Jesus and the Covenants

You are huh?

You know, I carried a King James Bible around when I was a Mormon . . . still do, in fact . . . but carrying the right Bible in no ways guarantees the holder is grounded.

2 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you.
I go to prepare a place for you. 3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again,
and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.

Christ said he is comming Back , bringing our rewards with him,
it does not say he returns to heaven at that time with us.

Isaiah 40:10 (KJV)
Behold, the Lord God will come with strong hand, and his arm shall rule for him:
behold, his reward is with him, and his work before him.

Isaiah 62:11 (KJV)
Behold, the Lord hath proclaimed unto the end of the world, Say ye to the daughter of Zion,
Behold, thy salvation cometh; behold, his reward is with him, and his work before him.

14For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus
will God bring with him. 15For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which
are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

16For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel,
and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
17Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds,
to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.


We that sleep are raised, and will meet Christ in the first heaven, not third heaven,
then Christ and us will come back down, and Christ and us will be on this earth.

Zechariah 14:4 (KJV)
And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem
on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and
toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall
remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.

Not sure what that has to do with the discussion.

"all they could see was two mountain peaks" - and the valley where dispensationalists hang out .

Nothing but pure inventionalism "immortalized" by Clarence Larkin about.



Yer'd be better off watching Twin Peaks.

. . . and don't forget Harry A. Ironsides.

Great men of God! I have some of his books posted on my website.

Oh wait, you don't like these guys. No matter . . . read them anyway - you might get saved.

The Sabbath was made for man,
Christ is the Lord of the Sabbath,
not Christ is our Sabbath.

A memorial of creation.

Desperation setting in

So according to dispensationalism the prophets never foresaw the church, yet Peter claims:

Acts 3:24 And likewise, all the prophets who have spoken, from Samuel and his successors onward, also announced these days.

"these days" in which the church was founded !!

I'll sit by the fireside with Peter rather than the Ironside

God is eternal, God does not go back on His promises, God does not change. God is faithful to the Hebrews as Paul says in the book of Romans, even if everyone else is a liar. If the Hebrews are unfaithful, just as we are sometimes unfaithful, still we can rely on God.

We are given a new covenant, an addition. God does not take back His ways because God gives an addition.

Now, the law we are given is not only the law as Moses states it, but it is the law of the spirit. In Matthew 5 on the Sermon of the Mt. we are told how this works. We are to die with Christ to sin, to come out forgiven and clean, and to live through Christ. That is in live in love. We are not mean to the people around us that God created, nor are to be their judge for judging is God's place only.

I forgot about this one. The flesh children of Israel couldn’t enter into his rest because they rejected THE GOSPEL which was preached to them.

Heb 3:19(KJV) So we see that they could not enter in because of unbelief.

Heb 4:2(KJV) For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.

Coupla things jump out around the context here 16:

Heb 3:17 And with whom was He angry for forty years? Was it not with those who sinned, whose bodies fell in the wilderness?

Heb 4:7 He again fixes a certain day, “Today,” saying through David after so long a time just as has been said before, “TODAY IF YOU HEAR HIS VOICE, DO NOT HARDEN YOUR HEARTS.”

First off he is writing to the Hebrews not Gentiles - secondly he "fixes a certain day", when coupled with the forty years of Heb 3:17 there is a definite relationship between the death of Christ to the destruction of the apostate Jews in the war of 70 AD:

Isa 65:9 “I will bring forth offspring from Jacob, And an heir of My mountains from Judah; Even My chosen ones shall inherit it, And My servants will dwell there.

Isa 65:12 will destine you for the sword, And all of you will bow down to the slaughter. Because I called, but you did not answer; I spoke, but you did not hear. And you did evil in My sight And chose that in which I did not delight.”

Isa 65:15 Therefore, thus says the Lord GOD, “Behold, My servants will eat, but you will be hungry. Behold, My servants will drink, but you will be thirsty. Behold, My servants will rejoice, but you will be put to shame.

Matt 24:22 “Unless those days had been cut short, no life would have been saved; but for the sake of the [fn]elect those days will be cut short.

Or, chosen ones.

Paul tells his readers the time is short and a short work will the Lord make:

(Rom 9:28 KJV) For he will finish the work, and cut it short in righteousness: because a short work will the Lord make upon the earth.

The letter to the Hebrews is saying to them "do not harden your hearts" because He has "fixed a certain day" for the nation before the time is up - "finish the work".

Forty years after Christ's death calamity fell on the nation and Jerusalem.

My dispensational friends can you see that there are two distinct and polar opposite Israels being talked about below?

One is flesh descendants - the enemies of the gospel.

