The Role of Women in Ministry & Life

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S

Scribe

Guest
#41
First of all welcome to Christian Chat. I think it is wonderful that you have a passion for God’s word and desire to share it with others. Whether it is Paul’s opinion or mandated by God, I understand why Paul wrote what he did. As a father of a two daughters, one older and one younger than yourself, a husband for 22 years, as well a brother to sisters and raised by my single mother, I can tell you that female thought patterns are not congruent with male thought patterns. It has nothing to do with intelligence. Fundamentally women do not think like men. Women do not teach like men. Women do not react to problems like men. Socially, parentally and occupationally men and women are just different. Take a look at society for a minute. Most stand up comedians, singers and politicians are men. My post would be exceptionally long and boring if I went into how mirror neurons are responsible for this. God made us different. He created women to nurture and men to lead. That doesn’t mean you can’t find empathetic men and authoritative women. However since people need some doctrine to follow to prevent chaos, this one was implemented. There were many priestesses (non-Christian) in the time of Paul. They successfully led...men astray. Men will do stupid things for women. Look at Adam, and Samson, and David and Solomon. Women who know how to manipulate (most of them) could successfully apostasize a church. I’m sure you would be a fantastic youth leader and woman’s Bible study leader. As far as leading men, I think the words are clear.
This kind of rationale is suggesting that the natural ability of men equips them for teaching the bible. That is what is wrong with the pulpit today.
So you think God doesn't want to equip women to preach because they think differently than men? God can't save them as much? Can't fix what you perceive as natural shortcomings? God delights in using those who naturally do not qualify. God does not need the natural strengths of men to get the job done. This kind of rationale you have presented makes it clear that God or Paul never intended that and any suggestion that women cannot preach because they are less capable of receiving or operating in the empowerment of the Holy Spirit is error. Not by might, nor by power, but by my Spirit says the Lord. That was in the context of rebuilding the temple. God would rather use a Holy Spirit empowered woman than a man who thinks his male qualities equip him.
 

Hungry

Senior Member
Nov 26, 2012
2,975
965
113
#42
This kind of rationale is suggesting that the natural ability of men equips them for teaching the bible. That is what is wrong with the pulpit today.
So you think God doesn't want to equip women to preach because they think differently than men? God can't save them as much? Can't fix what you perceive as natural shortcomings? God delights in using those who naturally do not qualify. God does not need the natural strengths of men to get the job done. This kind of rationale you have presented makes it clear that God or Paul never intended that and any suggestion that women cannot preach because they are less capable of receiving or operating in the empowerment of the Holy Spirit is error. Not by might, nor by power, but by my Spirit says the Lord. That was in the context of rebuilding the temple. God would rather use a Holy Spirit empowered woman than a man who thinks his male qualities equip him.
I never once stated all men were equipped to be leaders. Your opinions are far from scripture and even further from logic. How many women did Christ call to be apostles? It’s ok to admit that men and women are different.
 

Relic

Active member
Apr 29, 2020
249
104
28
#43
Children of God
23 Before the coming of this faith,[j] we were held in custody under the law, locked up until the faith that was to come would be revealed. 24 So the law was our guardian until Christ came that we might be justified by faith. 25 Now that this faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian.

26 So in Christ Jesus you are all children of God through faith, 27 for all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. 28 There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 If you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Christ crucified set us free of all the laws. The new testament is not a book of laws. It never was
meant to be and is not meant to be now. Jesus himself as in scripture above set us free. If we
happen to sin, there is a remedy to that in repent and redemption so we can clear ourselves as
sin. Faith is our promise to God and Love is the only commandment of Jesus. The world is full
of women preachers and teachers. Acts has several for example. A woman like a man can
preach and if it makes you feel fulfilled listen to them equally. If not, go somewhere else.
If you are a woman and Christ is in your heart, then go preach to the world. By no means
does it have to be an established church. There are many other ways to teach the love of our
Lord Jesus Christ. If you feel you need inspiration, watch Daystar Tv, it is full of women
that are sharing the love of Christ. Be free please. Jesus set us free on the cross.
 

shittim

Senior Member
Dec 16, 2016
7,097
3,989
113
#44
I have been taught that when the end time harvest comes, and I and many believe it is now or very near, we will need all hands on deck participating, each one we come in contact with each day is another we can affect for the Gospel and the Kingdom.\
blessings all
 

