation Jesus worked in us.
He gave us all things pertaining to life and godliness... that means we have it all in seed form. It's our job to read and study the Bible and submit to the Holy Spirit's teaching using the water of the Word. That grows us up from babies to adults in faith.
There is no more condemnation for us even as we learn and fall flat on our faces., as Romans 8:1 says and then goes on to say in vs.2 how to live as believers....
There is therefore now no condemnation to them that are in Christ Jesus. [SUP]2 [/SUP]For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus made me free from the law of sin and of death.
We live by the law of the Spirit of life IN CHRIST JESUS. We are set free from the law of sin and death.
So much in these verses.
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But you miss the whole point. The reason the parent instructs the child is because the Parent knows things the child doesn't know. Many times the child must go on faith that the wall plugs will shock and maybe kill them. The Parent instructs the child to protect them from their own foolishness, their own lack of knowledge, their own pride and natural rebellion. They do this in the hopes that the child will grow in knowledge and be safe. In the hope that the child will, one day, know not to stick things in the wall socket on their own, without the parent there to instruct.
But sadly many children reject the instruction of their parents. They rebel against the parent not having faith that the parent knows better.
Many die or make decisions that hurt them for the rest of their lives.
Jesus understood this.
Matt. 23:37 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!38 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.
Jer. 6:16 Thus saith the LORD, Stand ye in the ways, and see, and ask for the old paths, where is the good way, and walk therein, and ye shall find rest for your souls. But they said, We will not walk therein.
So Jesus knows the heartbreak a parent has for children who refuse to be instructed, He knows many will choose to rebel.
But some, a few, will learn from the instruction.
1 Pet. 1:13 Wherefore gird up the loins of your mind, be sober, and hope to the end for the grace that is to be brought unto you at the revelation of Jesus Christ;
14 As obedient children, not fashioning yourselves according to the former lusts in your ignorance:
Jesus knows children will slip and fall, but He also knows the difference between those children who love and trust Him and His instruction, and those who reject Him and create their own.
But sadly many children reject the instruction of their parents. They rebel against the parent not having faith that the parent knows better.
Many die or make decisions that hurt them for the rest of their lives.
Jesus understood this.
Matt. 23:37 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!38 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.
Jer. 6:16 Thus saith the LORD, Stand ye in the ways, and see, and ask for the old paths, where is the good way, and walk therein, and ye shall find rest for your souls. But they said, We will not walk therein.
So Jesus knows the heartbreak a parent has for children who refuse to be instructed, He knows many will choose to rebel.
But some, a few, will learn from the instruction.
1 Pet. 1:13 Wherefore gird up the loins of your mind, be sober, and hope to the end for the grace that is to be brought unto you at the revelation of Jesus Christ;
14 As obedient children, not fashioning yourselves according to the former lusts in your ignorance:
Jesus knows children will slip and fall, but He also knows the difference between those children who love and trust Him and His instruction, and those who reject Him and create their own.
E
Anything to law huh?
When the situation arises, Yes my parents would tell me not to do something, But did that work? Most people when they are told now are tempted even more to do things. Not less.
it is faith 9in the parent, and love for your parent that gets you to do what you KNOW is right. Not someone telling you no.
God told the isreal no, do not do these things, Christ was the first one ever to accomplish what God demanded. Of course that is the way it was meant to be. God did not expect us live up to his standard. He knew we could not. Thats why he wrote a law to condemn us and lead us to christ, Then he added. You must confirm and obey EVER LETTER (every jot and tittle on may add) if you do not. YOU ARE CURSED.
The law can only bring a crust. Love and faith and mercy brings about forgiveness, gratitude and obedience.
I disagree with your premise here. The Mainstream Preachers of that time were the Jews who Jesus said were "Transgressing the Commandments of God by their own traditions, they were "Teaching for doctrines the commandments of men". We know they had corrupted God's Sabbath, they were preaching man made traditions and doctrines.
There were Jews who understood the truth, just not "many".
