Disapointed In Trump SOTU

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

RickyZ

Senior Member
Sep 20, 2012
9,635
787
113
The government should not have the right to force me or anyone else to have insurance.
This is true. But isn't it also true that the government should not force me or anyone else to pay for your medical care?
 
7

7seasrekeyed

Guest
Canadian politics

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz


exciting news:











and we have our own scandalous types of course







not the country I grew up in......................:(
 

RickyZ

Senior Member
Sep 20, 2012
9,635
787
113
Naturally you don't provide sources to back up your claim they were loaded with pork.

If you read my entire post you would notice I mentioned 9 11 rescue workers and other veteran issues would would imply more than one bill. Were they all loaded with pork? Even when Bush Jr and the GoP were in charge?

https://medium.com/driftwood-chronicle/republicans-vote-against-our-veterans-again-a23be5a368ca

People claim to care about vets, but I believe this is nonsense and only a tactic to cloak oneself in false patriotism to attack "the other guy".
When was the last bill that WASN'T loaded with pork?
 

notuptome

Senior Member
May 17, 2013
15,050
2,538
113
This is true. But isn't it also true that the government should not force me or anyone else to pay for your medical care?
Can't refuse care and have you die on the sidewalk. Then we will get stuck with the clean up and disposal of the corpse. A fine kettle of fish we have here.

No health insurance and need medical care? Rob a bank and have the federal penitentiary cover your bills.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 

RickyZ

Senior Member
Sep 20, 2012
9,635
787
113
Can't refuse care and have you die on the sidewalk. Then we will get stuck with the clean up and disposal of the corpse. A fine kettle of fish we have here.

No health insurance and need medical care? Rob a bank and have the federal penitentiary cover your bills.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
It is a fine kettle of fish indeed. Danged if you do and danged if you don't.

Let's extrapolate to another related issue - if you can't afford a roof or food, should we make someone else pay for them for you?

The point being that the Republicans abhor paying taxes to provide services to the poor. So if they don't want to tax themselves to pay for healthcare food or rent, then how do you provide healthcare food and rent for the poor?
 

notuptome

Senior Member
May 17, 2013
15,050
2,538
113
It is a fine kettle of fish indeed. Danged if you do and danged if you don't.

Let's extrapolate to another related issue - if you can't afford a roof or food, should we make someone else pay for them for you?

The point being that the Republicans abhor paying taxes to provide services to the poor. So if they don't want to tax themselves to pay for healthcare food or rent, then how do you provide healthcare food and rent for the poor?
Jesus said the poor you have with you always.

The church is to care for the poor and destitute not the state.

Yeah that one is a toughie.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
Nov 23, 2016
510
37
0
It would be bad if what you were saying was accurate. Canada has been very tough on terrorists and a key player in driving back Isis. About 60 people who went overseas to join these groups have returned. The Prime Minister has spoken forcibly on prosecuting these individuals but also spoken about programs to prevent radicalization and deprogram those who have been.

If some people who are not directly responsible for attacks on Canada or our allies can be saved I don't see a problem with that. Otherwise I support full prosecution for treason and all other applicable crimes.

I am a card carrying member of the conservative party, just to preempt likely accusations of being some lefty liberal party voter. I did not vote for Justin Trudeau but I believe in working with the current government, not being obstinate.

https://globalnews.ca/news/3889240/liberals-isis-fighters-canada-open-arms/

From your article;

“But we also have methods of de-emphasizing or de-programming people who want to harm our society, and those are some things we have to move forward on.”

Agreed .. move forward on it .. and fly them back home.

Public Safety Minister Ralph Goodale said Wednesday that the government has identified about 250 people with links to Canada who are suspected of travelling overseas to engage in terrorist activity .
This could involve front-line fighting, training, logistical support, fundraising or studying at extremist-influenced schools. Yet the number who have returned to Canada has remained largely unchanged at around 60 over the past two years, suggesting there has not been a sudden influx of terrorists into the country.

Only 60 ? Hope they relocate to your hometown.

Still, the government has refused to say much about those 60 individuals, including who they are, where they travelled, what they may have done, and what the government is doing about them.

Why ? Sex predators we know about. Canadian soldier enemies ? ... nah .. we're good ?? :confused: Really ?

Much of the current political furor has centred on a new government centre that is funding research and programs to stop radicalization and help people leave extremist groups like IS.

As for the centre, which has a budget of $35 million over the next five years, it will fund programs and initiatives run by local organizations and groups. That means "the federal government will not actually"be rehabilitating or re-integrating returnees.

