Why Does the Bible Contain Explicit Narratives?
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K
Ok but I dont think its saying what you think it is. You are thinking oral sex, just going to lay this all out there.I understand by todays standards you would read that and see oral sex. There is an old song written years ago that said "make love to me". It was back in the day that that phrase had a totally different meaning then it does today. It was not saying "have sex with me",but to us,that is what we would take it to mean. So I think you are getting an image that is not there. This is not porn. You may be reading it that way because of the way sex is seen today. But its not what you assume it is.
Hello umzza
I will throw in my two cents.
My thinking is that one of the reasons the Song of Solomon is in scripture is to set a example that a love relationship between man and wife is not dirty or pornographic . God knew that we would desire to be not to displease Him in our marriages . So God in his wisdom placed the book there to show us that He (God) made the love relationship and it is to be enjoyed by every married couple.
Blesdings
Bill
I will throw in my two cents.
My thinking is that one of the reasons the Song of Solomon is in scripture is to set a example that a love relationship between man and wife is not dirty or pornographic . God knew that we would desire to be not to displease Him in our marriages . So God in his wisdom placed the book there to show us that He (God) made the love relationship and it is to be enjoyed by every married couple.
Blesdings
Bill
Now that I have stopped laughing, I can answer a little about how you feel we should maintain the customs of thousands of years ago.
Did you know that contractual deals were settled (shook on, in modern terms) between men in those days by reaching between each other's legs and grasping the inside of the other guy's thigh?
Divorces were declared by taking off a shoe, and throwing it.
There are a bunch of strange things like that, which if attempted today, might get you a black eye. LOL You need to learn that the Bible was written 'for' us to read.... but it was written 'TO' them at that time, in that culture.
Did you know that contractual deals were settled (shook on, in modern terms) between men in those days by reaching between each other's legs and grasping the inside of the other guy's thigh?
Divorces were declared by taking off a shoe, and throwing it.
There are a bunch of strange things like that, which if attempted today, might get you a black eye. LOL You need to learn that the Bible was written 'for' us to read.... but it was written 'TO' them at that time, in that culture.
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NO,,,it is not "hard to have faith THEN."
God tells us that "It is the glory of God to conceal a thing: but the honour of kings is to search out a matter." Prob. 25:2
or as my signature states, it is up to US to find out if what has been told is true. Acts 17:11
There are and were times, I doubted the Bible but still had faith in Jesus Christ. One did not and should not affect the other. Everybody has their doubt about the Bible at times, yet your faith in Jesus Christ should never faulter even while searching out the truth of His Book.
You see, I had always been told the New Testament was what was to be followed in the Bible. Then one day I was told that "what was concealed in the OT was revealed in the NT and what was concealed in the NT was revealed in the OT."
I began stealing away time to listen to voices (teachers, preachers, etc.) that taught the Bible as a complete Book (both OT and NT). After listening, I would search the scriptures, study (Hermeneutics, Hebrew, Koinoia Greek, etc.of the Bible) endlessly until one day I decided on my own that the Bible was the Inerrant Word of GOD that could be proven.
I have never doubted it since then and as I said before, I am still finding little bits of scripture or information that puts a different light on an area of seemingly contradiction. This light usually connects the other verses to clear up the contradiction.
(i.e. example)... In Daniel 9:27, the scripture tell us of that "he' (antichrist) will confirm a covenant with many which then starts the 70th week or 7 years of tribulations (God's Wrath).
Well if we look at this, we see the antichrist but still are missing two characters. The two (at least two) making the covenant. Rem. the Antichrist (he) only CONFIRMS the covenant. Now 'CONFIRM' could mean 'enforce'. Keep that in mind for later.
We do not know who are the two other parties. In Rev.11, the Israelites are rebuilding the temple. AH,,,,now we know what the covenant is..to rebuild the temple and we know one of the parties but the other????????????
Then hidden away in Isaiah 28:15...we find that Israel is making a covenant between themselves, Death and Hell. Who are these characters...We find them in Rev 6:8.... the 4th seal and the 'fourth horsemen' whose names are Death and Hell. The rest of Isaiah 28:15-end tells us why the covenant which shores up other sections of Revelation. It all comes together but it takes the OT and the NT to complete itself.
You see, unless you study the Bible and try to find out all the discrepancies that YOU are having a problem with, you will go on believing just about anything you are told.
I will tell you there are a few on this forum that will give you information about the Bible that is reliable. Take measure of every reply to your past and future questions. You will learn to weed them apart.
Blade
God tells us that "It is the glory of God to conceal a thing: but the honour of kings is to search out a matter." Prob. 25:2
or as my signature states, it is up to US to find out if what has been told is true. Acts 17:11
There are and were times, I doubted the Bible but still had faith in Jesus Christ. One did not and should not affect the other. Everybody has their doubt about the Bible at times, yet your faith in Jesus Christ should never faulter even while searching out the truth of His Book.
