Deception to come, or is it here?

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JTB

Active member
Aug 31, 2021
193
96
28
#1
God Warns us about a deception to come in the end. For sure the world is steeped in deceptions - So why would He warn us about a specific one? Let’s look at a few of these passages:


1 Timothy 4:1 Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits
and doctrines of demons, 2 speaking lies in hypocrisy...

~
Matthew 24:3 As Jesus was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to him privately. “Tell us,” they said, “when will this happen, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?” 4 Jesus answered: “Watch out that no one deceives you. 5 For many will come in my name, claiming, ‘I am the Messiah,’ and will deceive many.
...
10 At that time many will turn away from the faith and will betray and hate each other, 11 and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people. 12 Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold, 13 but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved.
...
23 At that time if anyone says to you, ‘Look, here is the Messiah!’ or ‘There he is!’, do not believe it. 24 For false messiahs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. 25 See, I have told you ahead of time. 26 “So if anyone tells you, ‘There he is, out in the wilderness,’ do not go out; or, ‘Here he is, in the inner rooms,’ do not believe it.
~
Romans 16: 17 I urge you, brothers and sisters, to watch out for those who cause division and put obstacles in your way that are contrary to the teaching you have learned. Keep away from them. 18 For such people are not serving our Lord Christ, but their own appetites. By smooth talk and flattery they deceive the minds of naive people.
~
Mark 13:5 Jesus said to them:

Watch out that no one deceives you.

6 Many will come in my name, claiming, ‘I am he,’

and will deceive many.
~

Three things to note out of that is; the warning is to His faithful, the purpose of the deception is to draw them away from Him. And it will be brought by people claiming to be from Him.

Some believe this speaks of the liberal agenda. Their sexual immorality, abdication of personal responsibility, the murder of the unborn, the promotion of self over others, and the restriction of personal freedoms are definitely drawing people away from God and His truths. But… this deception is aimed at the world, and it is drawing the world astray. And given their promotion of atheism and polytheism, the left certainly does not claim to be from God.

So the warning God gives us about a deception aimed at us, is not about the left.

There’s a fallacy ingrained into our subconscious that says if you can’t go left, you have to go right. And that would be on the surface the thing to do. Promote personal responsibility. Family values. Sexual purity. Freedom. The truth. And hey, the guys pushing these say they’re from God!

But deceptions don’t run on the surface. They’re an undercurrent, washing away the footing and foundations of what they seem to be supporting on the surface.

Underneath the surface of ‘personal responsibility’ flows self-idolatry and mammon worship. Family values don’t include an honest day’s wage or truly caring for the sick and poor. Sexual purity involves hating and shaming the impure. Freedom is individual at the expense of the greater good. Truth now includes conspiracies and is application specific.

On the left, you walk away from the truth knowing you’re walking away from the truth.

On the right, you walk away from the truth thinking you are the truth.

And only one side claims to be of God.

To deceive the elect says Matthew 24. That is what we are warned about. False prophets coming in Jesus Name to deceive the elect and draw them away from Him.

That’s what God’s warning to us is today.
 
P

planitsoon

Guest
#2
Times lines and audience relevance are so often ignored :-( Why do people keep falling to apply everything left, right and cente to their own generation, even when the time stamp is clear of "this generation"? One canot simply change "this" into " "that" as Luke 17:25 says clearly that He, Jesus had to be rejected and suffer much by this generation, the Jews, which we know all happened. Jesus is not going to die again as His sacrifice was ones and for all. Paul says that the gospel went out to all the world in his time and that five times. Romans 1:8/10:18/16:26 and Col, 1:6/23. The end referred to was the fulflment of Jesus judgement in Matthew 23:35 which happened. We even know that it was Turnius Rufus who ploughed the former temple fields after every stone was taken away. Just as the words "until today" in Genesis 47:26 doesn't apply to Our Century, the same is the case with terms like "these last days (not those - meaning future); "this is the last hour" (not that will be the last hour) all written 2000 years ago for us now. The fact that Jesus was revealed in the fullness of time....so at the end...of an age/era (also called the last days or end times of the Old Covenant and the end of the temple system) says book chapters for those willing to be open and look outside their taught paradigm, not matter if that's Historicism or Dispensationalism. Start to learn history and learn about all the fullfilments of Matthew 24 that historic writers such as Josephus Flavius, Tacitus and Euesebius recorded. I was into this for 23 years myself before I realized that what I was taught was only one of four main stream views. There are books that compare all four views next to eachoter as well to make it easy. A good start in regards to learning our history would be "Days of vengeance" from Padfield onlinet. It's a compilation of what these historians saw what happened in their days and wrote down.W Or you just buy their orignal writings like "The works of Josephus Flavius" He was ordered by the Romans to record the history of the Jewish people during his captivity and included also everything that happened in his own time. We know that 1200 false prophets arose, the nine big earth quakes in the region, the many many wars that happened, why the pestilence all during that generation as Jesus said and more importantly. The Eastern Gate opening up all by itself in the middle of the night and the Jews freaking out that God had left them desolate which he did to the Romans who were Gods tool to fulfill Matthew 23:35.-Matthew 24:1-2. In Rome today the Arch of Titus still stands tall as a reminder of the war that lasted 42 months as the gentiles trembled the city. Luke 21/Rev.17.
 

