Prophecy for those called by His name

prophecyman · Nov 26, 2011

So what is the Name of the Son, who said that he came in his Fathers name? If you have read the scriptures as to what the Apostles really believed, then its apparent that Peter the spokesman said... Repent and be baptize EVERYONE of you in the Name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins. Yes Peter understood what Jesus meant in Matt. 28:19.

Phillip when preaching to the Samaritans, taught baptism in Jesus name, for as yet he was fallen upon none of them, only they were baptized into the name of the Lord Jesus, please read the 8th chapter of Acts.

Again Peter in Acts chapter 10 preached the word to them that heard, and we learn that the holy ghost fell on them and they spoke in tongues. Peter did not ask them to be baptize, he commanded them to be baptize in name of Jesus.

Paul taught baptism in Jesus name, read Acts 19 for yourself... Yes the Apostle understood the words of Jesus quite well and were in perfect obedience.

Anyone who does not believe (Obey) and is not baptized according to jesus and his holy Apostles, denies the truth of God.

The right hand is symbolic with an Hebrew inflection meaning all power and authority. How can Jesus claim all power, only the one true God has all power. There is no trinity, you can not find this word in the gospels or any portion of the Holy Writ. God is not in three Persons, that is not taught in the bible nor can it be proven that this verbage ever was used by the Prophets or our Lord Jesus Christ and holy Apostles. The verbage God the Father, God the Son, God the Holy Ghost can not be found in scripture.

Romans 3:30 Seeing it is one God, which shall justify the circumcision by faith, and uncircumcision through faith.

Tit. 2:13 Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;

Rev. 1:8 " I am the Alpha and the Omega," says the Lord God, "who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty."

Its impossible that there be two or three Almighties, there is only one Lord Jesus who is the image of the invisble God

zone · Nov 26, 2011

zone said:

example:

classic dispensational (Scofield) redefinition of terms to create false doctrine:

FALSE:

THE DISPENSATION OF
THE GRACE OF GOD
by K. R. Blades

We, today, live in "the dispensation of the grace of God" to us Gentiles. This dispensation, or program, which God is now conducting is a new program and it is different from His program with the nation of Israel.

In this present dispensation, God's program with Israel is set aside and remains temporarily in abeyance, and the "time past" status of Israel being "nigh" to God and the Gentiles being "far off", no longer exists. (Romans 11:11 25; Ephesians 2:11 22) According to the apostle Paul in Ephesians 3:1 6, the revelation of this present dispensation, or program, was something God first made known and committed unto him.

"For this cause I Paul, the prisoner of Jesus Christ for you Gentiles, if ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you ward: how that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words, whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ) which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit; that the Gentiles should be fellow heirs, and of the same body and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:

This present dispensation is something which was a "mystery" before. God kept it secret unto Himself in ages and generations past, and it wasn't known about before or anticipated. Not until God raised up the apostle Paul and revealed unto him the "mystery of Christ", was this new dispensation of Gentile grace ushered in.

Enjoy The Bible MinistriesTHE DISPENSATION OF OF THE GRACE OF GOD >> Scofieldian dispo site

TRUE:

Ephesians 3:2

New American Standard Bible(©1995)
if indeed you have heard of the stewardship of God's grace which was given to me for you;

King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward:

International Standard Version(©2008)
Surely you have heard about the responsibility of administering God's grace that was given to me on your behalf

oikonomia: stewardship, administration
Original Word: οἰκονομία, ας, ἡ
Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine
Transliteration: oikonomia
Phonetic Spelling: (oy-kon-om-ee'-ah)
Short Definition: stewardship
Definition: management of household affairs, stewardship, administration.

3622 oikonomía (from 3621 /oikonoméō, "a steward, managing a household") – properly, a stewardship, management (administration), i.e. where a person looks after another's affairs (resources).

