Research: Majority of Americans Believe Works Are the Key to Salvation

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Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
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yet here you are adding

When you ENDURE it means you survive, or do what you have to do to remain that way.

These people DIED. so they did not ENDURE until the time Christ died.

Add to the word. You call eternal life conditional. in effect call Christ a liar.

Look inside my friend.
You add and twisted the verse
Endure remine believing Jesus till die, not till Jesus coming
How about you die of sickness before Jesus come, consider not endure?
 

Everlasting-Grace

Well-known member
Dec 18, 2021
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You add and twisted the verse
Endure remine believing Jesus till die, not till Jesus coming
Thats your interpretation. Thats not what the word says.

Jesus said he who endures till the end, not he who believed until the end.

once agin, You adding or twisting the word of God
How about you die of sickness before Jesus come, consider not endure?
if you do not make it until Christ comes. You did not endure.

Your trying to read to much into it. and refusing to see what is literally being said..
 

FreeGrace2

Well-known member
Jan 31, 2021
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I am reading the Bible and that is say
John 15:5
I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
Apparently that is the ONLY VERSE you read.

Not even one comment about the 3 verses I shared with you: Eph 4:30, 1 Thess 5:19 and Eph 5;18. Just crickets.

When you abide in Him or let Jesus in, you will bear fruit
This isn't salvation. It is being IN FELLOWSHIP with the Lord. All covered in 1 John 1.

And what is the fruit of the Holy Spirit?
Gal 5

Love, loving life style
Right. This is what believers are commanded to do. And they are already saved.
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
11,769
1,362
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Thats your interpretation. Thats not what the word says.

Jesus said he who endures till the end, not he who believed until the end.

once agin, You adding or twisting the word of God


if you do not make it until Christ comes. You did not endure.

Your trying to read to much into it. and refusing to see what is literally being said..
If you die before second coming you not endure? Than the 12 apostle not endure
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
30,460
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Do search...ours tells us...... that type of Bible interpretation has only appeared since the 1960's. It is ..... New age religion...... thinking and approach to God's word which began in that era....sadly.
Perhaps longer as it has smells of the Roman Catholic Church.
 

FreeGrace2

Well-known member
Jan 31, 2021
8,084
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FreeGrace2 said:
Apparently that is the ONLY VERSE you read.
Bible verse not lie
Obviously Bible verses do not lie. But the one you keep reading doesn't mean what you think it means.

and not contradict each other what in john 15:5 consistence with eph or other verse if you think John and eph contradict tell me why
I don't believe any verse contradicts any other verse. I've shown you verses that PLAINLY say the opposite of what you claim.
 
May 22, 2020
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Perhaps longer as it has smells of the Roman Catholic Church.

Good thought...but, RCC does not embrace ...new age religion thinking...and neither does ...new age religion.....embrace the RCC.
Reason;....the RCC is too enforcing of their controlling standards which ...new age religion types...resent in Christian standards.

Go tell.

I have never done a comparison but, there are probably some interpretations compatible with both groups....since they are wrong...in final analysis.
 

Inquisitor

Active member
Mar 17, 2022
659
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I understood....I gave you those commandments because they are sin, sin as defined by the Law.
And I knew you saw them as sin, and I wanted you to see they are two of the Ten Commandments...commandments we must still keep.
And also, I understand the Law is very difficult for many people to understand, with all the doctrines we have to choose from.


How many times has the Holy Spirit convicted you of a sin, a sin not listed among the Ten Commandments?
How will you know it's a sin, if you only use the Ten Commandments as your guide?
Many of us, when convicted of a sin by the Holy Spirit, try to Categorize those sins. And if we can't put them under one of the Ten Commandments, we assume they must not be a sin.

A famous example of this was Bill Clinton...a Christian...who didn't believe his sexual act with his Monica.... was a sin, because in his mind.... it didn't fit under the Ten Commandments . Paul was addressing this confusion by listing those sins. The Law of Christ has expanded to more than just those Ten Commandments. The Law of Christ is put into our minds and written on our hearts...some of these Laws for which we are still convicted, are many of the Ten Commandments. Like the Two I mentioned.

Like I said earlier...Paul taught against the "Works" of the Law of Moses, those Laws which required the Jews to do something. The Ten Commandments do not require you to do anything...so these Laws are not the Law Paul taught against. Paul was simply listing sins, people may commit, but not believing they were sins, simply because they didn't fall under one of the Ten Commandments.
Obviously...they were just as confused then...as we are now.
The ten commandments require an act of will, a work of the flesh to obey. Some of the ten commandments will require some serious work from you. I will give you some examples.

