THE BEMA SEAT....YET ANOTHER PRETRIB RAPTURE DYNAMIC

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Absolutely

Well-known member
Jul 23, 2018
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#1
Perry Stone ,who has friends in several end times doctrine camps ,brings out the component of the bema seat contrasting it in other views.

 

Absolutely

Well-known member
Jul 23, 2018
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#2
Interesting the verses perry brings out.

I thought of the "works vs grace" debaters.
Jesus rewards works at the bema seat.
In heaven.
Not earth
 
Mar 28, 2016
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#3
Perry Stone ,who has friends in several end times doctrine camps ,brings out the component of the bema seat contrasting it in other views.

We are in the tribulation. It began when Jesus said it is finished
 

Lucy-Pevensie

Senior Member
Dec 20, 2017
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#4
We are in the tribulation. It began when Jesus said it is finished
Interesting. Most seem to think the tribulation is stuffed completely into a final & literal 7 years. What are your thoughts on this?
 

Absolutely

Well-known member
Jul 23, 2018
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#5
Interesting. Most seem to think the tribulation is stuffed completely into a final & literal 7 years. What are your thoughts on this?
From what I have studied,the rapture is the gathering of the bride.
It is vividly portrayed in the book of Ruth as well as mat 25 the gathering of the bride.
Even the betrothal is illustrated at he last supper.
note it is canonized in the bible that the first miracle by Jesus is at a wedding. IOW the first miracle had to be a wedding type miracle. Note the declaration TO the groom ",,, but you saved the best wine for last"
The last groups to leave during the trib is in rev 14. Both groups are Jews and they come to the wedding last.the second group is classified as ripe harvest (grapes). A final harvest is made by an agel unto wrath and torment. (possibly jews that took the mark.)
that is my prism for all end times dynamics.( Heavy on the bride / groom dynamic.)

The trib is "jacobs trouble"
God shifts his focus on the covenant people during the trib.

Perry stone brings out the rewards we receive in heaven during the trib period. The bema seat.
 
Mar 28, 2016
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#6
No condemnation in those who have been given a new spirit by which they then can believe God not seen . No double jeopardy or retrial .That judgment was set from the foundation of the world. Names written in the Lambs book of eternal life. God did not sent his Son to judge evaluate sin. But came to save mankind all the way to the end. The judgement is already made.
We do not seek for signs a reward. no such thing as a sign gift. Spiritual not seen eternal gifts yes.

Those whose names are not written. They are already working out that judgment according to the letter of the law.... experiencing that judgment a dying corrupted creation. (death) The wrath of God being reveled from heaven

John 3:17-18-17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is "condemned already", because "he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God".

Faith or no faith. . no limbo

Romans 14:10 But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ.

In Christ the believer have stood.

All of the elect stand before the judgment seat of Christ, "the anointing Spirt of God" . Not the judgment seat of mankind. . . The letter of the law( death)

The letter of the law death will be cast into the fiery judgment of God never to rise and condemn to death another creation..

The reward of God working in us to both will and do his good pleasure as Emanuel is the same for every believers one penny. .

For it is
God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure. Do all things without murmurings and disputing's: philipians2:13-13

There is no stacking of rewards in some mysterious hall of fame. One penny is the agreed amount. Some murmured and grumbled like in the verse above.

Mathew 20: 1-14 For the kingdom of heaven is like unto a man that is an householder, which went out early in the morning to hire labourers into his vineyard. And when he had agreed with the labourers for a penny a day, he sent them into his vineyard.And he went out about the third hour, and saw others standing idle in the marketplace, And said unto them; Go ye also into the vineyard, and whatsoever is right I will give you. And they went their way. Again he went out about the sixth and ninth hour, and did likewise.And about the eleventh hour he went out, and found others standing idle, and saith unto them, Why stand ye here all the day idle? They say unto him, Because no man hath hired us. He saith unto them, Go ye also into the vineyard; and whatsoever is right, that shall ye receive.So when even was come, the lord of the vineyard saith unto his steward, Call the labourers, and give them their hire, beginning from the last unto the first.And when they came that were hired about the eleventh hour, they received every man a penny. But when the first came, they supposed that they should have received more; and they likewise received every man a penny. And when they had received it, they murmured against the goodman of the house, Saying, These last have wrought but one hour, and thou hast made them equal unto us, which have borne the burden and heat of the day. But he answered one of them, and said, Friend, I do thee no wrong: didst not thou agree with me for a penny? Take that thine is, and go thy way: I will give unto this last, even as unto thee.
 

Absolutely

Well-known member
Jul 23, 2018
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#7
remember Jesus meets John on earth is Glory and awesomeness .
He gives John the messages to the 7 churches while they bth are on earth.

Then ...BOOM... John is in heaven before the throne and weeps because no MAN was found to open the seals.
NO MAN WAS FOUND.

But then Jesus arrives as the kinsman redeemer.

Only a man could open the seals.

Only a KINS-MAN ...one like man but no,a God - Man.

Ruth illustrates rev 5. The kinsman redeemer.
 
Mar 28, 2016
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#8
Interesting. Most seem to think the tribulation is stuffed completely into a final & literal 7 years. What are your thoughts on this?
Thanks for the reply.

My thoughts are the great tribulation began at the time of reformation. Mankind lost a face or image that they could connect faith to. The foundation of pagan king as outward representatives seen with the eye had come to a end. (the time of reformation.) It continues to reform today. Many looking to put a image or face on the Holy thing of God as the unseen, eternal place of faith. the place of the antichrists, many a legion.

