K
Kenneth, what I am objecting to is you setting yourself as the be all and end all in Bilble interpretation, just because you are "led by the Holy Spirit", seeing that all the rest of us are too!
Anyone not being "led by the Holy Spirit" is not a Christian, because a Christian has the Holy Spirit.
So all things being equal, ALL of us being led by the Holy Spirit, there have to be others ways of correctly dividing the truth of God's Word besides, "I said so!"
One of those ways is weighing Scripture against Scripture. Another is weighing Scripture in the light of history, learning about the writers, and the original languages. Or learning someone from a valid teacher, whose books have stood the test of time, unlike internet sites which are set up by disaffected and angry people who have been rejected by the church for heresy.
When someone comes up with totally different doctrines, like adding books or taking away books, then everything that person says comes into disrepute!
And this happens because you are not correctly educated in how to read the Bible correctly! In all my quotes, I put a link to the source or the book where I got the information.
In your posts, including the one above you are asserting many things about the nature and formation of the canon, added words, words taken away, you have never posted a single source to defend your views. Not a single explanation using the original languages Instead, you rail against people with these extraneous ideas, with no support from literature, the Bible or anything resembling scholarship.
And then you have the nerve to criticize people who have seriously studied the Bible in Seminary or College who have looked deeply into these issues, using correct scholarship, by saying something to the fact that they are still ignorant!
And you did start the debate. I am not going to stand back and have you slander me, and everyone else I know who has graduated from Seminary and is serving God in multiple capacities. Like being pastors, missionaries, helping in para church organizations, teaching and leading in their local church, etc.
It is an ignorant person who says that the educated people are the ones who are ignorant. Now, not everyone who seeks further education in studying the Bible is perfect or called by God. And certainly there are many people who have studied the Bible extensively on their own, and have discovered good doctrine from their studies and using lots of good sources to support the Bible.
But this blanket condemnation of higher education to learn the Bible better is based on jealousy, pride or shame.
I think if you are going to make such completely off the wall statements about the Bible, adding to it, subtracting from it, including entire books, you better back up your claims with some reputable sources. Since you have never done that on any issue, I will assume that you are happy to remain ignorant and pushing beliefs and doctrines which are not based on any substantial research or community understanding of the Bible, the church and for that matter - Jesus Christ himself!
If that is mean, I am sorry. It is not meant for you personally, although a good portion of this can specificallty apply to you, because we are discussing your extrabiblical revelation. But it also applies to other people who are unable to correctly divide the Word of God because of no teaching or bad teaching.
Teaching, right? It all comes back to the OP, and that we should not be afraid to read from multiple sources and authors to supplement our Bible studies. But that also means knowing a lot about these teachers, and comparing what they say against the Word of God. But if someone does form a strange doctrine, they need to be prepared to give a strong account of where they learned it, and why they think it is valid. And certainly be prepared to have it refuted by people, especially those who are educated to recognize heresy when they see it.
PS. I am not talking about the Catholic Church and when it was formed, which I agree was probably sometime in the 4th century. I am talking about the numerous times you present doctrine which comes right out of your modern day RCC indoctrination when you were studying to be a Catholic.
Anyone not being "led by the Holy Spirit" is not a Christian, because a Christian has the Holy Spirit.
So all things being equal, ALL of us being led by the Holy Spirit, there have to be others ways of correctly dividing the truth of God's Word besides, "I said so!"
One of those ways is weighing Scripture against Scripture. Another is weighing Scripture in the light of history, learning about the writers, and the original languages. Or learning someone from a valid teacher, whose books have stood the test of time, unlike internet sites which are set up by disaffected and angry people who have been rejected by the church for heresy.
When someone comes up with totally different doctrines, like adding books or taking away books, then everything that person says comes into disrepute!
And this happens because you are not correctly educated in how to read the Bible correctly! In all my quotes, I put a link to the source or the book where I got the information.
