MisUsing Scripture: One Pearl

[AnandaHya]

I didn't realize until recently that we might not be talking on the same level plane of understanding. I thought everyone understood the basics, the foundation and that we were building upon that foundation when we spoke about the church, spiritual gifts and having a mature walk with Jesus in our every day lives.

However after having various conversations I realize. hmmm perhaps we should start the conversation on the basics. What is Grace and salvation?

Grace is undeserved and the one pearl given to people when they were sinners still. Jesus talks about the Kingdom of Heaven being a pearl that once found the person will trade everything they have to possess it.

That is grace, once you have it you will be willing to give up EVERYTHING up because that is what Jesus ask of us. To forsake family, material possessions,etc and pick up our cross and follow HIM. That is how you know you have the Holy Spirit firmly rooted in your heart, you are willing to give and trust God with EVERYTHING in your life. That is perfected Faith which only happens through the chastening of the Lord.

If you do not have perfected Faith then you do not yet have the breastplate of Righteousness needed to engage in battle with the forces of darkness. You need to abide in FAITH that God will protect you and save you and drink more milk which is God's Holy Bible.

A firm understanding of the Bible and the Gospel through a daily walk under the guidance of the Holy Spirit is what gives you the shoes of peace so that you may be like sheep among wolves, wise as serpents and kind as doves. It also allows God to sharpen your sword of the Spirit, which is the Holy Bible and your understanding of it.

NOTE: since you have given all to God in trust and love, then God will give you a burden that is light and that you can bear, which is the task He wants you to accomplish with your life.

He will ask you to care for certain people and will show you the gifts and abilities He already gave you since birth and how you can use them to show HIS grace and goodness to the world.

However the humbleness of spirit and willingness to sacrifice all, even your beloved children as God once asked a man in the Bible, is what is needed. For God sees people's HEARTS and judges their WORDS, THOUGHTS AND ACTIONS.

you can act like you have the Holy Spirit and do signs and miracles and more but if your heart has not been fully given to GOD and you do it out of pride and self righteousness then Jesus will say

"depart from me, for I never knew you"

Therefore, search your heart and pray to God. The pearl that everyone who calls themselves Christian should have is the knowledge of Grace: that while we were sinners still, Jesus died for us and saved us from death and damnaation of Hell. He gave us a place in heaven and gave us the honor of being adopted children of God.

therefore why do people pray to God like He is a vending machine, instead of thanking God for what He has already done?

Jesus told us do not rejoice that you can do miracles and cast out demons, but rejoice that your name is written in the Book of Life.

Basics, after people have that covered then we can move into talking about spiritual gifts and spiritual armor....

 

[livingbygrace]

I didn't realize until recently that we might not be talking on the same level plane of understanding. I thought everyone understood the basics, the foundation and that we were building upon that foundation when we spoke about the church, spiritual gifts and having a mature walk with Jesus in our every day lives.

However after having various conversations I realize. hmmm perhaps we should start the conversation on the basics. What is Grace and salvation?

Grace is undeserved and the one pearl given to people when they were sinners still. Jesus talks about the Kingdom of Heaven being a pearl that once found the person will trade everything they have to possess it.

That is grace, once you have it you will be willing to give up EVERYTHING up because that is what Jesus ask of us. To forsake family, material possessions,etc and pick up our cross and follow HIM. That is how you know you have the Holy Spirit firmly rooted in your heart, you are willing to give and trust God with EVERYTHING in your life. That is perfected Faith which only happens through the chastening of the Lord.

If you do not have perfected Faith then you do not yet have the breastplate of Righteousness needed to engage in battle with the forces of darkness. You need to abide in FAITH that God will protect you and save you and drink more milk which is God's Holy Bible.

A firm understanding of the Bible and the Gospel through a daily walk under the guidance of the Holy Spirit is what gives you the shoes of peace so that you may be like sheep among wolves, wise as serpents and kind as doves. It also allows God to sharpen your sword of the Spirit, which is the Holy Bible and your understanding of it.

NOTE: since you have given all to God in trust and love, then God will give you a burden that is light and that you can bear, which is the task He wants you to accomplish with your life.

He will ask you to care for certain people and will show you the gifts and abilities He already gave you since birth and how you can use them to show HIS grace and goodness to the world.

However the humbleness of spirit and willingness to sacrifice all, even your beloved children as God once asked a man in the Bible, is what is needed. For God sees people's HEARTS and judges their WORDS, THOUGHTS AND ACTIONS.

you can act like you have the Holy Spirit and do signs and miracles and more but if your heart has not been fully given to GOD and you do it out of pride and self righteousness then Jesus will say

"depart from me, for I never knew you"

Therefore, search your heart and pray to God. The pearl that everyone who calls themselves Christian should have is the knowledge of Grace: that while we were sinners still, Jesus died for us and saved us from death and damnaation of Hell. He gave us a place in heaven and gave us the honor of being adopted children of God.

therefore why do people pray to God like He is a vending machine, instead of thanking God for what He has already done?

