A place for rapture questions

I would offer the first resurrection is in respect to; "I will open the graves"(Ezekiel 37:12) which was fulfilled in
And the graves were opened Matthew 27:52 which will continue, seeing to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord. Until ….."Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice" ( the last day.) the 2nd and final resurrection.

The metaphor in Revelation 20 "thousand years" represents the whole new testament era ending with the execution of judgment .The believers receive their new incorruptible bodies and those who know not Christ will be cast in the lake of fire the second death

John 5 speaks of the final judgment for the believer as well as those who have no faith. Both simultaneously executed in the twinkling of the eye .

John 5:27-29 King James Version (KJV)And hath given him authority to execute judgment also, because he is the Son of man. Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

Ahwatukee do you mind another question:

Matthew 25:31-46 the sheep and goats thing. Rapture happens, and Jesus returns, this is when that happens right? OK.

Look at the last verse it says the wicked go to hell and the sheep get 'eternal life'. How does that work when in the millenium people are supposed to get only temporal life, since they missed the rapture already? Why does it say 'eternal life'? does it only mean that they were saved? like the bible says if you believe in Jesus you have(present tense) eternal life, is thats what its talking about? Or what?

Look at the last verse it says the wicked go to hell and the sheep get 'eternal life'. How does that work when in the millenium people are supposed to get only temporal life, since they missed the rapture already?

garee, couldn't these who came out of the graves have been like Lazarus? IOW, they rose from the dead, lived out the rest of their lives and then died like everybody does?

Good day Hevosmies,

First of all, regarding the judgment of the sheep and goats, we must establish the time period of when this takes place, which can be garnered from the context:

"When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the angels with Him, He will sit on His glorious throne." - Matt.25:31

Remember, the question the disciples asked was "what will be the sign of your coming and the end of the age." Therefore, all of the signs given in Matt.24 will take place leading up to the Lord's return to end the age and to establish His millennial kingdom. Matt.25:31 is referring back to Matt.24:31. Let's compare the two scriptures:

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

At that time the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven and all the tribes of the earth will mourn. They will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven, with power and great glory. And He will send out His angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather His elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other. " - Matt.24:30-31

"When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the angels with Him, He will sit on His glorious throne. All the nations will be gathered before Him, and He will separate the people one from another, as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats" - Matt.25:31

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

As you can see from both Matt.24:30-31 and Matt.25:31, they both refer to 1). the Lord's coming and 2). His angels arriving with Him, which would establish when the separation of the sheep and the goats takes place. If Matt.25:31 was speaking of the great white throne judgment, the Lord would not be coming into His glory, nor would the angels be coming with Him and that because they would already be in heaven. However, both scriptures demonstrate that both the Lord and His angels are coming from heaven to the earth.



The following verse is the results of the sheep and goat separation:

"And they will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life." - Matt.25:31

Now, I am not sure of what you are speaking about regarding "temporal life," as I have never heard of this. What I do know is that, the sheep will be the great tribulation saints who will have made it through the entire seven years of God's wrath and the beasts reign and survived. These are those who, along with the remnant of the woman/Israel, will repopulate the earth during the millennial kingdom. The goats on the other hand, will be those who rejected Christ and worshiped the beast, his image and received his mark and will have also made it through the entire seven years and survived and which is why they will have failed regarding the works that Christ said they will have neglected.

Regarding the results for both, we know that the sheep will eventually receive their immortal and glorified bodies and inherit eternal life. In opposition, the destination of the goats will be eternal punishment in the lake of fire. Whether or not the goats are immediately sent to the lake of fire or are sent to Hades until the final judgment at the great white throne, I am not sure. What I do know is that, what is stated for both will be their end result.

Now by these questions, you bring up a concern of mine and I believe that it just has to do with us not having all the information. What I mean is that, in speaking of the new Jerusalem in the eternal state in Rev.22:5, we read the following scripture:

"There will be no more night in the city, and they will have no need for the light of a lamp or of the sun. For the Lord God will shine on them, and they will reign forever and ever."

My concern is that prior to the time of the great white throne judgment, those worthy of the first resurrection will have already received their immortal and glorified bodies. Then at the great white throne judgment when Hades is resurrected, anyone whose name is not found written in the book of life will be thrown into the lake of fire. Therefore you have the results of the saved and the condemned. That being the case, who will the saved be reigning over in eternity? My point is that, in order to reign there must others in a lower position under the saved in order to rule over. Otherwise, if all of the saved are on the same level and ruling with Christ and the unsaved are all in the lake of fire, then there would be no one to rule over. To make my point clearer, if God neither had angels, nor mankind, nor any other created life, then though He is God, He would have no one to rule over, because there would be no created or lessor life below him to rule over.

I'm sure that He will reveal these things and more when we get there.

There will most definitely be a resurrection of the great tribulation saints when the Lord returns to the earth to end the age.



First of all, your attitude in referring to God's precious possession out of all the peoples of the earth as being "rebellious Jews" is not one of the Spirit. God cares for the Woman/Israel during the last 3 1/2 years. Israel along with the surviving great tribulation saints, will those who will enter into the millennial period and repopulate the earth. The resurrected saints are not apart of that population, but will be in their immortal and glorified bodies and will be ruling over the nations with Christ.