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Gideon300

Well-known member
Mar 18, 2021
1,284
866
113
#3
God Warns us about a deception to come in the end. For sure the world is steeped in deceptions - So why would He warn us about a specific one? Let’s look at a few of these passages:


1 Timothy 4:1 Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits
and doctrines of demons, 2 speaking lies in hypocrisy...

~
Matthew 24:3 As Jesus was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to him privately. “Tell us,” they said, “when will this happen, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?” 4 Jesus answered: “Watch out that no one deceives you. 5 For many will come in my name, claiming, ‘I am the Messiah,’ and will deceive many.
...
10 At that time many will turn away from the faith and will betray and hate each other, 11 and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people. 12 Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold, 13 but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved.
...
23 At that time if anyone says to you, ‘Look, here is the Messiah!’ or ‘There he is!’, do not believe it. 24 For false messiahs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. 25 See, I have told you ahead of time. 26 “So if anyone tells you, ‘There he is, out in the wilderness,’ do not go out; or, ‘Here he is, in the inner rooms,’ do not believe it.
~
Romans 16: 17 I urge you, brothers and sisters, to watch out for those who cause division and put obstacles in your way that are contrary to the teaching you have learned. Keep away from them. 18 For such people are not serving our Lord Christ, but their own appetites. By smooth talk and flattery they deceive the minds of naive people.
~
Mark 13:5 Jesus said to them:

Watch out that no one deceives you.

6 Many will come in my name, claiming, ‘I am he,’

and will deceive many.
~

Three things to note out of that is; the warning is to His faithful, the purpose of the deception is to draw them away from Him. And it will be brought by people claiming to be from Him.

Some believe this speaks of the liberal agenda. Their sexual immorality, abdication of personal responsibility, the murder of the unborn, the promotion of self over others, and the restriction of personal freedoms are definitely drawing people away from God and His truths. But… this deception is aimed at the world, and it is drawing the world astray. And given their promotion of atheism and polytheism, the left certainly does not claim to be from God.

So the warning God gives us about a deception aimed at us, is not about the left.

There’s a fallacy ingrained into our subconscious that says if you can’t go left, you have to go right. And that would be on the surface the thing to do. Promote personal responsibility. Family values. Sexual purity. Freedom. The truth. And hey, the guys pushing these say they’re from God!

But deceptions don’t run on the surface. They’re an undercurrent, washing away the footing and foundations of what they seem to be supporting on the surface.

Underneath the surface of ‘personal responsibility’ flows self-idolatry and mammon worship. Family values don’t include an honest day’s wage or truly caring for the sick and poor. Sexual purity involves hating and shaming the impure. Freedom is individual at the expense of the greater good. Truth now includes conspiracies and is application specific.

On the left, you walk away from the truth knowing you’re walking away from the truth.

On the right, you walk away from the truth thinking you are the truth.

And only one side claims to be of God.

To deceive the elect says Matthew 24. That is what we are warned about. False prophets coming in Jesus Name to deceive the elect and draw them away from Him.

That’s what God’s warning to us is today.
It's been going on since at least the start of the 20th century. The restoration of the truth of the Baptism of the Holy Spirit was accompanied by lying signs and wonders. This was especially true of the Azusa Street revival, but the Welsh revival had problems also. In the 1990's, the so-called Toronto Blessing was 100% false. Some are prophesying that there will be a revival. Looking into it, I'm convinced that it will be another phony. I would be delighted to be proven wrong. It's not looking good. One of the "prophets" stated that the Holy Spirit is Lord. He takes one verse, misunderstands it, and ignores the rest of the Bible regarding the Lordship of Christ.