Jesus told us do not rejoice that you can do miracles and cast out demons, but rejoice that your name is written in the Book of Life.

Basics, after people have that covered then we can move into talking about spiritual gifts and spiritual armor....

I agree with most of what you write here

No-one can be saved without grace, but how many truly in their hearts have given up EVERYTHING for God. I admit to my shame I have not done this, but earnestly wish I had

Kathryn Khulman once said

Anyone could see the power and miracles in their services that I have seen, but iot costs EVERYTHING

I agree, the Christian shlould be prepared to sacrifice all, but I have rarely in reality seen this happen, and I include myself in this

How many do you know that actually would forsake their family, home, everything in order to take up their cross and follow Christ. It is easy for us to say we would do it, but I would suggest that if in practice it was done by large amounts of people far more power and famous ministries would spring up

It is not I disagree with the goal that every Christian should aspire to, but like I say, in reality I believe only few ever reach that stage in their Christian walk

 

[AnandaHya]

that is why we are chastened LBG, because until we are willing to give all to God then we can not have the breastplate of righteousness. I admit I'm not quite there yet either, but I'm working on it through the guidance of the Holy Spirit. Even the Apostle Paul did not quite get there before he started ministering. that is how we know its not US but the HOLY SPIRIT that speaks to people and uses us as His hands and feet, because we are still not worthy without HIS grace to speak of such things.

Philippians 3:12 CEV
"I have not yet reached my goal, and I am not perfect. But Christ has taken hold of me. So I keep on running and struggling to take hold of the prize."

Ephesians 2:8 AMP
"For it is by free grace (God's unmerited favor) that you are saved (delivered from judgement and made partakers of Christ's salvation) through (your) faith. And this (salvation) is not of yourselves (of your own doing, it came not through your own striving) but it is a the gift of GOD"

Therefore we need to acknowledge what we are striving to reach to acknowledge and ask God to help us achieve the goal because we can not on our own change a hair on our heads.

 

[livingbygrace]

that is why we are chastened LBG, because until we are willing to give all to God then we can not have the breastplate of righteousness. I admit I'm not quite there yet either, but I'm working on it through the guidance of the Holy Spirit. Even the Apostle Paul did not quite get there before he started ministering. that is how we know its not US but the HOLY SPIRIT that speaks to people and uses us as His hands and feet, because we are still not worthy without HIS grace to speak of such things.

Philippians 3:12 CEV
"I have not yet reached my goal, and I am not perfect. But Christ has taken hold of me. So I keep on running and struggling to take hold of the prize."

Ephesians 2:8 AMP
"For it is by free grace (God's unmerited favor) that you are saved (delivered from judgement and made partakers of Christ's salvation) through (your) faith. And this (salvation) is not of yourselves (of your own doing, it came not through your own striving) but it is a the gift of GOD"

Therefore we need to acknowledge what we are striving to reach to acknowledge and ask God to help us achieve the goal because we can not on our own change a hair on our heads.

I know in your heart you want to be there ananda, I was not meaning to be critical of what you wrote, but just to stress it is not an easy matter to give up everything. I don't believe in pourselves we ever could do such a thing, but in the power of the spirt? That is another matter

 

[AnandaHya]

Alone we can do nothing except spin our wheels in an endless treadmill tryng but never reaching the goal, only through the grace of God are we saved and continue to live and work towards what God wants us to do and be. We work not to become saved but because we ARE saved. I wonder how many know the difference between the two.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Alone we can do nothing except spin our wheels in an endless treadmill tryng but never reaching the goal, only through the grace of God are we saved and continue to live and work towards what God wants us to do and be. We work not to become saved but because we ARE saved. I wonder how many know the difference between the two.

Unfortunately not many. Straight and narrow is the gate that leads to salvation and FEW their are than enter it. We even see this in those who profess to be part of the church.

 

[AnandaHya]

There we go an article that describes the type of church everyone should seek to belong to an ORGANIC CHURCH one that is natural and displays the natural gifts of the Spirit through growth, guidance and relationship with God. (thanks for the link uncleFester)