Will you forsake the Sabbath day?

The Sabbath day requires food to be prepared on the day before the Sabbath day. Any activity requiring effort that would normally be done on the Sabbath day. Must be accomplished prior to the Sabbath day.

A second example would be the law against adultery. For the ten (nine) commandment fraternity. Any sexual sin generated by lust must be avoided at all costs. So obviously, your not going to a nudist colony, the beach, your not going to watch movies with sex scenes. That probably includes nearly every movie ever made.

Your not going to read newspapers or magazines, which often have scantly clad women in their adverts. Same goes for the internet.

In fact, you will be greatly restricted in what you can do and places you can go. because of this.

Your flesh loves the world, your flesh desires, even lusts, after everything the world offers. Unfortunately, sex is a big card in the things of the world.

You can't obey two of the commandments let alone ten out of ten.
 

Inquisitor

Active member
Mar 17, 2022
659
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Not of Faith...can you explain what you mean by that?
1 Thessalonians 5:16-22
Rejoice always, pray without ceasing, in everything give thanks; for this is the will of God for you in Christ Jesus. Do not quench the Spirit, do not utterly reject prophecies, but examine everything; hold firmly to that which is good, abstain from every form of evil.

Did you notice this single instruction in the verses above. This one instruction unravels what a life lived by faith really means.

"pray without ceasing"

It may take some time for Paul's instruction to sink in. But when you understand what Paul is saying, you will understand what a living, active faith, really is!

The Christian life is not an ethical or even a moral journey, unfortunately. The Christian life is a spiritual existence of constant prayer, love, and a deep, sound faith in Jesus Christ. Sound's fanatical, sounds extreme, you will even lose your life. You bet it's extreme.

To be focused on Jesus, twenty four seven, is what Paul was preaching.

I was devastated when I first understood that statement.

Anything, that is not paramount to a complete devotion to Jesus Christ is sin.

"pray without ceasing"

There is no other way to read that statement by Paul, it cannot be interpretated into a more palatable form. It can be ignored, even dismissed, but it still stands as a window, a clear insight. Into what faith in Jesus Christ actually meant in the first century.

Anything that is not of faith is sin.

Sin is everything else you may do, that is not the living, active, spirit filled life in Christ.
 
May 22, 2020
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...timed out...

They both interpret the Bible to say that homosexuality is ok...the pope says...."if God made you that way".
 

Everlasting-Grace

Well-known member
Dec 18, 2021
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If you die before second coming you not endure? Than the 12 apostle not endure
Dude. We are not in the great tribulation. Jesus words were written to those who are in the tribulation period. Not to the disciples.Not to people 100 years ago. To people in the tribulation.

If they endure (whoever) they will witness the return of Christ and as such be saved out of tribulation.

It can not mean spiritual life. As moses lifted the serpent so must the son of man be lifted. that whoever believes (places their faith in him ) WILL NEVER DIE and HAS ETERNAL LIFE

unless never does not mean never, and eternal does not mean eternal. Then salvation, once granted, can never be lost.

Why? Because its not based on our deeds or our works, but on the work of Christ on the cross.. Saying you cal lose salvation is an attack on the work and promise of Christ. I just pray people who are trying to earn salvation one day see this fact. And repent.
 
May 22, 2020
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Dude. We are not in the great tribulation. Jesus words were written to those who are in the tribulation period. Not to the disciples.Not to people 100 years ago. To people in the tribulation.

If they endure (whoever) they will witness the return of Christ and as such be saved out of tribulation.

It can not mean spiritual life. As moses lifted the serpent so must the son of man be lifted. that whoever believes (places their faith in him ) WILL NEVER DIE and HAS ETERNAL LIFE

unless never does not mean never, and eternal does not mean eternal. Then salvation, once granted, can never be lost.

Why? Because its not based on our deeds or our works, but on the work of Christ on the cross.. Saying you cal lose salvation is an attack on the work and promise of Christ. I just pray people who are trying to earn salvation one day see this fact. And repent.

Yes...saved.....when granted by God after His judgement which occurs after physical death.
 

Everlasting-Grace

Well-known member
Dec 18, 2021
1,108
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Yes...saved.....when granted by God after His judgement which occurs after physical death.
saved..

