What is first Knowledge or Wisdom?

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Jul 24, 2014
302
1
0
#1
Highlighting the 'Fear' of the LORD.

Proverbs 1:7 KJV
The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge: but fools despise wisdom and instruction.

Proverbs 9:10 KJV
The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom: and the knowledge of the holy is understanding.

If I was to go by chronological order. I would say the fear of the LORD actually starts with 'Knowledge'.

Some have argued during my years of being a Christian. That it is 'Wisdom' that's the beginning of the fear of the LORD.

Then I have the problem with the following verse.

Proverbs 2:9 KJV
For the Lord giveth wisdom: out of his mouth cometh knowledge and understanding.

How can one say that it is the 'Wisdom' that is the beginning. When two versus undercut Proverbs 9:10 keeping with the chronological order.

I know there are other passages that and I have read commentaries surrounding this matter (including gotquestions.org) I'm at a stand still. I'm in quick sand just stuck and I want to be freed. So when I'm on an even keel with like minded Christians. I don't want to cause conflict as I have pulled up fellow Christians every time one mentions 'Wisdom' over 'Knowledge'. When a Christian states that the fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge. It doesn't bother me. But when it's wisdom. I end up being apologetic about it. Of which from a 3rd person perspective...I can be rather annoying!

It would be great if the scales can lean towards the one or the other. Knowledge or Wisdom. Instead of personally being at a stale mate. Which I feel has gone on for two decades too long.
 
Last edited:

JesusIsAll

Senior Member
Aug 27, 2014
5,167
94
0
#2
Highlighting the 'Fear' of the LORD.

Proverbs 1:7 KJV
The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge: but fools despise wisdom and instruction.

Proverbs 9:10 KJV
The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom: and the knowledge of the holy is understanding.

If I was to go by chronological order. I would say the fear of the LORD actually starts with 'Knowledge'.
Fear of the Lord is to reverence His awesomeness, His holiness, His eternal nature and worthiness, to be struck by His light. One can have all sorts of book knowledge of God, know all about Him, but not personally know Him. Fear of the Lord is knowing Him, that epiphany, this the beginning of learning all about who His is and the gaining of living spiritual wisdom.
 
Jul 24, 2014
302
1
0
#3
So it's knowledge before wisdom then?

To know who He is, will be revealed unto them once they have the acquired the knowledge of as you say. His awesomeness, His holiness, His eternal nature and worthiness, to be struck by His light. Will this give those the wisdom needed after knowledge and understanding? Would it not then lead to the wisdom of what to do right in the LORD line of sight? To know right from wrong? To give sound advice to new-borns? To know the path of righteousness? To preach the Gospel?
 

Joidevivre

Senior Member
Jul 15, 2014
3,838
268
83
#4
I Cor. 1:24 Christ is called the Wisdom of God.

In the beginning was the Word...and the Word was God. It looks like Wisdom comes first, doesn't it?
 

ELECT

Senior Member
Aug 18, 2014
2,332
4
0
#5
Highlighting the 'Fear' of the LORD.

Proverbs 1:7 KJV
The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge: but fools despise wisdom and instruction.

Proverbs 9:10 KJV
The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom: and the knowledge of the holy is understanding.

If I was to go by chronological order. I would say the fear of the LORD actually starts with 'Knowledge'.

Some have argued during my years of being a Christian. That it is 'Wisdom' that's the beginning of the fear of the LORD.

Then I have the problem with the following verse.

Proverbs 2:9 KJV
For the Lord giveth wisdom: out of his mouth cometh knowledge and understanding.

How can one say that it is the 'Wisdom' that is the beginning. When two versus undercut Proverbs 9:10 keeping with the chronological order.

I know there are other passages that and I have read commentaries surrounding this matter (including gotquestions.org) I'm at a stand still. I'm in quick sand just stuck and I want to be freed. So when I'm on an even keel with like minded Christians. I don't want to cause conflict as I have pulled up fellow Christians every time one mentions 'Wisdom' over 'Knowledge'. When a Christian states that the fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge. It doesn't bother me. But when it's wisdom. I end up being apologetic about it. Of which from a 3rd person perspective...I can be rather annoying!

It would be great if the scales can lean towards the one or the other. Knowledge or Wisdom. Instead of personally being at a stale mate. Which I feel has gone on for two decades too long.