~

so what did they do?

took ONE WORD - dispensation, which would actually mean to dispense, as in to distribute what one has been authorized as steward over......(grace)

and made it about a SPAN OF TIME (Dispensation of Grace/Church Age/Plan B) in a non-existent scheme that doesn't exist in the scriptures.

can you believe how easily they got away with it?

just goes to show ya

prophecyman · Nov 26, 2011

zone said:

example:

classic dispensational (Scofield) redefinition of terms to create false doctrine:

FALSE:

THE DISPENSATION OF
THE GRACE OF GOD
by K. R. Blades

We, today, live in "the dispensation of the grace of God" to us Gentiles. This dispensation, or program, which God is now conducting is a new program and it is different from His program with the nation of Israel.

In this present dispensation, God's program with Israel is set aside and remains temporarily in abeyance, and the "time past" status of Israel being "nigh" to God and the Gentiles being "far off", no longer exists. (Romans 11:11 25; Ephesians 2:11 22) According to the apostle Paul in Ephesians 3:1 6, the revelation of this present dispensation, or program, was something God first made known and committed unto him.

"For this cause I Paul, the prisoner of Jesus Christ for you Gentiles, if ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you ward: how that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words, whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ) which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit; that the Gentiles should be fellow heirs, and of the same body and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:

This present dispensation is something which was a "mystery" before. God kept it secret unto Himself in ages and generations past, and it wasn't known about before or anticipated. Not until God raised up the apostle Paul and revealed unto him the "mystery of Christ", was this new dispensation of Gentile grace ushered in.

Enjoy The Bible MinistriesTHE DISPENSATION OF OF THE GRACE OF GOD >> Scofieldian dispo site

TRUE:

Ephesians 3:2

New American Standard Bible(©1995)
if indeed you have heard of the stewardship of God's grace which was given to me for you;

King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward:

International Standard Version(©2008)
Surely you have heard about the responsibility of administering God's grace that was given to me on your behalf

oikonomia: stewardship, administration
Original Word: οἰκονομία, ας, ἡ
Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine
Transliteration: oikonomia
Phonetic Spelling: (oy-kon-om-ee'-ah)
Short Definition: stewardship
Definition: management of household affairs, stewardship, administration.

3622 oikonomía (from 3621 /oikonoméō, "a steward, managing a household") – properly, a stewardship, management (administration), i.e. where a person looks after another's affairs (resources).

~

so what did they do?

took ONE WORD - dispensation, which would actually mean to dispense, as in to distribute what one has been authorized as steward over......(grace)

and made it about a SPAN OF TIME (Dispensation of Grace/Church Age/Plan B) in a non-existent scheme that doesn't exist in the scriptures.

can you believe how easily they got away with it?

just goes to show ya

Zone that was good, I don't ascribe to the dispensational theory as was proposed by Scoffield, Darby, and D.L. Moody.

becausehedied · Nov 26, 2011

prophecyman said:

I will grant you that the verbage as you put it connot be found. However, you did not say anything about Christ baprtism where the Father, son, and Spirit were all present. You did not say anything about Christ prayer in John 17. Also, you said nothing about the usage of the original language in Deut 6:4.

What about 1 Corinthians 15

1Co 15:24 Then comes the end, when He delivers the kingdom to God the Father, when He puts an end to all rule and all authority and power.
1Co 15:25 For He must reign till He has put all enemies under His feet.
1Co 15:26 The last enemy that will be destroyed is death.
1Co 15:27 For "He has put all things under His feet." But when He says "all things are put under Him," it is evident that He who put all things under Him is excepted.
1Co 15:28 Now when all things are made subject to Him, then the Son Himself will also be subject to Him who put all things under Him, that God may be all in all.

Who us being spoken of there is a distinction between the Son and the Father. Who is Christ delivering up the kingdom to. Who is being spoken of in verse 27.

prophecyman · Nov 26, 2011

becausehedied said:

I have no problem with the scriptures you presented, for Jesus very clearly stated that his Father was greater than he, The Son is the image of the Father and the Father dwelt in the Son, for in him all fulness dwells. Jesus was not in the Godhead, but the Godhead was in Jesus, for it pleased the Father that in him should all the fulness of the Godhead dwell, for the Spirit was not given to him by measure.