Luke 1:5 There was in the days of Herod, the king of Judaea, a certain priest named Zacharias, of the course of Abia: and his wife was of the daughters of Aaron, and her name was Elisabeth.6And they were both righteous before God, walking in all the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blameless.
So here are two examples of religious Jews here.
One example taught for doctrines the Commandments of men.
Another example followed the instructions of God without their own doctrines and traditions.
These who Paul warned of were not trying to teach God's Law, they were furthering man made doctrines and traditions, "fables and endless genealogies". As Jesus instructed us, they were "preaching for doctrine the commandments of men".
Had they just taught what God instructed and not added their own righteousness, they would not have been rejected.
They didn't take the law out of context, they created their own law. Their own doctrines based on their own traditions. This is important to understand.
The law is good if you use it lawfully. What do we use God's Law for? To show us sin, Yes?
1 Tim. 1:9 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient,
What does the Law do for the lawless and disobedient? Does it show us we need to change, repent? Does it, like a mirror, show us who we are? So what good is the law if we don't obey it (Use it lawfully)
Paul tells of the same thing in;
Rom. 2:17 Behold, thou art called a Jew, and restest in the law, and makest thy boast of God,
18 And knowest his will, and approvest the things that are more excellent, being instructed out of the law;
19 And art confident that thou thyself art a guide of the blind, a light of them which are in darkness,
20 An instructor of the foolish, a teacher of babes, which hast the form of knowledge and of the truth in the law.
21 Thou therefore which teachest another, teachest thou not thyself? thou that preachest a man should not steal, dost thou steal?
22 Thou that sayest a man should not commit adultery, dost thou commit adultery? thou that abhorrest idols, dost thou commit sacrilege?
23 Thou that makest thy boast of the law, through breaking the law dishonourest thou God?
24 For the name of God is blasphemed among the Gentiles through you, as it is written.
In other words, how is breaking God's Law using it lawfully? Desiring to be teachers of the Bible, the gospel, the law and prophets, it's all the same. How can you use the Gospel by disobeying it? How can you preach to obey Jesus while living in disobedience to Jesus.
It is just like preachers today. They desire to be teachers of the Bible, of the Gospel, yet they reject it's Words. They claim Jesus as their instructor, but reject His instruction.
They preach to keep the first and greatest commandment while promoting an image of God they created in the likeness of some handsome long haired Levi Jean model.
"thou that abhorrest idols, dost thou commit sacrilege?"
They preach to love thy neighbor, yet they preach to them man made doctrines and traditions, a direct rebellion and disobedience to what Jesus taught, and certain rejection from the Kingdom of God. So they preach to love the brethren, but they deceive them in following a path that the Bible teaches leads to destruction.
How is a man righteous before God? By living in direct rebellion to God's Commandments? No, that makes him disobedient and in need of God's Laws for correction.
You omitted some important Biblical facts that shed a more truthful understanding on what Paul is preaching here.
Phil. 3:5 Circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, an Hebrew of the Hebrews; as touching the law, a Pharisee;
Did the Pharisees believe in Jesus? No, they were still promoting the Levitical Priesthood ceremonial, sacrificial "works of the Law" for remission of sins as did Paul when he was one. The Pharisees taught there was no righteousness without the ceremonial. sacrificial "works of the Law" for justification of sins. When Paul sinned, he bought a turtle dove, gave it to the Levites, and his sin was cleansed. That was his righteousness from the law.
9 And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:
But now he believes in Jesus and His atoning blood, not in the "Works of the Law" prescribed by Moses "Till the Seed should come". You should know this desiring to be a teacher of the Bible.
This is a very deceiving statement. Jesus said, before He became a man, that there will come a time when He will write His laws on our hearts. Why? So we can disobey them?
The Bible teaches almost the exact opposite of what you say here.
1 John 2:3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
I know you are only preaching Mainstream doctrine and you mean well. But Jesus warned us to "Take Heed" that those who come in His name don't deceive us. Are you preaching that satan will deceive us into obeying God's Instruction.