"However, within her body, she possesses the genetic codes that will produce the physical development by which to carry out these capabilities. If she is fed and nurtured properly, in time, these abilities will naturally develop within her. She will organically grow into them. Why? Because they are organic to her species as a human being. They are the product of human life.
In the same way, when an organic church is born, it possesses within its spiritual DNA all the giftings that are in Jesus Christ. But it takes time for them to develop and emerge. (Unfortunately, we live in a day when many church leaders don’t seem to understand this spiritual principle. Hence, they try to force the exercise of gifts and ministries in the body prematurely.)
What is needed, then, is not a restoration of the so-called “five-fold ministry.” What’s needed is the restoration of organic church life. And that is what God is seeking to restore today as He has in every generation.
Therefore, if we can discover how a church is born from God’s perspective and how it is to be nurtured and maintained, then we will see a restoration of all the gifts that are in Christ in the waythat they were meant to be expressed. (For a detailed discussion on how churches were planted and sustained in the New Testament, see Finding Organic Church.)
Since I’ve been meeting in organic churches over the last twenty years, I’ve made a startling discovery: The gifts of the Holy Spirit function very differently in an organic expression of the church than they do in the typical institutional church. The gift of prophecy, for example, that comes up out of the soil of authentic body life looks profoundly different from the way it’s packaged in the typical Pentecostal/Charismatic church. (The latter is often based on imitating others.)"

Rethinking the Five-Fold Ministry Reimagining Church

 

[zone]

I didn't realize until recently that we might not be talking on the same level plane of understanding. I thought everyone understood the basics, the foundation and that we were building upon that foundation when we spoke about the church, spiritual gifts and having a mature walk with Jesus in our every day lives.

However after having various conversations I realize. hmmm perhaps we should start the conversation on the basics.....

are you ready to learn now? or are you still teaching?

That is grace, once you have it you will be willing to give up EVERYTHING up because that is what Jesus ask of us. To forsake family, material possessions,etc and pick up our cross and follow HIM. That is how you know you have the Holy Spirit firmly rooted in your heart, you are willing to give and trust God with EVERYTHING in your life. That is perfected Faith which only happens through the chastening of the Lord......

who told you THAT?
faith is trusting in Jesus.

if you are being chastened it's because you are sinning or going astray.

If you do not have perfected Faith then you do not yet have the breastplate of Righteousness needed to engage in battle with the forces of darkness. ....

who told you THAT?
just whose breastplate are you wearing?
your own?

since you have been engaging the forces of darkness in battle for quite some time it seems, and are a prophet, how come you don't know what's actually happening in the world?

You need to abide in FAITH that God will protect you and save you and drink more milk which is God's Holy Bible.

A firm understanding of the Bible and the Gospel through a daily walk under the guidance of the Holy Spirit is what gives you the shoes of peace so that you may be like sheep among wolves, wise as serpents and kind as doves. It also allows God to sharpen your sword of the Spirit, which is the Holy Bible and your understanding of it.....

that's true.
so why haven't you done those things instead of looking to charismatic charlatans for guidance?
so far you haven't been able to recognize the wolves at all.

However the humbleness of spirit and willingness to sacrifice all, even your beloved children as God once asked a man in the Bible, is what is needed. For God sees people's HEARTS and judges their WORDS, THOUGHTS AND ACTIONS.....

would any sacrifice you offer (even your children) be better than His Sacrifice?
just whose offering are you counting on?

Psalm 51:17
The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit; a broken and contrite heart, O God, you will not despise.

Isaiah 57:15
For thus says the One who is high and lifted up, who inhabits eternity, whose name is Holy: “I dwell in the high and holy place, and also with him who is of a contrite and lowly spirit, to revive the spirit of the lowly, and to revive the heart of the contrite.

Psalm 138:6
For though the LORD is high, he regards the lowly, but the haughty he knows from afar.

Hebrews 10:10
And by that will, we have been made holy through the sacrifice of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

you can act like you have the Holy Spirit and do signs and miracles and more but if your heart has not been fully given to GOD and you do it out of pride and self righteousness then Jesus will say

"depart from me, for I never knew you"....

if your heart has not been fully given to God? what does that mean?

is that why Jesus says depart from me?

He says he NEVER knew them.

He does not say He knew them and their heart was not fully given to God, or that they did not sacrifice their children or engage the enemy.

HE NEVER APPROVED OF THEM AT ALL.

Therefore, search your heart and pray to God. The pearl that everyone who calls themselves Christian should have is the knowledge of Grace: that while we were sinners still, Jesus died for us and saved us from death and damnaation of Hell. He gave us a place in heaven and gave us the honor of being adopted children of God.....

amen.
that's that.

therefore why do people pray to God like He is a vending machine, instead of thanking God for what He has already done?....

because they learned it from the WORD FAITH apostates.

Basics, after people have that covered then we can move into talking about spiritual gifts and spiritual armor....

are you still teaching?

