Not By Works

I just said the LORD preserves us. I said present, active work where the Lord preserves us. Is Christ presently and actively keeping us? Or no?

I am familiar.

Of course it’s Jesus. I apologize; when I say the power of the Cross, I mean Jesus; it’s just a cool saying.

Jesus keeps His sheep from being lost because that’s what He desires and that’s what he gets. He thinks it and so it is.

No matter how one slices and dices....a salvation that...

a. Must be maintained by man or one's effort

b. Is losable by what one does or does not do.

c. Requires some sort of religious hoop jumping, deed or act

d. Or that USES JAMES out of context

= a false works based salvation

Who has used Ephesians 2:8-10 to peddle a right to live a life of sin?

Romans 4:4 is a beautiful verse on justification. But if there is but ONE aspect to salvation, and justification is part of the beginning of Gods work, what work is God doing and going to do in order to bring it to completion. Phi. 1:6?

What is the evidence of true faith, Dcontroversal? What has to be the evidence of true faith? A life full of fruits!
Why does it have to be full of fruits? Because faith is a fruit of the Spirit of Christ.

It is written.
James 2:26
26For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.


Why is it written that the body without the spirit is dead, and that faith without works is dead also?
Because if you do not have the Spirit of Christ within you, - it is not possible to walk in love (righteousness) - because the body is dead in unrighteousness, the reason why every man needs the Spirit of Christ! - and from love, His Spirit - righteousness flows.
"We love, because He first loved us."

So faith without works is dead (for how can one not walk in love, if they are in faith? Faith is a fruit of the Spirit, so if there are no works of love in a believers life, he or she does not have the Spirit of Christ within them - if they did, they must walk as He did, and produce the fruits similar to the ones beneath.) It is important to know also, that the fruits and works does NOT flow from effort, but from FELLOWSHIP with the LIGHT, Jesus Christ, within. As a branch, connected to the vine. If you walk in under commandments of law, you are fallen from grace.

1 Corinthians 13:4-8 King James Version (KJV)
4 Charity suffereth long, and is kind; charity envieth not; charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up,
5 Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil;
6 Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth;
7 Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.


1 John 3:7-16 King James Version (KJV)
7 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.
8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.
11 For this is the message that ye heard from the beginning, that we should love one another.
12 Not as Cain, who was of that wicked one, and slew his brother. And wherefore slew he him? Because his own works were evil, and his brother's righteous.
13 Marvel not, my brethren, if the world hate you.
14 We know that we have passed from death unto life, because we love the brethren. He that loveth not his brother abideth in death.
15 Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him.
16 Hereby perceive we the love of God, because he laid down his life for us: and we ought to lay down our lives for the brethren.


Many believe in vain, and do not believe that it is necessary to walk in love, as Christ did - and that it is ok to walk in darkness, the very works of the flesh, that Christ came to do away with.

Read the thread and then come accuse and while you are at it....UNDERSTAND the scope of this thread....it is about how one is saved...NOT THE RESULTS OF SALVATION!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

So there is a present work of God in which He is keeping us, it’s not just a matter of “hey, I believed and was justified forever”. Of course we know that we ARE justified forever, our salvation is fully accomplished, but yet we see in scriptures that there are present things and future things that God is doing and will do to finish the work He began.

Can you see that salvation is much more multifaceted than what has commonly been taught here. All of it, the many facets are works of God

Saved, not of our own works, but by HIS works. Past, present and fiture

God not only justifies, He also regenerates, adopts, sanctified, , preserves and glorifies. All of grace, not of our works. All works of God

This is my point. Justification is but one facet/aspect of salvation.

Your only being taugh not even half glass

The scope of salvation. Died for, drawn, regenerated, justified, adopted sanctified, kept, and glorified. All by the powerful work of God, none accomplished by any work of our own

There’s the scope

I don’t see how he has to actively keep us. A football team that has won the game doesn’t have to win the game again; it’s over; it’s already done. Jesus’ work is complete; it’s a done deal; we are His and none of us shall ever be lost.

But my reply was to the thing you said; and the example you used of a person that has most likely believed in vain, - for - you do agree with me, do you not? A person that has the Spirit of Christ, will be filled with the fruits?


If Christ is not in you, - you will walk in unrighteousness, and unrighteousness produces death and corruption of flesh.
We have to be indwelt by the Spirit of God, and walk in love as He did (fellowship with Him).
Paul asks every believer this question;

2 Corinthians 13:5 King James Version (KJV)
5 Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?

It is very important to know - if the Light of the world is within you, you will also walk after it, know His voice - and be full of His fruits. Believers are to be known by love - and love is not only in word and tongue, but deed and truth.
Love is not only heard, it can be seen by action - it was in Christ!

My point is Jesus does not have to work at it. His work is complete. None of us who have faith in Jesus will ever be lost. Our names are written in the book of life. It is a done deal.

Yes - the work is already done, but He is continually working out our salvation IN us, by our trust in what is already finished.
His righteousness, not our own - but His righteousness will be seen as a fruit of our faith, and by the fruits of His Spirit within us,
righteous works will flow from the believers. We are sealed, but the seal of God will also produce works of righteousness - because this is a fruit of the Spirit of God within. If one continues to walk in darkness, they may never have seen or had true faith in God, because God is light, and has no darkness in Himself.

Agreed. But what does 1 Peter 1:5 mean?

Do you at least see that I’m not talking about works saving or keeping us? I am not a works salvationist, except that I am a Gods work salvationist

Question 1. What Tense is the verb “sin” in 1 John 3:9?

What do I get if I answer correctly?

And the truth.....this thread is about how one actually gets saved....and NOT ABOUT THE RESULTS OF SALVATION and regardless.....

But to the one who does not work, but believes in Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is credited as righteousness

You may correct me of an error. I am always willing to be corrected by the Word of God.