vw up to now I have really been impressed ( not that this should mean anything to you) with your post on this thread , but will have to say I don't think Jesus died to sin, but Jesus died for our sins, I know romans say that we have died to sin but this is because we had sin, and we can now die to sin through Jesus, meaning that our sin nature can be killed that we may walk in righteousness, Jesus didn't have that sin nature, though so He would not had to die to sin.
Truth
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vw up to now I have really been impressed ( not that this should mean anything to you) with your post on this thread , but will have to say I don't think Jesus died to sin, but Jesus died for our sins, I know romans say that we have died to sin but this is because we had sin, and we can now die to sin through Jesus, meaning that our sin nature can be killed that we may walk in righteousness, Jesus didn't have that sin nature, though so He would not had to die to sin.
But really Jesus had to die at the hands of sinners. Under the old, a spotless animal was required. Christ was the spotless human being. The person offering had to identify with the animal. In contrast, we not only identify with Christ but Christ identified with us. The person offering had to kill the animal themself. That is why Christ had to face a death by the hands of sinners and couldnt' merely suicide himself or get God to kill him with an angel of death.
His sacrifice was not in fulfillment of the Law. His sacrifice was before the Law. He was crucified before the foundations of the world were laid. The sacrifices of the Law could not remove sin, only cover it. Jesus gave a better sacrifice, He, being without sin, being God in the flesh, gave Himself for us, died to sin for all and for all time, and died to our death due to sin. And then, He rose from this death, so that in Him we too could have new life, to God in Him. There was never any provision in the Law for these things.
but now to get back to the thought of the thread:
Mt 24:35Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.
Joh 1:1In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
yes we will always have His word which is truth:
Joh 14:6Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, THE TRUTH, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
Re 1:8I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.
Mt 24:35Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.
Joh 1:1In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
yes we will always have His word which is truth:
Joh 14:6Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, THE TRUTH, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
Re 1:8I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.
Those who were before the Law were not under the Law, for without the Law there is no accounting for sin. But death was still the judgment. Jesus died for this judgment, our death, everyone's death. For this reason, there is a resurrection, because Jesus was raised from the dead. Everyone will be raised from the dead. But we are raised to life with and in and for God. Those who are raised without this, they will see the lake of fire. God's second judgment.
Oh I found it, here
Rev 13:8 And all dwelling on the earth will worship it, those whose names have not been written in the Book of Life of the Lamb slain, from the foundation of the world.
But note where the comma is.
You are reading it as "the Lamb slain before the foundation of the world" which is incorrect I believe. It means the intention God had to give Christ as a sacrifice so early on.
Another thing to note is that it's not before the foundation of the world, it's from (or since) the foundation of the world.
Rev 13:8 And all dwelling on the earth will worship it, those whose names have not been written in the Book of Life of the Lamb slain, from the foundation of the world.
But note where the comma is.
You are reading it as "the Lamb slain before the foundation of the world" which is incorrect I believe. It means the intention God had to give Christ as a sacrifice so early on.
Another thing to note is that it's not before the foundation of the world, it's from (or since) the foundation of the world.
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well mine is worded alittle different and there is no comma:
Re 13:8And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. (KJB)
but we have to consider every word that came from God and this would be the plan of salvation , by the foreknowledge of the omnisceince of God,
1pe 1:2Elect according to the FOREKNOWLEDGE of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.
God knew who would be santify and in obedience by having the blood Of Jesus CHRIST applied. Noticed again He was the Christ/Savior by Him and through Him. He did not come and show us the way, But rather He was the WAY, no man cometh unto the father but by Me, saith Jesus The CHRIST
Re 13:8And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. (KJB)
but we have to consider every word that came from God and this would be the plan of salvation , by the foreknowledge of the omnisceince of God,
1pe 1:2Elect according to the FOREKNOWLEDGE of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.
God knew who would be santify and in obedience by having the blood Of Jesus CHRIST applied. Noticed again He was the Christ/Savior by Him and through Him. He did not come and show us the way, But rather He was the WAY, no man cometh unto the father but by Me, saith Jesus The CHRIST
The NASB makes this even clearer, what you are saying. But I was thinking of the passage in Ephesians,
"Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly placed in Christ, just as He chose us in Him before the foundations of the world, that we should be holy and blameless before Him in love. He predestined us to adoption as sons through Jesus Christ to Himself according to the kind intention of His will, to the praise of the glory of His grace, which He freely bestowed on us in the Beloved."
I see this as Jesus being slain for us in the beginning, before the creation, since He was before all things, as all things hold together in Him, and He has always been the Lamb slain, for us. Yes, in time, it was 2000 years ago. But He is not in time. I believe that the cross is eternal. That is all that I was trying to say.
M
All 66 Books of Scripture are Truth; the Bible is the infallible, inerrant Word of G-d. Yeshua went to the cross because He put Himself there not because of people. This may on the surface seam like not a big deal but to believe Yesuah died because of people (Jews) leads the anti-Semitism even in the church. Redemption would not have happened if Yeshua would not have of His own freewill chose to go to the Cross to fulfill Scripture exactly of the Messiah in the fullness of time (the time that was predestined for Him to die on the Cross before the foundation of the world). I absolutely agree with the fact that G-d protects His Word; the book of Isaiah declares that His Word will never pass away and it will not return unto Him void but will accomplish everything it was setout to accomplish.
