Plan-B

[MissCris]

This form of birth control seems unlikely to be used much within a marriage, anyway. Married couples, if they don't want children, know this ahead of time (uuuuusually) and prepare for that.

I dunno, on the one side, I agree that birth control is good in that it prevents a lot of unwanted children. But then, on the other side, it kind of disgusts me that birth control is available to people under 18 at all. Kind of a catch-22.

 

[Batman007]

Teenagers not having access to protective sex won't cut back on the amount of young people engaging in sexual activities, but rather will increase the amount of unwanted pregnancies, STDs, and abortions.

 

[MissCris]

That's why I said it's a catch-22. It's bad that these kids are having sex at all, but is worse that they end up diseased or pregnant and all the various issues that stem from those things.

 

[Porthos]

This form of birth control seems unlikely to be used much within a marriage, anyway. Married couples, if they don't want children, know this ahead of time (uuuuusually) and prepare for that.

I dunno, on the one side, I agree that birth control is good in that it prevents a lot of unwanted children. But then, on the other side, it kind of disgusts me that birth control is available to people under 18 at all. Kind of a catch-22.

The legal age for consensual sex in the UK is 16, and is 15 in some European states as far as I'm aware. And kids do it younger.

I think with their limited maturity, it is better for people to be safe about it than to have to raise children at ridiculous ages

 

[FAITHFULGILLIAN]

Teenagers not having access to protective sex won't cut back on the amount of young people engaging in sexual activities, but rather will increase the amount of unwanted pregnancies, STDs, and abortions.

That may be so but doling out unsolicited condoms to passers-by is a symptom of a society which glorifies lust. An ethos of casual sex itself multiplies all the ills you mention..

 

[Porthos]

That may be so but doling out unsolicited condoms to passers-by is a symptom of a society which glorifies lust. An ethos of casual sex itself multiplies all the ills you mention..

That's true, but now that that kind of viewpoint is established in our society, it would be a silly move to take away the safeguards that allow at least for people to have safe sex.

It would be like riling the people up with spongey bats and when they get excited, giving them blades and hatchets.

 

[Batman007]

That may be so but doling out unsolicited condoms to passers-by is a symptom of a society which glorifies lust. An ethos of casual sex itself multiplies all the ills you mention..

I'm not sure about that. I think it's very possible to have casual sex and be safe. I think the problem lies with people who are taught to be ashamed and embarrassed about asking for or buying contraceptives, so when they make the decision to engage in sex they're too afraid to ask anyone for help. I think people who are raised to understand that sex is natural and that it's important to be safe are way better off in terms of protection.

 

[Porthos]

I'm not sure about that. I think it's very possible to have casual sex and be safe. I think the problem lies with people who are taught to be ashamed and embarrassed about asking for or buying contraceptives, so when they make the decision to engage in sex they're too afraid to ask anyone for help. I think people who are raised to understand that sex is natural and that it's important to be safe are way better off in terms of protection.

I agree somewhat. But I would go a step further and although I would never teach my children to be ashamed of sex (as I was), and although I would never force a certain restriction on their own choices regarding faith and beliefs, I would endow them with the experience I have gained and teach them that sex means more than just a casual act, whether society faces that fact or not.

Sex is powerful and I don't think it's enough just to be 'safe'. A man particularly, needs to be aware of the emotional aspects and consequences of sex.

 

[MissCris]

Ehhh..."casual sex". Makes me cringe that society is so accepting of sleeping with who ever, whenever (the where ever part is apparently the only hang up as I'm pretty sure it's illegal to have sex in um, most public places? Ha, I don't even know).

 

[Porthos]

Ehhh..."casual sex". Makes me cringe that society is so accepting of sleeping with who ever, whenever (the where ever part is apparently the only hang up as I'm pretty sure it's illegal to have sex in um, most public places? Ha, I don't even know).

People should have that right.

I always say this; freedom is a right. Freedom is a right that was given to every human the minute they were born on this earth; the ability to sin in every manner they can think of. Whether or not another man punishes them for that, is up to the particular society that they live in. But we are all 'able' to do all these things. Whether or not we get punished is another story.

And in our society, our law is based on a principle that as long as you don't infringe on someone else's rights, you have the right to do as you please.

We are given freedom.

But I also always say; not everyone is given the wisdom to be able to use that freedom responsibly. And that's where we really need to start.

 

[FAITHFULGILLIAN]

That's true, but now that that kind of viewpoint is established in our society, it would be a silly move to take away the safeguards that allow at least for people to have safe sex.

It would be like riling the people up with spongey bats and when they get excited, giving them blades and hatchets.

I wasn't arguing that the safeguards should not be available. The meaning of your analogy eludes me I am afraid.

 

[Porthos]

I wasn't arguing that the safeguards should not be available. The meaning of your analogy eludes me I am afraid.

It means that to instill a view in society that casual sex and underage sex and successive promiscuous encounters are okay, and to give out condoms and contraception, is like giving people spongey bats to hit each other with; a bit unnecessary and a bit annoying but generally physically harmless as long as the sponge stays on, so to speak.

But to take away the safeguards surrounding a society that is promiscuous and to remove contraception, whenever people have got into the mindset of 'hitting each other', would be like replacing those spongy bats with blades and hatchets.

