Dual Covenant Theology

[zone]

Nothing to respnd to here

why not?
the passages say with whom God is in Covenant.

who is in Covenant with The Lord?

1 John 2:23
No one who denies the Son has the Father. Whoever confesses the Son has the Father also.

why don't you believe the plain words of scripture, mark?

1 John 4 c 90AD
1Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world. 2By this you know the Spirit of God: every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God, 3and every spirit that does not confess Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you heard was coming and now is in the world already. 4Little children, you are from God and have overcome them, for he who is in you is greater than he who is in the world. 5They are from the world; therefore they speak from the world, and the world listens to them. 6We are from God. Whoever knows God listens to us; whoever is not from God does not listen to us. By this we know the Spirit of truth and the spirit of error.

written by John, the jewish disciple Jesus loved.

he said plainly:

"every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God, 3and every spirit that does not confess Jesus is not from God."

who is from God?
with whom is God in Covenant as of john's writing?

was there a change of mind from God about who is antichrist?
could you show it to me?

"every spirit that does not confess Jesus is not from God."

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I am not saying i agree with this, but one Christian said they considered the abomination that causes desolation to be nuclear weapons which would be in the Temple, Jerusalem
I repeat, that view was put forward to me, I have no opinon really as to the worth of it

well make an opinion. That is not founded in scripture. The beast commits the abomination by placing an idol in the inner sanctum, then declares himself to be God.. and forces the world to worship him.. A nuc would have no significants.

 

[mark54]

why not?
the passages say with whom God is in Covenant.

who is in Covenant with The Lord?

1 John 2:23
No one who denies the Son has the Father. Whoever confesses the Son has the Father also.

why don't you believe the plain words of scripture, mark?

1 John 4 c 90AD
1Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world. 2By this you know the Spirit of God: every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God, 3and every spirit that does not confess Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you heard was coming and now is in the world already. 4Little children, you are from God and have overcome them, for he who is in you is greater than he who is in the world. 5They are from the world; therefore they speak from the world, and the world listens to them. 6We are from God. Whoever knows God listens to us; whoever is not from God does not listen to us. By this we know the Spirit of truth and the spirit of error.

written by John, the jewish disciple Jesus loved.

he said plainly:

"every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God, 3and every spirit that does not confess Jesus is not from God."

who is from God?
with whom is God in Covenant as of john's writing?

Same again, move along

I'm not going to write the above anymore, just not reply, it is getting monotonous

 

[zone]

Same again, move along

I'm not going to write the above anymore, just not reply, it is getting monotonous

write what?
your simple understanding of Hebrew imagery?
it's pictoral.
you should be able to see Jesus and the Church in it clearly.
plainly.

if you are from God....it should be clear.
i wonder why it isn't.

 

[zone]

Nothing to respond to here, move along

move along?
no, i don't think so.

with whom is God in Covenant?

John 8:19
They said to him therefore, “Where is your Father?” Jesus answered, “You know neither me nor my Father. If you knew me, you would know my Father also.”

 

[mark54]

I will destroy the wisdom of the wise;
the intelligence of the intelligent I will frustrate.”[SUP][c][/SUP] [SUP]20 [/SUP]Where is the wise person? Where is the teacher of the law? Where is the philosopher of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world

 

[zone]

I am not saying i agree with this, but one Christian said they considered the abomination that causes desolation to be nuclear weapons which would be in the Temple, Jerusalem
I repeat, that view was put forward to me, I have no opinon really as to the worth of it

what temple?


Matthew 16:21
From that time on Jesus began to explain to his disciples that he must go to Jerusalem and suffer many things at the hands of the elders, chief priests and teachers of the law, and that he must be killed and on the third day be raised to life.

John 2:19
Jesus answered them, "Destroy this temple, and I will raise it again in three days."

Matthew 26:61
and declared, "This fellow said, 'I am able to destroy the temple of God and rebuild it in three days.'"

Mark 14:58
"We heard him say, 'I will destroy this man-made temple and in three days will build another, not made by man.'"

Matthew 27:40
and saying, "You who are going to destroy the temple and build it in three days, save yourself! Come down from the cross, if you are the Son of God!"

Hebrews 9:11
When Christ came as high priest of the good things that are already here, he went through the greater and more perfect tabernacle that is not man-made, that is to say, not a part of this creation.

2 Corinthians 5:1
Now we know that if the earthly tent we live in is destroyed, we have a building from God, an eternal house in heaven, not built by human hands.

2 Peter 3:10
But the day of the Lord will come like a thief, and then the heavens will pass away with a roar, and the heavenly bodies will be burned up and dissolved, and the earth and the works that are done on it will be exposed.

Revelation 6:14
The sky receded like a scroll, rolling up, and every mountain and island was removed from its place.

Revelation 21:1
Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea.


where....where is the promise of a third temple for any purpose?

 

[zone]

I will destroy the wisdom of the wise;
the intelligence of the intelligent I will frustrate.”[SUP][c][/SUP] [SUP]20 [/SUP]Where is the wise person? Where is the teacher of the law? Where is the philosopher of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world

back to sock-puppetry.
we're done.