Reformyourself

Well-known member
Apr 29, 2020
777
272
63
#45
If you are a woman and Christ is in your heart, then go preach to the world. By no means
does it have to be an established church. There are many other ways to teach the love of our
Lord Jesus Christ.
totally agree.
Your profile says you are non-Christian. If you do not accept the authority of Scripture than your own human logic is your truth. Why, as a non-Christian man would you even care to discuss whether or not women should pastor or preach in Church? Your opinions are irrelevant. That’s my point exactly. We are not saved by following our logic, which is independant and fallible. We are saved by following our Lord. We are a Body, many members united as One under His authority. The pieces on a chess board don’t contemplate if the Grand Master has made a mistake by sacrificing a rook for a pawn. We can’t see the board. We only accept where He puts us, be it to conquer or die.
He’s searching for answers mr hungry 😁
 

Hungry

Senior Member
Nov 26, 2012
2,975
965
113
#46
totally agree.

He’s searching for answers mr hungry 😁
Yes, hopefully he finds them. It just surprised me when he answered a question regarding Biblical answers to women preaching as a non-Christian. I suppose if I went to a Muslim site for wisdom I wouldn’t be fielding answers about the Quran.
 

Adstar

Senior Member
Jul 24, 2016
6,629
3,023
113
#47
I find this topic interesting :)

In the Scandinavian /Nordic countries, where I am from, we have had several female political ministers and other leaders that I see are performing just as well as men.

So, what is the practical reason (not the historical about Adam not being deceived) from a Christian perspective, why women can't lead men?
It's not about ability or the lack there of... It is about the will of God for men and woman to fulfill different roles.. In a way it is symbolic of the relationship between Jesus and the church.. where the church is symbolically represented as a bride..
 

Unitas

Junior Member
Apr 6, 2015
124
23
18
#48
It's not about ability or the lack there of... It is about the will of God for men and woman to fulfill different roles.. In a way it is symbolic of the relationship between Jesus and the church.. where the church is symbolically represented as a bride..
Thank you for your reply to my question :)

The user Scribe has given an explanation about how the idea of women not teaching men is a misinterpretation of the scripture. That explanation makes sense for me.

I appreciate that you tried to explain your view for me, though.

Based on previous experiences in here, that has made me feel uncomfortable, I will most likely not contribute further to this discussion.
 

Adstar

Senior Member
Jul 24, 2016
6,629
3,023
113
#49
Thank you for your reply to my question :)

The user Scribe has given an explanation about how the idea of women not teaching men is a misinterpretation of the scripture. That explanation makes sense for me.

I appreciate that you tried to explain your view for me, though.

Based on previous experiences in here, that has made me feel uncomfortable, I will most likely not contribute further to this discussion.
Well i disagree with Scribe.. He is preaching what some woman brought up in the modern western culture WANT to hear.. Scribe is responsible for what he has given and will be judged by God for it on the day of judgement..

You have decided to go with Scribes message.. So be it.. people will be judged for what they affirmed as the truth and what they declared false .. Woe to anyone who declares the Word of God false and then declares what is not the Word of God to be the Word of God... Falsely representing another human being is a terrible thing to do.. Much much more is it a terrible thing to do to misrepresent the Will of God..
 

Relic

Active member
Apr 29, 2020
249
104
28
#50
totally agree.

He’s searching for answers mr hungry 😁
Hungry you are out to lunch. By no means are we under the authority under
anything except our Lord Jesus Christ. Christ crucified gave us our freedom
from laws. At best scriptures can be our guide but by no means authority.
 

p_rehbein

Senior Member
Sep 4, 2013
27,881
5,108
113
#51
Before I start, PLEASE PLEASE... this is a touchy subject but I am not here to start arguments or fights. People may have different opinions and interpretations and that is okay. I just want feedback on the topic at hand!
IMO, that is an unrealistic expectation given the thousands of Threads/Comments that have been posted here on CC concerning this subject..........

I am also wondering what Translation of the Bible you use, it isn't the KJV for sure
 

shittim

Senior Member
Dec 16, 2016
7,097
3,989
113
#52
You're OK maryjo, many of us have the expectation we can discuss without losing the Love, joy, peace, etc. that we are required to walk in.
Blessings
 

Unitas

Junior Member
Apr 6, 2015
124
23
18
#53
IMO, that is an unrealistic expectation given the thousands of Threads/Comments that have been posted here on CC concerning this subject..........

