The new covenant with Christ Jesus

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Oct 31, 2011
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#62
On the answer to these questions hangs the very heart of God's church, God's bride. One side says that Christ came to divide and cancel, so the church is a divided house that is soon to fall. The other side says that Christ was planned from the beginning, Christ was from the beginning, and all our world is and always has included Christ.

One side sees Christ in the sacrificial system used before Christ lived as a man, the other side says Christ deleted, got rid of, destroyed the sacrificial system. One side says the Levi priests showed the world Christ, the other side says Christ destroyed the old Levi priests. One side says that men were told to include the awareness of Christ and God in everything they did from washing hands to foods they chose to eat through rituals, just as we have the Holy Spirit today to listen to as guides to awareness of everything we do centered on Christ, the other side says that is only Judaism that Christ wiped out and destroyed. One side says the New Covenant wiped out everything but that, covenants aren't to be trusted at all, the other side says the New is wonderful and is an even better agreement with our loving and merciful God. One side sees the improvements, the other side works for destruction.

One side is for destruction, for division in the church. They don't want to build or make anything better, they just want destruction. The other side is for God and the church.
 
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Jan 19, 2013
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#63
Re: The new covenant of Christ Jesus

Elin said:
Look at moral decline. What has brought this to bear? Ya think it might be that some (such as yourself) have preached that the instructions concerning the love of God must be abolished because of the new covenant? Or are Christians suppose to be oblivious to reality in your opinion?
One thing pure and simple, lack of rebirth into eternal life.
Please answer all the questions I have asked on post #49. Or you can take them rhetorically if you want.
I did. . .they all have the one answer I gave.

Moral decline is never due to those who are born again.
 
Jan 19, 2013
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#64
Re: The new covenant of Christ Jesus

So are you saying then that God can break his promise?
Nope.

And he is never the party who violates a covenant, which violation causes it to be nullified.
 
Mar 4, 2013
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#65
Re: The new covenant of Christ Jesus

Red herring. . .

Read it again. . .and pay attention.

The original creation is not just matter on earth.
So as I indicated quoting Colossians saying Jesus also created heavenly things. Read it again please.
 
Mar 4, 2013
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#66
Re: The new covenant of Christ Jesus

All covered in the NT law of Christ (Mt 22:37-40; Gal 5:6).
Are not the finite details of love instructions in the old testament, or are we suppose to follow the Holy Spirit minus the Word of God?
 
C

chubbena

Guest
#67
Re: The new covenant of Christ Jesus

Which is precisely what the old covenant is (Gal 3:10).
Was Paul not talking about the folly of justification by the works of the law in Galatians? Did he teach justification by disobedience to the law?
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
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#68
That's why it is so important to have a solid understanding of both OT & NT. One represents the hand while the other is the glove. They co-exist & interwoven just like the Holy Trinity.

I am just appalled as to the number of Christians who are not familiar with the Bible (OT & NT).
True, and that is a Two-Way Street!
 
Mar 4, 2013
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#69
Re: The new covenant of Christ Jesus

Are not the finite details of love instructions in the old testament, or are we suppose to follow the Holy Spirit minus the Word of God?
Jesus quoted the Old Testament from the old covenant to Satan while He was 40 days tempted in the wilderness. Are we suppose to believe that Jesus said something that had power even though it is obsolete? Go figure.
 
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Oct 31, 2011
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#70
the law has now been made obsolete, inoperative and has vanished away by being superceded and excelled by the glory of another, the ministration of the Spirit. No one can tear a patch of the new covenant and apply it to the old garment to make up for the what the law could not do through the weakness of the flesh, nor can you put new wine in old stretched out wineskins (bottles) less they burst, spill out and perish.
I didn't copy this entire rant against scripture, but I have kept the gist of it in the highlighted and underlined part. Basically, it says that because scripture uses certain times and people to explain God principles to us, we should not read any scripture as from God to us, only as from God to the times it is addressing.

These people preaching destruction say that Christ can be read as for us today, nothing else. They Christ, being the new and fresh that Christ was 2,000 years ago, is fresh today. Christ wanted people to use His blood, to use Him as the high priest, etc. so when that is what we are supposed to do, that has to mean we destroy anything that explained Him, before. Shadows, old wineskins, principles of God the Father our world is built on, destroy the whole works. Just read this post.
 
Mar 4, 2013
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#71
True, and that is a Two-Way Street!
Jeremiah 32:39 And I will give them one heart, and one way, that they may fear me for ever, for the good of them, and of their children after them:

Some of the Old Covenant for ya.
 