There is an old testament scripture that says..."O' Thou that hearest prayer all flesh shall come and pray. Jesus the Son was in the flesh, he had to pray. I do not believe that Jesus is the Father and God prayed to himself, rather I believe that God was in Christ reconciling the world unto himself. I think alot of times people don't realize when he spoke as the Son vs. the Father speaking. In the sense that God the Father who is Spirit dwelt in the living Son, in this sense they are one. It was never taught in the Holy writ that God is in three persons, the Spirit of God can not be a person, for to be a person requires by definition that you must be flesh and blood. We can not equate the Spirit on the level of humanity, nor can we use english definitives to translate accurately or convey and receive the revelation of Jesus Christ, he is the Messiah the holy one of God.

What he heard from the Father, that he spoke. He said that his doctrine was not his, but to him that sent the living truth into the world. Yes he will yeild the kingdom up to the father that God may be all in all. It is at this juncture that the office of sonship has ceased to be, and then in that future day we will look upon the face of the visible manifestation of Jesus, who is the image of the invisble Father, in this sense is he One, and there will be one that sits upon the throne, and he shall come in great glory on that great and notable day, the day of the Lord.

One God, One Father,One Lord, One faith, One baptism. Not purloining, but shewing all good fidelity; that they may adorn the doctrine of God our Saviour in all things.

TheAristocat · Nov 26, 2011

zone said:

Revelation 11:3 And I will appoint my two witnesses, and they will prophesy for 1,260 days, clothed in sackcloth.

I don't think this has happened yet, so prophecy is still a possibility. But I don't know about this prophecy. I've never been Pentacostal and have never had a prophetic message from God or spoke in tongues, but the language they use to describe these gifts is a little troubling because their description often times tells me that it's coming from their own minds - not from God's mouth.

TheAristocat · Nov 26, 2011

jonathanbchristian said:

This says the Lord, I am with you all. I am meek and lowly says the Lord. Cast your cares on me for I can bear them. I will be with those who hear my voice and heed my speach. This says the Lord, I am not far from you as one who cannot reach down and touch you. This says the Lord if you have faith I will touch the hymn of your garment and you will be healed in spirit or in body. I am generous says the Lord. I have heard your request and I have changed my manner. I have not forgotten those who are called by my name. God is your father, be of good courage, for all those called by my name will have great rejoicing, says the Lord.

What is the significance here of touching the hem of one's garment? What does it mean for God to change his manner?

Spiritual_Plague · Nov 27, 2011

Abiding said:

Well i hear your reasoning and it doesnt hold up with the point i made.
I tend to stay away from trying to stand on a cessationist view. The reason
is its takes away from my motive...that is when my motive is to point out false
prophets.....like this thread is built not on words from a prophet....but either
a person very led away in his mind coupled with false teaching....or a rather
weak manifestation of what the manifestation of prophecy actually was originally
which does take place today...in fact all the time...yet its natural in its delivery
it doesnt happen with a thus sayeth the Lord. But that would be for another thread.

If you didnt understand what you just responed to im afraid im not communicating
good enough for me to try and go deeper into the issue. My issue with Prophets isnt
that there is none....although i simply see no use for one till it hits the fan...like in
revelation(by the way you might notice things then are quite different than any other
time in the church age) but as yet in the past 35 years every prophet ive seen has been
a false prophet.

Continuists to me spend so much time defending continuism they hanvt the time
to point out or even look at the heaps of false prophets all through the churchs
in america. That is so obvious to me and it makes me sick. And im not kidding they
actually will defend them even without examining them. And call people names who
do. Charismatics are the same fighting all the time for the gifts and ignoring the
purely obvious satanic manifestations sweeping the church.

So in closing ive at least lost respect for charismatics and continuists since they
allow anything that wiggles come in the door and say not a word till they hear
someone point out the danger...then they just defend themselves...played out
with a rediculious quip...like dont throw the baby out with the bathwater.
Tell me im wrong about this evaluation.

