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This is a re-post of a statement I made just a couple days ago concerning the same arguments set forth on these forums. The posting was actually directed towards a certain forum user, so there may be portions there not directed towards you. This is to help clear up the Oneness controversy, since it seems some didn't see the post. Be sure to read it all, and you'll get a clearer picture of the argument as a whole:
First, let me tell you that what I’m about to proclaim is going to make you really, really upset, or it is going to be really, really insightful.
In a previous post you said, ‘You can refute modalism all you want I am not a modalist, and that is not what Ricke was teaching.’ I contend that this is precisely what is being taught by you, and Ricke. Sequential modalism may differ than the view that Oneness Pentecostals hold true to, but regardless, you agree that God is one in Person, with three distinct personalities, thus you are a modalist. Of course, there are different forms of modalism, such as, Patripassianism, which Oneness Pentecostals deny, but all Oneness groups (whether you be a Oneness Pentecostal, or Patripassianist) are considered modalists. Modalism is simply the belief that God is one in Person. David Bernard, a Oneness advocate, even said, "Modalism is the same as the modern doctrine of Oneness." (the Oneness of God p.318 ).
I find it almost fascinating that some Jehovah Witnesses, as well as some Mormons, but not always, make the false accusation that Trinitarian’s actually adhere to Oneness theology, that is, most often, believe that we think Jesus is the Father, and the Holy Spirit is the Son, and every other combination of the sort. Then it comes to Oneness proponents, and they accuse the Trinitarian of tri-theism, which is actually a Mormon view of God (Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are all separate, and individual Gods, no unity), but it is even evident, that Mormons are actually more polytheistic, in their belief that they too can achieve a status equivalent to God, and that they too could rule over planet(s). And then we have the Trinitarian caught in the center of the cross hairs of fire, waving that big red flag, saying, ‘No, no, no, and no… that’s not what we believe, you’ve got it all wrong!’ The Jehovah Witnesses, the Mormons, and the Oneness folks don’t quite get their accusations right at all. So here I am, holding that big red flag. Let me share with you what a Trinitarian is, and what a Trinitarian is not.
(Continued...)
First, let me tell you that what I’m about to proclaim is going to make you really, really upset, or it is going to be really, really insightful.
In a previous post you said, ‘You can refute modalism all you want I am not a modalist, and that is not what Ricke was teaching.’ I contend that this is precisely what is being taught by you, and Ricke. Sequential modalism may differ than the view that Oneness Pentecostals hold true to, but regardless, you agree that God is one in Person, with three distinct personalities, thus you are a modalist. Of course, there are different forms of modalism, such as, Patripassianism, which Oneness Pentecostals deny, but all Oneness groups (whether you be a Oneness Pentecostal, or Patripassianist) are considered modalists. Modalism is simply the belief that God is one in Person. David Bernard, a Oneness advocate, even said, "Modalism is the same as the modern doctrine of Oneness." (the Oneness of God p.318 ).
I find it almost fascinating that some Jehovah Witnesses, as well as some Mormons, but not always, make the false accusation that Trinitarian’s actually adhere to Oneness theology, that is, most often, believe that we think Jesus is the Father, and the Holy Spirit is the Son, and every other combination of the sort. Then it comes to Oneness proponents, and they accuse the Trinitarian of tri-theism, which is actually a Mormon view of God (Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are all separate, and individual Gods, no unity), but it is even evident, that Mormons are actually more polytheistic, in their belief that they too can achieve a status equivalent to God, and that they too could rule over planet(s). And then we have the Trinitarian caught in the center of the cross hairs of fire, waving that big red flag, saying, ‘No, no, no, and no… that’s not what we believe, you’ve got it all wrong!’ The Jehovah Witnesses, the Mormons, and the Oneness folks don’t quite get their accusations right at all. So here I am, holding that big red flag. Let me share with you what a Trinitarian is, and what a Trinitarian is not.
- A Trinitarian is totally Monotheistic, that is, the belief in One God (please note the difference between One Being, and One Person). Deuteronomy 6:4, Isaiah 45:18, James 2:19
- A Trinitarian believes that the Scripture declares that the Father is 100% God (Galatians 1:1, Romans 1:7, 1 Corinthians 1:3, 1 Corinthians 8:6, Ephesians 1:2; 3), that the Son is 100% God (Isaiah 48:11-16, Hebrews 1:8-12, John 1:1-14, Colossians 1:13-17, Revelation 22:12-16), and that the Holy Spirit is 100% God (Acts 5:1-5, Job 33:4, Psalms 139:7-8, Hebrews 9:14, Acts 8:29; 10:19; 11:12; 21:11, 1 Timothy 4:1, Hebrews 3:7)
- A Trinitarian believes that the Father is Eternal, that the Word (Christ before His manifestation) is Eternal, and that the Spirit is Eternal. That is, Christ as the Eternal Word pre-existed with the Father, as well as the Holy Spirit.
- A Trinitarian believes that God exists in three Persons revealed to us as the Father, Son, and Spirit, and that they are One in Being and in purpose, that is, the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit make up a tri-unity (Trinity). The Father, Son, and Holy Spirit exist in unity in the Godhead.
- A Trinitarian does not believe the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are separate, or distinct Beings (not to be confused with Persons).
- The Doctrine of the Trinity teaches that there is One Being, that is God. Not that there’s three Being that are One Being. Nor does it teach that there is One Person that is three Persons. The Trinity is One Being that is God, three Persons that fully share that Divine Being.
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