Will Some NonChristians (Unbelievers) Get to Heaven?

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Johnny_B

Senior Member
Mar 18, 2017
1,938
58
48
#21
I believe so... Personally, I believe that God can still work with a person even after death, so that all may come to the knowledge of the truth about His Son Jesus Christ...

I get this from the bible...

The bible says that all tounges will confess that Jesus Christ is the Lord for the Glory of the Father...

The only thing is... I don't know how all of it works, exactly and it's deemed of course heresy, because I believe this way.

2 Peter: 9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

2 Philippians 2: 10 that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth, 11and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

1 Timothy 2:3This is good and pleasing in the sight of God our Savior, 4who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth

1 Peter 3: 18 For Christ also suffered for sins once for all, the righteous for the unrighteous, to bring you to God. He was put to death in the body, but made alive in the spirit, 19 in which He also went and preached to the spirits in prison 20who disobeyed long ago when God waited patiently in the days of Noah, while the ark was being built.

I mean I don't understand 100%, but God knows my heart of this subject, here that is being asked...

There are people who actually want people to be in hell forever, or expect them to be in hell forever and ever, but Hell isn't forever from what the bible says in the revelation, that Hell/Hades gives up it's dead out of it...

God will Judge, and I want every one to turn to God, and come to repentance, just like the Lord desires, but many people say no no no matthew, no no no...

But I don't care about what they say, I want God to win and Him, to get what He desires!


People at funerals when the preacher tells them the person that died, is now with the Lord, and that person didn't believe.

Some people that are there in the back of their mind could be like well this preacher is lying saying He is with the Lord He is really in hell...

One more notice, do you just go up to someone who lost say like their mom and their mom didnt believe in God, do you just go up and say, I'm sorry your mom is in hell forever and ever?

I don't understand it, nor ever will...
You are misinterpreting I Peter 3:18-20 “For Christ also suffered once for sins, the just for the unjust, that He might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh but made alive by the Spirit,19 by whom also He went and preached to the spirits in prison,20 who formerly were disobedient, when once the Divine longsuffering waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was being prepared, in which a few, that is, eight souls, were saved through water.”

Jesus was made alive by the Spirit the Holy Spirit by whom also went. The question is when did He preach to them? Peter clears it up in his second epistle in chapter 2 verse 5 “For if God did not spare the angels who sinned, but cast them down to hell and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved for judgment;5 and did not spare the ancient world, but saved Noah, one of eight people, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood on the world of the ungodly;”

Noah preached to those people in his time, if Jesus preached to them. Them He is a liar and the Bible is not true. Noah was empowered by the Spirit by whom Jesus preached to those during Noah's time. This would mean that Jesus lied, Luke 16:24-26 “Then he cried and said, ‘Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.’25 But Abraham said, ‘Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things; but now he is comforted and you are tormented.26 And besides all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed, so that those who want to pass from here to you cannot, nor can those from there pass to us.’”

Jesus taught that once a person is in a place awaiting judgement they cannot pass to the other side, was He lying?

Also was the writer of Hebrews lying as well? Hebrews 9:27-28 “And as it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment,28 so Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many. To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time, apart from sin, for salvation.” Once man dies he is appointed to judgement.

So who is wrong Jesus or you? If Jesus is wrong or if I am please supply the Scriptures.

As far as hell being forever I'll make another post for that.
 

Chester

Senior Member
May 23, 2016
2,055
82
48
#22
Yes it is possible:

1 Cor 15:55“Where, O death, is your victory?Where, O death, is your sting?”[SUP]i[/SUP]

56The sting of death is sin, and the power of sin is the law. 57But thanks be to God! He gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.


Romans 7:7
What then shall we say? Is the Law sin? By no means! Indeed, I would not have been mindful of sin if not for the Law. For I would not have been aware of coveting if the Law had not said, "Do not covet."

The people who never heard the gospel or the good news of Jesus Christ don't know the law and therefore are not aware of any contravention and are blameless. This include mentally ill/Children/people of tribes living far from civilization.
I think those living in tribes far from civilization will get to heaven only through believing in Jesus. If they don't know the gospel story, they will not get in.

Mentally ill and children - good question - I want to hear people's perspectives . . .
 