The other is spiritual descendants - beloved and elect of the Father.

Rom 11:28(KJV) As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes.

Wrong reference for Isa 65:15 in the above post:

“You will leave your name for a curse to My chosen ones, And the Lord GOD will slay you. But My servants will be called by another name.

That's pretty good, it does seem like the writer of Hebrews is trying to imply they've got 40 years to get right with God.

Another thing in opposition to dispensationalism:

Acts 3:22 “Moses said, ‘THE LORD GOD WILL RAISE UP FOR YOU A PROPHET LIKE ME FROM YOUR BRETHREN; TO HIM YOU SHALL GIVE HEED to everything He says to you.

Acts 3:23 ‘And it will be that every soul that does not heed that prophet shall be utterly destroyed from among the people.’

Acts 3:24 “And likewise, all the prophets who have spoken, from Samuel and his successors onward, also announced these days. .

Peter is saying in 3:23 that the unbelieving of Israel will be utterly destroyed from the people, wherein he is impying that the church at Pentecost are the people/nation

A warning-about entering into His rest.

Heb 4:1 Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering
into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it.

-how did they came short?

Heb 4:2 For indeed we have had good tidings preached unto us,
even as also they: but the word of hearing did not profit them,
because it was not united by (faith) with them that heard.

-they did not have faith.

Heb 4:3 For we who have believed do enter into that rest;even as
he hath said, As I sware in my wrath, They shall not enter into my rest:
although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.

Heb 4:4 For he hath said somewhere of the seventh day on this wise,
And God rested on the seventh day from all his works;

-notice entering into that rest is connected with the seventh day.

Heb 4:5 and in this place again, They shall not enter into my rest.
Heb 4:6 Seeing therefore it remaineth that some should enter thereinto,
and they to whom the good tidings were before preached

Heb 4:7 he again defineth a certain day, To-day, saying in David
so long a time afterward (even as hath been said before),
To-day if ye shall hear his voice, Harden not your hearts.

Heb 4:8 For if Joshua had given them rest, he would not have spoken
afterward of another day.

-David said "today" long after Joshua took them into the promised land
so thus proving that there is a rest still to be entered.

Heb 4:9 There remaineth therefore a sabbath rest for the people of God.
Heb 4:10 For he that is entered into his rest hath himself also rested from his works,
as God did from his. Let us therefore give diligence to enter into that rest,
lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.

-A rest remains, but notice the issue is do not disobey.

Heb 9:3 And after the second veil, the tabernacle which is called the Holy of holies;
Heb 9:4 having a golden altar of incense, and the ark of the covenant overlaid
round about with gold, wherein was a golden pot holding the manna,
and Aaron's rod that budded, and the tables of the covenant;

-the pot of manna was put in the most Holy

Deu 8:2 And thou shalt remember all the way which Jehovah thy God hath led thee
these forty years in the wilderness, that he might humble thee, to prove thee, to know
what was in thy heart, whether thou wouldest keep his commandments, or not.
Deu 8:3 And he humbled thee, and suffered thee to hunger, and fed thee with manna,
which thou knewest not, neither did thy fathers know; that he might make thee know


that man doth not live by bread only, but by everything that proceedeth
out of the mouth of Jehovah doth man live.


And thou shalt remember all the way which the Lord thy God led thee these forty years
in the wilderness, to humble thee, and to prove thee, to know what was in thine heart,
whether thou wouldest keep his commandments, or no. Deuteronomy 8:2

-God tested them for 40 years to humble them to see what was in their hearts.
that they should live by every word (10 commandments spoken by Gods own mouth)
not by bread alone.

-what did the bread teach?

Exo 16:4 Then said Jehovah unto Moses, Behold, I will rain bread from heaven for you;
and the people shall go out and gather a day's portion every day, that I may prove them,
whether they will walk in my law, or not.

Exo 16:5 And it shall come to pass on the sixth day, that they shall prepare that which
they bring in, and it shall be twice as much as they gather daily.

-and how long did God prove them with the manna?

Exo 16:32 And Moses said, This is the thing which Jehovah hath commanded, Let
an omerful of it be kept throughout your generations, that they may see the bread
wherewith I fed you in the wilderness, when I brought you forth from the land of Egypt.

Exo 16:33 And Moses said unto Aaron, Take a pot, and put an omerful of manna therein,
and lay it up before Jehovah, to be kept throughout your generations.

As Jehovah commanded Moses, so Aaron laid it up before the Testimony, to be kept.
And the children of Israel did eat the manna forty years, until they came to a land inhabited;
they did eat the manna, until they came unto the borders of the land of Canaan.

