When is it gonna be enough?

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Feb 20, 2016
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#1
I know I'll expect resistance, given the nasty things I've said before. I know I may be mocked, ridiculed, and sidelined. But I don't care. I have a strong opinion and I want to share it.

We've had five shootings in the last five days. Christians, when are we gonna get serious about this beyond "thoughts and prayers?" Thoughts and prayers are meaningless without action. Something needs to be done.

Maybe less guns won't solve the problem, but more certainly won't help either. Should we just sit back and let the nation become a terrorist state? Should gun violence only be stopped by making sure the good guy has the bigger gun? You know something is terribly wrong when shootings become a matter of "when" rather than "if." If Christians want to be part of the solution, we can't just pray, we need to do something. Then again, according to a lot of evangelicals, the world is going to be consumed by fire anyway so why bother doing jack?

I'm honestly ashamed to call myself a Christian now, not because I'm ashamed of Jesus, but because I'm ashamed of my fellow Christians who've all but sold their souls to political power. The past few years have proven to me that most Christians aren't much different, if at all, from the world. We're sloppy with grace and don't teach people to be responsible for their actions.

There are people in this world who are evil and do not deserve our sympathy. I do not feel one bit sorry for all these mass shooters and all those youth teachers who turned out to be pedophiles. There are normal people, and then there are the depraved. Do not tell me there is not a difference. Do not tell me that the only unforgivable sin is "blasphemy." Blasphemy takes many forms.

But whatever, it's not like anyone truly cares. Even I prefer to isolate myself because I know that I can only take so much empathy. I can only weep with so many others who weep. This is why so many people my age are so disillusioned. We were prepared for a world that no longer exists, where people are content to hate each other rather than get over themselves and work together.

I'm sick of theology that tells me to hate people based on their skin color, religion, sexual orientation, or whatever. I want to judge people by their character, nothing else. Christians, the world is watching. We are called to a higher standard. And if I'm the only one willing to hold to it, then so be it.
 

7seasrekeyed

Senior Member
Aug 27, 2017
7,518
3,106
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#2
I know I'll expect resistance, given the nasty things I've said before. I know I may be mocked, ridiculed, and sidelined. But I don't care. I have a strong opinion and I want to share it.

We've had five shootings in the last five days. Christians, when are we gonna get serious about this beyond "thoughts and prayers?" Thoughts and prayers are meaningless without action. Something needs to be done.

Maybe less guns won't solve the problem, but more certainly won't help either. Should we just sit back and let the nation become a terrorist state? Should gun violence only be stopped by making sure the good guy has the bigger gun? You know something is terribly wrong when shootings become a matter of "when" rather than "if." If Christians want to be part of the solution, we can't just pray, we need to do something. Then again, according to a lot of evangelicals, the world is going to be consumed by fire anyway so why bother doing jack?

I'm honestly ashamed to call myself a Christian now, not because I'm ashamed of Jesus, but because I'm ashamed of my fellow Christians who've all but sold their souls to political power. The past few years have proven to me that most Christians aren't much different, if at all, from the world. We're sloppy with grace and don't teach people to be responsible for their actions.

There are people in this world who are evil and do not deserve our sympathy. I do not feel one bit sorry for all these mass shooters and all those youth teachers who turned out to be pedophiles. There are normal people, and then there are the depraved. Do not tell me there is not a difference. Do not tell me that the only unforgivable sin is "blasphemy." Blasphemy takes many forms.

But whatever, it's not like anyone truly cares. Even I prefer to isolate myself because I know that I can only take so much empathy. I can only weep with so many others who weep. This is why so many people my age are so disillusioned. We were prepared for a world that no longer exists, where people are content to hate each other rather than get over themselves and work together.

I'm sick of theology that tells me to hate people based on their skin color, religion, sexual orientation, or whatever. I want to judge people by their character, nothing else. Christians, the world is watching. We are called to a higher standard. And if I'm the only one willing to hold to it, then so be it.

yikes

I think you are mainly speaking for yourself here. I'm not familiar with you actually...that I can remember...but I am truly sorry if you identify with Christians who have almost sold their souls for political power as 'fellow Christians'

But whatever, it's not like anyone truly cares. Even I prefer to isolate myself because I know that I can only take so much empathy. I can only weep with so many others who weep. This is why so many people my age are so disillusioned. We were prepared for a world that no longer exists, where people are content to hate each other rather than get over themselves and work together.
really? nobody cares? listen....you do not have to be your age, guessing it's younger than mine here, to be disillusioned. EVERY generation blames the one before it. ever hear that? and then they get busy, doing things the following generation can declare themselves innocent of and so on

I'm sick of theology that tells me to hate people based on their skin color, religion, sexual orientation, or whatever. I want to judge people by their character, nothing else. Christians, the world is watching. We are called to a higher standard. And if I'm the only one willing to hold to it, then so be it.
which theology tells you to hate the things you list?

what standard is it you wish to follow exactly? do you see it in the Bible?

what world is watching? you could never ever hold to the standard set by God for yourself

only Christ holds to that standard

you do sound quite upset...I don't blame you, but if you hold to the actual Biblical standard, you will point out sin anyway, which will make many upset and they will hate you and want to do away with you. notice this does not mean hating people or holding placards and telling them they are going to hell

what are your solutions since you want things to be different?
 