Chester

Senior Member
May 23, 2016
2,055
82
48
#23
Where do non-believers get judged? Is the great white throne in heaven, the abode of God, or not?
Not sure what you are trying to say?

Do you mean that unbelievers will be in heaven when they are judged at the Great White Throne Judgment? You ask two questions and don't answer them . . .
 

jaybird88

Senior Member
Jan 7, 2015
3,996
57
48
#24
You are misinterpreting I Peter 3:18-20 “For Christ also suffered once for sins, the just for the unjust, that He might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh but made alive by the Spirit,19 by whom also He went and preached to the spirits in prison,20 who formerly were disobedient, when once the Divine longsuffering waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was being prepared, in which a few, that is, eight souls, were saved through water.”

Jesus was made alive by the Spirit the Holy Spirit by whom also went. The question is when did He preach to them? Peter clears it up in his second epistle in chapter 2 verse 5 “For if God did not spare the angels who sinned, but cast them down to hell and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved for judgment;5 and did not spare the ancient world, but saved Noah, one of eight people, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood on the world of the ungodly;”

Noah preached to those people in his time, if Jesus preached to them. Them He is a liar and the Bible is not true. Noah was empowered by the Spirit by whom Jesus preached to those during Noah's time. This would mean that Jesus lied, Luke 16:24-26 “Then he cried and said, ‘Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.’25 But Abraham said, ‘Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things; but now he is comforted and you are tormented.26 And besides all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed, so that those who want to pass from here to you cannot, nor can those from there pass to us.’”

Jesus taught that once a person is in a place awaiting judgement they cannot pass to the other side, was He lying?

Also was the writer of Hebrews lying as well? Hebrews 9:27-28 “And as it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment,28 so Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many. To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time, apart from sin, for salvation.” Once man dies he is appointed to judgement.

So who is wrong Jesus or you? If Jesus is wrong or if I am please supply the Scriptures.

As far as hell being forever I'll make another post for that.
he never said Jesus was a liar he was interpreting what the scriptures say. are you Jesus? if not, please stop placing your opinion as equal as Jesus. any opinion other than yours is "calling Jesus a liar" goodness, what arrogance.
 

Chester

Senior Member
May 23, 2016
2,055
82
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#25
Do you count being judged before a holy omnipotent God, Who is the creator of the universe and the giver of life, "miscellaneous"? If you are not found in Him at the end of this age, following the resurrection and judgment of all, you will perish. Also, life ever after will be on the new earth :)
Magenta,

I am not sure I am following what you are trying to say . . . maybe I am just "dim-witted" :p :confused:

Can you explain more?
 
Aug 7, 2016
203
7
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#26
Try not to read into what im saying thanks @ johnyb
 

Chester

Senior Member
May 23, 2016
2,055
82
48
#27
If the question is about being reconciled to God and attaining to life ever after, the Scriptures are pretty clear that is by grace through faith in the shed righteous blood of Christ, Who gave His life as an atoning sacrifice to pay the sin debt of the world. He is God. He baptizes with the Holy Spirit, causing a new birth in us, giving us the right to be called children of God. Those found in Him through the covering of His blood at the end of this age, have their names written in the Lamb's book of life, and live. Those not born again of the imperishable seed of Christ perish.

Got this post - that is - I understand it - and I agree!
 

Chester

Senior Member
May 23, 2016
2,055
82
48
#28
that would depend on what your calling a non believer.

if someone is living by what Jesus taught, but never heard of Him, do you really think the Father would send them to hell? IMO that person is a believer.
On that particular question, I think the Bible is very clear: Jesus said "I am the way, the truth, and the life, no man cometh unto the Father, but by me." There are not two ways into heaven: there is only one way.

It doesn't matter how a person lived: if they do not believe in the finished work of Jesus at Calvary (his death and resurrection), there is no salvation!

In my view, such a person as you describe is not a believer.
 
Aug 18, 2016
97
2
0
#29
There is only one way to get to Heaven, and He is the Way.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
23,391
1,326
113
#30
Not sure what you are trying to say?

Do you mean that unbelievers will be in heaven when they are judged at the Great White Throne Judgment? You ask two questions and don't answer them . . .
Questions are generally asked that another may answer them ;)
 

Chester

Senior Member
May 23, 2016
2,055
82
48
#31
This is what you were taught, but can you prove it biblical?

