Support Israel? Yes or No? And Why?

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
7,708
2,496
113
I did not say the fall of the temple was the tribulation period. It was only within the series of events to come. We are on a timeline where parts have already occurred.
I disagree, no part of the great tribulation as seen in Matthew Chapter 24 or Luke Chapter 21 has taken place, a future 3.5 year event unfulfilled

This future 3.5 year tribulation will start when the "Future" antichrist is revealed and takes his seat in Jerusalem
 
Oct 23, 2020
971
164
43
I disagree, no part of the great tribulation as seen in Matthew Chapter 24 or Luke Chapter 21 has taken place, a future 3.5 year event unfulfilled

This future 3.5 year tribulation will start when the "Future" antichrist is revealed and takes his seat in Jerusalem
Makes zero sense. Why would Jesus warn his disciples about something 2000 years away.
You make so little sense 7t7
 

kaylagrl

Senior Member
Oct 18, 2014
17,263
4,742
113
Once Again :)

Your claims of Antisemitism are "False" (n) CNN, MSNBC, fake news in a false narrative

My Lord Jesus Christ and his twelve apostles were Jews, and their names are written in the foundations of New Jerusalem forever, and you call me Antisemitic, please!
And once again, I'm talking about where this started. Before telephone, before tv, before computer. I'm talking about Martin Luther and the church fathers. Yes, your beliefs are anti- Semitic.



The false teachings you promote in two peoples of God, fleshly Jews (Israel), and the (Church) known as Zionism's (Dual Covenant Theology) is found no place in scripture
Israel Is The Church, Children Of The Promised Seed

Jesus Is The Lord!

Jesus Christ fulfilled the promises and covenant made to Abraham, the Church is the Israel of God, children of the promised seed, it's that simple :)
No, it is simple, but not the way you are twisting it. The church does not replace Israel!!

Genesis 15:18
On that day the Lord made a covenant with Abram, saying,
“To your descendants I have given this land,

From the river of Egypt as far as the great river, the river Euphrates

Psalm 105:5-11

He has remembered His covenant forever,
The word which He commanded to a thousand generations,
The covenant which He made with Abraham,
And His oath to Isaac.
Then He confirmed it to Jacob for a statute,
To Israel as an everlasting covenant,
Saying, “To you I will give the land of Canaan
As the portion of your inheritance,”


Genesis 12:1-3

Now the Lord said to Abram,
“Go forth from your country,
And from your relatives
And from your father’s house,
To the land which I will show you;
And I will make you a great nation,
And I will bless you,
And make your name great;
And so you shall be a blessing;
And I will bless those who bless you,
And the one who curses you I will curse.
And in you all the families of the earth will be blessed.”




Genesis 35:10-12

God said to him,
“Your name is Jacob;
You shall no longer be called Jacob,
But Israel shall be your name.”
Thus He called him Israel. God also said to him,
“I am God Almighty;
Be fruitful and multiply;
A nation and a company of nations shall come from you,
And kings shall come forth from you.

“The land which I gave to Abraham and Isaac,
I will give it to you,
And I will give the land to your descendants after you.”



Joshua 1:2-6
“Moses My servant is dead; now therefore arise, cross this Jordan, you and all this people, to the land which I am giving to them, to the sons of Israel. Every place on which the sole of your foot treads, I have given it to you, just as I spoke to Moses.


Be strong and courageous, for you shall give this people possession of the land which I swore to their fathers to give them.


Joshua 21:43-45

Not one of the good promises which the Lord had made to the house of Israel failed; all came to pass.


1 Chronicles 16:15-18

Remember His covenant forever,
The word which He commanded to a thousand generations,
The covenant which He made with Abraham,
And His oath to Isaac.
He also confirmed it to Jacob for a statute,

To Israel as an everlasting covenant,
Saying, “To you I will give the land of Canaan,
As the portion of your inheritance.”


Ezekiel 37:21-25

Say to them, ‘Thus says the Lord God, “Behold, I will take the sons of Israel from among the nations where they have gone, and I will gather them from every side and bring them into their own land; and I will make them one nation in the land, on the mountains of Israel; and one king will be king for all of them; and they will no longer be two nations and no longer be divided into two kingdoms. They will no longer defile themselves with their idols, or with their detestable things, or with any of their transgressions; but I will deliver them from all their dwelling places in which they have sinned, and will cleanse them. And they will be My people, and I will be their God.



Amos 9:14

“Also I will restore the captivity of My people Israel,
And they will rebuild the ruined cities and live in them;
They will also plant vineyards and drink their wine,
And make gardens and eat their fruit.



Hebrews 11:8-10
By faith Abraham, when he was called, obeyed by going out to a place which he was to receive for an inheritance; and he went out, not knowing where he was going. By faith he lived as an alien in the land of promise, as in a foreign land, dwelling in tents with Isaac and Jacob, fellow heirs of the same promise; for he was looking for the city which has foundations, whose architect and builder is God.




