Not By Works

So we can have a situation of someone who hears the Gospel, calls upon Jesus, sits back because he is told that HE is now eternally secure and NO WORKS can do anything to save him. Yet he misunderstands this. He is pacified that the risk (of damnation) is past. His flesh comforts him that its not necessary to press into God, to hear what God has to say about things. He doesn't read the bible. He doesn't pray. But in his mind he is totally secure. He made a real choice to believe in Jesus at the start. But he did not go on with the journey. He gladly calls upon the name of the Lord. He believes he loves the Lord. But he also loves certain vices. The risk of participating in these vices is fairly low because God is a loving God who has forgiven all sins, past, present and future he was told. So there is NOTHING that God has not forgiven according to his belief. He reasons within himself that maybe God might be a bit disappointed with him, and was told that this may mean that some of these things might be burned up when he makes it to heaven, and possibly his mansion might not be as large as it might have been if he sacrificed a bit more in this life. But, hey, heaven itself is not that bad a deal anyway.

I am SO glad you asked!!

Jesus preached the Good News of the Kingdom of God and also demonstrated it. He said if we had faith in Him, we would do the same. And He gave us, His disciples, the command to seek first His Kingdom and His righteousness. He not only gave us the command but lived the example for us. He did nothing on His own initiative. The initiative was the Father's. As His disciples, the initiative for us today is to be Jesus'. Upon Him do we wait all the day. Living in the Spirit like this, we will not gratify the desires of the sinful nature. Right there with Him, so near His rod and His staff, the wolves are far from us. Being under His authority, we exhibit not only fruit of the Spirit but also gifts; love and also love in action. After all, the Kingdom of God does not exist in words but in power and neither Jesus nor the Scriptures left any program for change before the end of the age.

"To the one who pleases Him, God gives wisdom, knowledge and happiness. But to the sinner, He gives the task of gathering and storing up wealth only to hand it over to the one who pleases Him." Ecc.2:6 or so. And in Psalm 125 or so, "In vain you rise up early and stay up late toiling for food to eat, for while they sleep He provides for those He loves." And repeatedly in His Word, He has promised to love those who love Him, i.e., those who obey Him. This is no "sloppy Agape".

I used to sit under the ministry of a man who stated that "the only problem with a living sacrifice is that it is always crawling off the altar." We can chuckle at that because we know what that means but it really isn't valid for a disciple who has denied himself and must continue doing so daily. "I have set the Lord before me continually" the Psalmist said. Isaiah 64:4 has always meant a great deal to me in this context: "Since ancient times, no one has heard, no ear has perceived, no eye has seen any God besides You who acts on behalf of those who wait for Him."

In this connection, we are always telling our children to "live in the moment." They begin to ask all kinds of questions about what we're going to do in the future but "the wind blows wherever it pleases, you hear the sound of it but cannot tell where it comes from or where it is going. So it is with everyone who is born of the Spirit." And this Gospel by which Jesus becomes Head over all things for the disciple is the one they have heard since they were in utero. But we simply tell them that sheep don't tug at the shepherd's clothes asking about where they're going next.

We had a beautiful example of this principle last night at Bible study. When Scripture states "When you come together everyone has a hymn or a word of instruction, a revelation a tongue or an interpretation. All of these must be done for the strengthening of the church." The fact that that's so alien points to the problem. If Jesus isn't Lord of all, He's not Lord at all. "The preacher" isn't the one who should "give the message". The bulletin, or "how we always do it" isn't what is supposed to be followed. The Holy Spirit is.

So we come together and wait for what song we should sing. After that, I was led to ask each person what their one prayer request for 2020 would be. And you can feel God's presence when His will is being done. He was in what we were doing. We felt we should write them down. Then when we go to the Word, we listen for where we should go. Psalm 61 was where we were directed and it is a Psalm that begins, "Hear my cry, O God; listen to my prayer. From the ends of the earth I call to You, I call as my heart grows faint..." And they commented before I did that this was God. So I got to reiterate how we must live in the moment and that as we let Him lead that He is speaking to us, He is listening to us and His desire is to answer and we went again to Luke 18 and touched on the example of the widow and also of Elijah and what fervent prayer is like. And the requests weren't the kind asked with wrong motives so that they could spend what they get on their pleasures - no one was asking for a pony or stuff like that.

I believe in the Greek in the sermon on the mount, Jesus' statement that "You cannot serve both God and money" actually is "You cannot work for God and money". Like many of the Jews of Jesus' time, many Christians today are lovers of money, i.e. idolaters. I haven't had a "real job" since 1996 since the Lord began teaching me this. I haven't had a paycheck since that time. And yet we have abundance. Derek Prince stated, "Jesus didn't carry a lot of cash but He always had His Father's credit card and it was accepted everywhere He went." That's a good way of stating it. Obviously I work but the yoke I have on is not one put on for the purpose of getting money but for the purpose of doing His will.

