When Has God Gathered After He Scattered Without Any Repentance?

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Kolistus

Well-known member
Feb 3, 2020
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#61
Revelation’s symbolism requires interpretation - “Jews” and “Israel” in Revelation refers to Christianity because they are followers of Jesus.


Zechariah 14:1-5 KJV
[1] Behold, the day of the Lord cometh, and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee. [2] For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city. [3] Then shall the Lord go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle. [4] And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south. [5] And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the Lord my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.


https://tbibl.es/19ss
Sure, He works to “lead thee to repentance”, after which He can fulfill His promise to gather His people after they cry out to Him for it.

God had nothing to do with 1948 - the last remaining Israelite tribe, Judah, was scattered to the four winds after 70 A.D. and since “restoration” of literal Israelites is now impossible due to both dispersion and disqualification, only SPIRITUAL ISRAELITES are recipients of the promises. :)
You quoted the Zechariah chapter but provided no commentary, how exactly can that be fulfilled in your view?

If God cannot restore the descendants of Jacob then God lied and we have a problem.
 

Journeyman

Well-known member
Jan 10, 2019
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#62
The gathering of God's people is accomplished by becoming one with him,

That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him: Eph.1:10

For thy Maker is thine husband; the LORD of hosts is his name; and thy Redeemer the Holy One of Israel; The God of the whole earth shall he be called. Isa.54:5

he that is joined unto the Lord is one spirit. 1Cor.6:17

This gathering has been going on for a long time.
 
Aug 3, 2019
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#63
According to Bible prophecy they are, not all of them, but some of them.

Proof is in chapters like Revelation 11, Zechariah 14 and many others. Where Jerusalem is center stage in Bible prophecy, end time events and there are Jews there.
Prophecies are conditional. Zechariah's prophecy to Israel was on condition that they would get their act together and announce to the world the arrival of the Messiah in Bethlehem.

They blew it, and thus God could not fulfill His promises to them. Good gravy, man, Jesus HIMSELF said that the kingdom was to be "taken from them and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof" which is the church. Sure, certain elements of Zechariah's prophecy will be fulfilled by the church, just as Jonah's prophecy went unfulfilled, but eventually Nineveh was destroyed at a much later date.
 
Aug 3, 2019
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#64
You quoted the Zechariah chapter but provided no commentary, how exactly can that be fulfilled in your view?

If God cannot restore the descendants of Jacob then God lied and we have a problem.
Sorry, I was on my phone and couldn't see the screen well.

Israel is done. The tribes are gone. God is not a liar, prophecy is conditional. If the church doesn't get it's act together, God will have to "remove thy candlestick from it's place" and fulfill the prophecies to the church in something else, too.
 
Aug 3, 2019
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#65
With respect to Revelations the Jews spoken about have been converted

We have seen many scriptures which begin with the word " in the latter days" if the Jews are no more how can they have prophecies relating to the latter days.

This is the amazing miracle of the Jews. No other ethnic group could have survived 2, ooo years of dispersion among the nations but they have. it is PROOF that God still has a purpose and a plan for them.
And neither are those poeple who occupy the land Jews because GOD HAS NEVER gathered anyone back to the land unless they first repent of that caused Him to scatter them in the first place...have those "Jews" ever repented of killing Jesus? No, they're planning to rebuilt a temple, in which the resumption of their sacrificial system will be a middle finger in the face of God. They are descendants of the pagan Khazarian Empire. Check it out for yourself.
 

Kolistus

Well-known member
Feb 3, 2020
538
273
63
#66
Prophecies are conditional. Zechariah's prophecy to Israel was on condition that they would get their act together and announce to the world the arrival of the Messiah in Bethlehem.

They blew it, and thus God could not fulfill His promises to them. Good gravy, man, Jesus HIMSELF said that the kingdom was to be "taken from them and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof" which is the church. Sure, certain elements of Zechariah's prophecy will be fulfilled by the church, just as Jonah's prophecy went unfulfilled, but eventually Nineveh was destroyed at a much later date.
Proof that prophecy is conditional? I did not see any conditions mentioned in Zechariah 14 or the Isaiah restoration passages.

If you show me the proof that prophecy is conditional I will recant my beliefs on modern state of Israel
 

Evmur

Well-known member
Feb 28, 2021
2,896
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London
#67
And neither are those poeple who occupy the land Jews because GOD HAS NEVER gathered anyone back to the land unless they first repent of that caused Him to scatter them in the first place...have those "Jews" ever repented of killing Jesus? No, they're planning to rebuilt a temple, in which the resumption of their sacrificial system will be a middle finger in the face of God. They are descendants of the pagan Khazarian Empire. Check it out for yourself.
they killed Jesus by God's predeterminate will.

They are an elect people, even when they do evil God turns it around for good.

I've read all that anti-semite rubbish, I didn't buy it, you did.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#68
if one would study prophecy, they would see that Israel repents after the time of the gentile is up (romans 11) After the time of Jacobs trouble, also known as the great tribulation. When God himself comes and gathers them from all the nations after they repent.