I definitely can't tell you that you're wrong about your evaluation, 'cause like everyone else all we can do is "speak what we know and testify of what we have seen".

I know I've experienced something much different in the churches I've been to and heard of in my area with one exception. The church that was the one exception was completely disobedient to the scripture that says "Let two or three prophets speak, and let the others judge". They had let people prophesy without accountability.

One simple verse makes all the difference between accountability and chaos.

Spiritual_Plague · Nov 27, 2011

zone said:

Spiritual_Plague,
concerning this point of the 2 witnesses brought up yesterday.....

i'm not going to go into Revelation here on this thread, for a few simple reasons:

i see clearly that the so called millennium ('future 1,000 years) is NOW - the redemptive period between the First and Second Advents.

this is a despised doctrine, but without this understanding, the Book of Revelation as a book of very real spiritual truths expressed in symbolic language isn't accepted.
its trampled everyday. but its crucial to understanding the symbolism in scripture - i'm studying SP...i'm leaving the counterfeit entirely.
that's why the 'events' in the world as they are going down don't seem to "MATCH" what is written: its a counterfeit being played out just as God said in 2 Thess 2

so to do any kind of service to what i am seeing in Revelation re: the 2 witnesses, we'd have to almost start from the beginning, because our presuppositions are completly different.

the problem lies in trying to undo dispensational "literalism" at every turn: this is, ultimately The Holy Spirit's work in the faithful christian. if we can't make the transition from the TYPES of the OT to the Fulfillments in Christ and His church, nothing makes any sense at all. and Jesus is sidelined.

~

Re: Prophecy for those called by His name

and a verbatim First Person utterance supposedly from Jesus is what i am arguing AGAINST.

the Word of God already delivered is what should have been posted in that OP if we were to be hearing from a real 'prophet' - not some fake new utterance.

~

all i'll post for now about the 2 witnesses REGARDING THE IDEA OF 'CONTINUATION' of miraculous prophetic/apostolic offices from Acts/Corinth etc is this (i do not believe they are 2 literal men): this shouldn't have to launch us off into the Book of Revelation as the subject of this thread: you're familiar with the Rev passages, so consider these:

Amos 8:11
"Behold the days come, saith the Lord God, that I will send a famine in the land, not a famine of bread, nor a thirst for water, but of hearing the Word of God".

Isaiah 55:10-11
For as the rain cometh down, and the snow from heaven, and returneth not thither, but watereth the earth, and maketh it bring forth and bud, that it may give seed to the sower, and bread to the eater:
So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.

Isaiah 12:2-3
Behold, God is my salvation; I will trust, and not be afraid: for the LORD Jehovah is my strength and my song; he also is become my salvation. Therefore with joy shall ye draw water out of the wells of salvation.

James 5:16-20
The prayer of a righteous person has great power as it is working. Elijah was a man with a nature like ours, and he prayed fervently that it might not rain, and for three years and six months it did not rain on the earth. Then he prayed again, and heaven gave rain, and the earth bore its fruit.
My brothers, if anyone among you wanders from the truth and someone brings him back, let him know that whoever brings back a sinner from his wandering will save his soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins.

~

anyways....the key for me is knowing dispensationalism (mixed with the occult) is a system that has overlaid an entirely 'visible' and physical counterfeit on the spiritual truth and reality.

LAO can explain these things better than i can, though i totally disagree with him on the 1,000 years.
typology is critical.

zone.

Zone,

Fair enough. Thanks for taking the time to respond concerning the 2 witnesses and your perspective of Rev.

