Failure to launch or failure to parent?

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C

Charcoal

Guest
#21
Much good has been said on both sides, though I find some chagrin in this thread, intended to be about the "failure to launch or failure to parent" has become a discussion on gender roles.

I would like to point out, however, that a boat cannot be resold to cover the initial investment within a single lifetime... boat depreciation is intense.

Learning to make sacrifices, be it not buying the boat, not buying the gun, not having cable or even high speed internet IS part of the process of growing up. These are the sacrifices that do not kill you but make you stronger. If you cannot deny yourself that soda pop or frap when you are scraping by to pay your cell bill since you started living on your own, then you will not be able to deny your own child - whom you may find that you do in fact love more dearly than yourself - the pack of Twinkies & a Happy Meal when you should be making beans and rice because you've just hit an unfortunate period of unemployment and would like to keep the mortgage paid for as long as possible. We are all charged to be good stewards of our resources. I will not go on a rant about people with dedicated off-road rigs and new diesel trucks and a meager 9.5% tithe. Nor will I say that one should deny all worldly goods so that one might better fund charity (I know a friend who makes good money but owns only 7 shirts because he feels more is an excess of goods.). I am, however, trying to say that part of being a grown up is knowing when to not buy more toys (for yourself or your family) and accepting it if life comes down to liquidating assets to maintain your family (ie, selling off the excess guns, project cars, diamond tennis bracelets, Lego's, or whatever sacrifice is needed when you have been making an HONEST effort to find employment in tough economic times... not sitting around playing xbox or posting on CC 24/7...if you've not been trying, don't make someone else sacrifice for the good of the family!).

I grew up with a relatively high standard of living. This was, in part, due to sacrifices my parents made for their children which I had been unaware of. When I began living on my own there were weeks where I did not have grocery budget enough for meat or any kind and had to learn how to get the protein my body craved through more frugal means. I learned over time how to have a large lifestyle on a small budget. I guarantee you that I have a higher percentage of home equity than most of my peers, and a lower paycheck than any comparable household in my neighborhood. My family's standard of living far exceeds the standard of my paycheck, and that is in part due to good stewardship, frugality, and the willingness to self sacrifice for the sake of my family.
Sure, we need film makers and artists, and musicians...and they need to be willing to accept the lifestyle they can afford doing that. If you can do those things and live comfortably, Here's to you! <doff's hat>
If you want to be a family person (mom or dad, or even a childless husband or wife), you need to be willing to work that factory job, take your device to McD's for the free wifi, and refill your fancy looking Starbucks tumbler that you carry (you know, second hand one that you typically use to keep the one you got as a present looking nice) with house brand coffee that didn't come out of a K-cup.

Becoming a responsible adult does prepare one for a better marriage and for the job of raising better children, but Truly, Honestly, at the Core of it... Becoming a responsible adult IS ITS OWN PAYOFF. We've just failed to teach the value of it.

Here's hoping that enough of us can teach the next generation differently, so that in enough generations we can turn this tide.
 

Roh_Chris

Senior Member
Jun 15, 2014
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#22
Beautifully written one, Charcoal. I couldn't have said it any better.

We have to become responsible adults not just for a better marriage or for raising better children, but because it is good for us. :)

Too bad CC wouldn't let me give you a rep-point.
 

Oncefallen

Idiot in Chief
Staff member
Jan 15, 2011
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#23
Wisebeardman, I understand that in these times some people are unable to become fully independent due to economic situations. My train of thought was pointed more towards those who are capable and choose not to or towards those who are not capable for lack of proper parenting such as teaching a strong work ethic. In my industry I've dealt with tons of young adults who seem to expect that they shouldn't have to work hard, show up on time, etc. because their parents did everything for them and never instilled responsibility.

I even understand that sometime people run into a bad spot in life and have to move back home for a while to get back on their feet. At thirty I had to move back in with my folks for a couple of years (major blow to my ego) because of some poor life decisions that I had made which left me absolutely broke, but I was back out on my own as soon as it was financially possible.

What drives me nuts is that many (not all) of the younger generation don't move out because think they "can't afford it." I got my first apartment at twenty in a decent part of town. Could I afford it on my own? Absolutely not! I had three room mates in a two bedroom apartment with a bare minimum of second hand (free) furniture. Over the years as my income increased the number of room mates dropped and the stuff in my home became nicer. What I learned about finances in the first year made me realize just how much money I had been WASTING when I had been living at home with my folks.
 