You see, I had always been told the New Testament was what was to be followed in the Bible. Then one day I was told that "what was concealed in the OT was revealed in the NT and what was concealed in the NT was revealed in the OT."
I began stealing away time to listen to voices (teachers, preachers, etc.) that taught the Bible as a complete Book (both OT and NT). After listening, I would search the scriptures, study (Hermeneutics, Hebrew, Koinoia Greek, etc.of the Bible) endlessly until one day I decided on my own that the Bible was the Inerrant Word of GOD that could be proven.
I have never doubted it since then and as I said before, I am still finding little bits of scripture or information that puts a different light on an area of seemingly contradiction. This light usually connects the other verses to clear up the contradiction.
(i.e. example)... In Daniel 9:27, the scripture tell us of that "he' (antichrist) will confirm a covenant with many which then starts the 70th week or 7 years of tribulations (God's Wrath).
Well if we look at this, we see the antichrist but still are missing two characters. The two (at least two) making the covenant. Rem. the Antichrist (he) only CONFIRMS the covenant. Now 'CONFIRM' could mean 'enforce'. Keep that in mind for later.
We do not know who are the two other parties. In Rev.11, the Israelites are rebuilding the temple. AH,,,,now we know what the covenant is..to rebuild the temple and we know one of the parties but the other????????????
Then hidden away in Isaiah 28:15...we find that Israel is making a covenant between themselves, Death and Hell. Who are these characters...We find them in Rev 6:8.... the 4th seal and the 'fourth horsemen' whose names are Death and Hell. The rest of Isaiah 28:15-end tells us why the covenant which shores up other sections of Revelation. It all comes together but it takes the OT and the NT to complete itself.
You see, unless you study the Bible and try to find out all the discrepancies that YOU are having a problem with, you will go on believing just about anything you are told.
I will tell you there are a few on this forum that will give you information about the Bible that is reliable. Take measure of every reply to your past and future questions. You will learn to weed them apart.
Blade
I thought romantic love was the topic of the book. Poets use all kinds of literary devices and metaphors and descriptors attempting to articulate their feelings, but they do not always mean what you might think they do. Love is a rose but you better not pick it, only grows when its on the vine. Hand full of thorns and you know you've missed it...
Explaining the various aspects of the Bible to an unbeliever is futile. The only thing an unbeliever needs explained is the Gospel of Christ, which should lead them to their repentance and salvation. Once they realize who Christ is and how much they need Him in their lives, then they can begin to learn of and understand other questions about Scripture.
Some of your responses thus far have a tinge of "troll" to them, and it would not surprise me to find out this is all this is about............you would not be the first to do so here. Your response to Multilingual is one in particular that raises Red Flags for me.
I am going to have to read all of your comments to see if I can pick up on some hints that you are a "recreation" of some other Screen Name no longer able to post here. There are a few similarities already, but I will wait to see.....
What was the Screen Name you used the last time you were here?
Some of your responses thus far have a tinge of "troll" to them, and it would not surprise me to find out this is all this is about............you would not be the first to do so here. Your response to Multilingual is one in particular that raises Red Flags for me.
I am going to have to read all of your comments to see if I can pick up on some hints that you are a "recreation" of some other Screen Name no longer able to post here. There are a few similarities already, but I will wait to see.....
What was the Screen Name you used the last time you were here?
Not if read with carnal eyes inciting to lust that can not be satisfied....where is godliness in that ?
I actually see your point....why is stuff like that in scripture ? the fault may well be ours for not reading it the way it was meant but as a weak and vulnerable human we are 'prone to influence of the wrong kind. Solomon may have been the wisest man but not our best example.
I actually see your point....why is stuff like that in scripture ? the fault may well be ours for not reading it the way it was meant but as a weak and vulnerable human we are 'prone to influence of the wrong kind. Solomon may have been the wisest man but not our best example.
My previous user name was Selenah. Joined in 2011 I think, not 2009. I was banned once when I was like 15 for reasons that are irrelavent now. I apologized and had my account reinstated. Haven't had any other issues. I asked to have my account deleted when about 19. I started a new account a couple a while after that. That's my story. You can look me up all you want. I need to go to bed now. Good night.
First, understanding the Bible really does require an understanding of hermeneutics, or Bible interpretation, which you do not have.
It is wrong, exegetically to read back into the culture of the Bible, from modern culture. You have judged and condemned SoS because it doesn't meet with your 20th century views of morality. (I say 20th, because it doesn't seem like 21st!). Solomon lived around 1000 BC. That is 3000 years ago. He was Jewish, but a very Middle Eastern type of Jewish. He is not morally bound to behave like you expect a a repressed, 1950's man to behave. Sex within marriage was totally acceptable and so was writing about it. Which brings me to my second point. (Yes, sex within marriage is still beautiful and acceptable today!)
