Not By Works

It’s called prayer, and it’s not a secret.

PSA: Pray for my friend ERROL SPENCE! He was in a car accident and is in critical condition currently. He is a pro-boxer unified welterweight champ. That man needs some Jesus in his life, he was foolishly SPEEDING and from what I heard through EXCLUSIVE sources, might of been under the influence. Lord Jesus save this man and bring comfort and peace to his family!

He’s in stable condition which is a good thing. Prayers lifted.

Pisteou aka Faither

Have you done an exhaustive lexicographical study of the word "pisteou" in Greek literature?

And to you other question, you not you have not added to grace, there is no grace in your doctrine because you have made faith/belief volitional and a work.

Scripture is very clear

Romans 4:5 (NIV)
5 However, to the one who does not work but trusts God who justifies the ungodly, their faith is credited as righteousness.

Surrendering is an act of the will.... Salvific faith/belief is being persuaded and not an act of the will.

Your doctrine is not a secret, it is just plain wrong.

And btw @dcontroversal has not left me hanging.

Faith does assume action. Faith causes action. Lack of faith causes lack of action.

But belief doesn't necessarily cause action. Or it doesn't have to.


Pisteuo is having faith in Christ and having faith that He is where all your Blessings come from.

Which is kind of what you said but then you said "with no expectations of any benefits." That's highly incorrect.


There is no reason to have faith in something if it doesn't provide benefit. I can't think of anything we do that isn't of some kind of benefit to us. Otherwise, we would probably stop doing it.

Hebrews 11:6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.

Well I think Pisteou should, then he will find out he is wrong!

OH MY, are you deceived. Every bit of MY SURRENDERED, life is because I LOVE HIM WITH GODLY LOVE. That kind of Love was PUT IN ME BY GOD. It is HIS LOVE IN ME, that Caused me to LOVE HIM BACK. How did that LOVE GET IN ME, here is that specific answer:


Romans 5:5 (HCSB)
5 This hope will not disappoint ⌊us⌋, because God’s love has been poured out in our hearts through the Holy Spirit who was given to us.


If you do not have that LOVE IN YOU, you are not Born Again, and all you works are worthless to GOD.

I cried and WEPT like a baby, for HOURS over my utter sinfulness after my third attempt at suicide. HE POURED THAT LOVE INTO TO MY HEART, then and only then I was able to LOVE HIM BACK by surrendered to HIM OUT OF THAT LOVE.

I
Those who enter in no longer live for themselves. As you mentioned earlier, are disciplined by the Lord to be His disciples.
The broad way that leads to destruction refers to those who will not bear the cross daily and "Will suffer losss, but will be saved through the fire," their works were perishable; having their affections in this life rather than in God, fallen from Grace, unable to do the work of God. "In Faith that works by Love," " As labourers together with God." There is much missleading controversy about the works of the flesh: idolatry witchcraft... and the fruit of the Spirit that endures through the fire. "The fire will refine every man's work. No one is saved by achievement, is obvious to those who come to Christ and anyone who truly Loves his neibour is influenced by the Holy Spirit and that's why rejecting Him can't be forgiven. To most everyone's surprise death and hell no longer belong to the enemy. Jesus has the keys, He declared this when he rose from the dead, and that's wy many will be saved through the fire but loose their reward. Even many that don't recognise Jesus as God will be forgiven. Jesus said this would be forgiven, but rejecting the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven.

No Grace? That's what you come back with?

You are correct, surrendering is an act of the will. And in fulfilling pisteuo, we must surrender our life anew each and every day.

Ya , he has.

It is rejecting the truth about JESUS that the Holy Spirit works on the Heart to get us to believe. One of the things IT THE DEITY OF CHRIST, so I disagree with you. AND belief it is GOD's LOVE has been put in our hearts, thus it acts like a SEED and reproduces the SAME KIND OF LOVE IN US.

NO IT IS AN ACT OF GOD's LOVE HE has put in us.

So "pisteuo" is a work according to you, and you have agreed to this, so please reconcile this with scripture?
Start with Romans 4:5 please.

I'll bite!

Your saying we respond with saving Faith because of the indwelling Spirit of Christ. Well that is true after God has been perfecting us for years and years.

What about before we receive the Spirit of Christ? When we are just being called out by the Father? Pisteuo is a simple response to the call!

Because your understanding of pisteuo or saving Faith is incorrect (believe and recieve), you think that you received the Spirit of Christ at the beginning of the salvation journey, when you can't receive it until a number of things must happen, and happen in the correct order. Your understanding is backwards.

1) we are called by the Father.
2) we respond to the call with a turning from our way to His way. Repentance.
3) we then take our first step in Faith towards God. Submitting our surrendered life for the first time.
4) Christ must determine if the surrendered life is genuine.
5) if genuine, we move into the testing ground, or what the word calls the parable of the sower.
6) in the testing ground or parable of the sower, 3 out of the four surrendered lives will fail. (Without the Spirit of Christ yet.) If they failed with the Spirit of Christ, they wouldn't be able to start the journey anew, submitting a surrendered life again to be tested. Since the three that failed didn't have the Spirit of Christ yet, they can start again as long as the Father continues to draw them.
7) the one good soil goes onto the grafting process , continuing forward with saving pisteuo, or continually surrendered life.
8) God then accepts the tested and grafted on surrendered life by sealing the Spirit of Christ in that vessel..
Now, and only now does the Spirit of Christ, Christ, His word, and the promises in His word belong to that surrendered vessel. And yes, at this point our Continually surrendered life is mixed with the love of God we sense through His Spirit being in us. And if we have the Spirit of Christ, we also have the mind of Christ! Our Faith, our continually surrendered life is being perfected by Jesus. At this state, it's harder for one like that to get out of God's will, than it would be to stay in it!

That a quick outline of the salvation process. Everything in there must happen and happen in the correct order.

Believing then recieving? It's not an option!

We aren't at a point in our relationship to discuss much scripture. Let's just stay with the Greek word and it's true meaning.

The Greek language doesn't allow work and effort to be separated from pisteuo, or saving Faith. Only the mistranslated words believe, believer, and believing demand that. Like I stated in post 110645, courage and tinacity takes effort and surrending our lives continually takes an act of our will. We make a decision daily to surrender ourselves to Him. If we're not surrendering daily, He'll never know us!

Surrender isn't "a" work! Surrender is work!

I will say this about scripture and your need for reconciliation.

Pisteuo is for us the most important word in the scriptures, without it we can't receive the Spirit of Christ.

Pisteuo, is used 248 times in the NT. The Vines Greek dictionary defines pisteuo as "a personal surrender to Him and a life inspired by such surrender".

So God is telling us 248 times, in different tenses, that saving Faith applied, is a personal surrender to Him and a life inspired by such surrender!

I was taught when God repeats Himself, pay extra attention! 248 times!

Yup, therefore you are against the Gospel which is ........salvation is a gift .... by grace through faith apart from works!