The Truth About The Sabbath

[Laodicea]

Yeah I was accused earlier in another thread when I wrote the commandments existed before Moses. False teachings and a non christian I believe I was made out to be. I'm pretty sure they are sitting right now as we type in a British museum carved into stone in hieroglyphics. They have been scientifically proven to predate the writings of Moses. Still with many found in genesis and scientific proof outside the bible people still choose to believe a lie and can never experience the full spirit of God free from bondage. The spirit of unleavened they will always have, nourished through time by the corn purchased out of egypt by their fathers. Like what I say or not that is what is written in the bible. I don't care what they thought or were taught or how many believe it to be a lie. Doesn't matter....that's what is written.

Yes people can mention any of the other nine commandments and they are all for it but, as soon as the sabbath is mentioned no matter how evidence is shown they go against it. I have shown the word rested in Genesis 2:2 also means sabbath but they try to get around it by their opinion.

 

[jag1977]

There is no truth or understanding in the teachings of Moses because they of abraham always need to prove God with a burning bush or cloud of smoke. Inspired by God? Yes through those who came many years before them. Baking bread, sacrifice of literal animals, and yet still they are desolate in their hearts. No truth, no understanding, just regurgitation of the path they came here on.

 

[tdrew777]

The patriarchs of Genesis set up altars and burned sacrifices that would have been in violation of Mosiac Law. We can not assume that they kept the Law of MOses. The Ten Commandments were not, individually, unknown before Moses, but they acquired a stamp of divine authority that they did not previously possess because of the way that God used Moses' ministry.

 

[danschance]

]1) Christ is the END of the Mosaic laws for those who believe in Him.
"For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes."Romans 10:4
In your post you mention something about the greek but I did not understand what you were saying other than you feel this word should not be translated as end.

a) The vast majority of english bibles state Christ is the end or termination of the law.
Romans 10:4 Parallel: For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.

b) In the NASB that Greek word telos is most often translated as end. If you feel this is wrong please show evidence to support that claim.

c) Look at how telos is translated in the NASB into English and see how often it occurs. Notice the main way telos is translated is end most often.
24-end
2-ends
1-finished
6-outcome
2-custom
1-continually
1-custom
2-customs
1-goal
1-sum
1-utmost

d) The majority of English bible translations translate telos as "end" in this verse.
Romans 10:4 Parallel: For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.

2) The next verse augments the verse above. The Mosaic law has no hold on those who believe in Christ.
"23Now before faith came, we were held captive under the law, imprisoned until the coming faith would be revealed. 24So then, the law was our guardian until Christ came, in order that we might be justified by faith. 25But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian,26for in Christ Jesus you are all sons of God, through faith."Gal. 3:23-25

You claim the above verse means "The schoolmaster, the instructor that brought us to Christ were the animal sacrifices that were the shadow of Christ's perfect sacrifice.".

a) Frankly I do not understand your answer and it does not counter the clear decree that Christians are not under the Mosaic law. If I have missed something please let me know.

b) This verse does not mention animal sacrifice.

3)This next verse states the same thing, the abolishment of the Mosaic law for the NT believer.
"by abolishing the law of commandments expressed in ordinances, that he might create in himself one new man in place of the two, so making peace," Eph. 2:15

You claim: "Quote the passage not the verse...

Eph 2:15 having abolished in His flesh the enmity, that is, the law of commandments contained in ordinances, so as to create in Himself one new man from the two, thus making peace,
Eph 2:16 and that He might reconcile them both to God in one body through the cross, thereby putting to death the enmity."

a) Yes, I quoted part of a verse as the rest of the verse would of been confusing. Quoting the rest does not take away from what I posted. It is still stating that Christ abolished in His flesh the Mosaic laws.

b) You finish your argument by defining the term "enmity" in the following verse which I never quoted. This appears to be a straw man argument.