Land, seed blessing promise, unconditional and everlasting. Right there in the Word. Yes, your belief is anti Semitic. I hope one day your eyes will be opened to the truth.
 
Oct 23, 2020
971
164
43
I disagree, no part of the great tribulation as seen in Matthew Chapter 24 or Luke Chapter 21 has taken place, a future 3.5 year event unfulfilled

This future 3.5 year tribulation will start when the "Future" antichrist is revealed and takes his seat in Jerusalem
So are you saying that John The Baptist was a false prophet (cough, cough)
 

kaylagrl

Senior Member
Oct 18, 2014
17,263
4,742
113
Your knowledge is worldly secular.
Please go talk about something you know about. You have zero understanding here. I have posted verse after verse. smh


Can you remember Job's story in OT?
Job encountered the most intolerable thing for ordinary people. If the Rockets attacked Job's family, how would Job face it ?
Job only looked up to God. Job did not even revile his enemies, let alone eye for eye and tooth for tooth killing for killing.
Again, you have no clue what you're talking about. What about Jericho? What David do to the giant/ Philistines? Moses in Egypt? Battle of Jericho? What of Joshua? All of these people and places were about war and defending the Israelites. God sent them into battle. Israel today has a right to defend their country, period.



We are not here to anti-Jews,
We just want Israel to understand the truth, the truth from the God of Israel.
No, Israel has a right to a homeland the same as you do. They are defending their people. You totally have no clue what is being discussed and are misusing the Bible to make points that have nothing to do with the subject at hand.
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
7,708
2,496
113
Makes zero sense. Why would Jesus warn his disciples about something 2000 years away.
You make so little sense 7t7
Makes Zero Sense For A Person To Falsely Believe And Teach, Jesus Christ Returned Immediately After A Great Tribulation In 70AD

As clearly taught by the (Time Stamp)

Daniel's Abomination seen in verse 15 below "Starts" the great tribulation in verse 21, as the instruction to flee Jerusalem is given, the future Antichrist takes his seat, as the time of the gentiles "Starts"

Matthew 24:29-31 below clearly teaches immediately after the tribulation of those days the second coming takes place

You cant have a tribulation in 70AD, and immediately after a 70AD tribulation a second coming of Jesus Christ in the clouds of heaven, all tied together by the (Time Stamp)

The Abomination of Desolation, The Great Tribulation, And The Second Coming are "Future" events unfulfilled

Matthew 24:15-21 & 29-31KJV
15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:)
16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:
17 Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house:
18 Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes.
19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!
20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:
21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
 

Roughsoul1991

Senior Member
Sep 17, 2016
6,765
3,350
113
I disagree, no part of the great tribulation as seen in Matthew Chapter 24 or Luke Chapter 21 has taken place, a future 3.5 year event unfulfilled

This future 3.5 year tribulation will start when the "Future" antichrist is revealed and takes his seat in Jerusalem
Huh? Agree. Those scriptures are prophecy of future events that did occur in A.D. 70 it is in other passages where we learn of a tribulation period that is still to come.

This future 3.5 year tribulation will start when the "Future" antichrist is revealed and takes his seat in Jerusalem
The antichrist will be revealed at the start of the 7 year tribulation as he will make a covenant with the people of Israel.
 

Roughsoul1991

Senior Member
Sep 17, 2016
6,765
3,350
113
Makes Zero Sense For A Person To Falsely Believe And Teach, Jesus Christ Returned Immediately After A Great Tribulation In 70AD

As clearly taught by the (Time Stamp)

Daniel's Abomination seen in verse 15 below "Starts" the great tribulation in verse 21, as the instruction to flee Jerusalem is given, the future Antichrist takes his seat, as the time of the gentiles "Starts"

Matthew 24:29-31 below clearly teaches immediately after the tribulation of those days the second coming takes place

You cant have a tribulation in 70AD, and immediately after a 70AD tribulation a second coming of Jesus Christ in the clouds of heaven, all tied together by the (Time Stamp)

The Abomination of Desolation, The Great Tribulation, And The Second Coming are "Future" events unfulfilled

Matthew 24:15-21 & 29-31KJV
15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:)
16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:
17 Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house:
18 Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes.
19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!
20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:
21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
You are confused. The ad 70 event was not the tribulation in scripture.
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
7,708
2,496
113
And once again, I'm talking about where this started. Before telephone, before tv, before computer. I'm talking about Martin Luther and the church fathers. Yes, your beliefs are anti- Semitic.





No, it is simple, but not the way you are twisting it. The church does not replace Israel!!