TheAristocat · Nov 27, 2011

zone said:

Spiritual_Plague,
concerning this point of the 2 witnesses brought up yesterday.....

i'm not going to go into Revelation here on this thread, for a few simple reasons:

i see clearly that the so called millennium ('future 1,000 years) is NOW - the redemptive period between the First and Second Advents.

this is a despised doctrine, but without this understanding, the Book of Revelation as a book of very real spiritual truths expressed in symbolic language isn't accepted.
its trampled everyday. but its crucial to understanding the symbolism in scripture - i'm studying SP...i'm leaving the counterfeit entirely.
that's why the 'events' in the world as they are going down don't seem to "MATCH" what is written: its a counterfeit being played out just as God said in 2 Thess 2

so to do any kind of service to what i am seeing in Revelation re: the 2 witnesses, we'd have to almost start from the beginning, because our presuppositions are completly different.

the problem lies in trying to undo dispensational "literalism" at every turn: this is, ultimately The Holy Spirit's work in the faithful christian. if we can't make the transition from the TYPES of the OT to the Fulfillments in Christ and His church, nothing makes any sense at all. and Jesus is sidelined.

~

Re: Prophecy for those called by His name

and a verbatim First Person utterance supposedly from Jesus is what i am arguing AGAINST.

the Word of God already delivered is what should have been posted in that OP if we were to be hearing from a real 'prophet' - not some fake new utterance.

~

all i'll post for now about the 2 witnesses REGARDING THE IDEA OF 'CONTINUATION' of miraculous prophetic/apostolic offices from Acts/Corinth etc is this (i do not believe they are 2 literal men): this shouldn't have to launch us off into the Book of Revelation as the subject of this thread: you're familiar with the Rev passages, so consider these:

Amos 8:11
"Behold the days come, saith the Lord God, that I will send a famine in the land, not a famine of bread, nor a thirst for water, but of hearing the Word of God".

Isaiah 55:10-11
For as the rain cometh down, and the snow from heaven, and returneth not thither, but watereth the earth, and maketh it bring forth and bud, that it may give seed to the sower, and bread to the eater:
So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.

Isaiah 12:2-3
Behold, God is my salvation; I will trust, and not be afraid: for the LORD Jehovah is my strength and my song; he also is become my salvation. Therefore with joy shall ye draw water out of the wells of salvation.

James 5:16-20
The prayer of a righteous person has great power as it is working. Elijah was a man with a nature like ours, and he prayed fervently that it might not rain, and for three years and six months it did not rain on the earth. Then he prayed again, and heaven gave rain, and the earth bore its fruit.
My brothers, if anyone among you wanders from the truth and someone brings him back, let him know that whoever brings back a sinner from his wandering will save his soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins.

~

anyways....the key for me is knowing dispensationalism (mixed with the occult) is a system that has overlaid an entirely 'visible' and physical counterfeit on the spiritual truth and reality.

LAO can explain these things better than i can, though i totally disagree with him on the 1,000 years.
typology is critical.

zone.

Hmm. I didn't see this. Admittedly there is a lot of symbolism in Revelation. If you look at the entirety of Revelation 11, though, the language does not give me the feeling that the two witnesses, themselves, are symbolic. It actually uses the two witnesses as real people to explain symbols such as the the two olive trees and the two lampstands and talks about them having bodies and being two prophets, etc. And I think even if the two prophets are symbolic of a multitude of people or the like then prophecy is still mentioned. It would be a hard task to explain away this occurrence of prophecy which has yet to come in the future.

sonnyd · Nov 27, 2011

If there is no longer Prophecies in the church, I wonder why Paul in 1 Corinthians 12th chapter 10th verse would list prophecy as one of the spiritual gifts that would be given to individuals of the church?

A new member just asking this question.

systemdown101 · Nov 27, 2011

TheAristocat said:

No, you misunderstand. According to the prophecy, He will touch the HYMN of your garment. So, this prophecy can only take place once our technology has created clothes made out of solid music. What clothing made out of concrete sound will look like is anyone's guess, but I have no doubt it will be spectacular. I myself plan to have an entire wardrobe made out of Mozart.

prophecyman · Nov 27, 2011

sonnyd said:

The answer is simple, because these gifts are for the edification of the body (Church). The gifts are still in operation, the reason why people are so divided about the spiritual gifts, is due in part that they were told that such gifts passed with the Apostles, or have been told by their Pastors that it is of the Devil. What further complicates the situation is the many fakes who imitate the gifts of God, and no marvel, because Satan himself is transformed into an Angel of light.