Jan 19, 2013
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#72
Re: The new covenant of Christ Jesus

Jesus quoted the Old Testament from the old covenant to Satan while He was 40 days tempted in the wilderness. Are we suppose to believe that Jesus said something that had power
even though it is obsolete? Go figure.
Red herring. . .

You are the only saying the OT is obsolete.

Pay attention.
 

iwant2serve

Senior Member
Apr 12, 2009
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#73
Well lets take a look at the word Covenant. That is another word for legal binding agreement or contract which the Word of God is. There is only one law you will find int the NT that is not in the old which Jesus said I give you a new commandment, John 13:34-35 [SUP]34 [/SUP]“A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. [SUP]35 [/SUP]By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another.” The law was never given to be done by works but faith Rom 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law. Rom 9:30-32 What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, which followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith. But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness. Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone. So there was nothing wrong with the law except that it could not save or be a total removal of sin. Again every commandment you fine in the new testament you will find in the old except one.
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
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#74
Jeremiah 32:39 And I will give them one heart, and one way, that they may fear me for ever, for the good of them, and of their children after them:

Some of the Old Covenant for ya.
Completely a non sequiter. Why did you even bother quoting me?
 

gzusfrk

Senior Member
Aug 4, 2013
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#75
Re: The new covenant of Christ Jesus

Jesus quoted the Old Testament from the old covenant to Satan while He was 40 days tempted in the wilderness. Are we suppose to believe that Jesus said something that had power even though it is obsolete? Go figure.
since there was no new covenant at that point( Jesus had yet died) He used the covenant that was in effect, showing the power of the written Word.
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
30,726
3,661
113
#76
On the answer to these questions hangs the very heart of God's church, God's bride. One side says that Christ came to divide and cancel, so the church is a divided house that is soon to fall. The other side says that Christ was planned from the beginning, Christ was from the beginning, and all our world is and always has included Christ.

One side sees Christ in the sacrificial system used before Christ lived as a man, the other side says Christ deleted, got rid of, destroyed the sacrificial system. One side says the Levi priests showed the world Christ, the other side says Christ destroyed the old Levi priests. One side says that men were told to include the awareness of Christ and God in everything they did from washing hands to foods they chose to eat through rituals, just as we have the Holy Spirit today to listen to as guides to awareness of everything we do centered on Christ, the other side says that is only Judaism that Christ wiped out and destroyed. One side says the New Covenant wiped out everything but that, covenants aren't to be trusted at all, the other side says the New is wonderful and is an even better agreement with our loving and merciful God. One side sees the improvements, the other side works for destruction.

One side is for destruction, for division in the church. They don't want to build or make anything better, they just want destruction. The other side is for God and the church.
What is this, a straw man mattress? None of these sleights apply to those in this thread.
 
Jan 19, 2013
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141
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#77
Re: The new covenant of Christ Jesus

Elin said:
just-me said:
Really? Do
you actually look at creation as the ecological system only?
Red herring. . .

Read it again. . .and pay attention.

The original creation is not just matter on earth.
So as I indicated quoting Colossians saying Jesus also created heavenly things. Read it again please.
You're going in circles.
 
C

chubbena

Guest
#78
Re: The new covenant of Christ Jesus

Regarding the topic of discussion, the old covenant was based on law, not grace.

Expanding the discussion to Abraham, it was grace that credited faith to him as righteousness.

All unilateral covenants are of free grace, they require no performance by the participant.
In the past God spoke to our ancestors through Moses: Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is one.Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength. These commandments that I give you today are to be on your hearts. Impress them on your children. Talk about them when you sit at home and when you walk along the road, when you lie down and when you get up. Tie them as symbols on your hands and bind them on your foreheads. Write them on the doorframes of your houses and on your gates - and - you shall love your neighbor as yourself.

In these last days he has spoken to us by his Son: Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.

Again, some probably think "hang" means "executed" or "terminated" and the same way "fulfill" means "get rid of".
 
Jan 19, 2013
11,909
141
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#79
Re: The new covenant of Christ Jesus

Are not the finite details of love instructions in the old testament, or
are we suppose to follow the Holy Spirit minus the Word of God?
Take it up with God, who made the promise (Heb 8:10),
and with Jesus, who gave the new law of love (Mt 22:37-40; Gal 5:6)
for the new covenant (Jer 31:31; Heb 8:8).
 
C

chubbena

Guest
#80
Re: The new covenant of Christ Jesus

since there was no new covenant at that point( Jesus had yet died) He used the covenant that was in effect, showing the power of the written Word.
Man no longer has to live on every word that comes out of God?