 

[mark54]

Do not deceive yourselves. If any of you think you are wise by the standards of this age, you should become “fools” so that you may become wise. [SUP]19 [/SUP]For the wisdom of this world is foolishness in God’s sight. As it is written: “He catches the wise in their craftiness”[SUP][a][/SUP]; [SUP]20 [/SUP]and again, “The Lord knows that the thoughts of the wise are futile

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I will destroy the wisdom of the wise;
the intelligence of the intelligent I will frustrate.”[SUP][c][/SUP] [SUP]20 [/SUP]Where is the wise person? Where is the teacher of the law? Where is the philosopher of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world

[SUP]18 [/SUP]do not be arrogant toward the branches; but if you are arrogant, remember that it is not you who supports the root, but the root supports you. [SUP]19 [/SUP]You will say then, “Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in.” [SUP]20 [/SUP]Quite right, they were broken off for their unbelief, but you stand by your faith. Do not be conceited, but fear; [SUP]21 [/SUP]for if God did not spare the natural branches, He will not spare you, either. [SUP]22 [/SUP]Behold then the kindness and severity of God; to those who fell, severity, but to you, God’s kindness, if you continue in His kindness; otherwise you also will be cut off. [SUP]23 [/SUP]And they also, if they do not continue in their unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again. [SUP]24 [/SUP]For if you were cut off from what is by nature a wild olive tree, and were grafted contrary to nature into a cultivated olive tree, how much more will these who are the natural branches be grafted into their own olive tree? [SUP]25 [/SUP]For I do not want you, brethren, to be uninformed of this mystery—so that you will not be wise in your own estimation—that a partial hardening has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in; [SUP]26 [/SUP]and so all Israel will be saved; just as it is written,

“The Deliverer will come from Zion,
He will remove ungodliness from Jacob.”
[SUP]27 [/SUP]“This is [SUP][i][/SUP]My covenant with them,
When I take away their sins.”


[SUP]28 [/SUP][SUP][j][/SUP]From the standpoint of the gospel they are enemies for your sake, but [SUP][k][/SUP]from the standpoint of God’s choice they are beloved for the sake of the fathers; [SUP]29 [/SUP]for the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable.

 

[mark54]

[SUP]18 [/SUP]do not be arrogant toward the branches; but if you are arrogant, remember that it is not you who supports the root, but the root supports you. [SUP]19 [/SUP]You will say then, “Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in.” [SUP]20 [/SUP]Quite right, they were broken off for their unbelief, but you stand by your faith. Do not be conceited, but fear; [SUP]21 [/SUP]for if God did not spare the natural branches, He will not spare you, either. [SUP]22 [/SUP]Behold then the kindness and severity of God; to those who fell, severity, but to you, God’s kindness, if you continue in His kindness; otherwise you also will be cut off. [SUP]23 [/SUP]And they also, if they do not continue in their unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again. [SUP]24 [/SUP]For if you were cut off from what is by nature a wild olive tree, and were grafted contrary to nature into a cultivated olive tree, how much more will these who are the natural branches be grafted into their own olive tree? [SUP]25 [/SUP]For I do not want you, brethren, to be uninformed of this mystery—so that you will not be wise in your own estimation—that a partial hardening has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in; [SUP]26 [/SUP]and so all Israel will be saved; just as it is written,

“The Deliverer will come from Zion,
He will remove ungodliness from Jacob.”
[SUP]27 [/SUP]“This is [SUP][i][/SUP]My covenant with them,
When I take away their sins.”


[SUP]28 [/SUP][SUP][j][/SUP]From the standpoint of the gospel they are enemies for your sake, but [SUP][k][/SUP]from the standpoint of God’s choice they are beloved for the sake of the fathers; [SUP]29 [/SUP]for the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable.

Oh, the depth of the riches of the wisdom and[SUP][i][/SUP] knowledge of God!
How unsearchable his judgments,
and his paths beyond tracing out!
[SUP]34 [/SUP]“Who has known the mind of the Lord?
Or who has been his counselor?”[SUP][j][/SUP]
[SUP]35 [/SUP]“Who has ever given to God,
that God should repay them?”[SUP][k][/SUP]
[SUP]36 [/SUP]For from him and through him and for him are all things.
To him be the glory forever! Amen.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Oh, the depth of the riches of the wisdom and[SUP][i][/SUP] knowledge of God!
How unsearchable his judgments,
and his paths beyond tracing out!
[SUP]34 [/SUP]“Who has known the mind of the Lord?
Or who has been his counselor?”[SUP][j][/SUP]
[SUP]35 [/SUP]“Who has ever given to God,
that God should repay them?”[SUP][k][/SUP]
[SUP]36 [/SUP]For from him and through him and for him are all things.
To him be the glory forever! Amen.

amen, it is always about the glory of God. and not the glory of men..

it does not mean we do as some christians and go out of our way to protect Isreal or make them feel at home. God does not need our help here, and he has to do alot before they will finally see. Plus they need the gospel. not osme praise some want to give them.

it means we should not be arrogant to think God is done with isreal.. his gifts (of which the land was a gift0 are irrevocable)

 

[zone]

Oh, the depth of the riches of the wisdom and[SUP][i][/SUP] knowledge of God!
How unsearchable his judgments,
and his paths beyond tracing out!
[SUP]34 [/SUP]“Who has known the mind of the Lord?
Or who has been his counselor?”[SUP][j][/SUP]
[SUP]35 [/SUP]“Who has ever given to God,
that God should repay them?”[SUP][k][/SUP]
[SUP]36 [/SUP]For from him and through him and for him are all things.
To him be the glory forever! Amen.