There is nothing in the Bible about "age of accountability." There is nothing in the Bible about aborted babies in heaven. That's man filling in the blanks.
Well, the phrase "age of accountability" is not there, but to say there is nothing in the Bible about it - I wouldn't say it that way . . .
 

Chester

Senior Member
May 23, 2016
2,055
82
48
#32
Questions are generally asked that another may answer them ;)
Ha! OK! I asked a question, you asked two in response, and finally I asked another: and now we have four questions on the loose! What the forum is for, right? (5 questions, now!)
 

Ahwatukee

Senior Member
Mar 12, 2015
6,970
258
83
#33
Hello MattG,

I believe so... Personally, I believe that God can still work with a person even after death, so that all may come to the knowledge of the truth about His Son Jesus Christ...

I get this from the bible...

The bible says that all tongues will confess that Jesus Christ is the Lord for the Glory of the Father...
You are partially correct, but it is not inferring that everyone who kneels and bows before the Lord are all saved. The inference is that, whether saved or unsaved, in heaven and on earth and under the earth, every knee shall bow and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord to the glory of God the Father, whether they are reconciled or not. This includes the fallen angels and all unsaved men.

By the way, God does not work with those who have died in their sins to bring them to salvation. For once a person dies God's grace and His mercy are no longer in operation for the person who has died without receiving Christ. God is looking for faith, those who will take Him at His word today, while individuals are still alive. If a person were to die in their sins and experience the torment of flame in Hades, then I can guarantee you that every individual would take His offer, not by faith, but to escape their torment and judgment. In that case there would be no one entering into everlasting fire, which we know is not true because the word of God already states that the road to destruction is wide and broad and many find its path.

2 Peter:3:9 - Instead he is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance./quote]

"Not wanting" anyone to perish, does not mean that everyone repents, but that God wants them to.

1 Timothy 2:3This is good and pleasing in the sight of God our Savior, who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth
Again, God "desires" all men to be saved and come to the knowledge of truth, but that does not mean that everyone does.

There are people who actually want people to be in hell forever, or expect them to be in hell forever and ever, but Hell isn't forever from what the bible says in the revelation, that Hell/Hades gives up it's dead out of it...
The verse that you are referring to above is regarding when the unrighteous dead are resurrected out of Hades, where they will stand before God at the great white throne judgment. The problem is that there are three words that translators (IMO) have erroneously translated as "Hell," which are Tartaroo, Hades and Geenna. Tartaroo/Tartarus is used only once in 2 Peter. Hades is referring to the place where all of the spirits of the unrighteous dead go which is under the earth. And geenna is another designation for the lake of fire, which is the final place of punishment.

Therefore, in the scripture that you quoted above, the spirits of the unrighteous dead will be released from Hell/Hades where they will have been in torment in flame, like the rich man and will receive a resurrect body and will be judged according to every work of sin that they committed in their lives and then will be thrown into the final place of punishment which is Hell/geenna, the lake of fire, which is also called the second death. The fact that these people will be coming out of Hades demonstrates that their names will not be found in the book of life. If it was, they would be in Hades in the first place.

There are people who actually want people to be in hell forever, or expect them to be in hell forever and ever
No true believer in Christ wants anyone to die without Christ and end up in the lake of fire. Our contention with those who say that punishment is not forever or that they get burned up right away, is for the sake of the truth of God's word, not that we want anyone to suffer. It is to proclaim what the truth of God's word says, which is why I am contending with you right now, because what you inferring is not the truth.

One more notice, do you just go up to someone who lost say like their mom and their mom didnt believe in God, do you just go up and say, I'm sorry your mom is in hell forever and ever?
No, you wouldn't say that to someone! For how does anyone know that prior to that person taking their last breath that they did not call on the name Jesus? We cannot and should not say where someone has gone, because that would be passing condemning judgment upon someone, which is the type of judgment that we are not to do. God will know whether or not that person received His Son before he died. If didn't then that person is lost. If he did, then he's saved. There is no do overs or invitations after dead. For a man is once to die, then comes the judgment.

My advise to you, is to put down the preterist books and get away from those teaching preterism and read the word of God in its plain and literal meaning, until a symbolic interpretation is required.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
23,391
1,326
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#34
Ha! OK! I asked a question, you asked two in response, and finally I asked another: and now we have four questions on the loose! What the forum is for, right? (5 questions, now!)
Questions are also asked to stimulate thought.

