Why Do Christians Ignore Most of the Old Testament Rules?

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Xethea

Member
#81
Aug 12, 2013
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#81
Lillywolf said:
The scripture doesn't forbid men having beards. (LINK)

While cutting, branding as happens now in some cases, and tattoos were forbidden. And being the God that gave these commands for personal hygeine and bodily maintenance is the same God as we worship today through the son Jesus, unless there is an amendment in the NT that says tatt's are OK, the rule stands.
And rightly so actually. The body is a temple of the holy spirit. Why should it carry graffiti upon itself? (This would be for the Christian not for the person who was tattooed prior to finding Christ.)
1 Corinthians 6:19-20
Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit within you, whom you have from God? You are not your own, for you were bought with a price. So glorify God in your body.


Health wise there are issues too. Standard tattoo inks deposit in the liver. Red ink will still be in the liver long after a person's tatt's have been let to fade or have been lasered off. It is toxic being it is made of red dye #40.

Leviticus 19:28
KJV
28:Ye shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor print any marks upon you: I am the LORD.
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He said that because of WHY they were doing it, not because of the action itself, but the purpose and meaning of the action.
But if you still disagree, there's no need to reply to me, because trust, I've heard what you've already said a million times and countless other explanations why it is wrong and I find looking at scripture and seeking understanding by the Lord that it isn't.
 
E

Embankment

Senior Member
#82
Feb 28, 2017
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#82
Lillywolf said:
Why is it you think you teach the words of God using condescension , sarcasm, mockery and ridicule as tactics? Jesus did not teach in this manner.
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There are scriptures regarding winging ones self off of mothers milk and onto solid food. Stuff like this is baby food.
 
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Lillywolf

Well-known member
#83
Aug 29, 2018
1,562
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#83
Xethea said:
He said that because of WHY they were doing it, not because of the action itself, but the purpose and meaning of the action.
But if you still disagree, there's no need to reply to me, because trust, I've heard what you've already said a million times and countless other explanations why it is wrong and I find looking at scripture and seeking understanding by the Lord that it isn't.
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If one wants to find justification for anything at all they can do so using the scriptures.
You have tattoo's.
That doesn't mean God condemns you.
The Bible says what God intended to communicate to the world.
What we find we need to hear is our responsibility.
 
Blik

Blik

Senior Member
#84
Dec 6, 2016
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#84
notuptome said:
The law of Moses was never written to or intended for Gentiles. Gentiles were never under the law.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
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No it was intended for all who love and accept Him, not for doubters. Are you planning on throwing out your scripture?
 
notuptome

notuptome

Senior Member
#85
May 17, 2013
15,050
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#85
Blik said:
No it was intended for all who love and accept Him, not for doubters. Are you planning on throwing out your scripture?
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Just keeping scripture in context. Righteousness cannot come through the law. The law can only condemn.

Are you planning to throw out Gods grace?

Ro 2:14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:

Ro 2:27 And shall not uncircumcision which is by nature, if it fulfil the law, judge thee, who by the letter and circumcision dost transgress the law?

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
Dino246

Dino246

Senior Member
#86
Jun 30, 2015
24,672
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#86
Blik said:
No it was intended for all who love and accept Him, not for doubters. Are you planning on throwing out your scripture?
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What is your scriptural support for this?
 
Budman

Budman

Senior Member
#87
Mar 9, 2014
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#87
ReturnToGod said:
Because it is what scripture teaches. We come to God in faith and coming to God nothing we do has any merit. However once we have accepted Jesus Christ, we are to live faithfully. I remind you of what happened to the Israelites who were also promised something that did not come to pass because they did not live faithfully.
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If you add a single condition to salvation, before or after, you negate it as the gift it is.
 
ReturnToGod

ReturnToGod

Member
#89
Dec 1, 2018
92
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#89
Budman said:
If you add a single condition to salvation, before or after, you negate it as the gift it is.
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untrue, at least Biblically. All that gift means it is something we cannot earn. We must have the gift to be saved BUT we require faith. Scripturally faith can be dead, lost, shipwrecked, compromised, or transferred to something else (ex works). The Modern Church teaches you can have true faith in something but be committed to acting inconsistent with that faith. Scripture does not. We stand on the basis of faith but true faith produces works; it testifies to the evidence of a saving faith but it is the faith which saves. Faith and actions in the Bible cannot be split. Consider for a moment John 5:29. So if you really believe what you said does that mean that once you have accepted Jesus Christ you can live anyway you want based on your divorcing of faith and works?
 