I am also wondering what Translation of the Bible you use, it isn't the KJV for sure
Hi :)

I would like to understand you correct. Do you mean, it's unrealistic to have a discussion here without arguing or fighting?

My native language isn't English. Maybe I misunderstand you because of this.
 

Lanolin

Well-known member
Dec 15, 2018
12,237
4,400
113
#54
Hello, brothers and sisters. I wanted to get some opinion's on a topic that can be very controversial amongst believers: the role of a woman in evangelism, ministry, preaching, parenting, work, life, etc.

Before I start, PLEASE PLEASE... this is a touchy subject but I am not here to start arguments or fights. People may have different opinions and interpretations and that is okay. I just want feedback on the topic at hand!

I am a 21 year old woman who just recently graduated from college; I used to write for an online magazine called Whole Magazine for women and would write weekly devotionals - I have led Bible studies as well. I have been saved now for about 5 years now and have always had a passion to study and share God's Word in some way shape or form. I admire and look up to people such as Kari Jobe, Sadie Robertson, and other young women who are known to speak in church and "preach" if you want to call it.

I recently stumbled upon a few Scriptures that certainly got my attention. I will list them out and then continue:

1 Timothy 2:11-15 ~ "Let a woman learn quietly with all submissiveness. I do not permit a woman to teach or to exercise authority over a man; rather, she is to remain quiet. For Adam was formed first, then Eve; and Adam was not deceived, but the woman was deceived and became a transgressor. Yet she will be saved through childbearing—if they continue in faith and love and holiness, with self-control."

Titus 2:4-5 ~ And so train the young women to love their husbands and children, to be self-controlled, pure, working at home, kind, and submissive to their own husbands, that the word of God may not be reviled.

1 Corinthians 14:34-35 ~ "As in all the churches of the saints, the women should keep silent in the churches. For they are not permitted to speak, but should be in submission, as the Law also says. If there is anything they desire to learn, let them ask their husbands at home. For it is shameful for a woman to speak in church."

Ephesians 5:22-23 ~ "Wives, submit yourselves to your own husbands as you do to the Lord. For the husband is the head of the wife as Christ is the head of the church, his body, of which he is the Savior."

Now, I can't emphasize how important Scripture is to me. I don't want to "cherry pick" and deny a passage even though it sits strangely with me. I accept this for what it is. And I have been praying deeply to the Lord about this subject. I have seen and witnessed so many women be complete warriors for God and they do it beautifully. I know there is a difference between pastoring a church and evangelizing. Proverbs 31 is one of my favorite parts of the Word and I think it tells elegantly of just how important a woman's role is in the eyes of God, but why these verses? I haven't researched the historical context of these at all.

I guess I am here to ask: what is your interpretation of these? Do they truly mean what they say? Does this mean it is wrong for me to lead Bible study, enter into the workforce, speak in a church, etc.? I am just REALLY interested in knowing what it is that people have to say about these Scriptures, how they think they relate to the role women play in ministry and life [in general]. What is a woman's purpose to you?

God bless, everyone! Feel free to leave a brief comment, long comment, or anything that pertains to this issue - you don't need to answer everything, you can just answer certain parts; its up to you!! Sorry for the book of an intro!!
it just means men cant be told what to do...you can teach boys but when they grow up to be men they just aint gonna listen to you. This is where Jesus comes in God knew it would take a man to reach a man so He send his only son He didnt send a daughter.

another part of this context Paul was writing about was unbelieving women and wives. How can they even say anything about God, they cannot.
 

Lanolin

Well-known member
Dec 15, 2018
12,237
4,400
113
#55
back them in those times many women were barred from education or even learning how to read.
It was thought all they were good for was bearing children and being a servant to their husbands. So any woman who spoke up wasnt likely to be educated in scripture or anything. If she had a testimony or a witness it wasnt even believed...this still happens today.
 

Lanolin

Well-known member
Dec 15, 2018
12,237
4,400
113
#56
Read the book of Esther for one woman who spoke up...for such a time as this.
she could have been killed for speaking but she risked her life for her nation. But she had faith you see thats the difference.
 