May 9, 2012
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#24
If I had still been in GA, it's literally impossible to find safe apartments that are suitable enough to afford. The reality is that over 95% of college grads cannot afford it because priorities have shifted from moving out to paying off debts first. I moved back home for the summer originally but could not find a job and there was a controlling parent issue. NOw, I'm with my grandparents and have better access to cheap city transit which is cheaper than driving and if I get a good full time job, I just might be able to afford living on my own or with roommates. I have a few people in mind :D
 

Lynx

Folksy yet erudite
Aug 13, 2014
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#25
Oncefallen: For real, free furniture rocks. Remember the spool? Did y'all have one? That big wooden thing that the electric company uses to wrap their cables around, that they leave when they've used all the cable off it. Makes a great coffee table.
 

Oncefallen

Idiot in Chief
Staff member
Jan 15, 2011
6,030
3,261
113
#26
Oncefallen: For real, free furniture rocks. Remember the spool? Did y'all have one? That big wooden thing that the electric company uses to wrap their cables around, that they leave when they've used all the cable off it. Makes a great coffee table.
Albeit I am redneck through and through somehow I missed out on the "spool" coffee table.
 
Sep 6, 2013
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#27
Oncefallen: For real, free furniture rocks. Remember the spool? Did y'all have one? That big wooden thing that the electric company uses to wrap their cables around, that they leave when they've used all the cable off it. Makes a great coffee table.
We had that when I was a kid! There was a slat missing from the middle and a little kid could crawl inside and hide, if they were of a mind to. :eek:
 
C

Charcoal

Guest
#28
My Spool is under the carport. It's the perfect height to be useful when cooking outdoors. Last time she was here, my mom put it up on some bricks to keep it out of the water if it rains. She likes my Spool, too.

I'm maybe just a little whyet trash.
 
M

MidniteWelder

Guest
#29
I would like to point out, however, that a boat cannot be resold to cover the initial investment within a single lifetime... boat depreciation is intense.
Well ya know, depends on the boat. ;)



You bring up some good points Charcoal.
I just used boat as an example because not many people may understand buying
A forklift as an investment
A desirable firearm as an investment
An older truck as opposed to a newer one etc.
A muscle car as an investment

My point was more that knowing the value or "potential long term" value of something whatever it may be can reap far greater returns than funds sitting in a bank account collecting 1.5% APR
I'm sure most would prefer to be able to double or triple or quadruple initial investment within terms as short as a year or two.
A good rule to go by as much as possible is:
Aside from basic survival items (food, furniture, rent etc):
"Only spend money on things that can make you money"
or at the least an item that you can always resell for what you paid for it.
Within marriage it's not even about making lots of money and being rich.
But rather:
Being smart with ones money and doing well on investments takes time and research knowing the potential market.

There's always going to be those fun toys one or the other wants.
Therefore in doing so, why not buy what can be resold for the same if times get hard during the winter.
Planning for security and stability.

These are thing that are learned and many parents could take the time to teach their children these values as well as appreciating what they have since:
we have nothing which has not been given to us.
per 1Cor 4:7

 
Feb 18, 2013
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#30
This post in Streams really deserved a thread of it's own (IMO).
Woo! I wasn't even trying to start a thread..

And yet I still ended up indirectly starting a thread. :D

I approve of this discussion. *throws confetti around*
 

Roh_Chris

Senior Member
Jun 15, 2014
4,728
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#31
Oncefallen: For real, free furniture rocks. Remember the spool? Did y'all have one? That big wooden thing that the electric company uses to wrap their cables around, that they leave when they've used all the cable off it. Makes a great coffee table.
We had that when I was a kid! There was a slat missing from the middle and a little kid could crawl inside and hide, if they were of a mind to. :eek:
My Spool is under the carport. It's the perfect height to be useful when cooking outdoors. Last time she was here, my mom put it up on some bricks to keep it out of the water if it rains. She likes my Spool, too.

I'm maybe just a little whyet trash.

Are you guys talking of a spool player? I still have the one my Grandpa used in the 1970s. :eek:


 

Fenner

Senior Member
Jan 26, 2013
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#32
This was kind of my life...... in a way. I didn't know how to basic things because no one taught me. Even my understanding of how to communicate was very limited. I can't tell you how many times someone would say to me, How do you not know how to do this? or How is it no one taught you about this or that?
I was so ill prepared.

There were a lot of us kids and so for the people who raised me, my cousins, brothers, sister it was all about enduring our presence until they could get us all out of their house. So there was never any time spent trying to teach us anything.
So i kind of got the other end of it. Not someone being over protective as much as just not caring to prepare us.
For a long time i felt like a kid trapped in an adults body, because of my almost helplessness in knowing how to do anything adults do.