What could deceive the elect? It won't be anything worldly as we know enough not to accept the ways of the world. However, many do not know the difference between the spiritual and the supernatural. Many accepted the manifestations of the Toronto Blessing as being from God. Absolutely not. The manifestations were real, but the source is demonic. I have little confidence that God's people are better prepared to discern the next deception that comes along.

The Holy Spirit's job is described in John 16. Fundamentally, He takes what is of Lord Jesus and makes it known to believers. The Holy Spirit does not speak on His own initiative. When all you hear is "Holy Spirit" without any reference to the mighty name of Jesus, King of Kings and Lord of Lords, you should be on the highest alert. If God glorifies the Lord Jesus we should be doing the same.
 
Aug 4, 2021
586
175
43
#4
God Warns us about a deception to come in the end. For sure the world is steeped in deceptions - So why would He warn us about a specific one? Let’s look at a few of these passages:


1 Timothy 4:1 Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits
and doctrines of demons, 2 speaking lies in hypocrisy...

~
Matthew 24:3 As Jesus was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to him privately. “Tell us,” they said, “when will this happen, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?” 4 Jesus answered: “Watch out that no one deceives you. 5 For many will come in my name, claiming, ‘I am the Messiah,’ and will deceive many.
...
10 At that time many will turn away from the faith and will betray and hate each other, 11 and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people. 12 Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold, 13 but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved.
...
23 At that time if anyone says to you, ‘Look, here is the Messiah!’ or ‘There he is!’, do not believe it. 24 For false messiahs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. 25 See, I have told you ahead of time. 26 “So if anyone tells you, ‘There he is, out in the wilderness,’ do not go out; or, ‘Here he is, in the inner rooms,’ do not believe it.
~
Romans 16: 17 I urge you, brothers and sisters, to watch out for those who cause division and put obstacles in your way that are contrary to the teaching you have learned. Keep away from them. 18 For such people are not serving our Lord Christ, but their own appetites. By smooth talk and flattery they deceive the minds of naive people.
~
Mark 13:5 Jesus said to them:

Watch out that no one deceives you.

6 Many will come in my name, claiming, ‘I am he,’

and will deceive many.
~

Three things to note out of that is; the warning is to His faithful, the purpose of the deception is to draw them away from Him. And it will be brought by people claiming to be from Him.

Some believe this speaks of the liberal agenda. Their sexual immorality, abdication of personal responsibility, the murder of the unborn, the promotion of self over others, and the restriction of personal freedoms are definitely drawing people away from God and His truths. But… this deception is aimed at the world, and it is drawing the world astray. And given their promotion of atheism and polytheism, the left certainly does not claim to be from God.

So the warning God gives us about a deception aimed at us, is not about the left.

There’s a fallacy ingrained into our subconscious that says if you can’t go left, you have to go right. And that would be on the surface the thing to do. Promote personal responsibility. Family values. Sexual purity. Freedom. The truth. And hey, the guys pushing these say they’re from God!

But deceptions don’t run on the surface. They’re an undercurrent, washing away the footing and foundations of what they seem to be supporting on the surface.

Underneath the surface of ‘personal responsibility’ flows self-idolatry and mammon worship. Family values don’t include an honest day’s wage or truly caring for the sick and poor. Sexual purity involves hating and shaming the impure. Freedom is individual at the expense of the greater good. Truth now includes conspiracies and is application specific.

On the left, you walk away from the truth knowing you’re walking away from the truth.

On the right, you walk away from the truth thinking you are the truth.

And only one side claims to be of God.

To deceive the elect says Matthew 24. That is what we are warned about. False prophets coming in Jesus Name to deceive the elect and draw them away from Him.

That’s what God’s warning to us is today.
The verses are not for you then, since you contradict them and tell us to submit to the children of the lie, and sacrifice our faith for the socalled greater good. Opposite of what Jesus tried to tell us. And you are all wrong in your judgement of the sexually pure, that you call jugdemental. Stay with the children of the lie if you want.
 

