Reason for the "angry" God of the Old Testament.

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pittsburghjoe

Active member
Jan 21, 2021
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#1
Is the view of God being angry in the Old Testament from God setting opportunities for souls to be compatible with the Kingdom?
Did the "anger" stop because Jesus started a new way out of this fallen condition?
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
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#2
Could you please contextualize this anger a little more?

Like, give a "for instance in this case..."


Ultimately, though, the wicked will perish.

That has never changed :)
 

pittsburghjoe

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Jan 21, 2021
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#3
Atheists like to bring up the "angry" God of the Old Testament ..He did wipe some wicked people out. They had zero chance of being compatible with God's Kingdom.
 

Roughsoul1991

Senior Member
Sep 17, 2016
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#4

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
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#5
2 cor 5 .19
19To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
 

pittsburghjoe

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Jan 21, 2021
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#6

Magenta

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Jul 3, 2015
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#7
Atheists like to bring up the "angry" God of the Old Testament ..He did wipe some
wicked people out. They had zero chance of being compatible with God's Kingdom.
Some? Eh, He drowned the whole world except for eight people and enough animals to carry the genetic lines forward.
 

pittsburghjoe

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Jan 21, 2021
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#8
Is there a chance that flood was regional and not the entire Earth? They would only need animals from that region then. There was a flood around the mediterranean.
 

p_rehbein

Senior Member
Sep 4, 2013
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#9
Yours is the right answer. But for the monsters that are atheists ..the are not going to read that. I'm looking for a one-two punch to shut them down.
That's simple.

Tell 'em.........If you think God isn't an angry God, just keep living the way you are. One day soon, you will be the heir of His Wrath!

If you don't think God is a loving God, just repent and turn to Him! He will pour out His loving grace and mercy upon you, and you will live forever with Him!
 

p_rehbein

Senior Member
Sep 4, 2013
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#10
OR, you can just say:

Everyone is going to spend eternity somewhere. The choice is your.

Heaven?
Hell?
 

pittsburghjoe

Active member
Jan 21, 2021
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#11
I have a hard time with the eternal hell thing. I know Heaven is infinite ..but why would a loving God allow infinite torment? I get the reason to scream it at atheists, but they see it as a reason to not even bother trying to believe.
 

Lucy-Pevensie

Senior Member
Dec 20, 2017
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#12
I have a hard time with the eternal hell thing. I know Heaven is infinite ..but why would a loving God allow infinite torment? I get the reason to scream it at atheists, but they see it as a reason to not even bother trying to believe.
Trying won't get them anywhere anyway.
The kingdom is hidden for a reason. It stops the insincere from entering.
 

Roughsoul1991

Senior Member
Sep 17, 2016
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#13
Yours is the right answer. But for the monsters that are atheists ..the are not going to read that. I'm looking for a one-two punch to shut them down.
The best way to shut them down is to walk away. If they will not listen to your arguments or point of view then they are not ready for what you have to say. They are not worth your time.

Are they monsters? If you define that as sinners then we all are monsters. If you mean wicked then yes. If you mean fools then yes. But without Christ, we were all in this same definition. They need love, forgiveness, mercy, grace, kindness, and trust before they feel safe to talk about foundation-shaking subjects.
 
Feb 21, 2021
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#14
Ironically it is in the New Testament that God's wrath reaches its zenith, perhaps because unlike in the OT times now they don't have the excuse of ignorance.
 

Roughsoul1991

Senior Member
Sep 17, 2016
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#15
I have a hard time with the eternal hell thing. I know Heaven is infinite ..but why would a loving God allow infinite torment? I get the reason to scream it at atheists, but they see it as a reason to not even bother trying to believe.
Of course, this wouldn't matter to the atheist if God doesn't exist, if the Bible isn't authoritative or Heaven and Hell don't exist.

Define torment Biblically? Is it possible their eternal existence is loving? Just as a father to a child that doesn't want anything to do with the father still cares for the child but gives them what they want. To be away from the father. God pulls away and they are in a place where the attributes of God are gone. The only way we experience anything good is through the attributes of God as we are created in His image. If God pulls away we are left with our carnal natural evil nature. Literally, a place without God is Hell. The souls in Hell wanted to be without God. God gives them exactly what they want.

God says in Romans all are without excuse. God has worked in nature, conscience, prophets, miracles, visions, dreams, etc. God gives people plenty of opportunities to respond.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
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#17
Is there a chance that flood was regional and not the entire Earth?
Not a chance. The Bible and geological evidence confirms that the Flood was global.

Also, the only reason God has not unleashed His wrath on the ungodly is because the Gospel must first be preached in all the world. But He is the same God who is presently offering grace and mercy to sinners.
 
Feb 21, 2021
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#18
Did the souls in the OT have the excuse of ignorance?
Some did yes, obviously some were utterly wicked, but yes, before Christ all the races with exception to Israel lost the knowledge of God. We can actually sort of see this in the Bible as in the early parts of Genesis there is an almost universal recognition of God, and that makes logical sense since God saved Noah and his sons whom are the fathers of everyone alive today, but by the time we get to Abraham there are very few that retain the knowledge of God, and by the time of Moses it's pretty much just Israel and those that sojourn with them.

The good news is that with Christ's birth, crucifixion, and resurrection then the knowledge of God began to spread to the other races via the apostles (this forms a large plot point of book of Acts and the backdrop for Paul's letters) so that the world may be given the knowledge of God again so that it has no excuses. On the other hand though this means the world will be even more wicked on this side of history because they will simply reject God and his good ways, thus the extreme curses of the book of Revelation that are promised for them culminating ultimately in the total destruction of creation. Though one good turn deserving another, this also means that those that believe in Jesus and his good ways will indeed inherit the promise of God of eternal life.

This passage comes to my mind immediately, and I think is fairly decent in supporting this notion:

Acts 17:24-31
24 God that made the world and all things therein, seeing that he is Lord of heaven and earth, dwelleth not in temples made with hands;

25 Neither is worshipped with men's hands, as though he needed any thing, seeing he giveth to all life, and breath, and all things;

26 And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation;

27 That they should seek the Lord, if haply they might feel after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us:

28 For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring.

29 Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and man's device.

30 And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:

31 Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by that man whom he hath ordained; whereof he hath given assurance unto all men, in that he hath raised him from the dead.
 

Journeyman

Well-known member
Jan 10, 2019
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#19
Is the view of God being angry in the Old Testament from God setting opportunities for souls to be compatible with the Kingdom?
Did the "anger" stop because Jesus started a new way out of this fallen condition?
The Father described in the OT is no more angry than his Son. Nor is the Son described in the NT any more patiently loving than his Father. They're exactly the same.

God has always been longsuffering toward the evil of mankind,

Because sentence against an evil work is not executed speedily, therefore the heart of the sons of men is fully set in them to do evil. Though a sinner do evil an hundred times, and his days be prolonged, yet surely I know that it shall be well with them that fear God, which fear before him: But it shall not be well with the wicked, neither shall he prolong his days, which are as a shadow; because he feareth not before God. Ecc.8:11-13

Just because our Lord didn't immediately pass judgement on people who mercilessly abused him doesnt mean they won't pay for their crimes unless they repent in the time he graciously offers. Someday, the unrepentant will say,

hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb: Rev.6:16
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
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#20
I have a hard time with the eternal hell thing. I know Heaven is infinite ..but why would a loving God allow infinite torment? I get the reason to scream it at atheists, but they see it as a reason to not even bother trying to believe.
Whether "hell" is infinite torment is a matter of much debate. What is certain is that those who are not in the Kingdom of God through faith in Jesus Christ will suffer eternal separation from God.