The Falling Away - pre-trib rapture or ???

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Absolutely

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NO - there is only one Harvest = "Do you not say, ‘There are still four months and then comes the harvest’? Behold, I say to you, lift up your eyes and look at the fields, for they are already white for harvest." John 4:35

pre-trib is built upon many errors including "multiple harvests" = the LORD destroyed that myth, error and lie.

There is only One Harvest of Souls which began with His Resurection and continues unto His Coming.

The completion of this One Harvest continues unto Rev 19 & 20
Good verse
The rest...pure debunked baloney
 

Absolutely

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It does not occur until Rev 19& 20 nd it is IMPOSSIBLE for it to occur before then because GOD said so in chapters 6, 7, 14
So 1thes 4 fits that how?

I cant wait to see the answer.

Reconcile it for us.
Show us the dead meeting Jesus in the air a day after the second coming.
 

Absolutely

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Rev 20.

I need you to show me how the first resurrection as you call it is a day after the second coming with the dead in christ NOT MEETING Jesus in the air.
^^^^^^^^waiting for this^^^^^^^^
 

DavidTree

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Good verse
The rest...pure debunked baloney
Nope. It establishes it firmly.

And a third angel followed them, calling out in a loud voice, “If anyone worships the beast and its image, and receives its mark on his forehead or on his hand, 10he too will drink the wine of God’s anger, poured undiluted into the cup of His wrath. And he will be tormented in fire and sulfur in the presence of the holy angels and of the Lamb. 11And the smoke of their torment rises forever and ever. Day and night there is no rest for those who worship the beast and its image, or for anyone who receives the mark of its name.”
12Here is a call for the perseverance of the saints who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.
13And I heard a voice from heaven telling me to write,
“Blessed are the dead—those who die in the Lord from this moment on.”
“Yes,” says the Spirit, “they will rest from their labors, for their deeds will follow them.”
The Harvest of the Earth
14And I looked and saw a white cloud, and seated on the cloud was One like the Son of Man, with a golden crown on His head and a sharp sickle in His hand.
Then another angel came out of the temple, crying out in a loud voice to the One seated on the cloud, “Swing Your sickle and reap, because the time has come to harvest; for the crop of the earth is ripe.” 16So the One seated on the cloud swung His sickle over the earth, and the earth was harvested.

Now to understand this in Revelation 14 you must believe what the LORD said in His Gospel:

Do you not say, ‘There are still four months and then comes the harvest’?

Behold, I say to you, lift up your eyes and look at the fields, for they are already white for harvest!
John 4:35
 

Absolutely

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Clearly not = stop looking for a rapture = God did not tell us to look for a rapture and HE never said pre-trib = NEVER.

"and to wait for His Son from heaven, whom He raised from the dead, even Jesus who delivers us from the wrath to come."

1.) waiting and LOOKING for JESUS = HIS COMING
2.) the Resurrection = JESUS the firstfruits and those at His Coming
3.) Deliverance from the wrath of the LAMB

Idoatry is when we place our desire BEFORE the LORD's WILL
Then the last sentences of the bible with the Spirit of God and the bride awaiting and calling for his return are out if whack how.?

Please explain the error of the last instruction and heart cry of heaven
 

DavidTree

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Then the last sentences of the bible with the Spirit of God and the bride awaiting and calling for his return are out if whack how.?

Please explain the error of the last instruction and heart cry of heaven
Did i say Good Morning Brother??? - If not - Good Morning Brother

Are you speaking of Rev ch22 ?
 

Absolutely

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Nope. It establishes it firmly.

And a third angel followed them, calling out in a loud voice, “If anyone worships the beast and its image, and receives its mark on his forehead or on his hand, 10he too will drink the wine of God’s anger, poured undiluted into the cup of His wrath. And he will be tormented in fire and sulfur in the presence of the holy angels and of the Lamb. 11And the smoke of their torment rises forever and ever. Day and night there is no rest for those who worship the beast and its image, or for anyone who receives the mark of its name.”
12Here is a call for the perseverance of the saints who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.
13And I heard a voice from heaven telling me to write,
“Blessed are the dead—those who die in the Lord from this moment on.”
“Yes,” says the Spirit, “they will rest from their labors, for their deeds will follow them.”
The Harvest of the Earth
14And I looked and saw a white cloud, and seated on the cloud was One like the Son of Man, with a golden crown on His head and a sharp sickle in His hand.
Then another angel came out of the temple, crying out in a loud voice to the One seated on the cloud, “Swing Your sickle and reap, because the time has come to harvest; for the crop of the earth is ripe.” 16So the One seated on the cloud swung His sickle over the earth, and the earth was harvested.

Now to understand this in Revelation 14 you must believe what the LORD said in His Gospel:

Do you not say, ‘There are still four months and then comes the harvest’?