You say "
so just because someone may be obeying the law and doing what the law says, does not mean they are righteous."
But Paul says; Rom. 8: "6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
Name one single time in the Bible where a person who is said to be obeying God was not considered righteous.
You can't EG, this is just more furthering of Mainstream doctrines and commandments of man.
Jesus cleansed my past sin on the cross. All sin past sin. If I slip us I repent and have faith that Jesus will forgive me. That is different than completely rejecting His Words and "Transgressing God's Commandments by my own righteousness, or doctrines and traditions.
When has there ever been a time apart from God's Laws? You see EG, you don't have any idea what you are preaching, just as Paul warned Timothy about. In all due respect, you still refuse to accept the "ADDED" Levitical Priesthood in any of your preaching. Abraham was justified "apart from the laws of justification which was "ADDED" until the seed should come. (Gal. 3:19)
Who was Paul preaching about in Romans 3?
Rom. 3:1 What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision?
2 Much every way: chiefly, because that unto them were committed the oracles of God.
3 For what if some did not believe? shall their unbelief make the faith of God without effect?
And what law did the Jew center their whole religion on? The 10 Commandments? The Sabbath? No!! The Levitical Priesthood "works of the Law" for remission of sins.
Rom. 3:26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.
27 Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works?
What was the law of works the Jews had their faith in EG? Paul is explaining to the Gentiles the reason why we don't kill goats for the remission of sins even though it was part of God's Law.
Nay: but by the law of faith. There is still a law EG.Abraham was blessed because he obeyed this law. (Gen. 26:5) Not the Levitical Priesthood "Works of the Law" for remission of past sins, but the good, perfect, holy, just laws of God. He had faith in that God and showed this faith by his works, and his faith saved him.
28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith(obedience to God) without the deeds of the law.(blood of goats and ceremonial "works" performed by Levite Priests)
Our past sins are freely forgiven, IF we turn to God, repent and bring forth works worthy of repentance. That is what Jesus and Paul taught.
Acts 26:20 But shewed first unto them of Damascus, and at Jerusalem, and throughout all the coasts of Judaea, and then to the Gentiles, that they should (ALL) repent and turn to God, and do works meet for repentance.
A true "Christian" would know as long as we are in this body, as long as this world exists, we have sin in us. God told us from the very beginning to "Rule over it". And with His help, His instruction, we can despite all the preaching from those who come in Christ's name to the contrary. And as Jesus said, He that endures to the end SHALL be saved.
I wanted to honor your post with a thorough response. I know you can't accept what I have written, but I didn't want to just blow your OP off. Since I believe the very foundation of your belief is built on old man made doctrines and traditions we have been taught for years, there is no sense in addressing any more of this OP. It is my hope you might actually consider some of what is written herein.
There were Jews who understood the truth, just not "many".
Luke 1:5 There was in the days of Herod, the king of Judaea, a certain priest named Zacharias, of the course of Abia: and his wife was of the daughters of Aaron, and her name was Elisabeth.6And they were both righteous before God, walking in all the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blameless.
So here are two examples of religious Jews here.
One example taught for doctrines the Commandments of men.
Another example followed the instructions of God without their own doctrines and traditions.
These who Paul warned of were not trying to teach God's Law, they were furthering man made doctrines and traditions, "fables and endless genealogies". As Jesus instructed us, they were "preaching for doctrine the commandments of men".
Had they just taught what God instructed and not added their own righteousness, they would not have been rejected.
They didn't take the law out of context, they created their own law. Their own doctrines based on their own traditions. This is important to understand.
The law is good if you use it lawfully. What do we use God's Law for? To show us sin, Yes?
1 Tim. 1:9 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient,
What does the Law do for the lawless and disobedient? Does it show us we need to change, repent? Does it, like a mirror, show us who we are? So what good is the law if we don't obey it (Use it lawfully)
Paul tells of the same thing in;
Rom. 2:17 Behold, thou art called a Jew, and restest in the law, and makest thy boast of God,
18 And knowest his will, and approvest the things that are more excellent, being instructed out of the law;
19 And art confident that thou thyself art a guide of the blind, a light of them which are in darkness,
20 An instructor of the foolish, a teacher of babes, which hast the form of knowledge and of the truth in the law.
21 Thou therefore which teachest another, teachest thou not thyself? thou that preachest a man should not steal, dost thou steal?