ResidentAlien

Well-known member
Apr 21, 2021
965
342
63
#5
It's unbelievable the number of cult leaders that have arisen claiming to be Christ, and saying "the day (end) is at hand."
 

Icedaisey

Well-known member
Jul 19, 2021
1,360
436
83
#6
It's unbelievable the number of cult leaders that have arisen claiming to be Christ, and saying "the day (end) is at hand."
One such person now dead, California radio preacher Harold Camping.

Over a period spanning decades he claimed he knew the date and time of the second coming.

He reportedly spent $100 million to advertise the warnings around the world.

I remember a woman made news trying to block the bequeathment her mother had given Camping's ministry. Her entire multimillion dollar estate. She lost.

Before Camping met his maker he wrote a letter to his followers apologizing for being so wrong.

He had at his disposal $100 million dollars! And with money to spare.

Would have never happened if his followers weren't so gullible. And had bothered to read the Bible for themselves.

No one knows the day or time of the second coming. Only God knows.

The money frauds make for themselves is staggering.
 

ResidentAlien

Well-known member
Apr 21, 2021
965
342
63
#7
The Evangelical Industrial Complex has probably contributed more to the falling away and the great deception than anything. By EIC I mean Christianity as big business and as a vehicle for people to become celebrities.
 

JTB

Active member
Aug 31, 2021
193
96
28
#8
Times lines and audience relevance are so often ignored :-( Why do people keep falling to apply everything left, right and cente to their own generation, even when the time stamp is clear of "this generation"? One canot simply change "this" into " "that" as Luke 17:25 says clearly that He, Jesus had to be rejected and suffer much by this generation, the Jews, which we know all happened. Jesus is not going to die again as His sacrifice was ones and for all. Paul says that the gospel went out to all the world in his time and that five times. Romans 1:8/10:18/16:26 and Col, 1:6/23. The end referred to was the fulflment of Jesus judgement in Matthew 23:35 which happened. We even know that it was Turnius Rufus who ploughed the former temple fields after every stone was taken away. Just as the words "until today" in Genesis 47:26 doesn't apply to Our Century, the same is the case with terms like "these last days (not those - meaning future); "this is the last hour" (not that will be the last hour) all written 2000 years ago for us now. The fact that Jesus was revealed in the fullness of time....so at the end...of an age/era (also called the last days or end times of the Old Covenant and the end of the temple system) says book chapters for those willing to be open and look outside their taught paradigm, not matter if that's Historicism or Dispensationalism. Start to learn history and learn about all the fullfilments of Matthew 24 that historic writers such as Josephus Flavius, Tacitus and Euesebius recorded. I was into this for 23 years myself before I realized that what I was taught was only one of four main stream views. There are books that compare all four views next to eachoter as well to make it easy. A good start in regards to learning our history would be "Days of vengeance" from Padfield onlinet. It's a compilation of what these historians saw what happened in their days and wrote down.W Or you just buy their orignal writings like "The works of Josephus Flavius" He was ordered by the Romans to record the history of the Jewish people during his captivity and included also everything that happened in his own time. We know that 1200 false prophets arose, the nine big earth quakes in the region, the many many wars that happened, why the pestilence all during that generation as Jesus said and more importantly. The Eastern Gate opening up all by itself in the middle of the night and the Jews freaking out that God had left them desolate which he did to the Romans who were Gods tool to fulfill Matthew 23:35.-Matthew 24:1-2. In Rome today the Arch of Titus still stands tall as a reminder of the war that lasted 42 months as the gentiles trembled the city. Luke 21/Rev.17.
I believe God's word is eternal and echoes throughout history. As such one manifestation does not render it moot. It has been fulfilled in the past; it will be fulfilled in the future. On a grander scale than ever seen before.

God offered the Messiah to the Jews, the Jews rejected Him, and they suffered their tribulation for it. God then offered the Christ to the world, and the world is rejecting Him. So the world will suffer it's tribulation in the days to come.

Things were settled in the heavens in the time of Jesus. But things here on creation are yet to fully manifest that settlement.

But back to the subject, God's faithful being deceived away from Him at that time.
 

