Sovereign?

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
6,466
605
113
#1
I’m curious how people define the word sovereign. For me, when someone uses the word sovereign, that’s usually an indicator that they are a Calvinist. Just to note, the word sovereign is not a biblical word.

How do you define the word sovereign?
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
10,532
5,093
113
#2
As it's not a biblical word, I look to its general use in English. It means (as a noun) king or queen, as in a single person who reigns over a defined realm. As an adjective, in means sole ruler or independent (as in the sovereign state of Canada).

I have never thought that its use suggests any particular theological bent, because it is not used exclusively (or even primarily) by Christians.
 

Bingo

Well-known member
Feb 9, 2019
1,707
1,270
113
#3
"Everything to do with Power."
~Thought for this page~
tumblr_n9i39d86rG1sdg0pko4_400.gif
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
9,208
2,933
113
#4
How do you define the word sovereign?
Rather than define the word, we can simply look at what the Bible says about God's sovereignty.

Psalm 47:2 -- For the LORD most high is terrible; he is a great King over all the earth.

Psalm 47:7,8 -- For God is the King of all the earth: sing ye praises with understanding. God reigneth over the heathen: God sitteth upon the throne of his holiness.

Psalm 22:28 -- For the Kingdom is the LORD'S: and he is the Governor among the nations.


Calvinism has distorted God's sovereignty in TWO ways:

(1) They claim that God has decreed everything which comes to pass (including all the sin, evil, and wickedness on earth) WHICH IS A LIE. They even claim that God's planned for Adam to disobey Him.

(2) They have made the Gospel of Grace into the Gospel of Sovereignty. WHICH IS ANOTHER LIE. You will not find any reference to sovereignty when it comes to the Gospel. But GRACE AND TRUTH came by Jesus Christ.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
6,466
605
113
#5
Rather than define the word, we can simply look at what the Bible says about God's sovereignty.

Psalm 47:2 -- For the LORD most high is terrible; he is a great King over all the earth.

Psalm 47:7,8 -- For God is the King of all the earth: sing ye praises with understanding. God reigneth over the heathen: God sitteth upon the throne of his holiness.

Psalm 22:28 -- For the Kingdom is the LORD'S: and he is the Governor among the nations.

Calvinism has distorted God's sovereignty in TWO ways:

(1) They claim that God has decreed everything which comes to pass (including all the sin, evil, and wickedness on earth) WHICH IS A LIE. They even claim that God's planned for Adam to disobey Him.

(2) They have made the Gospel of Grace into the Gospel of Sovereignty. WHICH IS ANOTHER LIE. You will not find any reference to sovereignty when it comes to the Gospel. But GRACE AND TRUTH came by Jesus Christ.
A lot of the Psalms are prophetic in nature concerning the Lord’s second coming. Do you think the verses you stated could be as such?

Is the Lord ruling sovereign right now?
 

Melach

Well-known member
Mar 28, 2019
972
635
93
#6
A lot of the Psalms are prophetic in nature concerning the Lord’s second coming. Do you think the verses you stated could be as such?

Is the Lord ruling sovereign right now?
yes but just because someone is sovereign doesnt mean they have to do it like this or like that. God is sovereign and can destroy the devil right now if He wanted to, but He just chooses not to, for reasons i dont understand. but Lord knows best.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
9,208
2,933
113
#7
Is the Lord ruling sovereign right now?
You are correct. Many Psalms speak of God and Christ's future sovereignty. But what I quoted is in the present tense, and God is indeed sovereign today.

However He has made allowance for sin and evil on this earth for a season (a thousand years being as one day in His sight), while He has also provided the Gospel of Grace so that none would go to Hell. He has also given the Church the mandate and the responsibility to take the Gospel into all the world and preach it to every creature.

But we know that the wrath of God against the unbelieving and the ungodly is not too far off, following which Christ will literally establish the physical, visible, tangible, and universal Kingdom of God on earth. First for one thousand years, and then for eternity.

I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of Man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of Days, and they brought Him near before Him. And there was given Him dominion, and glory, and a Kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve Him: His dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and His Kingdom that which shall not be destroyed. (Daniel 7:13,14)
 

ForestGreenCook

Well-known member
Jul 8, 2018
2,634
296
83
#8
As it's not a biblical word, I look to its general use in English. It means (as a noun) king or queen, as in a single person who reigns over a defined realm. As an adjective, in means sole ruler or independent (as in the sovereign state of Canada).

I have never thought that its use suggests any particular theological bent, because it is not used exclusively (or even primarily) by Christians.
Being sovereign in what you accomplish, is the fact that you had no outside help from any source.
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
10,532
5,093
113
#9
Being sovereign in what you accomplish, is the fact that you had no outside help from any source.
While perhaps technically correct, that is not a common usage of the term.