22 Thou that sayest a man should not commit adultery, dost thou commit adultery? thou that abhorrest idols, dost thou commit sacrilege?
23 Thou that makest thy boast of the law, through breaking the law dishonourest thou God?
24 For the name of God is blasphemed among the Gentiles through you, as it is written.
In other words, how is breaking God's Law using it lawfully? Desiring to be teachers of the Bible, the gospel, the law and prophets, it's all the same. How can you use the Gospel by disobeying it? How can you preach to obey Jesus while living in disobedience to Jesus.
It is just like preachers today. They desire to be teachers of the Bible, of the Gospel, yet they reject it's Words. They claim Jesus as their instructor, but reject His instruction.
They preach to keep the first and greatest commandment while promoting an image of God they created in the likeness of some handsome long haired Levi Jean model.
"thou that abhorrest idols, dost thou commit sacrilege?"
They preach to love thy neighbor, yet they preach to them man made doctrines and traditions, a direct rebellion and disobedience to what Jesus taught, and certain rejection from the Kingdom of God. So they preach to love the brethren, but they deceive them in following a path that the Bible teaches leads to destruction.
How is a man righteous before God? By living in direct rebellion to God's Commandments? No, that makes him disobedient and in need of God's Laws for correction.
You omitted some important Biblical facts that shed a more truthful understanding on what Paul is preaching here.
Phil. 3:5 Circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, an Hebrew of the Hebrews; as touching the law, a Pharisee;
Did the Pharisees believe in Jesus? No, they were still promoting the Levitical Priesthood ceremonial, sacrificial "works of the Law" for remission of sins as did Paul when he was one. The Pharisees taught there was no righteousness without the ceremonial. sacrificial "works of the Law" for justification of sins. When Paul sinned, he bought a turtle dove, gave it to the Levites, and his sin was cleansed. That was his righteousness from the law.
9 And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:
But now he believes in Jesus and His atoning blood, not in the "Works of the Law" prescribed by Moses "Till the Seed should come". You should know this desiring to be a teacher of the Bible.
This is a very deceiving statement. Jesus said, before He became a man, that there will come a time when He will write His laws on our hearts. Why? So we can disobey them?
The Bible teaches almost the exact opposite of what you say here.
1 John 2:3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
I know you are only preaching Mainstream doctrine and you mean well. But Jesus warned us to "Take Heed" that those who come in His name don't deceive us. Are you preaching that satan will deceive us into obeying God's Instruction.
You say "
so just because someone may be obeying the law and doing what the law says, does not mean they are righteous."
But Paul says; Rom. 8: "6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
Name one single time in the Bible where a person who is said to be obeying God was not considered righteous.
You can't EG, this is just more furthering of Mainstream doctrines and commandments of man.
Jesus cleansed my past sin on the cross. All sin past sin. If I slip us I repent and have faith that Jesus will forgive me. That is different than completely rejecting His Words and "Transgressing God's Commandments by my own righteousness, or doctrines and traditions.
When has there ever been a time apart from God's Laws? You see EG, you don't have any idea what you are preaching, just as Paul warned Timothy about. In all due respect, you still refuse to accept the "ADDED" Levitical Priesthood in any of your preaching. Abraham was justified "apart from the laws of justification which was "ADDED" until the seed should come. (Gal. 3:19)
Who was Paul preaching about in Romans 3?
Rom. 3:1 What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision?
2 Much every way: chiefly, because that unto them were committed the oracles of God.
3 For what if some did not believe? shall their unbelief make the faith of God without effect?
And what law did the Jew center their whole religion on? The 10 Commandments? The Sabbath? No!! The Levitical Priesthood "works of the Law" for remission of sins.