-40 years. this is the issue being spoken of in Hebrews:

Heb 3:16 For who, when they heard, did provoke? nay, did not all they
that came out of Egypt by Moses?

Heb 3:17 And with whom was he displeased forty years?
was it not with them that sinned, whose bodies fell in the wilderness?
Heb 3:18 And to whom sware he that they should not enter into his rest,
but to them that were disobedient?
Heb 3:19 And we see that they were not able to enter in because of unbelief.


Hebrews 4:4-10 "For he spake in a certain place of the seventh day on this wise,
And God did rest the seventh day from all his works [Gen. 2:2-3].

And in this [place again],

If they shall enter into my rest. Seeing therefore it remaineth
that some must enter therein, and they to whom it was first preached entered not in
because of unbelief [sound familiar?]: Again, he limiteth a certain day, saying in David,
To day, after so long a time; as it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts.

For if Jesus had given them rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day.
There remaineth therefore a rest [see below] to the people of God. For he that is entered
into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his."

rest (G4520) sabbatismos
1. a keeping sabbath
2. the blessed rest from toils and troubles looked for in the age to come by
the true worshippers of God and true Christians
from a derivative of G4521

(G4521) sabbaton
1. the seventh day of each week which was a sacred festival on which the Israelites
were required to abstain from all work
1a. the institution of the sabbath, the law for keeping holy every seventh day of the week
1b. a single sabbath, sabbath day
2. seven days, a week
of Hebrew origin H7676

(H7676) shabba^th
1. Sabbath
1a. sabbath
1b. day of atonement
1c. sabbath year
1d. week
1e. produce (in sabbath year)
intensive from H7673

(7673) sha^bath
1. to cease, desist, rest
1a. (Qal)
1a-1. to cease
1a-2. to rest, desist (from labour)
1b. (Niphal) to cease
1c. (Hiphil)
1c-1. to cause to cease, put an end to
1c-2. to exterminate, destroy
1c-3. to cause to desist from
1c-4. to remove
1c-5. to cause to fail
2. (Qal) to keep or observe the sabbath
a primitive root

Genesis 2:2-3 "And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made;
and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made. And God
blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from
all his work which God created and made."

The LORD created the seventh day (Sabbath), blessed and sanctified it
"because that in it he had rested from all his work".

-once God has blessed something, can it be undone?

Numbers 23:19-20 "God is not a man, that he should lie; neither the son of man,
that he should repent: hath he said, and shall he not do it? or hath he spoken, and shall
he not make it good? Behold, I have received commandment to bless:
and he hath blessed; and [I cannot reverse it]."

-Here Balaam tells Balak that the LORD gave him a commandment to bless Israel.
He told Balak that what the LORD has blessed, he cannot reverse it.
Do we think we can reverse the blessing the LORD has placed on something?

1 Chronicles 17:26-27 "And now, LORD, thou art God, and hast promised this goodness
unto thy servant: Now therefore let it please thee to bless the house of thy servant, that it may
be before thee for ever: for thou blessest, O LORD, and it shall be blessed for ever."

The Voice

GENESIS 26
[3]Sojourn in this land, and I will be with thee, and will bless thee; for unto thee,
and unto thy seed, I will give all these countries, and I WILL PERFORM THE OATH
WHICH I SWARE UNTO ABRAHAM thy father;

[4] And I will make thy seed to multiply as the stars of heaven, and will give unto thy seed
all these countries; and in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed;

[5] BECAUSE THAT ABRAHAM OBEYED MY VOICE, and kept my charge,
MY COMMANDMENTS, my statutes, and MY LAWS.

And in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed;
because thou hast obeyed my voice.

Abraham was observing to keep Gods 10 commandments
He heard and obeyed Gods "voice".


DEUT. 27
[8] And thou shalt write upon the stones all the words of this law very plainly.
[9] And Moses and the priests the Levites spake unto all Israel, saying, Take heed,
and hearken, O Israel; this day thou art become the people of the Lord thy God .

[10] Thou shalt therefore OBEY THE VOICE of the Lord thy God, and
DO HIS COMMANDMENTS and his statutes, which I command thee this day.

The voice

DEUT. 4 [12] And the Lord spake unto you out of the midst of the fire:
ye heard THE VOICE of the words, but saw no similitude; only ye heard a voice.

[13] And he declared unto you his covenant, which HE COMMANDED
YOU TO PERFORM, EVEN TEN COMMANDMENTS; and he wrote
them upon two tables of stone.