Therefore, the population of the earth will consist of both Israel and Gentiles

Thanks for the good reply AGAIN. I have also wondered about Rev 22:5 ! I just dont see why the need to reign over anyone when there is no more sin. I gotta check what the word reign means there. Maybe martyrs are "higher class" saints? who knows.

Nonetheless: you said the sheep will eventually receive their immortal bodies, so when it says they have eternal life, yet they will reproduce in the millenium, Does that mean that they (the sheep in matt25) will DIE during the millennium? and only then be given the immortal bodies?

Ahwatukee do you mind another question:

Matthew 25:31-46 the sheep and goats thing. Rapture happens, and Jesus returns, this is when that happens right? OK.

Look at the last verse it says the wicked go to hell and the sheep get 'eternal life'. How does that work when in the millenium people are supposed to get only temporal life, since they missed the rapture already? Why does it say 'eternal life'? does it only mean that they were saved? like the bible says if you believe in Jesus you have(present tense) eternal life, is thats what its talking about? Or what?

That is exactly what we saw in Jesus ministry and in this day...rebellios Jews.
In fact, Jesus calls them a harlot.
Still God's people, but rebellious.

But it is conjecture to say the ac does not kill everyone refusing the mark.
The word of God says he does kill them.[/lquote]

It cannot be conjecture if we have other scriptures showing that there are survivors of the great tribulation saints, such as the following:

He will judge between the nations and will settle disputes for many peoples.

They will beat their swords into plowshares

and their spears into pruning hooks.

Nation will not take up sword against nation,

nor will they train for war anymore.

If all of the great tribulation saints are killed, then who are the nations mentioned above?

Further, if these saints are there during the GT, they are stung by the flying scorpions because ONLY JEWS are protected.
So,apparently, there are no saints on the planet during the GT.

Why would demonic locusts stinging the inhabitants of the earth infer that there will be no great tribulation saints. Remember, these demon locusts who come out of the Abyss are commanded not to kill them, but only to torture the inhabitants for five months.

"They were told not to harm the grass of the earth or any plant or tree, but only those people who did not have the seal of God on their foreheads. They were not allowed to kill them but only to torture them for five months."

The only people who will have the seal of God on their foreheads will be the 144,000 who are sealed in Rev.7:1-8

And we know from scripture that the GTS will be exposed to God's wrath, simply because they will be on the earth:

"Never again will they hunger;

never again will they thirst.

The sun will not beat down on them,’

nor any scorching heat.

The above are all the results of the seals, trumpets and bowl judgments that the GTS will be exposed to. Regarding the "sun not beating down on them, nor any scorching heat, " compare this with the 4th bowl judgment:

"The fourth angel poured out his bowl on the sun, and the sun was allowed to scorch people with fire. They were seared by the intense heat and they cursed the name of God, who had control over these plagues, but they refused to repent and glorify him."

Scripture would disagree with you, as there is most certainly a resurrection of the great tribulation saints who will have died during the tribulation, as can be seen below:

"And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their testimony of Jesus and for the word of God, and those who had not worshiped the beast or its image, and had not received its mark on their foreheads or hands. And they came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years. " - Rev.20:4-6

The resurrection of the GTS above takes place after Jesus returns to the earth in Rev.19:11-21. John first sees them as those who were beheaded, then he sees them come to life (resurrected). So I don't know why you would claim that there is no resurrection of the GTS?

It is akin to the parable of the fig tree.
If you look at mat 25 there are 3 stories. Virgins,talents,sheep/goats.
The message is to be aligned with heaven,be ready and full of oil,and be fruitful.
Too much emphasis on the negative,destroys the message.

Hello Karraster,

What you stated above regarding those resurrecting like Lazarus, is exactly my understanding, i.e. those who came out of their graves did so only to die again and will be resurrected with Israel, where at that time they will receive their immortal and glorified bodies. To date, I believe that Jesus is the only one who has resurrected with an immortal and glorified body and the church is next.

There are two messages there, those who are ready and those who are not with the rewards and consequences for both. The only negative, will be for those who end up being on the earth during the time of God's wrath.

Does NOT say " they came to life"
What bible says that?
Extremely poor translation.
That is why we need precision,not a paraphrase.

I just noticed that the sheep and goats judgment in matthew 25 has THREE groups.

1. Sheep
2. Goats
3. BRETHREN. Those whom the sheep treated well, and goats poorly

Jesus and the patriarchs resurrected 2k yrs ago. It even says some were recognised walking the streets. They are called firstfruits which envokes the other 3 parts of harvest.
We have the remaining main harvest which is the rapture,with the other sections harvested during the GT.
All completed,and all invited at the marriage supper.
(See the parable of the wedding supper)
That is why the marriage supper is at the end of the GT,so all invited will be seated

Does NOT say " they came to life"
What bible says that?
Extremely poor translation.
That is why we need precision,not a paraphrase.

There is no resurrection immediately after the GT.
None