Genesis 15:18
On that day the Lord made a covenant with Abram, saying,
“To your descendants I have given this land,

From the river of Egypt as far as the great river, the river Euphrates

Psalm 105:5-11

He has remembered His covenant forever,
The word which He commanded to a thousand generations,
The covenant which He made with Abraham,
And His oath to Isaac.
Then He confirmed it to Jacob for a statute,
To Israel as an everlasting covenant,
Saying, “To you I will give the land of Canaan
As the portion of your inheritance,”


Genesis 12:1-3

Now the Lord said to Abram,
“Go forth from your country,
And from your relatives
And from your father’s house,
To the land which I will show you;
And I will make you a great nation,
And I will bless you,
And make your name great;
And so you shall be a blessing;
And I will bless those who bless you,
And the one who curses you I will curse.
And in you all the families of the earth will be blessed.”




Genesis 35:10-12

God said to him,
“Your name is Jacob;
You shall no longer be called Jacob,
But Israel shall be your name.”
Thus He called him Israel. God also said to him,
“I am God Almighty;
Be fruitful and multiply;
A nation and a company of nations shall come from you,
And kings shall come forth from you.

“The land which I gave to Abraham and Isaac,
I will give it to you,
And I will give the land to your descendants after you.”



Joshua 1:2-6
“Moses My servant is dead; now therefore arise, cross this Jordan, you and all this people, to the land which I am giving to them, to the sons of Israel. Every place on which the sole of your foot treads, I have given it to you, just as I spoke to Moses.


Be strong and courageous, for you shall give this people possession of the land which I swore to their fathers to give them.


Joshua 21:43-45

Not one of the good promises which the Lord had made to the house of Israel failed; all came to pass.


1 Chronicles 16:15-18

Remember His covenant forever,
The word which He commanded to a thousand generations,
The covenant which He made with Abraham,
And His oath to Isaac.
He also confirmed it to Jacob for a statute,

To Israel as an everlasting covenant,
Saying, “To you I will give the land of Canaan,
As the portion of your inheritance.”


Ezekiel 37:21-25

Say to them, ‘Thus says the Lord God, “Behold, I will take the sons of Israel from among the nations where they have gone, and I will gather them from every side and bring them into their own land; and I will make them one nation in the land, on the mountains of Israel; and one king will be king for all of them; and they will no longer be two nations and no longer be divided into two kingdoms. They will no longer defile themselves with their idols, or with their detestable things, or with any of their transgressions; but I will deliver them from all their dwelling places in which they have sinned, and will cleanse them. And they will be My people, and I will be their God.


Amos 9:14

“Also I will restore the captivity of My people Israel,
And they will rebuild the ruined cities and live in them;
They will also plant vineyards and drink their wine,
And make gardens and eat their fruit.



Hebrews 11:8-10
By faith Abraham, when he was called, obeyed by going out to a place which he was to receive for an inheritance; and he went out, not knowing where he was going. By faith he lived as an alien in the land of promise, as in a foreign land, dwelling in tents with Isaac and Jacob, fellow heirs of the same promise; for he was looking for the city which has foundations, whose architect and builder is God.




Land, seed blessing promise, unconditional and everlasting. Right there in the Word. Yes, your belief is anti Semitic. I hope one day your eyes will be opened to the truth.
You continue to "Falsely" claim that Gods words of truth beliw are Antisemetic, I disagree with your Christian Zionism, God has not chosen Jews based upon their race or ethnic heritage

Israel Is The Church, Children Of The Promised Seed

Jesus Is The Lord!

Jesus Christ fulfilled the promises and covenant made to Abraham, the Church is the Israel of God, children of the promised seed, it's that simple :)

The promises made to Abraham have been fulfilled in Jesus Christ :)

Jesus Christ is the promised seed, and his children are the Church

Galatians 3:16-29KJV
16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.
17 And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.
18 For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.
19 Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.
20 Now a mediator is not a mediator of one, but God is one.
21 Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.
22 But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.
23 But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.
24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

(Two Israel's Are Seen Below)

(1) Israel The Church, Children Of The Promised Seed

(2) National Ethnic Israel

The Church is the Israel of God, children of the promised seed :)

They which are the children of the flesh (Jews) these are not the children of God

Romans 9:6-8KJV
6 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all (1)Israel, which are of (2)Israel:
7 Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.
8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
7,708
2,496
113
So are you saying that John The Baptist was a false prophet (cough, cough)
I have no idea what you claim John The Baptist did or said, riddles and games

Make a claim, support it with scripture, not riddles and games
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
7,708
2,496
113
You are confused. The ad 70 event was not the tribulation in scripture.
I'm not confused whatsoever, you claimed parts of the great tribulation have been fulfilled as seen below in your quote

Quote Roughsoul post #1320

"I did not say the fall of the temple was the tribulation period. It was only within the series of events to come. We are on a timeline where parts have already occurred."
 