ZEPHANIAH 3
[1] Woe to her that is filthy and polluted, to the oppressing city!
[2] SHE OBEYED NOT THE VOICE; she received not correction; she trusted not in the
LORD; she drew not near to her God. [3] Her princes within her are ROARING LIONS;
her judges are evening WOLVES; they gnaw not the bones till the morrow.

[4] Her prophets are light and treacherous persons: her priests have polluted
the sanctuary, THEY HAVE DONE VIOLENCE TO THE LAW.


JOHN 10
[27] MY SHEEP HEAR MY VOICE, and I know them, and they follow me:

[28] And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish,
neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.

Also Gods sheep shall also hear His “voice”.


HEBREWS 4 [6] Seeing therefore it remaineth that some must enter therein, and they
to whom it was first preached entered not in because of unbelief:

[7] Again, he limiteth a certain day, saying in David, To day, after so long a time;
as it is said, TO DAY IF YE WILL HEAR HIS VOICE, harden not your hearts.

This was prophecied to happen.

DEUTERONOMY 4
[26] I call heaven and earth to witness against you this day, that ye shall soon utterly perish
from off the land whereunto ye go over Jordan to possess it; ye shall not prolong your days
upon it, but shall utterly be destroyed.

[27] And THE LORD SHALL SCATTER YOU AMONG THE NATIONS, and ye shall
be left few in number among the heathen, whither the LORD shall lead you.

[28] And there ye shall serve gods, the work of men's hands, wood and stone,
which neither see, nor hear, nor eat, nor smell.

[29] But if from thence thou shalt seek the LORD thy God, thou shalt find him,
if thou seek him with all thy heart and with all thy soul.

[30] When thou art in TRIBULATION, and all these things are come upon thee,
even in THE LATTER DAYS, if thou turn to the LORD thy God,
and shalt be OBEDIENT UNTO HIS VOICE;



[31] For the LORD thy God is a merciful God he will not forsake thee, neither
destroy thee, nor forget the covenant of thy fathers which he sware unto them.

yes I can try to explain

the seed of Abraham [ the birthright] In Isaac shall thy seed be called.

For this is the word of promise, At this time will I come,
and Sara shall have a son.

The seed [physical son]came from Sara, the handmadens child, Abrams
first child was rejected, "They which are the children of the flesh"

that Isaac was born by promise, and by a miracle from God, “And God said,
Sarah thy wife shall bear thee a son indeed; and thou shalt call his name Isaac:

and I will establish my covenant with him for an everlasting covenant,
and with his seed after him.

But my covenant will I establish with Isaac …” (verses 19-21).
Abraham wanted ishmael, Genesis 17:18, but God chose Isaac,first lawful son
Abraham gave all that he had unto Isaac [birthright passed down] (Genesis 25:5)

The promise, as confirmed to Isaac, Genesis 26:3-5 all these countries...
Ishmael and Abraham’s other sons were rejected from this birthright.

a future nation to spring from Ishmael,from Sarah’s Egyptian handmaid
the angel of the Eternal had said to Hagar: “[H]e will be a wild man;
his hand will be against every man, and every man’s hand against
him; and he shall dwell to the east of all his brethren” (Genesis 16:12).

Ishmael’s descendants were to become a great nation,the birthright nations
were to be greater, they were to dwell to the east of their brethren(Isaac)

The children of Ishmael have become the Arabs of today.
-

God appeared to Jacob, name was changed to Israel (Genesis 35:11).

Israel—which means “prevailer,” or “overcomer with God.” God appeared to
Jacob, whose name was changed to Israel (Genesis 35:11). through Abraham,
Isaac, and Jacob, the promises were handed down to one man at a time.

The next legal inheritor of the birthright was Reuben, firstborn son of Israel,
by his first wife, Leah. But Reuben, like Esau, lost it. And Joseph, 11th-born
of Jacob, but firstborn of Rachel, his second and truly loved wife, received it.

The birthright belonged, legally, to Reuben, not Joseph. It is related in 1 Chron 5:1-2
how it fell to Joseph: “Now the sons of Reuben the firstborn of Israel, (for he was the
firstborn; but, forasmuch as he defiled his father’s bed, his birthright was given unto
the sons of Joseph the son of Israel: and the genealogy is not to be reckoned after
the birthright [or, rsv, “so that he[Reuben] is not enrolled in the genealogy according
to the birthright”].

For Judah prevailed above his brethren, and of him came the chief ruler;
but the birthright was Joseph’s).”

So at this point the two divisions of the Abrahamic promises—
the birthright, involving material and national promises, and the
scepter, including the kingly and spiritual promises were separated.


The birthright, including the Promised Land now called Palestine, the
assurance of multitudinous population, material and national prosperity,
dominance over other nations, was now given to Joseph and his sons.