Feb 20, 2016
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#3
yikes

I think you are mainly speaking for yourself here. I'm not familiar with you actually...that I can remember...but I am truly sorry if you identify with Christians who have almost sold their souls for political power as 'fellow Christians'



really? nobody cares? listen....you do not have to be your age, guessing it's younger than mine here, to be disillusioned. EVERY generation blames the one before it. ever hear that? and then they get busy, doing things the following generation can declare themselves innocent of and so on



which theology tells you to hate the things you list?

what standard is it you wish to follow exactly? do you see it in the Bible?

what world is watching? you could never ever hold to the standard set by God for yourself

only Christ holds to that standard

you do sound quite upset...I don't blame you, but if you hold to the actual Biblical standard, you will point out sin anyway, which will make many upset and they will hate you and want to do away with you. notice this does not mean hating people or holding placards and telling them they are going to hell

what are your solutions since you want things to be different?
I honestly don't know. I'm just one person.
 

7seasrekeyed

Senior Member
Aug 27, 2017
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#4
I honestly don't know. I'm just one person.
ok. I get it.

it's the huge mass of information we are supposed to make sense out of and what we consider a tragedy for no reason

but you do have some very sweeping comments in your post so I was wondering if in place of those, you might offer some specifics when you say that you are willing to hold to a higher standard

honestly, about the only one I can think of, is trying to see God's perspective about it all and the fact that the nature of human kind is not as God created but He does offer a solution

even that solution is embedded with choices every day and just how much we choose to follow what we are convinced of as helpful

I understand the overwhelming sense of the craziness though. I have squirmed around in personal issues I can superimpose over bigger situations and get a better understanding only because human nature is human nature

I just ask God to help me..He does...we are in a world that is eating itself up. and all the mass communication overwhelms and we get all of it whether or not we want it...unless we just turn it off.

just my thoughts
 
Feb 20, 2016
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#5
ok. I get it.

it's the huge mass of information we are supposed to make sense out of and what we consider a tragedy for no reason

but you do have some very sweeping comments in your post so I was wondering if in place of those, you might offer some specifics when you say that you are willing to hold to a higher standard

honestly, about the only one I can think of, is trying to see God's perspective about it all and the fact that the nature of human kind is not as God created but He does offer a solution

even that solution is embedded with choices every day and just how much we choose to follow what we are convinced of as helpful

I understand the overwhelming sense of the craziness though. I have squirmed around in personal issues I can superimpose over bigger situations and get a better understanding only because human nature is human nature

I just ask God to help me..He does...we are in a world that is eating itself up. and all the mass communication overwhelms and we get all of it whether or not we want it...unless we just turn it off.

just my thoughts
Problem is you can never really get away from it. I don't watch the news period yet it still shows up on YouTube.
 

Kim82

Well-known member
Jun 17, 2018
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#6
I wonder if just before Joshua Harris decided to divorce his wife and kiss Christianity good bye, he was having the same thoughts as you?
 

7seasrekeyed

Senior Member
Aug 27, 2017
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#7
Problem is you can never really get away from it. I don't watch the news period yet it still shows up on YouTube.

well, IMO, youtube is problematical to begin with

if we understand the nature of sin, and unregenerate people, the fall and what the Bible says about how things will progress towards more evil, it would seem that is what is going on

they forever want to have peace talks with Israel and the Palestinians for example. well consult the Bible...it is never going to happen!
 

7seasrekeyed

Senior Member
Aug 27, 2017
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#8
I wonder if just before Joshua Harris decided to divorce his wife and kiss Christianity good bye, he was having the same thoughts as you?

oh come on

how is that helpful? I can't believe you said that.

smh
 
Feb 20, 2016
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#9
well, IMO, youtube is problematical to begin with

if we understand the nature of sin, and unregenerate people, the fall and what the Bible says about how things will progress towards more evil, it would seem that is what is going on

they forever want to have peace talks with Israel and the Palestinians for example. well consult the Bible...it is never going to happen!
The world has never been "more evil," or "less evil." Just evil. And who honestly knows what's gonna happen whether or not we consult the Bible.
 