Behold, I say to you, lift up your eyes and look at the fields, for they are already white for harvest!
John 4:35
They are Jews.

Firsttfruit Jews 144 k of them harvested as firstfruits at the start of rev 14.

Main harvest OF JEWS FOLLOWING BY JESUS SITTING ON A CLOUD.

OMISSION IS YOUR ERROR
 

DavidTree

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They are Jews.

Firsttfruit Jews 144 k of them harvested as firstfruits at the start of rev 14.

Main harvest OF JEWS FOLLOWING BY JESUS SITTING ON A CLOUD.

OMISSION IS YOUR ERROR
Are you sure? i SEE something else that is coded by the the LORD and speaks of Something and Someone who is Beautiful.

Revelation is not categorically chronological. It repeats Itself giving alternate views of the same things to emphasize points made for His Children to SEE thru the Seven Eyes of HS7.

Then I saw a Lamb, looking as if it had been slain, standing at the center of the throne, encircled by the four living creatures and the elders. The Lamb had seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven spirits of God sent out into all the earth.
 

DavidTree

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Y’all talkin’ about me? : )
Nothing bad, Beautiful in Christ - Brother Absolutely is trying to figure out if you are speaking of Christ or the Antichrist in First Seal and in Chapter 19.

So, for the record, would you please clarify ch6 White Horseman and chapter 19
 
S

SaltwaterGirl

Guest
Nothing bad, Beautiful in Christ - Brother Absolutely is trying to figure out if you are speaking of Christ or the Antichrist in First Seal and in Chapter 19.

So, for the record, would you please clarify ch6 White Horseman and chapter 19
You may already know this, but in Rev. 19, Christ comes riding a white horse.
In Rev. 6:2, it’s the Antichrist, the great imposter, who, as he always does, tries to imitate Jesus in everything, and so, of course, he also comes on a white horse. What a FAKE!

[2] And I saw, and behold a white horse: and he that sat on him had a bow; and a crown was given unto him: and he went forth conquering, and to conquer. (Notice the “h” is in lowercase)​
 

DavidTree

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You may already know this, but in Rev. 19, Christ comes riding a white horse.
In Rev. 6:2, it’s the Antichrist, the great imposter, who, as he always does, tries to imitate Jesus in everything, and so, of course, he also comes on a white horse. What a FAKE!

[2] And I saw, and behold a white horse: and he that sat on him had a bow; and a crown was given unto him: and he went forth conquering, and to conquer. (Notice the “h” is in lowercase)​
And as i suspected that believed as such, but was necessary for you to state - thank you
 

Pilgrimshope

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Brother Absolutely, thought you were referring the First Seal to being the Lord Jesus Christ.
i also had this presented to me before by another brother - and i was just checking in with you.

The seals do seem to lend themselves chronologically - i would say that Revelation Itself seems to repeat Itself in cycles.

First thing the Lord told His Bride: And Jesus answered and said to them: “Take heed that no one deceives you. For many will come in My name, saying, ‘I am the Christ,’ and will deceive many.

The Apostle John also bears witness:
Little children, it is the last hour; and as you have heard that the Antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come, by which we know that it is the last hour.
you know thre first four seals being opened and horses riding out ?

“And I turned, and lifted up mine eyes, and looked, and, behold, there came four chariots out from between two mountains; and the mountains were mountains of brass.

In the first chariot were red horses; and in the second chariot black horses; And in the third chariot white horses; and in the fourth chariot grisled and bay horses.

Then I answered and said unto the angel that talked with me, What are these, my Lord? And the angel answered and said unto me, These are the four spirits of the heavens, which go forth from standing before the Lord of all the earth.”
‭‭Zechariah‬ ‭6:1

notice when the four beasts around the throne speak horse rides out . Being commanded by the beasts . The first four seals are the four spirits of the heavens sent out from God to begin accomplishing his will in the earth after Christs crucifixion
 

DavidTree

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you know thre first four seals being opened and horses riding out ?

“And I turned, and lifted up mine eyes, and looked, and, behold, there came four chariots out from between two mountains; and the mountains were mountains of brass.

In the first chariot were red horses; and in the second chariot black horses; And in the third chariot white horses; and in the fourth chariot grisled and bay horses.

Then I answered and said unto the angel that talked with me, What are these, my Lord? And the angel answered and said unto me, These are the four spirits of the heavens, which go forth from standing before the Lord of all the earth.”
‭‭Zechariah‬ ‭6:1

notice when the four beasts around the throne speak horse rides out . Being commanded by the beasts . The first four seals are the four spirits of the heavens sent out from God to begin accomplishing his will in the earth after Christs crucifixion
and thus 1 John 2:18
 

TheDivineWatermark

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The Christ being the First Fruit, does indeed speaks of different harvests...
You make a good point (I've made the same point in past posts :) ).



