Which is bondage?

[posthuman]

The apostles and elders, your brothers,
To the Gentile believers in Antioch, Syria and Cilicia:

Greetings.

We have heard that some went out from us without our authorization and disturbed you, troubling your minds by what they said. So we all agreed to choose some men and send them to you with our dear friends Barnabas and Paul—men who have risked their lives for the name of our Lord Jesus Christ. Therefore we are sending Judas and Silas to confirm by word of mouth what we are writing. It seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us not to burden you with anything beyond the following requirements: You are to abstain from food sacrificed to idols, from blood, from the meat of strangled animals and from sexual immorality. You will do well to avoid these things.

Farewell.

(Acts 15:23-29)

 

[chubbena]

then what is this rest that Jesus offers?

The Word of God offers true understanding of what He spoke through Moses and the prophets which the Pharisees previously made a heavy burden of.

 

[chubbena]

The apostles and elders, your brothers,
To the Gentile believers in Antioch, Syria and Cilicia:

Greetings.

We have heard that some went out from us without our authorization and disturbed you, troubling your minds by what they said. So we all agreed to choose some men and send them to you with our dear friends Barnabas and Paul—men who have risked their lives for the name of our Lord Jesus Christ. Therefore we are sending Judas and Silas to confirm by word of mouth what we are writing. It seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us not to burden you with anything beyond the following requirements: You are to abstain from food sacrificed to idols, from blood, from the meat of strangled animals and from sexual immorality. You will do well to avoid these things.

Farewell.

(Acts 15:23-29)

If only one takes Acts 15:21 into account and know where this letter was to be read at that point in time.

 

[Scuba]

The apostles and elders, your brothers,
To the Gentile believers in Antioch, Syria and Cilicia:

Greetings.

We have heard that some went out from us without our authorization and disturbed you, troubling your minds by what they said. So we all agreed to choose some men and send them to you with our dear friends Barnabas and Paul—men who have risked their lives for the name of our Lord Jesus Christ. Therefore we are sending Judas and Silas to confirm by word of mouth what we are writing. It seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us not to burden you with anything beyond the following requirements: You are to abstain from food sacrificed to idols, from blood, from the meat of strangled animals and from sexual immorality. You will do well to avoid these things.

Farewell.

(Acts 15:23-29)

So I can lie, steal, kill, worship other gods, dishonor my father and mother as long as I don't don't eat animals that were sacrificed to idols and I'm good to go? Do you really think the list in Acts was an end all list? He goes on to say they will learn everything else they need to know when they attend church on Sabbath because that's where its taught every Sabbath.

 

[posthuman]

If only one takes Acts 15:21 into account and know where this letter was to be read at that point in time.

i think it's a good idea to read the whole book.

He goes on to say they will learn everything else they need to know when they attend church on Sabbath because that's where its taught every Sabbath.

no, that's not what the council said.

some believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees rose up and said, “It is necessary to circumcise them and to order them to keep the law of Moses.”
The apostles and the elders were gathered together to consider this matter. And after there had been much debate, Peter stood up and said to them, “Brothers, you know that in the early days God made a choice among you, that by my mouth the Gentiles should hear the word of the gospel and believe. And God, who knows the heart, bore witness to them, by giving them the Holy Spirit just as he did to us, and he made no distinction between us and them, having cleansed their hearts by faith.Now, therefore, why are you putting God to the test by placing a yoke on the neck of the disciples that neither our fathers nor we have been able to bear? But we believe that we will be saved through the grace of the Lord Jesus, just as they will.”
(Acts 15:5-11)

and then James said:

".. my judgment is that we should not trouble those of the Gentiles who turn to God, but should write to them to abstain from the things polluted by idols, and from sexual immorality, and from what has been strangled, and from blood. For from ancient generations Moses has had in every city those who proclaim him, for he is read every Sabbath in the synagogues.”
(Acts 15:19-21)

if Gentiles who turn to God are compelled to put themselves under the burden of the law, they will have no trouble finding it. but as Peter said, we are saved by the grace of Jesus Christ, not by the law. some Pharisee believers wanted to compel the Gentiles seeking God to become Jews and put themselves in bondage to the law of Moses. the council rejected this.
abstaining from idolatry, sexual immorality, eating blood and strangled animals are not "in addition to" the law -- these are also prohibitions under that law.
abstain from idolatry -- Leviticus 17:7-9
abstain from sexual immorality -- Leviticus 18:6-24
abstain from eating blood -- Leviticus 17:10-12
abstain from strangled things -- Leviticus 17:13