Proverbs 3:19-20King James Version (KJV)


19 The Lord by wisdom hath founded the earth; by understanding hath he established the heavens.


20 By his knowledge the depths are broken up, and the clouds drop down the dew.
 

JesusIsAll

Senior Member
Aug 27, 2014
5,167
94
0
#6
So it's knowledge before wisdom then?

To know who He is, will be revealed unto them once they have the acquired the knowledge of as you say. His awesomeness, His holiness, His eternal nature and worthiness, to be struck by His light. Will this give those the wisdom needed after knowledge and understanding? Would it not then lead to the wisdom of what to do right in the LORD line of sight? To know right from wrong? To give sound advice to new-borns? To know the path of righteousness? To preach the Gospel?
That word knowledge doesn't fit the inception well, as mentioned, as opposed to knowing God, personally, being likened to fear of God. Or, in terms of Christian doctrine, the baptism of the Holy Spirit the encounter with God that results in fear of God. From that fear, open eyes realizing the magnitude of the importance of God, our own smallness, one seeks knowledge of God. Adding knowledge to knowledge, one becomes wiser, knowing more the mind of God over time. But it's all a process of seeking God, for knowing Him, first, in faith.

Put it this way. You could look at the Bible, know about God the Creator, His bringing forth Israel, the destroyer of the flood and Sodom and Gomorrah, on and on, to becoming incarnate in His Son, our Lord Jesus, His ministry, death and resurrection: you could write a book about this, maybe even a pretty good one, sticking faithfully to the Bible. But, you could really be a Buddhist biographer of the Christian God, not really knowing squat about Him as a living reality, to fear Him. Hence, you'd never personally seek true knowledge and wisdom of that God, have any spiritual component, live by Him.

"Will this give those the wisdom needed after knowledge and understanding? Would it not then lead to the wisdom of what to do right in the LORD line of sight? To know right from wrong? To give sound advice to new-borns? To know the path of righteousness? To preach the Gospel?" Absolutely, nail hit on the head! I see wisdom as if the ends of spiritual knowledge, becoming more of the mind of Christ, which takes much knowledge, over time, wisdom not instantaneous or just a handful of knowledge.
 

dcontroversal

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2013
30,510
1,510
113
#7
Wisdom is the proper application of knowledge and you cannot be wise and apply that which s not known....so it would seem that knowledge comes first and then the wisdom to apply it!
 

ELECT

Senior Member
Aug 18, 2014
2,332
4
0
#8
Highlighting the 'Fear' of the LORD.

Proverbs 1:7 KJV
The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge: but fools despise wisdom and instruction.

Proverbs 9:10 KJV
The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom: and the knowledge of the holy is understanding.

If I was to go by chronological order. I would say the fear of the LORD actually starts with 'Knowledge'.

Some have argued during my years of being a Christian. That it is 'Wisdom' that's the beginning of the fear of the LORD.

Then I have the problem with the following verse.

Proverbs 2:9 KJV
For the Lord giveth wisdom: out of his mouth cometh knowledge and understanding.

How can one say that it is the 'Wisdom' that is the beginning. When two versus undercut Proverbs 9:10 keeping with the chronological order.

I know there are other passages that and I have read commentaries surrounding this matter (including gotquestions.org) I'm at a stand still. I'm in quick sand just stuck and I want to be freed. So when I'm on an even keel with like minded Christians. I don't want to cause conflict as I have pulled up fellow Christians every time one mentions 'Wisdom' over 'Knowledge'. When a Christian states that the fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge. It doesn't bother me. But when it's wisdom. I end up being apologetic about it. Of which from a 3rd person perspective...I can be rather annoying!

It would be great if the scales can lean towards the one or the other. Knowledge or Wisdom. Instead of personally being at a stale mate. Which I feel has gone on for two decades too long.
God called it the tree of knowledge Why not wisdom nor understanding ?

Genesis 2:9
And out of the ground made the Lord God to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight, and good for food; the tree of life also in the midst of the garden, and the tree of knowledge of good and evil.
 

JesusIsAll

Senior Member
Aug 27, 2014
5,167
94
0
#9
I Cor. 1:24 Christ is called the Wisdom of God.

In the beginning was the Word...and the Word was God. It looks like Wisdom comes first, doesn't it?
To have Christ in you is to have more fully the mind of Christ, be more conformed to the image of Christ. Our Lord Jesus is that wisdom, but a wisdom we must learn. Put it this way: babies aren't wise.
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
26,018
417
83
#10
But wisdom would grasp this...