(y) A few thoughts for the readers:

--there's the phrase "[Christ]... the firstfruit [no definite article ('the')] of those having fallen asleep" in v.20;
there's the phrase "firstfruit Christ" [no definite article] in v.23;
and then there is the phrase "[re: the 144,000]... firstfruit [no definite article] to God and to the Lamb" Rev14:4;
... and indeed in Leviticus 23, there are TWO distinct mentions of "firstfruit"... this is important (and pertains to the above-mentioned items);

--James 1:18 says, "a KIND of firstfruit" (meaning, there is more than ONE "KIND");

--"firstfruit" does seem to pertain to [distinct] "harvests" ;) ... thus, more than one "harvest" as well... and we see this both in scripture and in nature
 

DavidTree

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Since the bible frames Jesus snd those resurrected with him at Jesus resurrection as " fitstfruits" the bible is automatically invoking harvest.

Harvest is 4 parts.
Firstfruits
Main
Corners
Gleaners

all the first resurrection due to "firstfruits" component
No rapture until HE comes = Firstfruit Resurrection = don't be deceived by a falsehood of multiple raptures/harvests

BELIEVE what the LORD said concerning Harvest = John 4:35
Jesus said to them, “My food is to do the will of Him who sent Me, and to finish His work. 35Do you not say, ‘There are still four months and then comes the harvest’? Behold, I say to you, lift up your eyes and look at the fields, for they are already white for harvest! 36And he who reaps receives wages, and gathers fruit for eternal life, that both he who sows and he who reaps may rejoice together. 37For in this the saying is true: ‘One sows and another reaps.’ 38I sent you to reap that for which you have not labored; others have labored, and you have entered into their labors.”

Notice how the LORD discounts the "four months remaining for harvest", which the error of pre-trib seeks to establish.
 

Pilgrimshope

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and thus 1 John 2:18
I don’t think the anti Christ comes from the opening of the seals. If you. Price those four horsemen correspond to the four promised judgements from the breaking of Moses law ?

The seals seem to be fulfilling this

“For thus saith the Lord God; How much more when I send my four sore judgments upon Jerusalem,

the sword,

and the famine,

and the noisome beast,

and the pestilence, to cut off from it man and beast?”
‭‭Ezekiel‬ ‭14:21‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“And I saw when the Lamb opened one of the seals, and I heard, as it were the noise of thunder, one of the four beasts saying, Come and see. And I saw, and behold a white horse: and he that sat on him had a bow; and a crown was given unto him: and he went forth conquering, and to conquer.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭6:1-2‬ ‭

“And when he had opened the second seal, I heard the second beast say, Come and see. And there went out another horse that was red: and power was given to him that sat thereon to take peace from the earth, and that they should kill one another: and there was given unto him a great sword.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭6:3-4‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“And when he had opened the third seal, I heard the third beast say, Come and see. And I beheld, and lo a black horse; and he that sat on him had a pair of balances in his hand. And I heard a voice in the midst of the four beasts say, A measure of wheat for a penny, and three measures of barley for a penny; and see thou hurt not the oil and the wine.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭6:5-6‬ ‭

“And when he had opened the fourth seal, I heard the voice of the fourth beast say, Come and see. And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him.

And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭6:7-

the first four seals appear to me to be the sending of the four spiritual judgements into the world to pursue Israel for the reckoning of thier covenant

So the sword

“I will scatter them also among the heathen, whom neither they nor their fathers have known: and I will send a sword after them, till I have consumed them.”
‭‭Jeremiah‬ ‭9:16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“And I will scatter you among the heathen, and will draw out a sword after you: and your land shall be desolate, and your cities waste.”
‭‭Leviticus‬ ‭26:33‬ ‭KJV‬‬

The famine

“When I shall send upon them the evil arrows of famine, which shall be for their destruction, and which I will send to destroy you: and I will increase the famine upon you, and will break your staff of bread:”
‭‭Ezekiel‬ ‭5:16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“When they fast, I will not hear their cry; and when they offer burnt offering and an oblation, I will not accept them: but I will consume them by the sword, and by the famine, and by the pestilence.”
‭‭Jeremiah‬ ‭14:12‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“The Lord shall send upon thee cursing, vexation, and rebuke, in all that thou settest thine hand unto for to do, until thou be destroyed, and until thou perish quickly; because of the wickedness of thy doings, whereby thou hast forsaken me. The Lord shall make the pestilence cleave unto thee, until he have consumed thee from off the land, whither thou goest to possess it. The Lord shall smite thee with a consumption, and with a fever, and with an inflammation, and with an extreme burning, and with the sword, and with blasting, and with mildew; and they shall pursue thee until thou perish. And thy heaven that is over thy head shall be brass, and the earth that is under thee shall be iron. And thy carcase shall be meat unto all fowls of the air, and unto the beasts of the earth, and no man shall fray them away.”
‭‭Deuteronomy‬ ‭28:20-23,

the seals being opened seem to correspond with the culmination of Israel’s covenant when Christ the lamb was crucified it seems that the promised judgements were sent out from heaven and pursued israel Into all the world