Dude653

Senior Member
Mar 19, 2011
9,378
538
113
#57
Last time I checked, Paul isn't God
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
18,561
10,309
113
#58
Hello, brothers and sisters. I wanted to get some opinion's on a topic that can be very controversial amongst believers: the role of a woman in evangelism, ministry, preaching, parenting, work, life, etc.

Before I start, PLEASE PLEASE... this is a touchy subject but I am not here to start arguments or fights. People may have different opinions and interpretations and that is okay. I just want feedback on the topic at hand!

I am a 21 year old woman who just recently graduated from college; I used to write for an online magazine called Whole Magazine for women and would write weekly devotionals - I have led Bible studies as well. I have been saved now for about 5 years now and have always had a passion to study and share God's Word in some way shape or form. I admire and look up to people such as Kari Jobe, Sadie Robertson, and other young women who are known to speak in church and "preach" if you want to call it.

I recently stumbled upon a few Scriptures that certainly got my attention. I will list them out and then continue:

1 Timothy 2:11-15 ~ "Let a woman learn quietly with all submissiveness. I do not permit a woman to teach or to exercise authority over a man; rather, she is to remain quiet. For Adam was formed first, then Eve; and Adam was not deceived, but the woman was deceived and became a transgressor. Yet she will be saved through childbearing—if they continue in faith and love and holiness, with self-control."

Titus 2:4-5 ~ And so train the young women to love their husbands and children, to be self-controlled, pure, working at home, kind, and submissive to their own husbands, that the word of God may not be reviled.

1 Corinthians 14:34-35 ~ "As in all the churches of the saints, the women should keep silent in the churches. For they are not permitted to speak, but should be in submission, as the Law also says. If there is anything they desire to learn, let them ask their husbands at home. For it is shameful for a woman to speak in church."

Ephesians 5:22-23 ~ "Wives, submit yourselves to your own husbands as you do to the Lord. For the husband is the head of the wife as Christ is the head of the church, his body, of which he is the Savior."

Now, I can't emphasize how important Scripture is to me. I don't want to "cherry pick" and deny a passage even though it sits strangely with me. I accept this for what it is. And I have been praying deeply to the Lord about this subject. I have seen and witnessed so many women be complete warriors for God and they do it beautifully. I know there is a difference between pastoring a church and evangelizing. Proverbs 31 is one of my favorite parts of the Word and I think it tells elegantly of just how important a woman's role is in the eyes of God, but why these verses? I haven't researched the historical context of these at all.

I guess I am here to ask: what is your interpretation of these? Do they truly mean what they say? Does this mean it is wrong for me to lead Bible study, enter into the workforce, speak in a church, etc.? I am just REALLY interested in knowing what it is that people have to say about these Scriptures, how they think they relate to the role women play in ministry and life [in general]. What is a woman's purpose to you?

God bless, everyone! Feel free to leave a brief comment, long comment, or anything that pertains to this issue - you don't need to answer everything, you can just answer certain parts; its up to you!! Sorry for the book of an intro!!
Hi Maryjohanna,
As you can see from the responses so far, this is a very contentious topic. It's unfortunate that people jump so quickly to decrying each other over it. I commend you for asking the questions, knowing it might cause trouble.

I would encourage you to do three things: suspend your conclusions for now, do your homework, and ask God for understanding.

There is a wealth of material on the subject, on both sides. Some of it is reasonable, balanced, and scholarly; much is not. There are strong views that are held in clear conscience on both sides. It is not a salvation issue, despite what some might say.

Don't be easily swayed either way. As a woman, you are going to face this issue repeatedly, so it's good to sort it out firmly in your own mind and heart. Once that is done, you will be able to face the different opinions with strength and grace, regardless which way you conclude is right for you. May God give you clarity. :)
 

Hungry

Senior Member
Nov 26, 2012
2,975
965
113
#59
Read the book of Esther for one woman who spoke up...for such a time as this.
she could have been killed for speaking but she risked her life for her nation. But she had faith you see thats the difference.
If I remember the story correctly she would have been killed if she didn’t speak up.
 

shittim

Senior Member
Dec 16, 2016
7,097
3,989
113
#60
Maryjo- Your search for His understanding shouldn't be contentious, as always as you see His truth and understanding take it to the Lord for His impartation of truth and understanding, does what you read and hear resonate in your spirit? That is one of the ways He has confirmed His truth to me. Bless you in Jesus name