Daniel 9
24Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy. 25Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times. 26And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined. 27And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

 

[zone]

 

[cfultz3]

The whole chapter is very good for a reading.

Lev 26:42 Then will I remember my covenant with Jacob, and also my covenant with Isaac, and also my covenant with Abraham will I remember; and I will remember the land.
Lev 26:43 The land also shall be left of them, and shall enjoy her sabbaths, while she lieth desolate without them: and they shall accept of the punishment of their iniquity: because, even because they despised my judgments, and because their soul abhorred my statutes.
Lev 26:44 And yet for all that, when they be in the land of their enemies, I will not cast them away, neither will I abhor them, to destroy them utterly, and to break my covenant with them: for I am the LORD their God.
Lev 26:45 But I will for their sakes remember the covenant of their ancestors, whom I brought forth out of the land of Egypt in the sight of the heathen, that I might be their God: I am the LORD.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Daniel 9
24Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy. 25Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times. 26And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined. 27And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

well we have made it till the destruction of the city and sanctuary.

Can't wait till the rest us fulfilled. Then God will have poured out his wrath on the desolate.. and we will finally have peace on this earth. Although I doubt I will be here when this happens

 

[mark54]

amen, it is always about the glory of God. and not the glory of men..

it does not mean we do as some christians and go out of our way to protect Isreal or make them feel at home. God does not need our help here, and he has to do alot before they will finally see. Plus they need the gospel. not osme praise some want to give them.

it means we should not be arrogant to think God is done with isreal.. his gifts (of which the land was a gift0 are irrevocable)

I believe God brought them back and a time is coming when they will all be saved, for that is what to me scripture plainly states. Can I rationalise it? No! But I don't have to. You can rationalise how they became a country again, you can rationalise they have had help from America to win wars, but I just see it simply, God's plan is to give them back the land and keep them there. Can I rationalise why he has done this before they all turn to him? No! But I do not have to, I just accpet the plain scripture.

.
Some subjects I have delved in to(some I have been forced to study up on lol) this one I simply accept in very simple faith and have an assurity it is true

 

[eternally-gratefull]

The whole chapter is very good for a reading.

Lev 26:42 Then will I remember my covenant with Jacob, and also my covenant with Isaac, and also my covenant with Abraham will I remember; and I will remember the land.
Lev 26:43 The land also shall be left of them, and shall enjoy her sabbaths, while she lieth desolate without them: and they shall accept of the punishment of their iniquity: because, even because they despised my judgments, and because their soul abhorred my statutes.
Lev 26:44 And yet for all that, when they be in the land of their enemies, I will not cast them away, neither will I abhor them, to destroy them utterly, and to break my covenant with them: for I am the LORD their God.
Lev 26:45 But I will for their sakes remember the covenant of their ancestors, whom I brought forth out of the land of Egypt in the sight of the heathen, that I might be their God: I am the LORD.

The very promise Paul spoke of in Daniel 11.. Amen brother!!

 

[zone]

Ezra 2:70
Now the priests, the Levites, some of the people, the singers, the gatekeepers, and the temple servants lived in their towns, and all the rest of Israel in their towns.

Ezra 6:17
They offered at the dedication of this house of God 100 bulls, 200 rams, 400 lambs, and as a sin offering for all Israel 12 male goats, according to the number of the tribes of Israel.

Ezra 8:35
At that time those who had come from captivity, the returned exiles, offered burnt offerings to the God of Israel, twelve bulls for all Israel, ninety-six rams, seventy-seven lambs, and as a sin offering twelve male goats. All this was a burnt offering to the Lord.

Acts 2:36
"Let all the house of Israel therefore know for certain that God has made him both Lord and Christ, this Jesus whom you crucified."


any lost tribes?
were members from all 12 tribes of Israel in the Land in time for Daniel 9 to come to pass?


John 5:39-40
Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.
And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life.


is there eternal life to be found in the scriptures without coming to Jesus Christ the Actual Literal King of Israel; Messiah?
do they testify enough of Christ?

what did He say about it?

 

[zone]

I believe God brought them back and a time is coming when they will all be saved, for that is what to me scripture plainly states. Can I rationalise it? No! But I don't have to. You can rationalise how they became a country again, you can rationalise they have had help from America to win wars, but I just see it simply, God's plan is to give them back the land and keep them there. Can I rationalise why he has done this before they all turn to him? No! But I do not have to, I just accpet the plain scripture.

.
Some subjects I have delved in to(some I have been forced to study up on lol) this one I simply accept in very simple faith and have an assurity it is true

so you do not accept the plain reading of scripture then.