Is irresistible grace (effectual calling) a biblical doctrine?

We’re up 2-0 thus far.

The doctrines of grace, which some call the Five Points of Calvinism (TULIP), are the topic of three other threads I’ve started.

I am presenting the Reformed position, as well as my understanding of the free-willer position, for comparison. I am also inviting free-willers to disprove, from a Scriptural basis, Reformed theology.

The reason why I am presenting Reformed theology is to combat the consistent misrepresentation of it by some individuals on this forum.

I believe that many are simply parroting propaganda from Dave Hunt, Steven Anderson, Leighton Flowers, or any one of several vehemently anti-Reformed propagandists.

If a believer is going to criticize the Reformed position, they should properly understand it, and then criticize it from this proper understanding, not a strawman misrepresentation of it.

Additionally, I think it is important for the encouragement of the Church to understand the principles related to Reformed theology. Why?

Reformed theology should lead to humility in the believer. The doctrines of grace were meant to humble the Christian into realizing that salvation is God’s work, therefore they cannot take credit for it. The real believer seeks to glorify and worship God for his awesome acts of salvation.

Reformed theology should lead to humility in evangelists, too. The Reformed evangelist knows that regeneration is an act of God, therefore he cannot take credit for it, like some free-willer evangelists have done (namely, Charles Finney and the "New Method" preachers of the 1800's).

Man-centered theology such as free-willers embrace leads to pride and a lack of humility. Pride is the deadly enemy of the believer. Ironically, it can also lead to self-condemnation and a lack of self-confidence in some, because their focus is not on the LORD but is on themselves.

This particular thread focuses on the Reformed doctrine irresistible grace. The doctrine of irresistible grace teaches that God accomplishes his purpose in his elect, and that the application of divine grace is ultimately realized for the elect believer through regeneration, which is a movement of God, and is not caused by humans.

As I have consistently maintained, the free-willer belief of decisional regeneration is absurd. In essence, they teach that a man with a heart of stone must produce faith and repentance in order to receive the heart of flesh that causes repentance and faith. Rather, the correct, Reformed view is that God gives the man a heart of flesh, so he can produce faith and repentance.

So God views all people as the same on the same level, so why would He choose some and not others without their choice when all people are the same to Him.

1.The Bible says that God commands all people everywhere to repent, and wants all people to be come to the knowledge of the truth and be saved.

Jesus lights every person born in to this world, so everybody has the chance to see the light of Jesus and be saved.

The Spirit and bride say Come, and anybody can have that salvation.

So God did not choose who would be saved, and not saved without their choice.

2.God's kingdom is love, and He is not evil to condemn people that have no choice.

If God chooses who will be saved and not saved without their choice then His kingdom is not true love for they have no choice but to say I love you seeing no other alternative.

And He is not evil to condemn people that have no choice seeing no other alternative.

It goes against the nature of God that He is love and good.

Also if God chooses them without their choice then their faith is not real, their hope is not real, their love is not real, their confession of Christ is not real, their repentance is not real for it did not come from them but from God.

3.God calls things that have not happened yet, as though they already happened for if it is a plan of God to happen in the future it is the same as if it happened in the beginning, for it will surely come to pass with no hindrance.

Which the Lamb was slain from the foundation of the world, and the prophets blood shed from the foundation of the world.

So the saints predestined to salvation means that God already had the plan to give mankind salvation before He laid down the foundation of the world, and this salvation is to whoever wants to receive this salvation.

4.The Bible says all have sinned and come short of the glory of God, and there is none that does good, no, not one, and what makes you to differ from another person, and if you think you are something when you are nothing you deceive yourself, and God is no respecter of persons but in every nation those that do righteousness are accepted with Him, and if you offend in the least of the law you offend in all.

So God views all people as the same on the same level, so why would He choose some and not others without their choice when all people are the same to Him.

5.God chose us we did not choose Him.

No person says Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.

No person comes to the Son unless the Father draws them.

Peter said Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the living God, and Jesus said flesh and blood did not reveal that to Him but the Father.

If God chooses who will be saved and not saved without their choice then He would only work in the lives of those He chose, for it would not make any sense to work in the lives of those He did not choose.

But many people against Calvin believe Jesus is the Lord, and confess Him as the Christ, Savior, and the Son of the living God, so God has to be working in their lives.

But many are called but few are chosen so God does the calling and choosing on earth, and many confess Jesus as Lord, and Savior, both those that claim Calvin and those that do not, but not all will be chosen that says Lord, Lord.

Not many noble, not many mighty, not many wise after the flesh are called because their heart condition is not right for they like to exalt themselves too much, and do not love people enough to be called.

When God calls a person He will work in their lives to get them to the truth, but when they get to the door of truth they have to decide to walk through it for God's kingdom is true love, but they would of not gotten to the door of truth if God did not intervene in their life to get them there for the flesh alone will not want to accept it, so God chose us we did not choose Him.