 

[zone]

I agree with most of what you write here

No-one can be saved without grace, but how many truly in their hearts have given up EVERYTHING for God. I admit to my shame I have not done this, but earnestly wish I had

Kathryn Khulman once said

Anyone could see the power and miracles in their services that I have seen, but iot costs EVERYTHING

I agree, the Christian shlould be prepared to sacrifice all, but I have rarely in reality seen this happen, and I include myself in this

How many do you know that actually would forsake their family, home, everything in order to take up their cross and follow Christ. It is easy for us to say we would do it, but I would suggest that if in practice it was done by large amounts of people far more power and famous ministries would spring up

It is not I disagree with the goal that every Christian should aspire to, but like I say, in reality I believe only few ever reach that stage in their Christian walk

why would anyone listen to what Kathryn Khulman said?


"BY YOUR WORDS"
QUOTES FROM THIRD WAVE LEADERS

Matthew 12:36-37 "But I tell you that men will have to give account on the day of judgment for every careless word they have spoken. For by your words you will be acquitted, and by your words you will be condemned."

Here is a list of quotes from leaders in the Third Wave and "counterfeit" revival movements.

This page will provide you the documented evidence you need to determine whether or not the people listed on this page are teaching false doctrine and/or making false prophesies.

This page includes quotes from: A.A. Allen, John Arnott, John Avanzini, William Branham, Paul Cain, Charles Capps, Morris Cerullo, Paul Yonggi Cho, Randy Clark, Jack Coe, Kenneth Copeland, Paul Crouch, Jack Deere, Kenneth Hagin, Marilyn Hickey, Steve Hill, Benny Hinn, Rodney Howard-Browne, Rick Joyner, Essek Kenyon, John Kilpatrick, Kathryn Kuhlman, Aimee Semple McPherson, Earl Paulk, Peter Popoff, Fred Price, Oral Roberts, Pat Robertson, John Scotland, Robert Tilton, and John Wimber. Click on their name to go to their quotes. They are arranged in alphabetical order.

~

False teachers can repent of their false teaching and change. If they do, the church should forgive them and restore them if they remain in sound doctrine. If their apologies are hollow and deceitful and they persist in teaching false doctrine, they must come under church discipline as detailed in 1 Cor. 5, Eph 5:6-14 and Matt. 18:15-17. We must try them (I John 4: 1), we must rebuke them (Titus 1:13), we must have no fellowship with them if they do not repent (Eph. 5:11), we must withdraw from them (2 Thes. 3:6), we must separate from them (2 Cor. 6:17), we must turn away from them (2 Tim 3:5,7), we must mark them and avoid them (Rom. 16:17), we must not receive them into our house (2 John 10). We are to reject heretics (Titus 3:10).

http://www.deceptioninthechurch.com/quotes.html



~ really, the same names and phrases keep coming up over and over.

things like, THE THIRD WAVE....how hard is it to take some time to find out what's wrong with it?
what is it they all have in common?

 

[zone]

Alone we can do nothing except spin our wheels in an endless treadmill tryng but never reaching the goal, only through the grace of God are we saved and continue to live and work towards what God wants us to do and be. We work not to become saved but because we ARE saved. I wonder how many know the difference between the two.

i wonder the same thing.

 

[AnandaHya]

Zone, I was never "teaching" I was just expressing what I've learned and hoping others will find comfort in the words. that is why you have such a problem with me. Prophecy is for the Edification, Exhortation and Comfort of the church. Its similar but NOT the same thing.

Do you know the difference?

One is based on the Teacher/Individuals knowledge and experience (teaching) the other is based on experience and being lead by the Holy Spirit to words from Scripture or episodes in one's life or testimony that will help the listener to understand better that God is ALIVE and still active in this world.

As for the breastplate of righteousness its based on these verses:
Hebrews 12:3-11 (New King James Version)


The Discipline of God


3 For consider Him who endured such hostility from sinners against Himself, lest you become weary and discouraged in your souls. 4 You have not yet resisted to bloodshed, striving against sin. 5 And you have forgotten the exhortation which speaks to you as to sons:


“ My son, do not despise the chastening of the LORD,
Nor be discouraged when you are rebuked by Him;
6 For whom the LORD loves He chastens,
And scourges every son whom He receives.”[a]

7 If[b] you endure chastening, God deals with you as with sons; for what son is there whom a father does not chasten? 8 But if you are without chastening, of which all have become partakers, then you are illegitimate and not sons. 9 Furthermore, we have had human fathers who corrected us, and we paid them respect. Shall we not much more readily be in subjection to the Father of spirits and live? 10 For they indeed for a few days chastened us as seemed best to them, but He for our profit, that we may be partakers of His holiness. 11 Now no chastening seems to be joyful for the present, but painful; nevertheless, afterward it yields the peaceable fruit of righteousness to those who have been trained by it

when did I ever say that God had left you? though you may have wandered away from God, He NEVER Leaves His chosen ones. Remember I said God told me to be nice to you even though you weren't very pleasant.

who would be doing the teaching, if not the Holy Spirit?

God chastens His children unless you are not a rightful heir.