JTB

Active member
Aug 31, 2021
193
96
28
#9
It's been going on since at least the start of the 20th century. The restoration of the truth of the Baptism of the Holy Spirit was accompanied by lying signs and wonders. This was especially true of the Azusa Street revival, but the Welsh revival had problems also. In the 1990's, the so-called Toronto Blessing was 100% false. Some are prophesying that there will be a revival. Looking into it, I'm convinced that it will be another phony. I would be delighted to be proven wrong. It's not looking good. One of the "prophets" stated that the Holy Spirit is Lord. He takes one verse, misunderstands it, and ignores the rest of the Bible regarding the Lordship of Christ.

What could deceive the elect? It won't be anything worldly as we know enough not to accept the ways of the world. However, many do not know the difference between the spiritual and the supernatural. Many accepted the manifestations of the Toronto Blessing as being from God. Absolutely not. The manifestations were real, but the source is demonic. I have little confidence that God's people are better prepared to discern the next deception that comes along.

The Holy Spirit's job is described in John 16. Fundamentally, He takes what is of Lord Jesus and makes it known to believers. The Holy Spirit does not speak on His own initiative. When all you hear is "Holy Spirit" without any reference to the mighty name of Jesus, King of Kings and Lord of Lords, you should be on the highest alert. If God glorifies the Lord Jesus we should be doing the same.
It's been going on since Jesus ascended. Again, God's word echoes thru time. It has been manifested, it is being manifested, and will be manifested in the future. What we see in the end times isn't anything new, it's just one final reverberation at a grander scale than ever before.

And that includes the deception. Those spirits have been in play since the beginning. But again, this final deception will be at a grander scale than ever before.

And ensnare more of faithful. That's why it get's it's own especial warning.
 

SaltwaterGirl

Well-known member
Sep 18, 2021
357
356
63
#10
Yes, @JTB I believe that the deception of the end times will be a falling away from the Faith—a deception whereby many will stop believing in the true Christ and instead, will worship the Antichrist. This is the great Apostasy.

2 Thessalonians 2

The Great Apostasy
2 Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, 2 not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of [a]Christ had come. 3 Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of [b]sin is revealed, the son of perdition, 4 who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits [c]as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.

5 Do you not remember that when I was still with you I told you these things? 6 And now you know what is restraining, that he may be revealed in his own time. 7 For the [d]mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only [e]He who now restrains will do so until He is taken out of the way. 8 And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming. 9 The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, 10 and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie, 12 that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
 

JTB

Active member
Aug 31, 2021
193
96
28
#11
The verses are not for you then, since you contradict them and tell us to submit to the children of the lie, and sacrifice our faith for the socalled greater good. Opposite of what Jesus tried to tell us. And you are all wrong in your judgement of the sexually pure, that you call jugdemental. Stay with the children of the lie if you want.
 

JTB

Active member
Aug 31, 2021
193
96
28
#12
Yes, @JTB I believe that the deception of the end times will be a falling away from the Faith—a deception whereby many will stop believing in the true Christ and instead, will worship the Antichrist. This is the great Apostasy.

2 Thessalonians 2

The Great Apostasy
2 Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, 2 not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of [a]Christ had come. 3 Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of [b]sin is revealed, the son of perdition, 4 who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits [c]as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.

5 Do you not remember that when I was still with you I told you these things? 6 And now you know what is restraining, that he may be revealed in his own time. 7 For the [d]mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only [e]He who now restrains will do so until He is taken out of the way. 8 And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming. 9 The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, 10 and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie, 12 that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
Everyone knows about the mark of the beast, yet few are versed on the apostasy. I find that curious seeing as Paul put them on an equal footing.

And it's worth noting that this apostasy, which is turning away from both God and/or His truths, applies to the faithful and not the world in general. You have to have faced God to turn from Him.

The deception comes in when you turn from Him without really realizing it.
 

SaltwaterGirl

Well-known member
Sep 18, 2021
357
356
63
#13
Everyone knows about the mark of the beast, yet few are versed on the apostasy. I find that curious seeing as Paul put them on an equal footing.

And it's worth noting that this apostasy, which is turning away from both God and/or His truths, applies to the faithful and not the world in general. You have to have faced God to turn from Him.

The deception comes in when you turn from Him without really realizing it.
I totally agree, JTB. It will be a sudden turning away from worshiping the true Christ.
 