Matthew 24:21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

Mathew seems to be companion to the unseen understanding of Dan 12

Daniel 12 King James Version (KJV) And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book. And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, (the graves were opened as the glory that followed . . " it is finished"1 Peter 1:11) some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt. And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
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#9
My thoughts are the great tribulation began at the time of reformation.
How could the great tribulation coincide with the Reformation when that was the time when the authority of Scripture was being re-instituted, and the stars did not fall from heaven shortly afterwards? Neither did the sun and moon become black.
 

TheDivineWatermark

Well-known member
Aug 3, 2018
5,634
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#10
is in heaven before the throne and weeps because no MAN was found to open the seals.
NO MAN WAS FOUND.
I have no idea what P Stone says in his video (I've not seen it), I just wanted to say that I'm also always pointing out the "was found" wording of Rev5:4 as evidence that a "searching judgment" has already taken place... (besides the fact that in 5:9 the manuscript evidence shows the 24 elders saying "hath redeemed US"... and that Paul has spoken of the "stephanos/crown" he would receive "IN THAT DAY" [2Tim4:8]--the 24 elders are wearing "stephanon/crowns")… I agree this means "the BEMA of Christ" (which is only for "the Church which is His body") has already taken place.
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
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#11
Jesus rewards works at the bema seat.
Works wrought by God...John 3:21 (KJV) But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.

for it is God who works in you both to will and to do for His good pleasure. Philippians 2:13
 

JaumeJ

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2011
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#13
As regarding the greatest tribulation ever, it is understood to be seven years. Now, I realize to our Father a day is as a thousand years and a thousand years is as a dy when it is passed, but this is not what the Great Tribulation is following

We have not yet experienced the beginning but I believe we are on the very brink of it. I may not be here for it, but many folks here will be. God bless all with strength and determination to endure to the end...
 

Journeyman

Well-known member
Jan 10, 2019
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#15
The judgement seat of Christ is the judgement seat of God. Both saved and unsaved face him,

Knowing, therefore, the terror of the Lord, we persuade men 2Cor.5:11
 

JaumeJ

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2011
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#16
If all who read Revelation would pay special attention to Daniel also, perhaps more would understand that tyhere will be belivers on earth in this age to the end of the Great Tribulation……..They will be scattered but they will help many to the truth. READ please.
 
Mar 28, 2016
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#17
How could the great tribulation coincide with the Reformation when that was the time when the authority of Scripture was being re-instituted, and the stars did not fall from heaven shortly afterwards? Neither did the sun and moon become black.
I would offer. The pivoting point is measured by the time of reformation (beginning the last days all of them) .Many dismiss the working of the reformation because it takes away from putting faith in the flesh of a Jew. ( walking by sight) To them its like the reformation never came. They still cry out to lifeless stones in a temple that stood in the holy unseen place of God's glory, the abomination of desolation spoken of in Daniel 12. The time of Jacob trouble

Matthew 24:21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be

"To this time" above marks the time of refomation and it shows it will continue to the end the last day .

The great tribulation. No outward face to connect to a inward faith it began the final period "last days" .A unknown signified by the word thousand years . There is no need for the day and the hour or even the century needed to those who walk by faith. No sign as a wonder is given. God does not number days . But a sign of times. . things going on as in the days of Noah usual stuff under the Sun .


Mathew 24: 29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

It the end of time, No Sun and Moon in the new order .No more night. The glory of God will be the light as it was the first three days.

Until God saw pride in the heart of Lucifer the glory of God departed. . Day four he turned on the natural or created using the Sun and the moon. as temporal time keepers.

Mathew 24:15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:)

.Luke 10 would seem to inform us when Jesus did say "it is finished" It exposed the abomination of desolation. . a temple made with human hands a Pagan foundation standing in the place of faith. . The glory of God's living abiding word.

It was then that Satan fell and no longer could enter the presence of God with the angels of truth . The gospel key now in the hands of God like a chain binds the father lies with the gospel


Luke 10:17-19 King James Version (KJV) And the seventy returned again with joy, saying, Lord, even the devils are subject unto us through thy name. And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven. Behold, I give unto you power to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy: and nothing shall by any means hurt you.

The power of the gospel . . . all things written in the law and prophets.
 
Mar 28, 2016
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#18
You should be glad, that we are not. In tribulation you will find no christian.
According to my understanding that would be the hope of those who literalize the signified understanding of a "thousand years". It is used 9 times in the bible to signify a unknown .The faith principle.

Some have as it seems turned it into a sign and wonder. Like the faithless Jew. . "what miracle will you show us so the we can believe".

Jesus referred to as a evil generation (no faith).Natural unconverted mankind.
 

Absolutely

Well-known member
Jul 23, 2018
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#19
I have no idea what P Stone says in his video (I've not seen it), I just wanted to say that I'm also always pointing out the "was found" wording of Rev5:4 as evidence that a "searching judgment" has already taken place... (besides the fact that in 5:9 the manuscript evidence shows the 24 elders saying "hath redeemed US"... and that Paul has spoken of the "stephanos/crown" he would receive "IN THAT DAY" [2Tim4:8]--the 24 elders are wearing "stephanon/crowns")… I agree this means "the BEMA of Christ" (which is only for "the Church which is His body") has already taken place.
Hmmmm
I never thought of that.
Thank you
 

Absolutely

Well-known member
Jul 23, 2018
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#20
Works wrought by God...John 3:21 (KJV) But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.

for it is God who works in you both to will and to do for His good pleasure. Philippians 2:13
It would be worth 15 minutes of your time to see other verses that show the works rewarded at the bema seat.
Perry does an excellent job as always.

Of course the works are Christ based or kingdom based.

Even the overcomers recieve crowns.
Evangelism works earns crowns.
Etc