What do you think?

Hi!
James1:27 tells us what pure religion is.
There is salvation in no other name than Jesus!

The world population is fastly approaching 8 billion ppl.

In Revelations we see multitudes of those slain under the altar of God for their testimony and the blood of the Lamb.

Also in Revelations we find multitudes of ppl of every nation,kindred,and tongue stand who stood before the throne and the Lamb of God. The Angel told John in Rev.7:14 that these had come out of great tribulation.


Two fold supposition:
We have no census on what has been the populous of earth since creation.

According to rapture scripture some believe,I think the number will be small that are caught up. Due to the apostasy of this age, I fear they will only be counted as " Disappeared" among the ppl.

Do you think that those who come through the " Great Tribulation,will be more than those who have died in God and Jesus?

Interesting questions. My opinion is that for sure many will come though but we must also understand the Great tribulation in terms of scripture.
It is a time when God primarily focuses on Israel because it says that the time of the fullness of the Gentiles has come in and also that he sends them a strong delusion that people will believe the lie (the new world religion). There will be incredible persecution on those who are Gentiles who reject the mark of the beast, because they will have martyrdom as their only choice.

So the numbers will be constrained to a degree.

I can see that.

Yet the word of God is the most bought book today. It will still be here during the G.T. Also many that were taught correctly among the Gentiles the word and those that dabbled (lukewarm) will surely know the truth of the matter then.

There will also be those alive who come away from Gods wrath right? Not martyred..

Plus the 144 thousand will have been preaching the truth to all as well as Israel........media

Probably, but I fear not too many will. Seven years is a long time to buck the system. Unless you have an off the grid system of self sustenance already in place its going to be very, very, hard. Nobody can buy or sell anything without taking the Mark, and all who take the Mark are condemned without hope of salvation. Also, authority is GIVEN to the Antichrist to overcome the Saints (God allows it and is authorised).

Revelation 13
7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.

Revelation 14
11 And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.

When Yeshua appears on the clouds and those yet alive in the flesh are gathered up to Him after those who sleep, how is it anyone believes that all will have been martyred? It is good the heart be established with faith and not deceived by precepts.

The number of saints with white robes cannot be counted........they are as the sands on a shore, as the stars without number..... kind of reminds me of the promise God made to Abraham about all the children he would have........

Revelation 7:9 New International Version (NIV)
The Great Multitude in White Robes
9 After this I looked, and there before me was a great multitude that no one could count, from every nation, tribe, people and language, standing before the throne and before the Lamb. They were wearing white robes and were holding palm branches in their hands.

It is not as you are referring to above. Those raptured are not martyred. Some of those left behind are. These are the ones who know that they have missed the rapture and are cut to the heart, because they did not prepare themselves. These are those found in faith and repentance, who are now forced into a choice - the Mark of the Best or Death.


Revelation 6
9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:
10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?
11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

There is a prophecised Great tribulation at the end of this age just before the return of Jesus.. Some Saints will be persecuted and beheaded during those times. But there has been tribulation for Christians since the very start of the church age.. The verse you quoted stated Rev.7:14 that these had come out of great tribulation. This does not state that they came out of any particular episode of great tribulation.. And to those who are persecuted and killed for their belief in Jesus they personally experience Great Tribulation..

The end times tribulation against the Saints will be so great i believe very few Christians will be still alive at the time of the rapture.. Most Saints will have already been executed by the time of the return of our LORD Jesus Christ..

Adstar, there are two raptures in the bible for the saints of God. The first one is the Chrurch and it occurs before the start of the 7 year tribulation period. The second is for Israel (and the few elect who remain alive) at the end of the tribulation. Matthew 24 refers to the second rapture.

well whatever you believe about the rapture... the Lord did say shall He find faith on earth when He returns?

so that says to me its small amount. like in noah's day only his family were saved

I am not a subscriber to the Pre-tribulation rapture doctrine..

I believe that rapture will happen on the day of the second comming of my LORD Jesus Christ.. The Rapture of the living Saints who are alive and remain will happen at the same time as the first reasurection of the Saints from the dead.

The will he find faith on the earth is said more from a perspective of edification and rebuke (in the context above)

But yes, the reality is it will be very difficult in those days. Look what is written in Daniel 12:

Daniel 12
5 Then I, Daniel, looked; and there stood two others, one on this riverbank and the other on that riverbank. 6 And one said to the man clothed in linen, who was above the waters of the river, “How long shall the fulfillment of these wonders be?”
7 Then I heard the man clothed in linen, who was above the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand to heaven, and swore by Him who lives forever, that it shall be for a time, times, and half a time; and when the power of the holy people has been completely shattered, all these things shall be finished.

>the time (year), times (2 years) and half a time (1/2 a year) = 3.5 years and refers to the Great Tribulation
>the power of the holy people will be shattered. So we are talking very few.

And I respect that. No issues. If you want to explore the 2 raptures PM me and we can discuss off thread.

um..dont know sorry, I dont know know if God has a thing where He measures the population of human beings on earth and looks at it and goes 9 billion people are way too much now I'm gonna end the world.

He did once say, when the population was just 2, to go forth and multiply. But since then, He has come to divide the sheep from the goats. So, not sure. Ask Him.

I believe it is mentioned of a number to be acheived of those who were to fulfill the prophecies in Revelations. If this sheds light on the topic, praise God.

Hello @JaumeJ,

So sorry I haven’t read the posts on this thread..... they’re kinda long but, I saw your name and wanted to say “hello” to a fellow traveler with Yeshua/Jesus!

How have you been?!

Now, I will have to go back and actually read the thread so I can post a legitimate pro or con...lol!

As are all in Jesus, Yeshua, everything is delightful for me. Now, let us not go into the matters of old-age problems or we will be here until tomorrow. All love and blessings in Jesus, …. j

Interesting, never thought of this

we do know a great number will come, and they will have help the 144000 missionaries from Israel the two witnesses and the many martyred.

history showed that when things get bad, people tend to turn to God. Since this is the greatest tribulation mankind will ever witness, it may be the greatest influx of new converts also.

I would offer. The word martyr simply means "witness". Men, have added to it other meanings like death. All Christians die .

The 144 thousand represent a unknown number as born again Israel she was renamed Christian in Acts by God. . .

12 thousand, with the word thousand representing as unknown and 12 the fullness of God or authority .

In regard to 12 tribes out of 13 tribes, they are used as gates entering into to the city prepared as metaphor. . . the bride of Christ. Therefore representing all the old testament saints. And the 12 out of the 13 apostles as sent out ones...to represent the walls as a foundation of the city. . . . prepared as the chaste virgin bride. the church. Used as metaphor in that parable (.Chapter 21)

12 thousand times 12 thousand. 144 thousand an unknown.

God does not number the people in order to walk by sight rather than walking by faith. Leaving out the city prepared as the bride. The tribe of Dan from the old testament saints to represent the letter of the law "death" And the false apostles as false prophets, Judas as new testament saints as "two witnesses" ( the law and the prophets) to represent the unseen spirit of judgment..

Those two witnesses are the law and the prophets signified by Moses the law giver, and Elias the unseen power of prophecy .They will be silenced or killed for a short as God sends a famine for the hearing of faith believing our God. . . not seen. The gospel will be silenced.