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7seasrekeyed

Guest
#90
#90
Lillywolf said:
I think it a disservice to newborn Christians especially to impart the false idea that the laws of God are irrelevant today to the Christian.
Jesus spoke of the laws he intended to bring forward for remembrance in his teachings. And he was the Lord that gave the law in the OT.
The moral laws for instance. Also known as the Ten Commandments.
Those apply today. They demonstrate in the keeping of them the love of God and the love of one another. To love God with all our hearts and minds, and to love our neighbor as ourselves. Upon those two great commands that Jesus taught doth hang all the laws and the teachings of the Prophets in the old testament.

In certain nomenclature today it would appear the term Sabbath Keeper is intended to impart insult to those who keep the Sabbath.
When Jesus teaches the Sabbath was made for us, we were not made for the Sabbath.
Jesus demonstrated man's prosecution in the OT days of those who were found to be working on the Sabbath day was wrong. Jesus himself worked on the Sabbath. He healed people on the Sabbath. This was to show that one can keep the Sabbath and work in service to God and for the Kingdom.
Sabbath rest is an opportunity for any Christian that chooses to set a day aside, if they wish to follow the tradition, that day begins sundown on Friday unto sundown on Saturday, and serve God and take time to be in meditation with his holy spirit. It isn't a mandate. It i a choice. And an opportunity.
Jesus was Lord of the Sabbath. He was God who after creation ordained the Sabbath day as his day of rest. It predates the Ten Commandments.

God forbid any Christian ignore the old testament moral laws. If they do they're a lousy human being.



And for any Christian that wishes to keep the Sabbath day holy, do so if you wish. Don't let anyone imply you are wrong in honoring your time with God. Rather, on that day if you choose to keep the Sabbath , pray for those who rebuked you trying to use the scripture as a weapon to offend.
God will never condemn you for keeping the Sabbath. He may have something to say to those who mocked , ridiculed, or attacked your faith for doing so however.
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and since no one at all said what you are trying to say they said, you give reason once again, for me to ignore your attempt to bring home the bacon here at CC
 
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7seasrekeyed

Guest
#91
#91
the real question here is why do people who say they believe in the grace of God insist on all the addendums to it?

if you add to grace it is no longer grace

and again we have the time worn absolute lie being introduced that those who understand the law never saved anyone, are easy believers and have thrown the 10 commandments on the funeral pyre

that is a lie. no one has ever said that and I for one find it the weakest yet most used so called revelation unveiled by those who have one foot in the old and one foot in the new testament

if you even have one wrong thought....never mind deed...you have broken the entire law

get busy. you have much to catch up on it would seem. the Catholics have a system some may wish to emulate ...perhaps flogging? or the rosary to put you back in good standing
 
7

7seasrekeyed

Guest
#92
#92
ReturnToGod said:
untrue, at least Biblically. All that gift means it is something we cannot earn. We must have the gift to be saved BUT we require faith. Scripturally faith can be dead, lost, shipwrecked, compromised, or transferred to something else (ex works). The Modern Church teaches you can have true faith in something but be committed to acting inconsistent with that faith. Scripture does not. We stand on the basis of faith but true faith produces works; it testifies to the evidence of a saving faith but it is the faith which saves. Faith and actions in the Bible cannot be split. Consider for a moment John 5:29. So if you really believe what you said does that mean that once you have accepted Jesus Christ you can live anyway you want based on your divorcing of faith and works?
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really?

so why then does the NT tell us that nothing can separate us from the love of God...and that He will complete the work He has started in us?

are you going to make this about works now? well why not since Sabbath keeping and law keeping are works
 
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Lillywolf

Well-known member
#93
Aug 29, 2018
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#93
7seasrekeyed said:
and since no one at all said what you are trying to say they said, you give reason once again, for me to ignore your attempt to bring home the bacon here at CC
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Once again you'll ignore? You aren't ignoring when you're remarking.
I think you would make a great deal more sense when you remark with , as others do here, sarcasm, condescension, and ridicule, if you first knew what you were talking about.
Maybe you should prioritize reading comprehension over rude arrogant smartaleck remarks. Just a suggestion.

Praying for you.
 
G

Grandpa

Senior Member
#94
Jun 24, 2011
11,551
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#94
I thought it would be kind of neat to try to be a present day Nazarite.

But I realized it would be better to just be a Christian.
 
seed_time_harvest

seed_time_harvest

Senior Member
#95
Dec 9, 2011
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#95
Blik

Blik

Senior Member
#96
Dec 6, 2016
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#96
Dino246 said:
What is your scriptural support for this?
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There are many scriptures in the OT telling the Israelites to accept the stranger or foreigner who wants to join them, and to always treat them fairly and with love. There are instructions for when the foreigner wants to join them to accept them but also instructions to stay apart from them in their idol worship and honoring false Gods. They make it clear that our creator God is God of all in the same way for all, for God created and loves all His creation in the same way. The Hebrews are only different in that God was the one who created that race, it wasn't a race that man created by separating from other races. The purpose was to have them show a world that only knew false Gods at the time the real God.