our lives are free-will offerings to God, not commanded sacrifices of atonement. if it was expected that Gentiles would readily already be in obedience to the entire law of Moses, why did Peter object? why did James object? why single out these four encouragements that are in fact part of the law of Moses, if they took for granted that they would already be obeying them?
we have two great commands: love the Lord and love one another. the extent of our obedience shows the extent of our love. if you obey the Sabbath law because you think you will be damned if you do not, you are deceived and in bondage to the law. if you honor the Sabbath because of your love for God, you do well.

if we love the Lord if we love one another, we satisfy the whole law. love does not covet, murder, steal or lie. love does not create idols or boast of itself. as John wrote, this is the commandment we have had from the beginning, that we love one another as God has loved us. if we love the Lord, we will cease from our own labors and enter His rest, just as He did, and so fulfill the Sabbath. just as the outward sign of circumcision is not required of us, the outward ritual observance of His rest is not required, but neither is it discouraged -- what is required is circumcision of the heart, which is accomplished by the Spirit, and the true Sabbath rest, which is accomplished by Christ.

 

[chubbena]

i think it's a good idea to read the whole book.

What is the point of reading the whole book if not following?
He said: "Man does not live by bread alone, but by every word that comes from the mouth of God."

...if Gentiles who turn to God are compelled to put themselves under the burden of the law, they will have no trouble finding it. but as Peter said, we are saved by the grace of Jesus Christ, not by the law.

He is the Word of God who spoke through Moses and the prophets. If the law is bondage isn't He the author of such?

...we have two great commands: love the Lord and love one another. the extent of our obedience shows the extent of our love. if you obey the Sabbath law because you think you will be damned if you do not, you are deceived and in bondage to the law. if you honor the Sabbath because of your love for God, you do well.

The Word of God first gave these two comments in the torah. I think it's a good idea to read the whole book

 

[Erica]

the bible says, if ye love me then keep my commandments. it is easy to keep His commandments if we love Him.

 

[posthuman]

What is the point of reading the whole book if not following?
He said: "Man does not live by bread alone, but by every word that comes from the mouth of God."

He is the Word of God who spoke through Moses and the prophets. If the law is bondage isn't He the author of such?
The Word of God first gave these two comments in the torah. I think it's a good idea to read the whole book

what's the point of honoring God with our lips and hands and not with our hearts?
i'm not calling the law wrong or obedience to it wrong. just that we are set free from it!
a dead man is no longer beholden to the court, but i am made alive in Christ in newness and freedom!

Now, therefore, why are you putting God to the test
by placing a yoke on the neck of the disciples
that neither our fathers nor we have been able to bear?
(Acts 15:10)

But seeing that we have died to that which once held us in bondage,
the Law has now no hold over us, so that we render a service which,
instead of being old and formal, is new and spiritual.
(Romans 7:6)

Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free,
and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.
(Galatians 5:1)

if we are now in bondage, it is to Christ, not to the law of Moses, and we serve Him with love, not terror!

For he who is called by the Lord as a slave is the Lord's freedman.
Likewise he who is called as a free man is Christ's slave.
(1 Corinthians 7:22)

the precious gift of salvation through Jesus is very great indeed!!!

 

[Scuba]

the bible says, if ye love me then keep my commandments. it is easy to keep His commandments if we love Him.

Could you say that again, only louder, so everyone can hear you.

 

[prove-all]

acts 15 the question was do you have to be circumcised

Except ye be circumcised after the manner of Moses, ye cannot be saved.

the answer was no

20But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.

they did not go into any other salvation laws because they where allready given and was know them .

21For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.

 

[Scuba]

posthuman; what's the point of honoring God with our lips and hands and not with our hearts?
i'm not calling the law wrong or obedience to it wrong. just that we are set free from it!
a dead man is no longer beholden to the court, but i am made alive in Christ in newness and freedom!