Some people do not get to the door of truth for they did not get that far to accept Jesus, and some got to the door of truth but did not go through it.

Which they confessed Christ but did not have the proper attitude concerning their behavior to act Christlike, and abstain from sins by the Spirit.

Which the Lord knows them that are His having this seal, for this is what seals the saints and how they are saved, that everyone that names the name of Christ depart from iniquity.

And Paul said awake to righteousness, and sin not, but some do not have the knowledge of God, and he speaks that to their shame.

Which a Spirit led life will not fulfill the lusts of the flesh for they have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts, and God will not allow them to be tempted above measure, and will give them an escape from the temptation so they can bear it.

So a Spirit led life can abstain from sin which is required to do acting like Christ, and there is no excuse.

But some have a from of godliness, but deny the power thereof, from such turn away, and they are ever learning and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth, and it points out their sins and they are lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God for they will not let go of the flesh, and believe they are alright despite holding unto sin.

Which some say they cannot abstain from sin, and sin daily, and sin does not affect their relationship with God which is the wrong attitude.

Which that is the difference between those led of the Spirit, and those that are not, for those led of the Spirit might sin but they know they have to get rid of it and move forward to be right with God, but those without the Spirit will hang unto sin and believe they are alright with God.

Which we see in the world a lot of people claiming Christ like that as they are lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God, and are enjoying the world like the world.

Is that why people like to follow Calvin for they think they cannot fall so they can enjoy sin and believe they are alright, for we see them being worldly quite a lot.

But God said He wants all people to be saved so that alone should settle the matter, but it does not for some people.

Why do they want to believe it according to Calvin is the question.

God calls all mankind to repentance, regardless of election status, through a general calling.

Matthew 22:14 For many are called, but few are chosen

Acts 17:30-31 30 The times of ignorance God overlooked, but now he commands all people everywhere to repent, 31 because he has fixed a day on which he will judge the world in righteousness by a man whom he has appointed; and of this he has given assurance to all by raising him from the dead.”

Too much to respond to in this entire thread, but my objection here would be that the whole idea of a "general call" is absolutely useless because its not the "effectual calling". This is one of the many reasons I am not Reformed, I just cannot believe God would give a fake repentance call to people, "Repent, but you cant unless I give you the regeneration first and I will only give it to the elect". Sorry for putting it in that way, not doing it to be degrading to your theology, just typing as I see it, what parts have I misunderstood? There is the real effectual call that actually does something, and there is the fake call the general call which does absolutely nothing, no one is able to respond to it due to their "Total depravity".

I believe that is a false image of what God is doing. I believe the call to repentance in Acts 17:30-31 is genuine to all humanity, anyone who hears the Gospel can repent.

I try to avoid all systematic theologies to the best of my abilities because they are man-made frameworks for interpreting the Bible and once you are set on one, you see everything through that lens. It tends to over complicate things and none of the Apostles or the converts in the early Church had any systematic theological framework.

Simply the way I see it preached is best described in the book of Acts. Lets take a few examples:

Peter is preaching to the Jews who crucified Jesus and he is telling them what they did, they are pricked in their hearts and they ask What shall we do to be saved? To which Peter responds repent and be baptized for the remission of sins and you will get the gift of the Holy Spirit.
Paul is preaching repentance proven by deeds, repentance and faith throughout Damascus, Judea, to the Jews and to the Greeks.

Everyone has a conscience and we are to tell people they have violated God's law, and if judged at this moment they will go to hellfire for their sins. We are then to present to them the message that God sent His son for our sake, died on the cross for the sins of the world and paved us the way. We are then to tell them as Paul did:

2 Corinthians 5:20
We are therefore Christ's ambassadors, as though God were making his appeal through us. We implore you on Christ's behalf: Be reconciled to God.
Isaiah 45:22
Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am God, and there is none else.


How are we to tell them to be reconciled? Repent and believe the Gospel. Repentance and faith, the consistent message of the Bible, turn from serving idols to serving the living God, from sin to righteousness, from death to life, call out on the name of the Lord.

That is all I need to know. Anything we add to that about "Why were they pricked in their hearts during Peter's sermon?" and questions like that are just speculation, God tells us what to do, we are supposed to keep moving forward, walk in His commandments and dont look back. King Solomon said it best:

Ecclesiastes 12:13
Now all has been heard; here is the conclusion of the matter: Fear God and keep his commandments, for this is the duty of all mankind.

I believe this is what we should focus on, instead of the behind the scenes workings of God.

How do you deal with the Scripture which says "many are called, but few are chosen"?

Also, do you believe that God elects individuals to salvation?

The general call serves a purpose; it exposes the elect to the gospel message. It is not effective for the non-elect, but it is effective for the elect.

So, it is not purposeless.

I don't think it's speculation. Acts 13 mentions that the group which responded did so because they were appointed to eternal life, and this appointment occurred prior to their response.