2 Peter 1:2-8 Grace and peace be multiplied unto you through the knowledge of God, and of Jesus our Lord,
According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:
Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.
And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge;
And to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness;
And to godliness brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness charity.
For if these things be in you, and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.
 
Jul 24, 2014
302
1
0
#11
Wisdom is the proper application of knowledge and you cannot be wise and apply that which s not known....so it would seem that knowledge comes first and then the wisdom to apply it!
The scales are leaning in favor of knowledge. I should have created a poll.
 

Powemm

Senior Member
Jul 30, 2012
3,910
31
0
#12
The question im lead to ask is "who" is wisdom and " who" gives knowledge
god is wisdom who gives knowledge..
 
Oct 31, 2011
8,200
179
0
#13
I found these wonderful passages on the net:
Job 12:12 “With the ancient is wisdom; and in length of days understanding.”(I love this, might mean my 89 years were worth something being lots of them were spent studying the word, but I've met unwise old and wise young)

Job 28:28 And unto man he said, Behold, the fear of the LORD, that is wisdom; and to depart from evil is understanding.

Psalm 111:10 The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom: a good understanding have all they that do his commandments: his praise endureth forever.

Proverbs 1:7 The fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge: but fools despise wisdom and instruction.”

Proverbs 3:7 Be not wise in thine own eyes: fear the LORD, and depart from evil.”

Proverbs 4:5-7Get wisdom, get understanding: forget it not; neither decline from the words of my mouth. Forsake her not, and she shall preserve thee: love her, and she shall keep thee. Wisdom is the principal thing; therefore get wisdom: and with all thy getting get understanding. (My very favorite)

Proverbs 9:10 The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom: and the knowledge of the holy is understanding.”

Proverbs 11:2He that is void of wisdom despiseth his neighbour: but a man of understanding holdeth his peace.”(Bible says those nasty posts aren't a good thing)

Proverbs 11:30 The fruit of the righteous is a tree of life; and he that winneth souls is wise.”

Proverbs 14:8The wisdom of the prudent is to understand his way: but the folly of fools is deceit.”

Proverbs 16:16 How much better is it to get wisdom than gold! and to get understanding rather to be chosen than silver!”

Proverbs 29:15 “The rod and reproof give wisdom: but a child left to himself bringeth his mother to shame.” (We can give reproof to each other and still be wise)

Ecclesiastes 7:12 For wisdom is a defence, and money is a defence: but the excellency of knowledge is, that wisdom giveth life to them that have it.”

James 1:5 , 6If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him. But let him ask in faith, nothing wavering. For he that wavereth is like a wave of the sea driven with the wind and tossed.”

James 3:17 “But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, and easy to be intreated, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality, and without hypocrisy.” (Again!! nasty posts aren't wise!)
 

MaggieMye

Senior Member
May 19, 2009
2,379
30
0
#14
Knowledge comes first...from experience or from God. WISDOM is USING that knowledge according to God's mandates and/or in a manner that will benefit the most people without causing harm to any.
 
Jan 6, 2012
1,233
10
0
#15
Joidevivre mentioned that Jesus is called the Wisdom of God. (He is not called the knowledge of God however.) Elect posted Pro. 3:19-20 which really summarizes it in a way.JesusIsAll mentioned some good things on the topic as far as distinguishing wisdom, understanding, and knowledge from each other. As far as common thinking goes, knowledge should come first since you can't correctly apply knowledge (wisdom) until you have it. However, in the things of God and in the Bible, wisdom always comes first as far as importance: "Wisdom is the principle thing, therefore, get wisdom. And with all your getting, get understanding" (Pro. 4:7).

All three words (wisdom, understanding, and knowledge) are used interchangeably in the Bible, but while knowledge can be used for good or bad and can lead to or away from God (remember the tree of knowledge) and understanding can refer to good and bad, wisdom can only be used for good and only and always leads towards God. That's why the Bible says that wisdom is the principle (most important, first) thing among all other things, not just knowledge and understanding. This is something you find in the Bible when you realize the distinction between the three words. Knowledge tells you facts and truths; wisdom tells you how to proceed. Knowing facts and truths is important; but knowing how to proceed is more important, because with it, you don't need to know the details (the facts and truths). Check it out for yourself; it's awesome when it comes alive off the pages.
 