This birthright was not to be inherited by all the tribes of Israel! It was
not given to the Jews! Only a part of the Israelites—the descendants
of Joseph—was to inherit these tremendous national promises!

These material promises for this life, then, belonged to an altogether different tribe
among the children of Israel than the scepter promise of the kingly line culminating
in Jesus Christ, which spiritual promise belonged in the tribe of Judah!
-

At the time of Jacob’s death, he and his sons were living in Egypt.
51And Joseph called the name of the firstborn Manasseh: For God, said he,
hath made me forget all my toil, and all my father's house.
52And the name of the second called he Ephraim: For God hath caused me
to be fruitful in the land of my affliction

And Jacob said unto Joseph, God Almighty appeared unto me at Luz in the land
of Canaan, and blessed me, And said unto me, Behold, I will make thee fruitful,
and multiply thee, and I will make of thee a multitude of people; and will give this
land to thy seed after thee for an everlasting possession” (Genesis 48:2-4).


Nothing whatsoever is said about all the families of the Earth being blessed
in his seed—the one seed. Nothing is said about kings. Nothing is said about
spiritual blessings whatever. These promises are those of the birthright.

These promises are of multiple seed—a multitude of people—and possession
of the Promised Land.

“And now thy two sons, Ephraim and Manasseh, which were
born unto thee in the land of Egypt before I came unto thee into
Egypt, are mine; as Reuben and Simeon, they shall be mine”(verse 5).

Manasseh’s name is mentioned first, because Manasseh was the elder. But old Jacob
now mentioned the name of Ephraim first. Here we see supernatural guidance!

and let my name be named on them, and the name of my fathers Abraham and Isaac;
and let them grow into a multitude in the midst of the earth” (verses 14-16).

Israel did not confer this blessing on just one, but on both—“Bless the lads,”
he said. This blessing went upon them jointly. “Let my name be named on them”
was part of this blessing. His name was Israel. Hence, it was the descendants of
these lads, not the descendants of Judah, or the Jews, who were named Israel.

the name Israel was to be indelibly stamped on Ephraim and Manasseh!
Ephraim and Manasseh together received the right to the name Israel.
It was to become the national name of their descendants.
And their descendants were never Jews!

Together the descendants of these two lads, Ephraim and Manasseh, were
to grow into the promised multitude— the nation and company of nations.

Really?

Isaiah 45:4 (KJV)
For Jacob my servant's sake, and Israel mine elect, I have even called thee
by thy name: I have surnamed thee, though thou hast not known me.

God's heritage

Job 31:2 (KJV)
For what portion of God is there from above?
and what inheritance of the Almighty from on high?

Psalms 127:3 (KJV)
Lo, children are an heritage of the Lord:
and the fruit of the womb is his reward.


Psalms 33:12 (KJV)
Blessed is the nation whose God is the Lord; and the people
whom he hath chosen for [his own inheritance].

1 Kings 8:51 (KJV)
For they be thy people, and thine inheritance, which thou broughtest
forth out of Egypt, from the midst of the furnace of iron:

Deuteronomy 4:20 (KJV)
But the Lord hath taken you, and brought you forth out of the iron furnace,
even out of Egypt, to be unto him a people of inheritance, as ye are this day.

1 Kings 8:53 (KJV)
For thou didst separate them from among all the people of the earth,
to be thine inheritance, as thou spakest by the hand of Moses thy servant,
when thou broughtest our fathers out of Egypt, O Lord God.

Isaiah 19:25 (KJV)
Whom the Lord of hosts shall bless, saying, Blessed be Egypt my people,
and Assyria the work of my hands, and [Israel mine inheritance].

Psalms 68:9 (KJV)
Thou, O God, didst send a plentiful rain, whereby thou
didst confirm thine inheritance, when it was weary.

Psalms 74:2 (KJV)
Remember thy congregation, which thou hast purchased of old; the rod of thine
inheritance, which thou hast redeemed; this mount Zion, wherein thou hast dwelt.
-

Psalms 94:5 (KJV)
They break in pieces thy people, O Lord, and afflict thine heritage.

Psalms 94:14 (KJV)
For the Lord will not cast off his people, neither will he forsake his inheritance.

Ezekiel 22:16 (KJV)
And thou shalt take thine inheritance in thyself in the sight of the heathen,
and thou shalt know that I am the Lord.

None of those verses apply to physical descendants, it’s all to the spiritual descendants, the children of the promise like Joseph, Sampson, David, Solomon, Ezekiel, Daniel, Paul, Peter, Iames, John and all of us Gentiles who are children of the promise.