In your posts, including the one above you are asserting many things about the nature and formation of the canon, added words, words taken away, you have never posted a single source to defend your views. Not a single explanation using the original languages Instead, you rail against people with these extraneous ideas, with no support from literature, the Bible or anything resembling scholarship.
And then you have the nerve to criticize people who have seriously studied the Bible in Seminary or College who have looked deeply into these issues, using correct scholarship, by saying something to the fact that they are still ignorant!
And you did start the debate. I am not going to stand back and have you slander me, and everyone else I know who has graduated from Seminary and is serving God in multiple capacities. Like being pastors, missionaries, helping in para church organizations, teaching and leading in their local church, etc.
It is an ignorant person who says that the educated people are the ones who are ignorant. Now, not everyone who seeks further education in studying the Bible is perfect or called by God. And certainly there are many people who have studied the Bible extensively on their own, and have discovered good doctrine from their studies and using lots of good sources to support the Bible.
But this blanket condemnation of higher education to learn the Bible better is based on jealousy, pride or shame.
I think if you are going to make such completely off the wall statements about the Bible, adding to it, subtracting from it, including entire books, you better back up your claims with some reputable sources. Since you have never done that on any issue, I will assume that you are happy to remain ignorant and pushing beliefs and doctrines which are not based on any substantial research or community understanding of the Bible, the church and for that matter - Jesus Christ himself!
If that is mean, I am sorry. It is not meant for you personally, although a good portion of this can specificallty apply to you, because we are discussing your extrabiblical revelation. But it also applies to other people who are unable to correctly divide the Word of God because of no teaching or bad teaching.
Teaching, right? It all comes back to the OP, and that we should not be afraid to read from multiple sources and authors to supplement our Bible studies. But that also means knowing a lot about these teachers, and comparing what they say against the Word of God. But if someone does form a strange doctrine, they need to be prepared to give a strong account of where they learned it, and why they think it is valid. And certainly be prepared to have it refuted by people, especially those who are educated to recognize heresy when they see it.
PS. I am not talking about the Catholic Church and when it was formed, which I agree was probably sometime in the 4th century. I am talking about the numerous times you present doctrine which comes right out of your modern day RCC indoctrination when you were studying to be a Catholic.
Again you are making statements that I never said nor implied !!!
I do take correction if it is found to be biblically sound, as I have changed my stance on some areas over the years that others by the Holy Spirit have shown me. However if something you or another person tells me is this way, if I have already researched it by the Holy Spirit and the scriptures and found it not to be that way then no I am not going to agree with you.
That does not make me the end all know all person you claim, it just simply means I have already done that research.
Who is a better valid teacher then God Himself by the Holy Spirit ???
The scriptures say and show that if we have a question go to prayer to God and by His Holy Spirit He will give us the knowledge we seek, rather it come personally or by leading us to another person for that knowledge. The fact still remains the guidance of the Holy Spirit must be put first in any steps we take.
Again I never condemned higher education or learning !!!
I do not know where you get that from as I have repeated it more then once there is nothing wrong with it, but with it just like anything else you have to test it and not just take it as truth what they are telling you.
Like I have said before go and watch the Discovery and History channels when the do programs based on the bible.
Those people they have on those programs went to bible college or a Seminary school, but what they say may line up with the bible only about 15% of the time. They are blatantly wrong the rest of the time !!!
Again also I never said those books by Barnabas or any others should be added to the bible, nor did I say they are to override anything written in the bible. What I said is they do provide instruction and understanding in some areas of study.
Just like I told elf3 if you are going to say outside sources can not be used then you are using a faulty argument, because then you would have to throw out all your bible scholars, Hebrew and Greek study materials, and other books and such that you have used or read in your learning program and studies.
Again you are mistaken in this last part and I would greatly appreciate it if you would stop trying to pass RCC on me.
I do not follow their church or their doctrines, nor do I teach them, and again a document from the 2nd century (101-200 AD) can not be a Catholic doctrine or even started by them when they did not exist !!!
I am not studying to be a Catholic, I left that church because the falsehoods they taught !!!
Please stop with the false accusations !!!