K

Kerry

Guest
#16
MY people perish for the lack of knowledge so knowledge comes first and then wisdom. Proverbs will say buy wisdom and sell it it not.
 
Jan 6, 2012
1,233
10
0
#18
MY people perish for the lack of knowledge so knowledge comes first and then wisdom. Proverbs will say buy wisdom and sell it it not.
That's why it's important to grab the meaning of a word when it comes to the Bible. By meaning I mean interpretation, not necessarily translation. The word knowledge, for instance, is used to cover so many other words: wisdom, understanding, intimacy with God, the fear of God, and many, many, many more. (Check Pro. 2:1-6 and then on to the end of the chapter.) I say this all to say that when it talks about a lack of knowledge in the passage you mentioned, it's talking about a lack of revelation or understanding, not what we think of as knowledge.

There are many other passages where all these words are used interchangeably, but they all have their own distinct meanings. People don't perish just because they don't 'know' but often because they have received no revelation (which is a knowledge that is within you in such a way as to motivate and influence your life). God's people perish for lack of revelation, not lack of 'knowledge'. If you look at Pro. 29:18 in different translations, you will see that "Where there is no vision" basically means "where there is no revelation (inner illumination)". Revelation and wisdom are twins: the former gives you light (knowledge); the latter tells you what to do with it. Because of the primary importance of wisdom (first) and revelation (alongside it), Paul said in Eph. 1 that he prayed for God to give the Ephesians "a spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of Him."

Because a Christian cannot ever know and grasp or understand God and His ways without "a spirit of wisdom and revelation" (Jesus told His followers this same thing several times), which is simply a manifestation of the Holy Spirit as merged with the human spirit (look at 1Jn. 2:20, 26-27 where this merge is called "the anointing that remains within you" rather than the Holy Spirit or the human spirit), there are many Christians who have lots of information but who don't know who God is. The s is small in the Eph. 1 passage because it isn't just the Holy Spirit nor can it be an evil spirit nor the human spirit alone which has no ability to understand God alone; same in 1Jn. 2 with 'the anointing'. Without this 'spirit' which mentors us in the knowledge of God and this 'anointing' which teaches us the things of God (same thing), no person, Christian or non, is able to grasp, understand, or really come to know God and the ways and things of God. Wisdom is the foundation of everything that God builds (and without it, Christians are a complete wreck) as it says in Proverbs, and it is always at the beginning of God's works as Proverbs also says.
 
Feb 9, 2010
2,486
39
0
#19
Proverbs 1:7 KJV
The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge: but fools despise wisdom and instruction.

Proverbs 9:10 KJV
The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom: and the knowledge of the holy is understanding.

You do not have to look at what you receive first knowledge or wisdom but know when you come to God you do not have knowledge and wisdom but both are beginning to operate in your life.

It would seem like knowledge would come first because after you have knowledge for a while then you are wise about it.

The Bible says here is wisdom,let he that has understanding count the number of the beast for it is the number of a man,so having understanding causes wisdom,so it seems like wisdom is a result of having much knowledge about something for you become wise in that area.

Like in China they call the old people wise because they have many years of knowledge in the Chinese way.

 
Last edited:
Jan 6, 2012
1,233
10
0
#20
Proverbs 1:7 KJV
The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge: but fools despise wisdom and instruction.

Proverbs 9:10 KJV
The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom: and the knowledge of the holy is understanding.

You do not have to look at what you receive first knowledge or wisdom but know when you come to God you do not have knowledge and wisdom but both are beginning to operate in your life.

It would seem like knowledge would come first because after you have knowledge for a while then you are wise about it.

The Bible says here is wisdom,let he that has understanding count the number of the beast for it is the number of a man,so having understanding causes wisdom,so it seems like wisdom is a result of having much knowledge about something for you become wise in that area.

Like in China they call the old people wise because they have many years of knowledge in the Chinese way.


It's one of many things in the Bible that no one can wrap their minds around which is okay, because you are supposed to let your spirit comprehend it. Your mind will go round and round. Spiritual mathematics (like quantim physics) is vastly different from natural mathematics (like the laws of phsyics). Like in so many instances, this is where you will need the help of the Holy Spirit who was sent to lead us into all truth.