Just my two cents.

That's so sad Holly. Unfortunately there are a lot of kids now who live in those circumstances. I know two families in which the Mom in the family are in prison for drugs. The Dad is raising along with Grandparents help. One Dad though is an alcoholic and I know why his son acts out. He is longing for attention and guidance and stability, it's heart wrenching.
 
J

Jullianna

Guest
#33
This is an excellent thread, Oncefallen.

As parents, we want to be able to give our children things we never had (and THOUGHT we needed), make things a little easier for them than they were for us, and, yes, even spoil them a bit from time to time. But we do them no favors by doing everything for them and/or giving them whatever they want. How many people do you know who are instant gratification addicts? When I think about all of the things in my life that I thought I really needed/wanted that God denied me, I'm very grateful. Many of them would have destroyed me. We need to show our kids the same tough love at times.

I have huge concerns regarding where our society is going, so it has been very important to me that my son learn as much as possible....everything from laundry to cooking to sewing, planting gardens, fishing, you name it. A lot of times it comes down to how you go about it. Learning these things doesn't have to be grueling. You can make it fun and interesting if you are willing to invest the time and energy into the lives of your kids.

He did live with me during his college years and I did give him my old car, but he also held a job that paid for his own gas, personal expenses, etc. and worked very hard for scholarships that paid for the majority of his education. He is now doing extremely well on his own and I praise God for that.

The bottom line for me is that I'm going to give account to God for what I teach and how I deal with my son, so I want to learn as much about how God is raising me as I can. :) We don't stop being a parent just because our kids become legal adults. We need to be there for them, but, at the same time, give them space to grow and make the tough choices. We won't always be around.

One of the toughest things is to have to watch your child repeat your mistakes. It would be wonderful if they could learn from us, but they don't always. We have to pray and trust that God will use them for good, just as He has our own.

I want to pray for the young ladies discussed in the OP. I am very concerned for them. I was friends with four sisters who were raised much like those girls. When they got out on their own, they had a lot of issues and ended up getting into a lot of trouble, especially where men were concerned. It was difficult to watch. I pray that God will intervene in the lives of these young ladies before damage is done.
 

Rachel20

Senior Member
May 7, 2013
1,639
105
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#35
When I happened to stop by this thread, and after reading a few posts I thought of my mother.

She was the youngest child, and a late one – born to my grandma when she was 40. The age difference between her and her oldest sibling is 16 years.
So my mother grew up pampered , sheltered and protected. She never had to do a thing on her own. However marrying my dad really catapulted her into a whole new world.

When my dad married my mom, she did not know how to cook, drive or handle any financial statement at all.
My dad is a really capable man and had been living independently when he fell in love with my mom.

My dad’s the typical logical, scientific and smart kind of man. My mom is the Carl Jung, emo rebellious sort. But she was so beautiful I guess, he couldn’t help falling for her. According to him, it was love at first sight

Despite the glaring differences between the two of them , I don’t think my dad ever tried to overly teach my mom anything or patronize her or raise her up.
He let her handle everything on her own because as he puts it, she was such a capable and intelligent woman, she could do anything.


So in their early days of marriage, as my mom was figuring out how to manage the house there were lots of times the dinner was badly cooked and unpalatable.
My dad would never yell at my mom or belittle her for that stuff. In fact, as she puts it, he bravely would down it all. He would then take to cooking things himself, and show her his tricks on how to get things done.

Also, when they had us, the small fry, my mom would take us everywhere driving and handling challenging Indian terrain all because she had to.

Circumstances demanded it and she stood to the challenge.

The occasion needed it and she rose to it wonderfully. They were many times she was frustrated and wanted my dad to do everything instead of herself. But he point blank refused and allowed her to struggle and do it herself. He believed that she could do it. No one had to teach her explicitly.


As for my parents, they’re best friends. It’s never been one person trying to take charge of another but two people supporting one another.

My mother has single handedly been there for us when my dad could not be there.
I respect her so much and so does my dad.

He just can’t bear it when anyone even disrespects her slightly. In India, where women usually don’t have that place in society this can so happen often. My dad – being the strong, scary man that he can be, has countless times really got it for someone for doing that to my mom.

He tells me, “She is my boss. Everything of mine is hers.”
And she’s told me, “He’s the head of the house.” She takes so much care to ensure that when my dad returns home, everything is perfect for him.

My parents don’t share any sort of master-slave or teacher-student relationship. It’s just what it should be – husband and wife - best friends for life.

They recently celebrated their 25th anniversary in marriage.
 
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