Sometimes it is better to allow the other to find the answers on their own :)

Any ways, you asked me about some relative recently? Whether or not he was saved? I wonder why you think I would be able to tell you the eternal fate of his soul. First of all, I have no idea if he was a true believer, or a nominal Christian. You probably don't even know that. Only God knows his heart. Also, there is the matter of 1 John 2:19. I myself was born and raised in a fairly strict religious household, but walked away from "all that" when I was sixteen, not coming to a saving faith until I was almost fifty.
 

jaybird88

Senior Member
Jan 7, 2015
3,996
57
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#35
On that particular question, I think the Bible is very clear: Jesus said "I am the way, the truth, and the life, no man cometh unto the Father, but by me." There are not two ways into heaven: there is only one way.
IMO this is the most misunderstood statement in the bible.

It doesn't matter how a person lived: if they do not believe in the finished work of Jesus at Calvary (his death and resurrection), there is no salvation!

In my view, such a person as you describe is not a believer.
if it makes no difference how one lives there life, why does Jesus go on and on and on teaching about how one lives their lives? what does Jesus say about the pharisees, do what they teach but dont do what they do. im pretty sure thy pharisees "believed" everything they taught, but they did not live this and Jesus had a big problem with this.

and by this philosophy all those that live by what Jesus taught, but never heard His name would have been better off had Jesus never came in the first place, i always thought it was the "good news" that sounds more like bad news to me.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
23,391
1,326
113
#36
Magenta,

I am not sure I am following what you are trying to say . . . maybe I am just "dim-witted" :p :confused:

Can you explain more?
Which part do you not understand? (Sorry, I just saw this)

I protest people saying we will be in heaven, as if it is to be our forever abode. The New Jerusalem comes down from heaven (God's abode) to the new earth, and the new earth is where those who have attained to life ever after will live.
 

JB2018

Senior Member
Jan 17, 2018
195
5
18
#37
No, they can not go to heaven.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
5,394
364
83
#38
There is nothing in the Bible about "age of accountability." There is nothing in the Bible about aborted babies in heaven. That's man filling in the blanks.
No, that's not man filling in the blanks, but Christians properly understanding the grace of God and the finished work of Christ. There is NO ONE who is predestined for Hell. Only those who are able to comprehend and obey the Gospel must obey the Gospel.
 

Ahwatukee

Senior Member
Mar 12, 2015
6,970
258
83
#39
Yes it is possible:

1 Cor 15:55“Where, O death, is your victory?Where, O death, is your sting?”[SUP]i[/SUP]

56The sting of death is sin, and the power of sin is the law. 57But thanks be to God! He gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.


Romans 7:7
What then shall we say? Is the Law sin? By no means! Indeed, I would not have been mindful of sin if not for the Law. For I would not have been aware of coveting if the Law had not said, "Do not covet."

The people who never heard the gospel or the good news of Jesus Christ don't know the law and therefore are not aware of any contravention and are blameless. This include mentally ill/Children/people of tribes living far from civilization.
Sorry Noose, not true and below is why:

"Then I saw another angel flying in midair, and he had the eternal gospel to proclaim to those who live on the earth—to every nation, tribe, language and people. He said in a loud voice, “Fear God and give him glory, because the hour of his judgment has come. Worship him who made the heavens, the earth, the sea and the springs of water.”

Therefore, everyone will have heard the eternal gospel, even the tribes in the Amazon or wherever people may be, they will have the gospel preached to them by an angel and will then have the opportunity to make a decision.

So no! It is not possible for an unbeliever to inherit the kingdom of God. That will be one of the reasons for the pouring out of God's wrath, which is a more drastic measure to get people to repent and turn to God. Anyone who doesn't will not inherit the kingdom of God.
 

TMS

Senior Member
Mar 21, 2015
1,104
35
48
#40
If you know what is right and don't do it you are a sinner?
Jas 4:17 Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin.
If i lived in a jungle or as a person that has no knowledge of Jesus and the ways of the bible i can safely say i didn't know, i was ignorant.
Act 17:30 And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:
I'm glad God is Judge of the heart and i do believe there will be people in heaven that died (after Christ) not knowing about Jesus, but had true hearts, or followed the spirits leading.