Rom. 3:26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.
27 Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works?
What was the law of works the Jews had their faith in EG? Paul is explaining to the Gentiles the reason why we don't kill goats for the remission of sins even though it was part of God's Law.
Nay: but by the law of faith. There is still a law EG.Abraham was blessed because he obeyed this law. (Gen. 26:5) Not the Levitical Priesthood "Works of the Law" for remission of past sins, but the good, perfect, holy, just laws of God. He had faith in that God and showed this faith by his works, and his faith saved him.
28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith(obedience to God) without the deeds of the law.(blood of goats and ceremonial "works" performed by Levite Priests)
Our past sins are freely forgiven, IF we turn to God, repent and bring forth works worthy of repentance. That is what Jesus and Paul taught.
Acts 26:20 But shewed first unto them of Damascus, and at Jerusalem, and throughout all the coasts of Judaea, and then to the Gentiles, that they should (ALL) repent and turn to God, and do works meet for repentance.
A true "Christian" would know as long as we are in this body, as long as this world exists, we have sin in us. God told us from the very beginning to "Rule over it". And with His help, His instruction, we can despite all the preaching from those who come in Christ's name to the contrary. And as Jesus said, He that endures to the end SHALL be saved.
I wanted to honor your post with a thorough response. I know you can't accept what I have written, but I didn't want to just blow your OP off. Since I believe the very foundation of your belief is built on old man made doctrines and traditions we have been taught for years, there is no sense in addressing any more of this OP. It is my hope you might actually consider some of what is written herein.
=eternally-gratefull;3346501]
Only God knows what is right. When we have faith in Him and trust and obey Him, then we also "KNOW" what is right. It is when we reject the instruction of the Father and create our own definition of right that we get in trouble.
Yes, I know this is what the catholic church and her daughters all preach. But the Bible preaches differently.
Abel turned to God and was accepted. Noah turned to God and was accepted. Abraham turned to God and was accepted.
Gen. 26:4 And I will make thy seed to multiply as the stars of heaven, and will give unto thy seed all these countries; and in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed;5 Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.
So yes, Jesus never needed to repent because He didn't transgress God's Law in the first place so He qualified to forgive Abraham who was "Faithful to God". But He didn't forgive Sodom, or those who called Him Lord, Lord in Matt. 7.
Love and Faith and Mercy are part of the Laws of God the Mainstream Preachers of Christ's time rejected.
Matt. 23:23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.
Your preaching that love, mercy and Faith are somehow "apart from the law" is another deception. I think you mean well, but your refusal to understand the difference between the "ADDED" Law, the Levitical Priesthood "Works of the Law" for remission of sins and God's 10 Commandments and His Law to have faith Love and mercy is clouding your vision.
It is my sincere hope you will at least consider my post.
Only God knows what is right. When we have faith in Him and trust and obey Him, then we also "KNOW" what is right. It is when we reject the instruction of the Father and create our own definition of right that we get in trouble.
Yes, I know this is what the catholic church and her daughters all preach. But the Bible preaches differently.
Abel turned to God and was accepted. Noah turned to God and was accepted. Abraham turned to God and was accepted.
Gen. 26:4 And I will make thy seed to multiply as the stars of heaven, and will give unto thy seed all these countries; and in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed;5 Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.
So yes, Jesus never needed to repent because He didn't transgress God's Law in the first place so He qualified to forgive Abraham who was "Faithful to God". But He didn't forgive Sodom, or those who called Him Lord, Lord in Matt. 7.
Love and Faith and Mercy are part of the Laws of God the Mainstream Preachers of Christ's time rejected.
Matt. 23:23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.
Your preaching that love, mercy and Faith are somehow "apart from the law" is another deception. I think you mean well, but your refusal to understand the difference between the "ADDED" Law, the Levitical Priesthood "Works of the Law" for remission of sins and God's 10 Commandments and His Law to have faith Love and mercy is clouding your vision.
It is my sincere hope you will at least consider my post.