The anti christ seems to be represented in the beast that appeared to be killed by yet lived and has the false prophet performing miracles and signs and lying wonders

the opening of the seals I personally don’t think it has to do with the anti christ so much as the. Reeking of Israel’s covenant and it’s curses being sent into the earth after Christs crucifixion
 

DavidTree

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Aug 2, 2021
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I don’t think the anti Christ comes from the opening of the seals. If you. Price those four horsemen correspond to the four promised judgements from the breaking of Moses law ?

The seals seem to be fulfilling this

“For thus saith the Lord God; How much more when I send my four sore judgments upon Jerusalem,

the sword,

and the famine,

and the noisome beast,

and the pestilence, to cut off from it man and beast?”
‭‭Ezekiel‬ ‭14:21‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“And I saw when the Lamb opened one of the seals, and I heard, as it were the noise of thunder, one of the four beasts saying, Come and see. And I saw, and behold a white horse: and he that sat on him had a bow; and a crown was given unto him: and he went forth conquering, and to conquer.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭6:1-2‬ ‭

“And when he had opened the second seal, I heard the second beast say, Come and see. And there went out another horse that was red: and power was given to him that sat thereon to take peace from the earth, and that they should kill one another: and there was given unto him a great sword.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭6:3-4‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“And when he had opened the third seal, I heard the third beast say, Come and see. And I beheld, and lo a black horse; and he that sat on him had a pair of balances in his hand. And I heard a voice in the midst of the four beasts say, A measure of wheat for a penny, and three measures of barley for a penny; and see thou hurt not the oil and the wine.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭6:5-6‬ ‭

“And when he had opened the fourth seal, I heard the voice of the fourth beast say, Come and see. And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him.

And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭6:7-

the first four seals appear to me to be the sending of the four spiritual judgements into the world to pursue Israel for the reckoning of thier covenant

So the sword

“I will scatter them also among the heathen, whom neither they nor their fathers have known: and I will send a sword after them, till I have consumed them.”
‭‭Jeremiah‬ ‭9:16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“And I will scatter you among the heathen, and will draw out a sword after you: and your land shall be desolate, and your cities waste.”
‭‭Leviticus‬ ‭26:33‬ ‭KJV‬‬

The famine

“When I shall send upon them the evil arrows of famine, which shall be for their destruction, and which I will send to destroy you: and I will increase the famine upon you, and will break your staff of bread:”
‭‭Ezekiel‬ ‭5:16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“When they fast, I will not hear their cry; and when they offer burnt offering and an oblation, I will not accept them: but I will consume them by the sword, and by the famine, and by the pestilence.”
‭‭Jeremiah‬ ‭14:12‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“The Lord shall send upon thee cursing, vexation, and rebuke, in all that thou settest thine hand unto for to do, until thou be destroyed, and until thou perish quickly; because of the wickedness of thy doings, whereby thou hast forsaken me. The Lord shall make the pestilence cleave unto thee, until he have consumed thee from off the land, whither thou goest to possess it. The Lord shall smite thee with a consumption, and with a fever, and with an inflammation, and with an extreme burning, and with the sword, and with blasting, and with mildew; and they shall pursue thee until thou perish. And thy heaven that is over thy head shall be brass, and the earth that is under thee shall be iron. And thy carcase shall be meat unto all fowls of the air, and unto the beasts of the earth, and no man shall fray them away.”
‭‭Deuteronomy‬ ‭28:20-23,

the seals being opened seem to correspond with the culmination of Israel’s covenant when Christ the lamb was crucified it seems that the promised judgements were sent out from heaven and pursued israel Into all the world

The anti christ seems to be represented in the beast that appeared to be killed by yet lived and has the false prophet performing miracles and signs and lying wonders

the opening of the seals I personally don’t think it has to do with the anti christ so much as the. Reeking of Israel’s covenant and it’s curses being sent into the earth after Christs crucifixion
Three things mentioned in 1 John 2:18 = 1.) It is the last hour 2.) many antichrists 3) the Antichrist

Christ's ministry was for 3.5 years = the last hour began after His Ascension back to the Father

There is no 7 year period in Revelation. 3.5 years remaining to be fulfilled at the Fathers Time Schedule