Feb 20, 2016
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#10
oh come on

how is that helpful? I can't believe you said that.

smh
I honestly wonder that too. It's like Christians aren't allowed to be human beings and have problems. And it still infuriates me that people think murder is a lesser sin than divorce.
 

7seasrekeyed

Senior Member
Aug 27, 2017
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#11
The world has never been "more evil," or "less evil." Just evil. And who honestly knows what's gonna happen whether or not we consult the Bible.
there was a time the world was created and God said that creation was good

the New Testament does deal with the fact the world will progress towards evil more and more and there will be wars and rumors of wars as well all kinds of rumblings from natural events

first you speak of Christians being false and then you seem to disregard the Bible as though God were sitting in an armchair watching and not really caring

we actually do know what is going on and what is going to happen if we believe what the Bible says
 

Kim82

Well-known member
Jun 17, 2018
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#12
how is that helpful?
I was not trying to be helpful and neither did OP ask for help. But I just picked up on something that you might have not. I won't explain though.
 

7seasrekeyed

Senior Member
Aug 27, 2017
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#13
I honestly wonder that too. It's like Christians aren't allowed to be human beings and have problems. And it still infuriates me that people think murder is a lesser sin than divorce.

hmmm. sounds like you have been considering things for quite awhile...but like said, I am not familiar with you

if even thoughts can be sinful, and we know from what Jesus said they can be, then sin is worse than what we think and we do not think about it because it is our normal nature without God, make sense?

Christians most certainly have problems and one of those problems are other Christians telling them they should not have problems
 
Feb 20, 2016
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#14
there was a time the world was created and God said that creation was good

the New Testament does deal with the fact the world will progress towards evil more and more and there will be wars and rumors of wars as well all kinds of rumblings from natural events

first you speak of Christians being false and then you seem to disregard the Bible as though God were sitting in an armchair watching and not really caring

we actually do know what is going on and what is going to happen if we believe what the Bible says
No you don’t. No one truly does. There are about as many views on that stuff as there are denominations.
 

7seasrekeyed

Senior Member
Aug 27, 2017
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#15
I was not trying to be helpful and neither did OP ask for help. But I just picked up on something that you might have not. I won't explain though.
yeah

I've read some of your posts

you are right. not helpful at all. condemnation is not helpful

so glad you think you can stand from a higher vantage point and point out what you perceive is something you do not have a problem with

so so so tired of others banging people over the head with big Bibles instead of HELPING
 

7seasrekeyed

Senior Member
Aug 27, 2017
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#16
No you don’t. No one truly does. There are about as many views on that stuff as there are denominations.

well, choose one and go with it. but pray for discernment first

either the Bible is the word of God or it is not.

there is one view only that the Bible gives and I choose that view.

otherwise, I would be swimming in a morass of self-pity and quite possibly depression
 

7seasrekeyed

Senior Member
Aug 27, 2017
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#17
one of the biggest struggles we will have in this life is coming to grips with ourselves

Jesus is the anchor for our souls. like I said, I ask Him for help all the time because I would be waiting at the next next bus stop for the trip off the earth if there was one

I hate what goes on. sin causes it
 

Bingo

Well-known member
Feb 9, 2019
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#18
"Self-inflicted wrath, we have met the enemy, and it is US!
No more, no less."
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Feb 20, 2016
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#19
Here's my message to my fellow Christians out there.

Don't trust the church. Don't trust evangelicals. Trust NO ONE but God.

Christians, I refuse to be called one myself until YOU get your act together. WE are NOT God's favorites, we are not his "chosen" people, the world does not revolve around America and it certainly does not revolve around US! I am ashamed of and disappointed in you. Prove yourself WORTHY of my trust, and maybe I'll associate with you again. Prove to me that you are pro-life not just because you're against abortion. Prove to me that you care when a pedophile takes a child's innocence. The burden of proof is on YOU!
 

7seasrekeyed

Senior Member
Aug 27, 2017
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#20
Here's my message to my fellow Christians out there.

Don't trust the church. Don't trust evangelicals. Trust NO ONE but God.

Christians, I refuse to be called one myself until YOU get your act together. WE are NOT God's favorites, we are not his "chosen" people, the world does not revolve around America and it certainly does not revolve around US! I am ashamed of and disappointed in you. Prove yourself WORTHY of my trust, and maybe I'll associate with you again. Prove to me that you are pro-life not just because you're against abortion. Prove to me that you care when a pedophile takes a child's innocence. The burden of proof is on YOU!
you didn't accept a thing I said about God or the Bible

you really do need to start there

as it is, I am not American and I am not familiar with whatever you said before

however, it does seem you want some kind of revenge or admittance that everyone has disappointed you and I doubt even that would suffice.

pick up the Bible and ask God to help you.

you are steering for the rocks otherwise

I won't be back to take it up with you again.