People are gonna get hurt way worse.

 

[FAITHFULGILLIAN]

I'm not sure about that. I think it's very possible to have casual sex and be safe. I think the problem lies with people who are taught to be ashamed and embarrassed about asking for or buying contraceptives, so when they make the decision to engage in sex they're too afraid to ask anyone for help. I think people who are raised to understand that sex is natural and that it's important to be safe are way better off in terms of protection.

When casual sex is the norm, the incidence of unwanted pregnancies will increase,even if contraceptives are readily available and are not regarded as shameful. The UK on the whole reflects very liberal attitudes but the abortion rate is still significant.

 

[FAITHFULGILLIAN]

It means that to instill a view in society that casual sex and underage sex and successive promiscuous encounters are okay, and to give out condoms and contraception, is like giving people spongey bats to hit each other with; a bit unnecessary and a bit annoying but generally physically harmless as long as the sponge stays on, so to speak.

But to take away the safeguards surrounding a society that is promiscuous and to remove contraception, whenever people have got into the mindset of 'hitting each other', would be like replacing those spongy bats with blades and hatchets.

People are gonna get hurt way worse.

Thanks for the clarification.

 

[Porthos]

When casual sex is the norm, the incidence of unwanted pregnancies will increase,even if contraceptives are readily available and are not regarded as shameful. The UK on the whole reflects very liberal attitudes but the abortion rate is still significant.

I can guarantee that's because most people who end up pregnant are either; not sufficiently taught and looked after by their parents (most people who end up underage and pregnant are underprivileged teens), or do not feel comfortable asking for contraceptives.

There are those intances where people don't really care all that much, and then of course, the alcohol related incidents, seeing as the UK has an underage drinking problem. But most of the underage pregnancies you see are from underprivelaged and under-educated young girls, and many lead to abortion.

 

[FAITHFULGILLIAN]

I can guarantee that's because most people who end up pregnant are either; not sufficiently taught and looked after by their parents (most people who end up underage and pregnant are underprivileged teens), or do not feel comfortable asking for contraceptives.

There are those intances where people don't really care all that much, and then of course, the alcohol related incidents, seeing as the UK has an underage drinking problem. But most of the underage pregnancies you see are from underprivelaged and under-educated young girls, and many lead to abortion.

Have you any evidence to support this?

 

[Porthos]

Have you any evidence to support this?

Life experience?

I went to a high school full of young girls with mothers that spent their time smoking cannabis and drinking WKDs instead of looking after their daughters; and a good portion of them ended up pregnant. Whereas the girls who came from good homes with good parents generally went on to study in university and get degrees.

How often do you see a young, teenage single mother in a fancy area? Personally I don't think I've seen too many.

There is a study that also tells that over 50% of abortions in England and Wales are from women 24 and under. And we know Scotland's rates are worse. And women from NI simply go to England to get abortions (they are not covered on NHS here) though those statistics aren't included.

Abortion statistics for England and Wales: see the latest breakdown | News | guardian.co.uk

And another survey suggests that teen girls living in deprived areas are more than 4 times as likely to become pregnant as those who live in more well-off areas.

BBC NEWS | Health | Deprivation teen pregnancy boost

There is also the issue that while preventative contraception is normally free, it is very hard for a girl to obtain emergency contraception, particulalry if she is under 16, if she has no 'brook' clinic or some equivalent nearby.

And the price for an over the counter morning after pill is about £30. Usually more than most teens have lying around. Couple that with the fear of telling parents ...

 

[santuzza]

This thread has proven to be very interesting and stunning to me.

It seems there is no respect for traditional Christian values here. Let us promote NO sex, not "safe" sex for our children. There is no such thing as safe sex -- such a misnomer!

Any medication that would basically kill a fertilized egg is, to me, murder. It is heinous and should be completely banned -- for anyone at any age. It is exceptionally heinous when one think that it will be available to minors without parental consent.

I am outraged and I just shake my head and wonder "What has this world come to?"

 

[Porthos]

This thread has proven to be very interesting and stunning to me.

It seems there is no respect for traditional Christian values here. Let us promote NO sex, not "safe" sex for our children. There is no such thing as safe sex -- such a misnomer!

Any medication that would basically kill a fertilized egg is, to me, murder. It is heinous and should be completely banned -- for anyone at any age. It is exceptionally heinous when one think that it will be available to minors without parental consent.

I am outraged and I just shake my head and wonder "What has this world come to?"

So then all those girls should bring up children in un-supportive, uneducated families with no resources and no father around simply because they were born into families that never educated nor cared for them and they made a mistake?

Human suffering over a period of 18 years (birth to adult), of both the child and mother, far outweighs an embryo (or a sperm cell and unfertilized egg) being caught in a mucus trap.

We aren't promoting safe sex, we're promoting protection and education for those who CHOOSE to have sex. Not everybody chooses to be a christian, and that's their right.

The best we can do, as people who CHOSE to follow God, is to try to promote ways to limit suffering as best we can for those people.

 

[Porthos]

Just because they don't believe, or because they are uneducated, or because they made mistakes, should we leave them and their kids to slip into poverty & give them no choices except to either abide by our rules or live a life of struggle and deprivation?

WE are the knowing. WE are the lucky ones. And it's our duty to look out for the people who DONT know.