Here are a few of the verses:

Exo_12:49 One law shall be to him that is homeborn, and unto the stranger that sojourneth among you.

Lev_19:34 But the stranger that dwelleth with you shall be unto you as one born among you, and thou shalt love him as thyself; for ye were strangers in the land of Egypt: I am the LORD your God.

Lev_24:22 Ye shall have one manner of law, as well for the stranger, as for one of your own country: for I am the LORD your God.

Num_15:15 One ordinance shall be both for you of the congregation, and also for the stranger that sojourneth with you, an ordinance for ever in your generations: as ye are, so shall the stranger be before the LORD.
 
JaumeJ

JaumeJ

Senior Member
#97
Jul 2, 2011
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#97
How can any person who claims he is in Christ not study the O? How can they know how the law is to be approached now without understanding the futility of the law without Jesus having fulfilled most of it??

It is certain some crackpot obedience basher will come in saying to obey the Law according to Jesus is being under the law; avoid such ignorance, it is dangerous, and teaches disobedience of Jesus, for He tells us He did not destroy the law. He does fulfull most of it while what we should follow that fall within the parameters of God's Love is our new natural character, given us by the Holy Spirit.

In addition Jesus warns all who teach against even the least of the law that any who do this will be least in the Kingdom.

Again, if someone does not hear and do as Jesus teaaches in this area, avoid them for they do not hear Jesus. I say this with a clar and good conscience in the sight of our Fadther, Jesus...
 
Endoscopy

Endoscopy

Senior Member
#98
Oct 13, 2017
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#98
dcontroversal said:
Why is it so hard to understand that the O.T. law was designed to prove our guilt before God and point to the only cure.....The imputed righteousness of Christ dia faith without the deeds/ works of the law.

Why is it so hard to acknowledge this SIMPLE TRUTH!

Why must many CONFLATE the two covenants into one.......and in SO DOING VOID THE NEW....!!!!!
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2 issues relating to this. First what Jesus said about the law. Second what is the law.

Matthew 5 NIV
The Fulfillment of the Law
17 “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. 18 For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. 19 Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 20 For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven.

In addition to the 10 commandments there are the laws scattered through the Torah. Maimonides counted and documented them. No one has found any more.

The 613 laws of God.
https://www.gospeloutreach.net/613laws.html

Discussion of the 613 laws of God
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/613_commandments
 
JaumeJ

JaumeJ

Senior Member
#99
Jul 2, 2011
21,228
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#99
The law of Moses and the mercy of Jesus are not combined. The Mercy of Jesus fulfills the law while He, Himself, accomplished and overcame the law in His person, leaving us with very few laws that fall within the parameters of what Love is, god.

We are left with the laws remaing to be obeyed which are written on our hearts, out new man knows them, but they are also yet wrtten in the Word. We are not under the law for we are freed of the curse of the law, death, but it remains to be taught to be obeyed according to Jesus.

We are not saved by obeying the law, we are save only by the Blood of Jesus, but to teach agains Love and obeying the laws that make up love is anti-Love, antilGod.

All too many people who truly love Jesus are deceived by this word game of people who deny what Jesus teache.

There is no harm in obeying Jesus, but there is great harm in teaching against His teaching. If you cannot beware, open your heart and hear Jesus..He will explain all for He promises He will.
 
Endoscopy

Endoscopy

Senior Member
#100
Oct 13, 2017
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#100
JaumeJ said:
The law of Moses and the mercy of Jesus are not combined. The Mercy of Jesus fulfills the law while He, Himself, accomplished and overcame the law in His person, leaving us with very few laws that fall within the parameters of what Love is, god.

We are left with the laws remaing to be obeyed which are written on our hearts, out new man knows them, but they are also yet wrtten in the Word. We are not under the law for we are freed of the curse of the law, death, but it remains to be taught to be obeyed according to Jesus.

We are not saved by obeying the law, we are save only by the Blood of Jesus, but to teach agains Love and obeying the laws that make up love is anti-Love, antilGod.

All too many people who truly love Jesus are deceived by this word game of people who deny what Jesus teache.

There is no harm in obeying Jesus, but there is great harm in teaching against His teaching. If you cannot beware, open your heart and hear Jesus..He will explain all for He promises He will.
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First
You ignore what Jesus said about the law!
That he came to fulfill the law and the prophets. That the law will be in force until the heavens and earth disappear.

Second
The definition of sin is breaking the law. This implies that the law is in place.

Christians use the term sin but too many don't know the basic definition of it.
 
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