I see. They're outsourcing it ... and paying for it (but not actually doing it though) ?? Textbook Liberalism 101

“Counter-terrorism is never one-dimensional in a democracy. Prevention and re-integration are simply strands within a comprehensive counter-terrorism approach.”

How bout' this approach ... deportation ??

“If you can’t prosecute them or there’s long delays in prosecuting them or if peace bonds are only a partially effective measure … we can just do nothing. Just let them loose in our society,” he said.
Or you try and have some kind of program available that they could be strongly encouraged to partake in these programs.

This ISN'T Canada's "only" option. Think deportation. Some kind of program ? .. lol Like colouring books and crayons ? Or autographed selfies with the PM for anybody who competes the course .. at gov't expense, of course ? No thanks. Not for this conservative.

Should the Liberals dedicate more resources to ensure anyone coming back to Canada who is a member of ISIL or another terrorist group is investigated and prosecuted? Could the government be more transparent in terms of who is returning and what is being done to ensure they don’t pose a threat to society?
These are fair questions.

But the Conservatives suggest there has been a sudden influx of IS members into Canada, and that the government is welcoming them with open arms, the experts say.
“(Raitt’s) statement is trying to play upon people’s emotions in a reactionary way instead of being practical and realistic,” Dawson said.

Ya want practical and realistic ? Anybody that assisted or fought for ISIL/ISIS is/was trying to kill our soldiers ! Let that sink in ... okay ?

"Card carrying member" .... Do the Conservatives a favour .. and rip it up.

 
Last edited:
S

Susanna

Guest

From your article;

“But we also have methods of de-emphasizing or de-programming people who want to harm our society, and those are some things we have to move forward on.”

Agreed .. move forward on it .. and fly them back home.

Public Safety Minister Ralph Goodale said Wednesday that the government has identified about 250 people with links to Canada who are suspected of travelling overseas to engage in terrorist activity .
This could involve front-line fighting, training, logistical support, fundraising or studying at extremist-influenced schools. Yet the number who have returned to Canada has remained largely unchanged at around 60 over the past two years, suggesting there has not been a sudden influx of terrorists into the country.

Only 60 ? Hope they relocate to your hometown.

Still, the government has refused to say much about those 60 individuals, including who they are, where they travelled, what they may have done, and what the government is doing about them.

Why ? Sex predators we know about. Canadian soldier enemies ? ... nah .. we're good ?? :confused: Really ?

Much of the current political furor has centred on a new government centre that is funding research and programs to stop radicalization and help people leave extremist groups like IS.

As for the centre, which has a budget of $35 million over the next five years, it will fund programs and initiatives run by local organizations and groups. That means "the federal government will not actually"be rehabilitating or re-integrating returnees.

I see. They're outsourcing it ... and paying for it (but not actually doing it though) ?? Textbook Liberalism 101

“Counter-terrorism is never one-dimensional in a democracy. Prevention and re-integration are simply strands within a comprehensive counter-terrorism approach.”

How bout' this approach ... deportation ??

“If you can’t prosecute them or there’s long delays in prosecuting them or if peace bonds are only a partially effective measure … we can just do nothing. Just let them loose in our society,” he said.
Or you try and have some kind of program available that they could be strongly encouraged to partake in these programs.

This ISN'T Canada's "only" option. Think deportation. Some kind of program ? .. lol Like colouring books and crayons ? Or autographed selfies with the PM for anybody who competes the course .. at gov't expense, of course ? No thanks. Not for this conservative.

Should the Liberals dedicate more resources to ensure anyone coming back to Canada who is a member of ISIL or another terrorist group is investigated and prosecuted? Could the government be more transparent in terms of who is returning and what is being done to ensure they don’t pose a threat to society?
These are fair questions.

But the Conservatives suggest there has been a sudden influx of IS members into Canada, and that the government is welcoming them with open arms, the experts say.
“(Raitt’s) statement is trying to play upon people’s emotions in a reactionary way instead of being practical and realistic,” Dawson said.

Ya want practical and realistic ? Anybody that assisted or fought for ISIL/ISIS is/was trying to kill our soldiers ! Let that sink in ... okay ?

"Card carrying member" .... Do the Conservatives a favour .. and rip it up.

I guess they are outsourcing the de-radicalizing to your nearest extremist influenced school. Lol
 

RickyZ

Senior Member
Sep 20, 2012
9,635
787
113
Jesus said the poor you have with you always.

The church is to care for the poor and destitute not the state.

Yeah that one is a toughie.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
A toughie indeed. I think the church is overwhelmed and under-funded for that assignment.
 