4) The next verse basically states the same thing, that we are released from the law.
"But now we are released from the law, having died to that which held us captive, so that we serve in the new way of the Spirit and not in the old way of the written code." Romans 7:6

Your response to this verse is: "OK, are we released from the Law or released from the punishment due us for breaking the Law. If we are released from the Law we are free to do as we please with no penalty...".

a) Yes, we are released from the Mosaic law.

b) Christ bore the punishment we all deserved, not the law!

c) Your last statement is way off on a tangent. You interject sarcasm instead of reasoning by claiming we are not under any penalty and we can do as we please. We are held under the law of Christ, as I have mentioned a dozen times before and I would mention them again but I am sure it will do no good as you can't seem to recall the many other times I have stated it. Instead, I will post the words of Paul:

1What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin that grace may abound? 2By no means! . Rom 6:1-2

Conclusion
Your arguments countering the verses I posted have not swayed me in the least. You seem to of been grabbing at straws. I posted scriptures that state the Mosaic laws are not to be followed by NT believers and all you posted was an alternative definition from the Greek on the first verse and an attempt to "bait n switch" on the rest.

 

[phil112]

Phil, you cannot know you are against God's word, for you are blind to that. I am not trying to convince you, I am trying to make the true word spoken on cc. Christ says that not a jot of the law is changed, only that He is adding to it. You are saying that is not so. That is your words, not mine.

I have never said it is wrong for you not to observe the Sabbath, I have said it is wrong for you to say that all the law of Moses as you define that law as the entire law, not the rituals, is wrong.

Okay, first allow me to apologize. It wasn't you that said it was wrong for me not to rest on the sabbath. It was JesusLives in post 372. I try to be very careful and that got by me.

Still doesn't change what you said about me rejecting Jesus' word. Whe He died on the cross he did fulfill the law. It had completed it's work at that point in time, you sir, are the one not understanding what Christ was telling us. One more time, I will bring you what Christ said:

John 15:10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.

He was very clear about His instruction for us to keep HIS, not God's. He kept God's, and with His blood, fulfilled them so that, thru faith, we had an easier path to salvation. You cannot explain that away. His commandments we keep, because He kept His Father's commandments.

Paul is very clear, in more than one place, that we are no longer under the law. Paul got his gospel from Christ. If you refuse to believe Paul, YOU are directly rejecting Christ's word.

 

[danschance]

There is no truth or understanding in the teachings of Moses because they of abraham always need to prove God with a burning bush or cloud of smoke. Inspired by God? Yes through those who came many years before them. Baking bread, sacrifice of literal animals, and yet still they are desolate in their hearts. No truth, no understanding, just regurgitation of the path they came here on.

I have reported this post as being troll-ish and offensive to Christians.

 

[Brother_Don]

only one entity exist that would not want us to obey the Almighty. the reason for this is the deceiver knows the power that is in the Word, and keeping the Word, and obeying the Word. The power and the blessings defeat satan and his works, so of course he will do all he can to trip us up. satan and his schemes can't trip me up i have been in them to long. For me to start ignoring the Almighty, and not receiving the blessings that come with obeying Him. It would be like i'm here in a nice warm bath, and some one is sitting across from me in a bucket of ice, telling me come and see what its like, Nah, i'll stay where i know its warm.

 

[Brother_Don]

i meant i've been in the Almightys blessings to long, but satan is always there with his schemes, trying to convince me of a better way, but when both roads have been trveled we know which one has more pot holes.

 

[Karraster]

only one entity exist that would not want us to obey the Almighty. the reason for this is the deceiver knows the power that is in the Word, and keeping the Word, and obeying the Word. The power and the blessings defeat satan and his works, so of course he will do all he can to trip us up. satan and his schemes can't trip me up i have been in them to long. For me to start ignoring the Almighty, and not receiving the blessings that come with obeying Him. It would be like i'm here in a nice warm bath, and some one is sitting across from me in a bucket of ice, telling me come and see what its like, Nah, i'll stay where i know its warm.

Thanks for your post.

I was just thinking how much I look forward to it. Our Creator has done and continues to do so much for us every moment of every day, and has invited us to spend the 7th day with Him. How awesome is that? Wow, thank you Heavenly Father, I'll be there!

 

[john832]

wow, you are a spiteful person. why target me?

if you want to enslave yourself, go ahead.

ignoring user.
I am growing so tired of the shallow cultural 'Christians' that roll around in here.

How does the American legal system affect your call to Christ?

Hmmm, if obedience to God's Law is slavery, and disobedience is freedom, I'll say "Yes Master", I am your doulos (bondslave). Puts me in the company of Paul...