I have the baptism of the Holy Spirit, and I speak in tongues, I also operate in the gifts and I can assure you it is great power. I am not of the Charismatic movement, but I am Apostolic Pentecostal Holiness, many would say we are legalist, but in our assembly, we just really love the Lord. Sometimes the Lord speaks to me in dreams and he gives me messages to preach. Too bad that many people are missing out on the real thing, due in part that they have seen one to many of Benny Hinn and others who claim the power of God.

jonathanbchristian · Nov 27, 2011

systemdown101 said:

I know how I spelled it; it was not a mistake. Is it really so hard to believe that you could wear something not material? Read these verses: 1 Peter 3:3 "Whose adorning let it not be that outward adorning of plaiting the hair, and of wearing of gold, or of putting on of apparel; 4 But let it be the hidden man of the heart, in that which is not corruptible, even the ornament of a meek and quiet spirit, which is in the sight of God of great price." The Bible says you can wear a meek and quiet spirit; so what's wrong with wearing something not corruptible?

sonnyd · Nov 27, 2011

prophecyman said:

Brother, Like you, I received the like gift as you in 1941 at the age of 11 years. The UPCI standard of christian living has with me for 71 years. In my post I was trying to establish the fact that scripture does verify that prophecy is still part of the church even today. I have an unction that we agree on the plan of salvation and the apostolic belief in Holy living. God Bless

prophecyman · Nov 27, 2011

sonnyd said:

Amen, and may we yet do the work of the Master and with prayer and fasting, reap the harvest. May the Lord open the eyes of them that can not see, that the Gospel of Christ shine in their hearts to Salvation....GLORY!

TheAristocat · Nov 28, 2011

systemdown101 said:

Lol. I'm sure at some point in time it would be possible to bend and conform sound waves to the curvature of your body, and might be possible today. But I still haven't received a serious answer to my questions.

Katy-follower · Nov 26, 2012

I'm unsure really, but as I have understood it, the gift of prophet was a gift given to the early church to proclaim the word of God to others, when the bible was not complete or others did not have access to it. Today we have the bible.....

2 Tim 3:16: "All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work"

Saying all that, God still uses us. The Holy Spirit works through us and can often use us to communicate a message to someone else, say, in their time of need when they needed to hear a scripture to pick them up, or it could be the Holy Spirit gives us words to speak to another in answer to a question they prayed about.

God reveals truth to us in a supernatural way, even if it be something we were pondering over that He then answers... but these things are not the gift of being a prophet.... all Christians with the Holy Spirit dwelling in them are part of the body of Christ, with different spiritual gifts and God can choose to give us more gifts and use us in different ways. We are arms and legs, none of us greater than another.

God still gives us visions for different reasons. I also know of a sound pastor that was given visions of future events, many of which he received way in advance and they did actually take place, but these visions did not add to scripture in any way, they didn't take you away from God's truth, he didn't ever claim to be a prophet, by his own words, rather he claimed to have visions and wanted to share them.

We should always use discernment.... compare everything with the word of God.

1 Thess 5:20-21: "Do not despise prophecies. Test all things; hold fast what is good"

Jonathan, I hope you come back to the site, as I noticed you disappeared.

Much love

jb · Nov 26, 2012

systemdown101 said:

I don't think you're old...I would say you are in between 'old' and 'young'...more like an inbetweeny!

PostWar · Feb 8, 2013

When I was 14 I had visions of the future. I thought an angel was speaking to me. Often times I wished I could tell someone about the visions but I knew no one would believe me. Some of them have happened and a few more are yet to come. It has been very lonely to live and know important, world changing knowledge but to never know anyone who would ever believe you. Life is very lonely when you have big secrets, when you've already seen what will happen to everything. I feel lonely seeing how difficult it is to speak of Prophecy in a Christian setting. I know god will change it for me, very soon.

Prophecy for those called by His name

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