Now, therefore, why are you putting God to the test
by placing a yoke on the neck of the disciples
that neither our fathers nor we have been able to bear?
(Acts 15:10)

Context:

Acts 15:1-2 And certain men came down from Judea and taught the brethren, “Unless you are circumcised according to the custom of Moses, you cannot be saved.” Therefore, when Paul and Barnabas had no small dissension and dispute with them, they determined that Paul and Barnabas and certain others of them should go up to Jerusalem, to the apostles and elders, about this question.

Salvation is a free gift through faith, not through circumcision.

Acts 15:8-10 So God, who knows the heart, acknowledged them by giving them the Holy Spirit, just as He did to us, and made no distinction between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith. Now therefore, why do you test God by putting a yoke on the neck of the disciples which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?

But seeing that we have died to that which once held us in bondage,
the Law has now no hold over us, so that we render a service which,
instead of being old and formal, is new and spiritual.
(Romans 7:6)

Context:

The purpose of the Law as to convict and condemn. We are no long under the aspect of the Law but the also defines love and righteousness. That will never go away. Knowing this I rejoice in the Law inwardly but outwardly I struggle with it.

Romans 7:21-25 I find then a law, that evil is present with me, the one who wills to do good. For I delight in the law of God according to the inward man. But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members. O wretched man that I am! Who will deliver me from this body of death? I thank God—through Jesus Christ our Lord! So then, with the mind I myself serve the law of God, but with the flesh the law of sin.

Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free,
and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.
(Galatians 5:1)

Again context: What must I do to be saved is the context. The yoke is what people say we must do to be saved and the answer is, believe on Jesus Christ, not get circumcised.

Galatians 5:1-4 Stand fast therefore in the liberty by which Christ has made us free, and do not be entangled again with a yoke of bondage. Indeed I, Paul, say to you that if you become circumcised, Christ will profit you nothing. And I testify again to every man who becomes circumcised that he is a debtor to keep the whole law. You have become estranged from Christ, you who attempt to be justified by law; you have fallen from grace.

if we are now in bondage, it is to Christ, not to the law of Moses, and we serve Him with love, not terror!

The Law of Moses is referring to circumcision, not the Ten Commandments.

For he who is called by the Lord as a slave is the Lord's freedman.
Likewise he who is called as a free man is Christ's slave.
(1 Corinthians 7:22)

Again context: Circumcision was a big issue back then. We are free from the law of having to be circumcised to be saved.

1 Corinthians 7:17-22 But as God has distributed to each one, as the Lord has called each one, so let him walk. And so I ordain in all the churches. Was anyone called while circumcised? Let him not become uncircumcised. Was anyone called while uncircumcised? Let him not be circumcised. Circumcision is nothing and uncircumcision is nothing, but keeping the commandments of God is what matters. Let each one remain in the same calling in which he was called. Were you called while a slave? Do not be concerned about it; but if you can be made free, rather use it. For he who is called in the Lord while a slave is the Lord’s freedman. Likewise he who is called while free is Christ’s slave.

the precious gift of salvation through Jesus is very great indeed!!!

Yes it is and it's a free gift for those who believe. And then there is the fruit of salvation which is obedience to the commandments of God.

 

[homwardbound]

Anyone that has not Faith in the finished work of Christ is sin and sin is bondage.
so the ? is are you growing in grace and leaving the trash can behind. God is the one doing this, many times it has been me in the way fro God to perform God's love and Mercy, I am growing in grace and am not proud of what I have done in past, yet what I do, is put behind me the past and move on into the future, trusting God to train me how to walk in Faith

Romans 1:17, the Just live by Faith in Christ Jesus unto Father as cleansed, l;earning to just trust, getting the self out of the way

 

[posthuman]

was circumcision a 'yoke that neither we nor our fathers could bear'

?

but it meant more than cutting skin to the people in that day. it was a symbol of the covenant of the law.

 

[chubbena]

what's the point of honoring God with our lips and hands and not with our hearts?

Obeying what is written does not necessarily imply lip services. He spoke through Isaiah and He in the flesh repeated: "These people come near to me with their mouth and honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me. Their worship of me is based on merely human rules they have been taught." And the law is not human rules, is it?

i'm not calling the law wrong or obedience to it wrong. just that we are set free from it!

We are free only because it has become a life style just as a law abiding citizen in USA.

a dead man is no longer beholden to the court, but i am made alive in Christ in newness and freedom!

And Paul was referring to death to sin.