Rom 1:1 Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God,

G1401
δοῦλος
doulos
Thayer Definition:
1) a slave, bondman, man of servile condition
1a) a slave
1b) metaphorically, one who gives himself up to another’s will those whose service is used by Christ in extending and advancing his cause among men
1c) devoted to another to the disregard of one’s own interests
2) a servant, attendant
Part of Speech: noun
A Related Word by Thayer’s/Strong’s Number: from G1210
Citing in TDNT: 2:261, 182

 

[john832]

I have news for you. God doesn't care what "it seems to you". His plan was set before time. Are you so dense that you cannot understand it didn't change,

OK, if His plandidn't change, then keeping His Laws did change? Keeping the Sabbath is on again, off again, on again, off again?

only that it became outdated.

Oh, God was able to come up a perfect plan, it grew outdated? He musta said to Himself "My bad, gotta change this plan again."

What version of God's plan are we under now? Ver 5.6 or what?

Do you believe that God didn't realize there was going to be 6 BILLION people on this planet and more?

And you just got finished telling me that God's plan grew outdated as if He didn't realize there would be 7 BIllion on the earth at this time.

Can you imagine the chaos and strife that having even a third of those people trying to have enough animals for offerings alone would bring? Do you not understand that things HAD to change, and God built that into His plan?

Well, I am certainly glad God has you around to help Him figure this stuff out.

Mal 3:6 For I am the LORD, I change not; therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed.

When Christ shed His blood on the cross, He fulfilled the law, so that we might obtain salvation today. Do you understand that when you cling to the law you are rejecting the blood of Christ that He shed for you that day?

G4137
πληρόω
plēroō
Thayer Definition:
1) to make full, to fill up, i.e. to fill to the full
1a) to cause to abound, to furnish or supply liberally
1a1) I abound, I am liberally supplied
2) to render full, i.e. to complete
2a) to fill to the top: so that nothing shall be wanting to full measure, fill to the brim
2b) to consummate: a number
2b1) to make complete in every particular, to render perfect
2b2) to carry through to the end, to accomplish, carry out, (some undertaking)
2c) to carry into effect, bring to realisation, realise
2c1) of matters of duty: to perform, execute
2c2) of sayings, promises, prophecies, to bring to pass, ratify, accomplish
2c3) to fulfil, i.e. to cause God’s will (as made known in the law) to be obeyed as it should be, and God’s promises (given through the prophets) to receive fulfilment
Part of Speech: verb
A Related Word by Thayer’s/Strong’s Number: from G4134
Citing in TDNT: 6:286, 867

What part of this means did away with?

Luk 16:17 And it is easier for heaven and earth to pass away than for one tittle of the law to fail.

I'll take scripture over foolish human reasoning every single time.

 

[john832]

You need to read your bible more. Your reading comprehension is lacking. If you try to keep part of the law, you are under all of it. Jesus fulfilled that requirement.

I think you need to take some remedial reading classes. Paul said things like this...

Rom 7:12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.

Rom 7:14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.

Rom 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

1Co 7:19 Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God.

 

[john832]

​

The NT believer is not under the Mosaic laws but is under the law of Christ. Records show the early Church did not have a sabbath.

Whose records?

Act 13:14 But when they departed from Perga, they came to Antioch in Pisidia, and went into the synagogue on the sabbath day, and sat down.

Act 13:44 And the next sabbath day came almost the whole city together to hear the word of God.

Act 16:13 And on the sabbath we went out of the city by a river side, where prayer was wont to be made; and we sat down, and spake unto the women which resorted thither.

Act 17:2 And Paul, as his manner was, went in unto them, and three sabbath days reasoned with them out of the scriptures,

Paul's manner was to keep the Sabbath.

Act 18:4 And he reasoned in the synagogue every sabbath, and persuaded the Jews and the Greeks.

The real truth of the matter is that THERE IS NO RECORD OF THE EARLY CHURCH KEEPING ANY DAY BUT THE SABBATH!