Nov 23, 2016
510
37
0
I guess they are outsourcing the de-radicalizing to your nearest extremist influenced school. Lol
But the good news is, they're "not doing it themselves".:rolleyes: This country is in dire straits like never seen before.
 
Jan 6, 2018
115
21
18
Literacy check:

Consider the sentence:
"You declare to respect the law and yet you violated it yesterday"

Is this a criticism of people of declare to respect the law, or of those who violate it?

You might not agree with the content of the criticism, that is perfectly ok. But
if you say that the reason of criticism is the number of times that "America" was mentioned,
you probably are in bad faith and I can only encourage you to look into yourself and ask the reason.
(The less probable explanation is that you cannot interpret english language.)
 

notuptome

Senior Member
May 17, 2013
15,050
2,538
113
A toughie indeed. I think the church is overwhelmed and under-funded for that assignment.
If the church trusted Christ then all that is needed would be supplied. Not mans plan but the supply of God.

The apostolic church was not exactly wealthy or well accepted yet it knew this truth.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
K

kaylagrl

Guest
If the church trusted Christ then all that is needed would be supplied. Not mans plan but the supply of God.

The apostolic church was not exactly wealthy or well accepted yet it knew this truth.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

Two of the worst moves the church ever made, getting the gov't involved and moving up town. IMO

Waggles thats "in my opinion" for us old folks ;)
 

MichaelOwen

Senior Member
Nov 6, 2017
909
252
63
Two of the worst moves the church ever made, getting the gov't involved and moving up town. IMO

Waggles thats "in my opinion" for us old folks ;)
And the biggest reason we have a separation today between church and state is because the government is ALWAYS striving to take God out
 

RickyZ

Senior Member
Sep 20, 2012
9,635
787
113
If the church trusted Christ then all that is needed would be supplied. Not mans plan but the supply of God.

The apostolic church was not exactly wealthy or well accepted yet it knew this truth.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
Very true! That and if people would only give like they ought to...

Or, if employers pay a living wage and took some of the burden off the church's back ... a lot of the people who can't afford healthcare work 60 hrs a week already.
 

tourist

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2014
41,304
16,297
113
69
Tennessee
Can't refuse care and have you die on the sidewalk. Then we will get stuck with the clean up and disposal of the corpse. A fine kettle of fish we have here.

No health insurance and need medical care? Rob a bank and have the federal penitentiary cover your bills.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
Some desperate people have actually done this.
 
3

3Scoreand10

Guest
Very true! That and if people would only give like they ought to...

Or, if employers pay a living wage and took some of the burden off the church's back ... a lot of the people who can't afford healthcare work 60 hrs a week already.
What is a living wage? Having enough money to buy food, clothing, and shelter should be a living wage, but most want to include cell phones and internet and satellite TV and movies and CDs and pet food and, and, and.


Simple truth is that most money earned today is wasted on wants not necessities.

I also see people run to the clinic when taking an aspirin would be sufficient.
 

AdolfHipster

Senior Member
Jan 15, 2018
221
8
18
Wow Hipster, we may have our first area of disagreement! May being the operative word ... regarding the insurance mandate. The problem is that people without insurance or other means of payment are guaranteed basic and emergency medical care ... the cost of which is then added onto the bills of those with insurance or other means to pay. The mandate was intended to end that unfairness by making sure everyone had at least a minimal ability to pay. So if you're not going to mandate coverage, you then have to mandate that anyone without the means to pay does not receive care.
I guess that means we can now start throwing personal attacks at each other! JK! :p

I understand why the mandate was there, but I think it was incredibly unconstitutional to pass the ACA with the mandate. It's one thing if it was a complete single payer system (which would be better than ACA) where it comes out of everyone's taxes, but for the government saying we have to buy something doesn't sound right. I had family members who could not come close to affording the "Affordable" Care act and was fined for not being able to sign up for any insurance.

Out of curiosity Brother Ricky, what are your thoughts on a single payer system?
 

AdolfHipster

Senior Member
Jan 15, 2018
221
8
18
The independent mandate was a crime against those who lost their jobs! It didn't affect me until I the company I worked for 9 years restructured and out-sourced out positions. At that time I was out of work, but because of that independent mandate I was required to have insurance or pay the fine at tax time. Well, the lowest insurance cost was over $400 per month. So Mr. Obama caused me and many other people financial hardship, for when I lost my job I no longer had any income and the government wants me to take on a new debt in order to comply with their mandate law. I'm still paying on my fines for not having insurance. The government should not have the right to force me or anyone else to have insurance.
I thought when Trump got in office he removed those fines. Are you sure you still owe it?