There will be no regathering and peace until they repent according to Lev 26
 

Evmur

Well-known member
Feb 28, 2021
2,896
1,594
113
London
#69
if one would study prophecy, they would see that Israel repents after the time of the gentile is up (romans 11) After the time of Jacobs trouble, also known as the great tribulation. When God himself comes and gathers them from all the nations after they repent.

There will be no regathering and peace until they repent according to Lev 26
Zech.12
"And I will pour out on the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem a spirit of compassion and supplication so that when they look upon Him whom they have pierced they shall mourn for Him as one mourns for an only child and weep bitterly over Him as for as one weeps for a firstborn."
 

Evmur

Well-known member
Feb 28, 2021
2,896
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London
#70
If God's word concerning Israel's fall from grace came to pass His promise of their restoration will also surely come to pass.
 
Aug 3, 2019
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#71
they killed Jesus by God's predeterminate will.
So, exactly what does that have to do with God's explicitly stated requirement that His people repent of whatever caused Him to scatter them before He would gather them? Last time I checked, "Israel" has not repented.
They are an elect people, even when they do evil God turns it around for good. I've read all that anti-semite rubbish, I didn't buy it, you did.
Isaiah:
5:5 And now go to; I will tell you what I will do to my vineyard: I will take away the hedge thereof, and it shall be eaten up; [and] break down the wall thereof, and it shall be trodden down:
5:6 And I will lay it waste: it shall not be pruned, nor digged; but there shall come up briers and thorns: I will also command the clouds that they rain no rain upon it.
5:7 For the vineyard of the LORD of hosts [is] the house of Israel, and the men of Judah his pleasant plant: and he looked for judgment, but behold oppression; for righteousness, but behold a cry.

Matthew:
21:40 When the lord therefore of the vineyard cometh, what will he do unto those husbandmen?
21:41 They say unto him, He will miserably destroy those wicked men, and will let out [his] vineyard unto other husbandmen, which shall render him the fruits in their seasons.
21:42 Jesus saith unto them, Did ye never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner: this is the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes?
21:43 Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.


Can you believe how "anti-Semitic" Jesus was toward His "elect" people??? :ROFL:
 

Journeyman

Well-known member
Jan 10, 2019
2,043
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#72
.have those "Jews" ever repented of killing Jesus?
Brother,
Some of them did repent,

Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls. Act.2:41

Also, there were many who repented of their sins during our Lords earthly ministry. Even among the leaders Jn.12:42
 
Aug 3, 2019
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#73
Brother,
Some of them did repent,

Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls. Act.2:41

Also, there were many who repented of their sins during our Lords earthly ministry. Even among the leaders Jn.12:42
Sorry, I meant as a nation they hadn't repented...for another 40 years, they persecuted Jesus until the armies of Rome came and scattered them.
 

Journeyman

Well-known member
Jan 10, 2019
2,043
737
113
#74
they killed Jesus by God's predeterminate will.

They are an elect people, even when they do evil God turns it around for good.

I've read all that anti-semite rubbish, I didn't buy it, you did.
Brother,
Gods people are believers, whether Jew or gentile,

What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded Rom.11:7

It was never Gods will for his Son to be killed. It was Gods will to show just how much men hate him and his love for us in spite of it.
 
Aug 3, 2019
3,744
506
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#75
Brother,
Gods people are believers, whether Jew or gentile,

What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded Rom.11:7

It was never Gods will for his Son to be killed. It was Gods will to show just how much men hate him and his love for us in spite of it.
Amen. While God is still willing to save individual Jewish branches, I don't believe they are anymore the subject of the fulfillment of prophecy, especially when every promise and prophecy can be shown to be fuliflled by the church.
 

Journeyman

Well-known member
Jan 10, 2019
2,043
737
113
#76
if one would study prophecy, they would see that Israel repents after the time of the gentile is up (romans 11) After the time of Jacobs trouble, also known as the great tribulation. When God himself comes and gathers them from all the nations after they repent.

There will be no regathering and peace until they repent according to Lev 26
Brother,
"Jacobs trouble" is epitomised in the suffering of our God and he came and is gathering the repentant to this day.
 

Journeyman

Well-known member
Jan 10, 2019
2,043
737
113
#77
Sorry, I meant as a nation they hadn't repented...for another 40 years, they persecuted Jesus until the armies of Rome came and scattered them.
Unbelievers persecuted believers. There were many Jews who saw the injustices being done to Jesus and didnt agree with it.
 

Journeyman

Well-known member
Jan 10, 2019
2,043
737
113
#78
Amen. While God is still willing to save individual Jewish branches, I don't believe they are anymore the subject of the fulfillment of prophecy, especially when every promise and prophecy can be shown to be fuliflled by the church.
The "church" is composed of believer, both OT and NT.
 

Journeyman

Well-known member
Jan 10, 2019
2,043
737
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#80
Yep, "the church that was in the wilderness" spoken of by Stephen.
Yes. Here's the gathering,

He has delivered us from the dominion of darkness and transferred us to the kingdom of his beloved Son Col.1:13