 

[john832]

What is being described here are the Old Covenant ceremonial Sabbaths. The last quote, from the Council of Laodicea, is a reference to "the Sabbath," but that which was kept by those Israelites who rejected Jesus and the New Covenant. There's, because it did not occur on the day Jesus rose from the dead ("the first day of the week [sabbatons]) was not to be honored by Christians as the remaining Sabbath (Hebrews 4:9). This is why the Council instructed Christians to work on that day (i.e., that observed by unbelieving Israelites. The same is true today, we are not to honor Saturday, that which is still observed by unbelieving contemporary "Jews." We are, as stated by the council, to reverence Sunday, or "the Lord's day and, if possible, not work on it. The bottom line here is, that this council was instructing early Christians to disrespect the Jewish Saturday Sabbath and respect the Christian Sunday Sabbath. Again, "Judaize," as applied in the afore mentioned quote is in a context condemning, not the Sunday Sabbath of Christians, but the Saturday Sabbath of Jews. It was the Sunday Sabbath, the Lord's day which was the one day in seven, the Sabbath that "remaineth," and to be honored. As Hebrews 4 states:

There remaineth therefore a rest (Sabbath rest) to the people of God. v. 9

Christendom, for over nineteen hundred years, has given this distinction to Sunday, please respect it.

Pro 14:12 There is a way which seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death.

Oh and Christ was not resurrected on Sunday. He rose at the end of the Sabbath in the late afternoon. You know, that being able to count to three thingy.

 

[john832]

That was a bunch of silly prattle. What were you trying to say? If you accept part of the law, you are putting yourself under all of it. Pretty sure that isn't a good idea.

Why don't you edify us with all the verses where the Sabbath is changed to Sunday or done away with or whatever?

 

[john832]

The first mention of Sabbath is in Exodus 16, not Genesis. You are believing a myth.

No, the first mention of the Sabbath is in Gen 2:2-3. Exodus 20:11 plainly shows this...

Exo 20:11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

What day did He hallow and bless as the Sabbath? The seventh day of creation week just as Exodus 20:11 says.

You are teaching heresy here. The Sabbath is not a myth.

 

[john832]

Yes, Hebrews 10:25, as previously mentioned.

Heb 10:25 Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.

And this says what?

 

[john832]

Wow Red, I posted four scriptures that clearly say the mosaic laws are not over NT believers and you call me lawless. Must you sink to the sin name calling? I state openly and repeatedly, that I am under the Law of Christ and you claim I am lawless?

The "nomian nuts" are the ones who mock Christ but mocking the very death of Christ when they say "we must follow the Mosaic laws":
"I do not nullify the grace of God, for if righteousness comes through the Law, then Christ died needlessly." Gal 2:21

I dismantled these in a previous post...

2Pe 3:15 And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you;
2Pe 3:16 As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.

 

[Josh321]

Okay, first allow me to apologize. It wasn't you that said it was wrong for me not to rest on the sabbath. It was JesusLives in post 372. I try to be very careful and that got by me.

Still doesn't change what you said about me rejecting Jesus' word. Whe He died on the cross he did fulfill the law. It had completed it's work at that point in time, you sir, are the one not understanding what Christ was telling us. One more time, I will bring you what Christ said:
He was very clear about His instruction for us to keep HIS, not God's. He kept God's, and with His blood, fulfilled them so that, thru faith, we had an easier path to salvation. You cannot explain that away. His commandments we keep, because He kept His Father's commandments.

Paul is very clear, in more than one place, that we are no longer under the law. Paul got his gospel from Christ. If you refuse to believe Paul, YOU are directly rejecting Christ's word.

what i don't get right, is the law ( moses law ) is the end for those that believe in God, now if the scripture plainly says this, it's obvious that it's something else... [h=3]1 John 3:23[/h]King James Version (KJV)

23 And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment.


2ndly the law is not made for born again believers how much longer will you harden your hearts to this, that makes me wonder are some of you even born again? if you were you would be able to see this, maybe instead of speaking law we could discuss the holy spirit and what it does



[h=3]1 Timothy 1:5-10[/h]King James Version (KJV)

5Now the end of the commandment is charity out of a pure heart, and of a good conscience, and of faith unfeigned:
6 From which some having swerved have turned aside unto vain jangling;
7 Desiring to be teachers of the law; understanding neither what they say, nor whereof they affirm.
8 But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;
9Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,
10 For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;





which pretty much means to practice it YOUR PRACTICING UNRIGHTEOUSNESS, IT'S IN VAIN,


[h=3]Galatians 2:21[/h]King James Version (KJV)

21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.




wake up people come on... how long will you harden your hearts and reject the holy spirit, and make the work of the cross go down in vain?

 

[john832]

Do you have any resources available to you such as Vines Word Study, lexicons or even just Strong's? If so, a study of the meaning of the word "end" would help you immensely.