Question

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Mar 18, 2021
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#81
Because there is another verse (v 19) which balances things out: Write the things which thou hast seen, and the things which are, and the things which shall be hereafter;

1. THE THINGS WHICH THOU HAST SEEN: ALL THE VISIONS IN REVELATION

2. THE THINGS WHICH ARE: THE PRESENT CONDITION OF THE CHURCHES AND THE LETTERS TO THEM

3. THE THINGS WHICH SHALL BE HEREAFTER: THE BULK OF THE REVELATION PROPHECIES.

One of those things which shall be hereafter is the Millennial reign of Christ and his saints. To ignore that, or to dismiss it, means a lack of appreciation for the things which shall be hereafter.

So what did Jesus mean when He said "The time is at hand"? What He was saying is that those seven churches were to immediately receive those letters sent by the hands of angels, and after the book of Revelation was completed, the events of the first five seals would go into effect (as noted in the Olivet Discourse).
You missed Rev 22:10 - These things ARE AT HAND.
Revelation is a book of spiritual realities, perfectly misunderstood by unspiritual minds.

The carnal minded preachers and their dysfunctional wolf-children that try to teach it are manifesting Rev 13:11 - And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth;
and he had two horns like a lamb (Looks like Jesus),
and he spake as a dragon (Speaks like the Devil - Flesh Nature.
 

oldhermit

Senior Member
Jul 28, 2012
9,087
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Texas
#82
I agree and I hope you will consider my original question in your thread.
I think what I will do is open the study by examining the prophesies of Daniel in the order they appear in the book of Daniel beginning with chapter two. Does this sound good to everyone?
 
Mar 18, 2021
90
16
8
#83
I think what I will do is open the study by examining the prophesies of Daniel in the order they appear in the book of Daniel beginning with chapter two. Does this sound good to everyone?
You're looking back as Lot's Wife to those dying in Sodom
 

oldhermit

Senior Member
Jul 28, 2012
9,087
572
113
68
Texas
#84
You're looking back as Lot's Wife to those dying in Sodom
It is impossible to ever understand the book of Rev without a study of the prophets where the symbols of Rev originate. It is like trying to study musical theory without first learning what a chord is.
 
Mar 18, 2021
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#85
It is impossible to ever understand the book of Rev without a study of the prophets where the symbols of Rev originate. It is like trying to study musical theory without first learning what a chord is.
I was wrong, you're in Sodom.
 
Feb 28, 2016
11,311
2,970
113
#87
It is clear from the book of Revelation that there will be a 1000 year reign of Jesus as He will take the government upon His shoulders.
==========================================================
Tourist,
you are spot-on. = REV. 20:5.
conditional Threads are most often implying 'want of control'...
 

iamsoandso

Senior Member
Oct 6, 2011
6,579
1,210
113
#88
I think what I will do is open the study by examining the prophesies of Daniel in the order they appear in the book of Daniel beginning with chapter two. Does this sound good to everyone?
Yes,,you say "beginning with chapter two" Do you see the chapters written at different times and by the same author?
 
D

DWR

Guest
#95
If you do not believe in a 1000 year earthly reign of Christ when He returns, then I respectfully decline.
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
20,969
11,473
113
#96
Beginning to smell like Preterism sneaking into a bible discussion as a wolf is sheep's clothing.

Any teaching that cannot stand disagreement is not teaching but an attempt to indoctrinate.
Do you see the hypocrisy in your words?
 

Evmur

Well-known member
Feb 28, 2021
2,896
1,594
113
London
#97
You can study Revs devotionally and learn from it as from any scripture but truly it is prophetic about the Day of the Lord onwards right up to the 1,000 years and the new heavens and earth.

It's title is "The revelation of Jesus Christ" meaning His revelation from heaven i.e. His coming again. That is what the book is about.

John says "I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day" it's not Sunday folks lol it's the Day of the Lord.

after the opening chapters the church is in heaven and on earth the then converted Jews. Which is why folks get mixed up in trying to apply the prophecies to the church.
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
7,708
2,502
113
#98
I am just curious. If anyone here had an opportunity to examine the book of Revelation from a non-millenialistic approach, would anyone be interested in such a study?
Get it going,it's my observation of Rev 20:1-6 that the description is seen 100% in the Lords spiritual realm of no literal time, one day is a thousand years, not literal.

Angel, Heaven, Devil, Satan, The Souls,The Dead, God, Christ

1. No Physical Kingdom On Earth Seen?

2. No Mortal Humans On Earth Seen?

A Literal 1,000 Year Kingdom On Earth, Claimed In Rev 20:1-6 Is A Man Made Fairy Tale.

Revelation 20:1-6KJV

1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
7,708
2,502
113
#99
It is the oposite of the millenial view. As another member once suggested on this site, the historical view offers a platform against which prophecies can be examined.

"Futurism promotes fanciful projections of prophecy into a future that can't be examined against anything. One is based on historical witness...." (Quoted from member HeRoseFromTheDead.)
I believe (Historicism) has many flaws, as does (Futurism) the truth is found in the middle

(Historicisms) interpretation of Matthew 24 claiming ongoing tribulations, and many antichrist relating to Rome is false in my opinion, for starters, a form of (Partial Preterism)

Be glad to converse on the (Historicist) view?
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
7,708
2,502
113
You can study Revs devotionally and learn from it as from any scripture but truly it is prophetic about the Day of the Lord onwards right up to the 1,000 years and the new heavens and earth.

It's title is "The revelation of Jesus Christ" meaning His revelation from heaven i.e. His coming again. That is what the book is about.

John says "I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day" it's not Sunday folks lol it's the Day of the Lord.

after the opening chapters the church is in heaven and on earth the then converted Jews. Which is why folks get mixed up in trying to apply the prophecies to the church.
Jesus Christ returns in fire and final judgement, dissolving the heavens and earth

Jesus dosent return in the (Second Coming) to start a Millennial Kingdom on Earth as many claim.


There Will Be No 1,000 Year Millennial Kingdom Upon This Earth, Jesus Christ Returns In Fire And Final Judgement, Dissolving This Existing Earth By Fire, Immediately After The Tribulation.

This Existing Heaven And Earth Will Be (Replaced) By The New Heaven, Earth, Jerusalem, A New Creation, At The Return Of Jesus Christ!

(Behold, I Make All Things New)

2 Peter 3:10-13KJV
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved
, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

Revelation 21:1-5KJV
1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
5 And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.

Matthew 24:29-30KJV
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

1 Corinthians 3:13KJV
13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.

Luke 17:29-30KJV
29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.
30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.


2 Thessalonians 1:7-9KJV
7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God
, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

Malachi 3:2KJV
2 But who may abide the day of his coming? and who shall stand when he appeareth? for he is like a refiner's fire, and like fullers' soap:

Psalm 46:6KJV
6 The heathen raged, the kingdoms were moved: he uttered his voice, the earth melted.

Psalm 50:3KJV
3 Our God shall come, and shall not keep silence: a fire shall devour before him, and it shall be very tempestuous round about him.

Psalm 97:5KJV
5 The hills melted like wax at the presence of the Lord, at the presence of the Lord of the whole earth.

Isaiah 66:15KJV
15 For, behold, the Lord will come with fire, and with his chariots like a whirlwind, to render his anger with fury, and his rebuke with flames of fire.

Nahum 1:5-6KJV
5 The mountains quake at him, and the hills melt, and the earth is burned at his presence, yea, the world, and all that dwell therein.
6 Who can stand before his indignation? and who can abide in the fierceness of his anger? his fury is poured out like fire, and the rocks are thrown down by him.

Revelation 20:9KJV
9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.