What am I going to do today? I don't know. I'm going to listen to the Master. He is the good Shepherd. It's not a religion - it's a relationship.

and here we have the bottom of the rabbit hole- sinless perfectionism.

you denied teaching this, accused me of making a false accusation, and right here you are, strongly implying it.

and, as far as the writer of Hebrews goes, Israel , when God delivered them ( as they rebelled and complained all the way), they refused to go in because of unbelief , the unbelief that God could subdue the nations of cannan.

so, God , in spite of their sin and unbelief, took them to the Promised Land, and they refused to go in.

God did NOT take away their salvation, they forfeited it by not believing . ( not trusting God, not having confidence in Him)
just as the greek launuage defines belief.

so, beliving is trusting and having confidence in Jesus. then obedience follows. as a result, not a cause.

Not real good at it, lol. But the times that I have overcome anxiety it was because I remembered how in past times of being anxious about something God made a way when there seemed to be no way. You'll grow from your experiences. There is no other way it seems.

Are you implying that we fight the good fight of faith to maintain salvation? You seem to believe that's all the Christian life is about. The implication seems to be only if we fight hard enough, then we will finally lay hold of eternal life based on the merits of our performance. I can understand why works-salvationists strongly oppose OSAS. It's all about "our performance" with them and not grace through faith.

Who said this fight was about maintaining salvation through faith? Genuine faith continues and is not some shallow, temporary belief that has no root, produces no fruit and withers away. Our victory is through faith in Christ and He is the author and finisher of our faith. (Hebrews 12:2) and He completes the good He began in us/carries it on to completion. (Philippians 1:6)

It's an exhortation and not a warning about losing salvation. Believers are to fight the good fight of faith and get a grip on the realty of matters associated with eternal life and live with a heavenly perspective. The Christian life is one of spiritual battle. Yet the Lord does not forsake His saints and they are preserved forever. (Psalm 37:28)

There is no problem with my doctrine and here is the problem with your biased doctrine. 1 Timothy 6:12 says the people who are exhorted to fight the good fight of faith, lay hold on eternal life are called and in Romans 8:30, notice also that such people were called. Romans 8:30 - Moreover whom He predestined, these He also called; whom He called, these He also justified; and whom He justified, these He also glorified. *Notice how Paul uses the past tense for a future event to stress it's certainty.

Abraham was justified DECADES before he offered Isaac. I think about 20 years between justified by faith and the offering of Isaac.

Justified by faith alone. Raised to spiritual life by faith alone. Works follow out of no other motive besides love for God and man, which love comes from above in the first place.

But the only obedience required in the new birth is repentance towards God and faith in Jesus Christ. Other obedience’s are impossible until you are raised to spiritual life. That is, until we are raised to spiritual life, we are under the Laws dominion, which requires perfection

God justified and imputes Christ’s righteousness to us through faith. And He raises us to spiritual life through faith. And from henceforth, we walk by faith. Faith to faith.

Exactly. Works that are not done in love are done through sinful motivation, and are therefore filthy rags.

Yes Sir.
unless directly mentioned and I am moved to speak I will remain silent on this topic from now on.
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1Co 3:4 For while one saith, I am of Paul; and another, I am of Apollos; are ye not carnal?

Are not all things of God "to include Christians, Non Christians, and those who are uncertain" to reward and punish as he pleases?

1Co 8:6 But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.

Seems better to be an unsure Gentile and doer of the law to be a lukewarm Christian with faithless works in my opinion "Not saying you are or aren't".

Rom 2:13 (For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.

Rom 2:14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
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Luckily the church of Laodicieans don't need to worry about no works just faith alone; Because works is just Old Covenant or nailed to the cross according to certain wisemen and prophets in here.

Rev 3:14 And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;
Rev 3:15 I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot.
Rev 3:16 So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.
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It is a narrow path and I rather put unsure or not applicable than put christian. I used the best available option.

E-X-A-C-T-L-Y.

What you said is correct. Where the dis-connect comes with many who debate here is on the topic of ongoing faith. They have isolated faith and salvation at a SPECIFIC point in time. Therefore it becomes quite legalistic from that point onwards with claims of people not being required to (1) continue in the faith (2) not being able to shrink back from the faith (3) not being able to do ANYTHING that could cause a loss of salvation (4) no need for repentance (just a few posts ago you see this one). (5) No need to fight the good fight of faith.....and I could go on and on.

The legalistic part is that they will go to God and claim the promises of eternal salvation, but have overlooked so many things that are part and parcel of our walk with God (e.g. points 1 to 5 above). When challenged, many excuses are thrown up like (1) well this wasn't a REAL believer (2) you are now using works to earn your salvation etc etc.

Belief is a choice. When presented with information you have the choice to believe that information or disbelieve. When presented with the gospel, many choose to believe in the saving power of Christ. But we are on a PILGRIMS JOURNEY through this world. We will continue to be given new information. There are many false prophets and false teachers who will present other information to you. You are free to choose to believe that information (with the risk of your faith being shattered), or continuing to cling to Jesus, The Cross and Him Crucified. It is still a choice. We have filters (the Word of God / Bible / Holy Spirit) which/who who help keep us on the path (led by the Spirit). But we could also sow seeds which are destructive to our faith - listening to and heeding these false teachings. The bible is clear that the faith of some were overthrown.

So we agree on some serious essentials here, Chris