Paul said we HAVE BEEN SAVED.

Jesus said we HAVE ETERNAL LIFE

Scripture says we HAVE BEEN justified

It says we HAVE BEEN REDEEMED

It says we HAVE BEEN SEALED by the HS

stop trying to earn your salvation. You can;t
 
May 22, 2020
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timed out.....

Endure...as used in scriptures includes .....maintain, overcome, enable, assure, comply, abide, persist, etc.
 
Aug 3, 2019
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Seem to me he believe once people believe and deny Jesus not endure to the end still save only lose they reward, and I believe who ever deny Jesus in front of man Jesus will deny them in front of the father and that man not save
Plainly stated, since Matthew 24:12-13 KJV destroys OSAS, what we have Biblically is salvation that is dependent on our choice to either surrender and remained surrendered or not. Works have nothing to do with anything except to show as outward evidence the inward choice we have made, plain and simple.

The OSAS crowd cannot accept this because of their belief that no one can produce the outward evidence of a truly surrendered heart: obedience. Hence, the OSAS License to Sin.
 
Aug 3, 2019
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Incorrect, the only folk under the law were the Jews.

Romans 2:14
For when Gentiles who do not have the Law instinctively perform the requirements of the Law, these, though not having the Law.
Is Paul speaking of Gentiles who had never or had not yet converted to Judaism and became "spiritual Jews"? Sure he is!
You are not at liberty to do anything, other than, love your neighbor. Only through love is true obedience to Jesus achieved. Love fulfills the law. If you want to go out and hurt people like widows and orphans, feel free, because you threw the law in the bin. The Jews themselves claim it is blasphemy for a Gentile to obey the Sabbath, ask them yourself.
If I am not at liberty to do anything, then I am not at liberty to break the Ten Commandments, including the Sabbath. If salvation in fact grants me liberty ("license") to break the Ten Commandments, it's exactly what I've been saying it is: a OSAS License to Sin.
 
Aug 3, 2019
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Your Bible and my Bible are written differently.

Romans 13:10
Love does no wrong to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfillment of the Law. (NASB)

Your Bible states.

"love is the fulfilling of the law" (KJV)

See how the two translations above are different. Your under the law and I am not under the law, purely derived from which translation you select.

LOVE DOES NO WRONG TO A NEIGHBOR!

How can love commit a sin?
The use of "fulfilling" and "fulfillment" doesn't change the sentiment - there is a law to be fulfilled by Christians and that is the Ten Commandments, which first four we will fulfill if we love God, and the last six we will fulfill if we love our neighbor. If we love God, we'll keep the first four, and if we love our neighbor, the last six.

Jesus said He didn't come to destroy the law, but fulfill, or "to keep" it, not do away with it. Otherwise, we distort Jesus' words into perhaps one of the most ridiculous statements there could ever by: "Think not I am come to destroy the law and the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to do away with". Makes Jesus as confused as the most confused individual on the planet: a white Rastafarian. ;)
 
Aug 3, 2019
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Negative, the Catholics placed the emphasis on the ten commandments. They called it moral law, you belong to a daughter church because you claim exactly the same thing.

1 John specifies the commandments and is not referring to the ten commandments.

1 John 3:23-24
This is His commandment, that we believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, just as He commanded us. The one who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. We know by this that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.

1 John 4:7-8
Beloved, let us love one another, for love is from God; and everyone who loves is born of God and knows God. The one who does not love does not know God, for God is love.

Read John's first letter properly and don't cherry-pick verses.
You do realize the Catholics CHANGED the Ten Commandments, right? That upon which they place emphasis are "the doctrines of men", the teaching of which which Jesus called "vain worship".

Are you aware they make it their boast that it is THEY who changed Sabbath from the 7th day to the 1st day, and mock "Protestants" who claim to go by the Bible only, yet can't find a shred of evidence that God changed the day?

www.romeschallenge.com

All honest scholars admit Sunday keeping is TRADITION, not Scripture, as can be seen in all the writings of the founders of the major Christian denominations. Jesus said we "make the law of God of none effect by YOUR tradition". That's why I PLACE MY EMPHASIS on Sabbath, because it's under attack either deliberately or ignorantly by those who claim to go by the Bible but are following tradition - and when any Biblical truth is under attack, Jesus is under attack because He is the "Word of God".