God inspired the whole Bible. That means the words of SoS are just as much a part of the Word of God, as admonitions to repent and turn from your sin are in the New Testament. If it was left in the canon, first in the Hebrew canon and then in the Christian canon, it is there for a reason. It does show that God created the love between a man and a woman and the passion two married people can have for each other. If it stimulates you, that is your problem, not God's. Perhaps you need to wait to re-read it till you are married? I know as a married woman of 36 years it does not offend me.
So to criticize God and/or the Bible because YOU don't like what it says, you need to examine who is God and who is not! Because YOU are not God. You do not have the right to criticize God for what he has written through his servant Solomon. When God saved me, he told me to read the Bible and believe it. Basically, you are saying you don't believe the bible because of what? Sexual love between a man and wife? How tragic you have set yourself up as judge/jury/executioner. Because that is NOT your place. I tell you, I was much more insulted by you, than I have ever been by reading SoS. And calling it porn? What sort of narrow minded background do you come from, anyway?
And regarding an older man marrying a young woman, as many others have said, the Bible does not give Mary and Joseph's ages. But, just so you know, my grandmother was 16 when she married my grandfather who was almost 30. They had a wonderful loving marriage, and produced 6 children, and 17 grandchildren. In fact, the only thing that was wrong with that age gap, is that my grandfather died long before my grandmother, and she missed him every day till she died. That is how many cultures operated. There was no going through school with same ages and then likely marrying someone from that cohort. Instead, they met people in their small towns and village, and were grateful for arranged marriages that gave the women financial security and the men wives who would care for their homes and bear their children.
I think you need to repent of this whole thread and your self righteous anger, coming out of your ignorance. You ask questions, and when people give you answers, you claim they have not? Why? Because they haven't agreed with you? Please note, not one single person on this thread agrees with you in any way, shape or form.
And if you really are not a troll, I would suggest you take your 21 year old ignorance, and learn what the Bible says about the wisdom of your elders, which is pretty much everyone on this thread. I do hope you will realize that in my eyes, you are just a child, and what sounds like a very spoiled child, demanding the bible conform to your expectations, or you will hate and turn away from God. Wait about 10 or 20 years, listen and learn, and then decide what to do about those 6 verses. By then, you may even realize that they truly are inspired and have incredible wisdom for marriage.
It is wrong, exegetically to read back into the culture of the Bible, from modern culture. You have judged and condemned SoS because it doesn't meet with your 20th century views of morality. (I say 20th, because it doesn't seem like 21st!). Solomon lived around 1000 BC. That is 3000 years ago. He was Jewish, but a very Middle Eastern type of Jewish. He is not morally bound to behave like you expect a a repressed, 1950's man to behave. Sex within marriage was totally acceptable and so was writing about it. Which brings me to my second point. (Yes, sex within marriage is still beautiful and acceptable today!)
God inspired the whole Bible. That means the words of SoS are just as much a part of the Word of God, as admonitions to repent and turn from your sin are in the New Testament. If it was left in the canon, first in the Hebrew canon and then in the Christian canon, it is there for a reason. It does show that God created the love between a man and a woman and the passion two married people can have for each other. If it stimulates you, that is your problem, not God's. Perhaps you need to wait to re-read it till you are married? I know as a married woman of 36 years it does not offend me.
So to criticize God and/or the Bible because YOU don't like what it says, you need to examine who is God and who is not! Because YOU are not God. You do not have the right to criticize God for what he has written through his servant Solomon. When God saved me, he told me to read the Bible and believe it. Basically, you are saying you don't believe the bible because of what? Sexual love between a man and wife? How tragic you have set yourself up as judge/jury/executioner. Because that is NOT your place. I tell you, I was much more insulted by you, than I have ever been by reading SoS. And calling it porn? What sort of narrow minded background do you come from, anyway?
And regarding an older man marrying a young woman, as many others have said, the Bible does not give Mary and Joseph's ages. But, just so you know, my grandmother was 16 when she married my grandfather who was almost 30. They had a wonderful loving marriage, and produced 6 children, and 17 grandchildren. In fact, the only thing that was wrong with that age gap, is that my grandfather died long before my grandmother, and she missed him every day till she died. That is how many cultures operated. There was no going through school with same ages and then likely marrying someone from that cohort. Instead, they met people in their small towns and village, and were grateful for arranged marriages that gave the women financial security and the men wives who would care for their homes and bear their children.
I think you need to repent of this whole thread and your self righteous anger, coming out of your ignorance. You ask questions, and when people give you answers, you claim they have not? Why? Because they haven't agreed with you? Please note, not one single person on this thread agrees with you in any way, shape or form.
And if you really are not a troll, I would suggest you take your 21 year old ignorance, and learn what the Bible says about the wisdom of your elders, which is pretty much everyone on this thread. I do hope you will realize that in my eyes, you are just a child, and what sounds like a very spoiled child, demanding the bible conform to your expectations, or you will hate and turn away from God. Wait about 10 or 20 years, listen and learn, and then decide what to do about those 6 verses. By then, you may even realize that they truly are inspired and have incredible wisdom for marriage.