Oct 23, 2020
971
164
43
I have no idea what you claim John The Baptist did or said, riddles and games

Make a claim, support it with scripture, not riddles and games
Outrageous. We all spend our time carefully teaching you with scripture and it flies over your head
like a beater at a pheasant shoot. Ok. Again. For those without milk teeth

When John The Baptist told that generation to flee from the wrath to come - was he lying?
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
7,708
2,496
113
Outrageous. We all spend our time carefully teaching you with scripture and it flies over your head
like a beater at a pheasant shoot. Ok. Again. For those without milk teeth

When John The Baptist told that generation to flee from the wrath to come - was he lying?
Post your scripture, when you make a claim

John's preaching of escaping Gods wrath was through Jesus Christ period!

You response in the basic teaching of John is a distraction
 

soberxp

Senior Member
May 3, 2018
1,050
161
63
Please go talk about something you know about. You have zero understanding here. I have posted verse after verse. smh




Again, you have no clue what you're talking about. What about Jericho? What David do to the giant/ Philistines? Moses in Egypt? Battle of Jericho? What of Joshua? All of these people and places were about war and defending the Israelites. God sent them into battle. Israel today has a right to defend their country, period.





No, Israel has a right to a homeland the same as you do. They are defending their people. You totally have no clue what is being discussed and are misusing the Bible to make points that have nothing to do with the subject at hand.
DO you think you better than Job ? fake
 
Oct 23, 2020
971
164
43
Post your scripture, when you make a claim

John's preaching of escaping Gods wrath was through Jesus Christ period!

You response in the basic teaching of John is a distraction
Read It Again, Jerusalem and the Jews are destined for Gods vengeance and wrath, when the future Antichrist takes his seat in Jerusalem
Ok - as long as we are all the same page, that's fine. So what you are now saying is that God
is in a state of total wrath with the Jews for 2000 years or so. The wrath began in the first Century, and
is ongoing and culminates in a future event.

It is a bit strange that John would tell the Pharisees to run away from something 2000 years in the future, but I am sure you will have a work around.

Again, if Israel is now out of covenant, and served its purpose 2000 years ago, as you claim, why is God still foaming at the mouth and imposing ongoing wrath. You are like gruyere cheese - full of holes.
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
7,708
2,496
113
Ok - as long as we are all the same page, that's fine. So what you are now saying is that God
is in a state of total wrath with the Jews for 2000 years or so. The wrath began in the first Century, and
is ongoing and culminates in a future event.

It is a bit strange that John would tell the Pharisees to run away from something 2000 years in the future, but I am sure you will have a work around.

Again, if Israel is now out of covenant, and served its purpose 2000 years ago, as you claim, why is God still foaming at the mouth and imposing ongoing wrath. You are like gruyere cheese - full of holes.
Yes the time of the gentiles to be fulfilled in Jerusalem is a future event, a "Basic" teaching within eschatology

You have taken something that is elementary and foundational in eschatology, and treat it as if it doesn't exist

Yes Jerusalem will be trodden down in the future for 3.5 years, the entire time of the future great tribulation

Luke 21:24KJV
24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.

Revelation 11:2KJV
2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.
 
Oct 23, 2020
971
164
43
Yes the time of the gentiles to be fulfilled in Jerusalem is a future event, a "Basic" teaching within eschatology

You have taken something that is elementary and foundational in eschatology, and treat it as if it doesn't exist

Yes Jerusalem will be trodden down in the future for 3.5 years, the entire time of the future great tribulation

Luke 21:24KJV
24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.

Revelation 11:2KJV
2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.
It exists.
I just find it odd that God has completely thrown away the Jews, except that everything in prophecy for the last two thousand years revolves around them. You're not getting any cognitive dissonance?
 

kaylagrl

Senior Member
Oct 18, 2014
17,263
4,742
113
DO you think you better than Job ? fake

Smh you're way out in left field. Job has no bearing on this. Use David, or Moses, Job wasn't defending anyone. He has nothing to do with this. You totally don't understand the conversation here.
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
7,708
2,496
113
It exists.
I just find it odd that God has completely thrown away the Jews, except that everything in prophecy for the last two thousand years revolves around them.
More like the focal point of prophecy surrounds Jerusalem, and the Jews are its residents

You dont want to let go of that Christian Zionist dream, that all ethnic Jews will be saved, based upon their race and ethnic heritage, the ole two peoples of God, Jews/Church
 

kaylagrl

Senior Member
Oct 18, 2014
17,263
4,742
113
It exists.
I just find it odd that God has completely thrown away the Jews, except that everything in prophecy for the last two thousand years revolves around them. You're not getting any cognitive dissonance?
The church gets all the blessing, Jews get all the curses. Then people say it's not anti -Semitic.