Now, therefore, why are you putting God to the test
by placing a yoke on the neck of the disciples
that neither our fathers nor we have been able to bear?
(Acts 15:10)

That's not about His commandments but rather the misapplication of such or He would have contradicted Himself cf Deuteronomy 30:11-14 which Paul repeated that in his letter to the Romans.

But seeing that we have died to that which once held us in bondage,
the Law has now no hold over us, so that we render a service which,
instead of being old and formal, is new and spiritual.
(Romans 7:6)

When one is dead to sin the law has no hold to him just as a law abiding citizen in USA.

Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free,
and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.
(Galatians 5:1)

Indeed we were dead in sin but He has given us a new life. Do we go back to the bondage of sin?

if we are now in bondage, it is to Christ, not to the law of Moses, and we serve Him with love, not terror!

That's contradicting because He's the One who spoke through Moses.

 

[posthuman]

Context:

Acts 15:1-2 And certain men came down from Judea and taught the brethren, “Unless you are circumcised according to the custom of Moses, you cannot be saved.”

this may be a little misleading. here is Acts 15:5 in an interlinear form:

[TABLE="width: 500, align: center"]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]1817[e]5 Exanestēsan
Ἐξανέστησαν
5 rose up
5 V-AIA-3P[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]1161[e]
de
δέ
moreover
Conj
[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]5100[e]
tines
τινες
certain
IPro-NMP[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]3588[e]
tōn
τῶν
of those
Art-GMP
[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]575[e]
apo
ἀπὸ
of
Prep[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]3588[e]
tēs
τῆς
the
Art-GFS[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]139[e]
haireseōs
αἱρέσεως
sect
N-GFS[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]3588[e]
tōn
τῶν
of the
Art-GMP[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]5330[e]
Pharisaiōn
Φαρισαίων
Pharisees
N-GMP[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]4100[e]
pepisteukotes
πεπιστευκότες ,
who believed
V-RPA-NMP[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]3004[e]
legontes
λέγοντες ,
saying
V-PPA-NMP[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]3754[e]
hoti
ὅτι
-
Conj[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]1163[e]
dei
δεῖ
It is necessary
V-PIA-3S[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]4059[e]
peritemnein
περιτέμνειν
to circumcise
V-PNA[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]846[e]
autous
αὐτοὺς ,
them
PPro-AM3P[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]3853[e]
parangellein
παραγγέλλειν
to command [them]
V-PNA[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]5037[e]
te
τε
moreover
Conj[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]5083[e]
tērein
τηρεῖν
to keep
V-PNA[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]3588[e]
ton
τὸν
the
Art-AMS[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]3551[e]
nomon
νόμον
law
N-AMS[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]3475[e]
Mōuseōs
Μωϋσέως .
of Moses
N-GMS[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]
[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]
[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]
[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]
[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]
[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

i don't think this was only about circumcision -- i am not any sort of Greek scholar at all, but there is unmistakably a conjunction in the text 'τε' meaning 'and' or 'also' or 'moreover' -- not meaning 'according to'
so these men thought it was necessary for the Gentiles to do more than simply cut off their foreskins.

 

[homwardbound]

was circumcision a 'yoke that neither we nor our fathers could bear'

?

but it meant more than cutting skin to the people in that day. it was a symbol of the covenant of the law.

It does as a matter of fact, it was and is the shedding of blood, that neutralizes Father, stops Father from everyone's deserved death, take a look at exodus where God came to kill Moses and Zeporrah saved Moses with circumcision of Moses's first born Son, and threw the blood on Moses, to stop God, from then on Moses's Faith grew, and trusted God and example to us all, and we are forgiven today by the last shed blood of Christ for us to get new life in Spirit and truth from Father. All First Testament shows the love and anger of God, in our human frailities, and I thank god for Son all the more. For without this, I am dead, period

[h=1]Exodus 4:24-26King James Version (KJV)[/h] [SUP]24 [/SUP]And it came to pass by the way in the inn, that the Lord met him, and sought to kill him.
[SUP]25 [/SUP]Then Zipporah took a sharp stone, and cut off the foreskin of her son, and cast it at his feet, and said, Surely a bloody husband art thou to me.
[SUP]26 [/SUP]So he let him go: then she said, A bloody husband thou art, because of the circumcision.