JTB

Active member
Aug 31, 2021
193
96
28
#15
I totally agree, JTB. It will be a sudden turning away from worshiping the true Christ.
I'm not sure it will be sudden. Deception is brought on slowly so as to not be recognized as such. And the spirit of deception has been in this world since the start. Again God's word is eternal, it echoes thru time, and manifests thru time. What we see in the end is nothing new, they are just the final earthly manifestations at a far greater scale than ever before. And that's why I think Paul noted it, not for it's sudden onset but for it's scale and size.
 

SaltwaterGirl

Well-known member
Sep 18, 2021
357
356
63
#17
I'm not sure it will be sudden. Deception is brought on slowly so as to not be recognized as such. And the spirit of deception has been in this world since the start. Again God's word is eternal, it echoes thru time, and manifests thru time. What we see in the end is nothing new, they are just the final earthly manifestations at a far greater scale than ever before. And that's why I think Paul noted it, not for it's sudden onset but for it's scale and size.
I understand what you’re saying, but let’s also consider the great apostasy of the end times. Let’s say that a person has been a Christian all his life. One day comes when he hears on the news, ‘Look, here is the Christ!’ or ‘There!’ and instantly, he believes the lie! and he begins to worship this false christ—this abomination of desolation! What has he done? He has taken the mark of the beast! He has been deceived by the greatest Deceiver of all time, the Father of Lies! This is the great Apostasy, and it shall take the world by storm! Suddenly, people will turn from worshiping the true Christ to worshiping the false Christ. The Bible tells us over and over “Do not be deceived.” The choice is ours.
. . .
Matthew 24:23-25

23 “Then if anyone says to you, ‘Look, here is the Christ!’ or ‘There!’ do not believe it. 24 For false christs and false prophets will rise and show great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. 25 See, I have told you beforehand.
 

JTB

Active member
Aug 31, 2021
193
96
28
#18
I understand what you’re saying, but let’s also consider the great apostasy of the end times. Let’s say that a person has been a Christian all his life. One day comes when he hears on the news, ‘Look, here is the Christ!’ or ‘There!’ and instantly, he believes the lie! and he begins to worship this false christ—this abomination of desolation! What has he done? He has taken the mark of the beast! He has been deceived by the greatest Deceiver of all time, the Father of Lies! This is the great Apostasy, and it shall take the world by storm! Suddenly, people will turn from worshiping the true Christ to worshiping the false Christ. The Bible tells us over and over “Do not be deceived.” The choice is ours.
. . .
Matthew 24:23-25

23 “Then if anyone says to you, ‘Look, here is the Christ!’ or ‘There!’ do not believe it. 24 For false christs and false prophets will rise and show great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. 25 See, I have told you beforehand.
There's an additional scenario ... pre trib believers 'wake up' one day to find they are in the thick of the tribulation, and realize they were wrong about escaping it. They're not ready to accept the persecution, and question 'well if I was wrong about that what else might I be wrong about' and find themselves more vulnerable to being led astray by false prophets.
 

ResidentAlien

Well-known member
Apr 21, 2021
965
342
63
#19
Seems to me, the key verse in 2 Thessalonians 2 is v.10: ". . .and with all wicked deception for those who are perishing, because they refused to love the truth and so be saved."

The root of all the deception in the church stems from one basic fact: people don't care about truth. This has never been more clear to me than right now. If people don't care about truth, they leave themselves open to every form of deception. People would rather be entertained and feel good. Truth is pretty much at the bottom of a growing number of people's list of priorities.

So how will so many people be deceived and believe the Antichrist's lies? It's simple: they didn't love truth.
 

JTB

Active member
Aug 31, 2021
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#20
Seems to me, the key verse in 2 Thessalonians 2 is v.10: ". . .and with all wicked deception for those who are perishing, because they refused to love the truth and so be saved."

The root of all the deception in the church stems from one basic fact: people don't care about truth. This has never been more clear to me than right now. If people don't care about truth, they leave themselves open to every form of deception. People would rather be entertained and feel good. Truth is pretty much at the bottom of a growing number of people's list of priorities.

So how will so many people be deceived and believe the Antichrist's lies? It's simple: they didn't love truth.
Great point and that will certainly be one aspect in play. But does abandoning the truth require fealty to the antichrist? It seems to me many Christians will reject the antichrist while still turning from God's Truth - and believing they haven't. That to me seems to be the biggest of all the deceptions ... and the deception God specifically warns believers about ... turning from God's truth while believing you haven't. That's the one that gets the elect off track.